[quote=phil36;357424]
Quote:
Originally Posted by livingbygrace
Hi LBG,
I dont think there is any need to try and drum up support from fellow users of the board, if they wanted to side with you they will. secondly as me and VW where discussing, when someone new, I mean a new convert or someone not long in the Faith comes to God, they will not know everything and neither do they need to know, I certainly don't and we can all agree that we never will know the full depths of God, and God's love. unfortunatly some people remain on milk rather than moving onto solid food.
I think by and large a good lot of people just arent sure all about the trinity, and how it is foundational, that is not to say they are not saved. however, if you do know about the doctrine of the trinity and wilfully teach against it, well that is a different story altogether! However it still may be the case of some might just be confused, or have been lead into a false teaching, I am not saying they are not saved either!
I will leave you with a question LBG:
If Oneness doctrine (or Modalism) is the so-called doctrine of the apostles, then, why was it universally condemned as *heretical* by the early church Fathers (some of who were disciples of the original apostles) and condemned by all the important church councils and creeds?
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Hi Phil
I certainly am not trying to drum up any support for my opinions. I accept that I am not in the majority with them.
What I genuinely find hard to understand is that you appear to be saying that I can be a Christian with my views(albeit a milk drinker). And yet in your belief I do not accept the foundational belief of Christianity(Christ is God Himself) You also say I am a heretic and commit heresy. I know of no other Christian who would believe that someone they would consdider not to have the foundational truth of the Christian faith and was a heretic could be saved. This does genuinely amaze me. Is this honestly what you believe. Only you have stated that belioeving Jesus is God Himself is the foundational belief of Christianity if I am not mistaken.
You also said that it doesn't say much for an internationally renowned minister if you are right I presume for confirming I am baptised in the Holy Spirit. Leaving aside the disagreement we have on this, there is another possibility I believe.
What is mature Christianity? Is it head theology? Or is it the heart?
To me mature Christianity is not theological head knowledge, but yielding to and being led of the Spirit. What does this produce in us? love, joy peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. and on that scale I know I so often fall short.
If head theology was the most important thing in Christianity I am left wondering something. Many Christians in their hearts-even on this website believe they have the theology. Mnay believe they have great theology based on the great theologians and scholars of the Christian faith. But if theology is the most important thing and people have such an abundance of this, why do we not see(or very seldom see) the power we were promised?
Jesus said. You will do greater miracles than I because I go to my Father. The early disciples saw these great miracles, why do we so rarely today? I have been to churches in England who pride themselves on standing on the truth of God's word, but there is no power that Christ spoke of us having, why is this?
Nearly every born again church I have been to in England(and I have been to many) are mainly filled with the more academically gifted half of society, and those who come from the more affluent half of society. Why is this? I have my opinions I wondered what yours were, as you have previously stated you believe this is the case. What of the lame. crushed, blind, downtrodden, oppressed the people Christ was annointed to preach to?
So what has the theology of man so often achieved? A church based on the early church of the New Testament? I would doubt that. Maybe we are often too caught up in head knowledge and the desire for it and to proclaim it while the most important aspect of Christianity becomes a casualty of such an approach.
The heart of the Gospel is love, the doctrine is faith in Christ and a total reliance on the Holy Spirit. But how many truly in their hearts live by that principal today?
I can only repeat. I will always prefer to be called an imature Christian and to accept in childlike faith the simple, plain, direct staements on this subject made by God Himself, Christ, and the Apostle Paul than to be considerd a mature Christian for believing what is considered to be mature doctrine and mature Christianity, but has to cast aside the simple, plain and emphatic statements of those mentioned.
I will always prefer simple, childlike faith to the intellectual philosopher and scholar. Why do people so look to them? Because they believe they are totally led of the Spirit? Or is the main reason because they are considered deep thinkers, and intellectually wise by this worlds standards?
I don't know why you asked me the question concerning 'oneness'. I have not professed to follow that belief as stated on this website