Heavenly bound or Not

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Mem

Mem

Senior Member
#21
Sep 23, 2014
5,886
1,675
113
#21
ELECT said:
So where did God take Enoch ?
Click to expand...
He died. I don't have the reference but it says he lived 365 years, and somebody (again sorry I sound so simple) recieved a letter from him, later, after that event that most believe as his ascension, but rather he was moved to a safe place, as also happened with Elijah. Sorry, I am unprepared with the source explaining that though. But... yeah. :p
 
Mem

Mem

Senior Member
#22
Sep 23, 2014
5,886
1,675
113
#22
It may have been Elijah that sent the letter after the event... again sorry I am unprepared with the explanation. I will dig the source back up.
 
Mem

Mem

Senior Member
#23
Sep 23, 2014
5,886
1,675
113
#23
J

john832

Senior Member
#24
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#24
ELECT said:
i cannot find any that why i am asking
Click to expand...
Neither can I, what I have found is the reward of the saved is eternal life here on earth with the Father and Christ.
 
J

john832

Senior Member
#25
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#25
Brainfreeze said:
Luke 23:42
The Crucifixion
…42And he was saying, "Jesus, remember me when You come in Your kingdom!" 43And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."
Click to expand...
We have discussed this in other threads but oh well, here we go again...

First thing to remember is that there were no commas in the original, they were added in about the 11th century.

Luk 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

So if we remove the commas...

Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him Verily I say unto thee To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

We now have another way to read this verse...

Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee To day, shalt thou be with me in paradise.

I am telling you today that when I come into my Kingdom you will be there.

There are more problems with the thief going to heaven the day Christ died...

Joh 13:33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come; so now I say to you.

Just the evening before, Christ told the twelve that they could not go to heaven. Did He then decide to give something to this thief that the Disciples didn't get?

Another issue here is this...

Joh 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Now, three days and four nights later we have Christ telling Mary that He had NOT YET ascended to the heaven where the Father is. So did the thief go to heaven three days and four nights before Christ? That makes the scripture false...

Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Either Christ was the firstborn among many brethren or the thief was. My money is on Christ.

The truth is the thief is still in His grave awaiting a resurrection...

1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
 
J

john832

Senior Member
#26
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#26
Mem said:
It may have been Elijah that sent the letter after the event... again sorry I am unprepared with the explanation. I will dig the source back up.
Click to expand...
It was Elijah and it was around ten years after his being taken up in the chariot. He was transported to another place on earth. This was not the first time that Elijah was transported though...

1Ki 18:1 And it came to pass after many days, that the word of the LORD came to Elijah in the third year, saying, Go, shew thyself unto Ahab; and I will send rain upon the earth.
1Ki 18:2 And Elijah went to shew himself unto Ahab. And there was a sore famine in Samaria.

So Ahab sent Obadiah to find some water and pasture for his livestock. On the way he met Elijah...

1Ki 18:7 And as Obadiah was in the way, behold, Elijah met him: and he knew him, and fell on his face, and said, Art thou that my lord Elijah?
1Ki 18:8 And he answered him, I am: go, tell thy lord, Behold, Elijah is here.
1Ki 18:9 And he said, What have I sinned, that thou wouldest deliver thy servant into the hand of Ahab, to slay me?
1Ki 18:10 As the LORD thy God liveth, there is no nation or kingdom, whither my lord hath not sent to seek thee: and when they said, He is not there; he took an oath of the kingdom and nation, that they found thee not.

Now why in the world was Elijah so hard to find?

1Ki 18:12 And it shall come to pass, as soon as I am gone from thee, that the Spirit of the LORD shall carry thee whither I know not; and so when I come and tell Ahab, and he cannot find thee, he shall slay me: but I thy servant fear the LORD from my youth.

Elijah was well known for being transported to other locations...

2Ki 2:16 And they said unto him, Behold now, there be with thy servants fifty strong men; let them go, we pray thee, and seek thy master: lest peradventure the Spirit of the LORD hath taken him up, and cast him upon some mountain, or into some valley. And he said, Ye shall not send.

Actually, the NIV is not too bad here...

2Ki 2:16 "Look," they said, "we your servants have fifty able men. Let them go and look for your master. Perhaps the Spirit of the LORD has picked him up and set him down on some mountain or in some valley." "No," Elisha replied, "do not send them."

Is Elijah the only man in the Bible known to be transported? Nope, in Acts 8 we read the story of Philip and the Ethiopian Eunuch. God guides Philip by the Holy Spirit to teach the Ethiopian then after he is baptized this amazing thing happens...

Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
Act 8:40 But Philip was found at Azotus: and passing through he preached in all the cities, till he came to Caesarea.

Philip is transported to Azotus. Why is it a problem to believe that this also occurred with Enoch? And why is it such a problem to believe Christ?

Joh 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Joh 7:34 Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come.

Joh 8:21 Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.

Joh 13:33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come; so now I say to you.
 
J

john832

Senior Member
#27
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#27
crossnote said:
That's the Church in the rapture but come back to earth with Christ at the end of the Tribulation.
Click to expand...
The resurrection of the saints occurs at the return of Christ...

1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

The saints meet Christ in the air (the earth's atmosphere)...

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Then return to earth to rule and reign with Christ for 1000 years...

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#29
#29
john832 said:
The resurrection of the saints occurs at the return of Christ...

1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

The saints meet Christ in the air (the earth's atmosphere)...

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Then return to earth to rule and reign with Christ for 1000 years...

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Click to expand...
Are you saying this is the first heaven that they are caught up in ?
 
J

john832

Senior Member
#30
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#30
ELECT said:
Are you saying this is the first heaven that they are caught up in ?
Click to expand...
Yes, the atmosphere. There are no clouds above about 40,000 feet yet we meet Christ in the clouds. So we must not go more than 8 miles above the surface of the earth.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#32
Nov 24, 2012
30,706
3,650
113
#32
john832 said:
The resurrection of the saints occurs at the return of Christ...

1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

The saints meet Christ in the air (the earth's atmosphere)...

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Then return to earth to rule and reign with Christ for 1000 years...

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Click to expand...
So it's an instant up/down yo yo effect?
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#35
Nov 24, 2012
30,706
3,650
113
#35
ELECT said:
no telling :confused: i never knew the bible said that we would be in the air for 7 years interesting
Click to expand...
I did not say 7 years, your little trap sprung too soon.
 
tribesman

tribesman

Senior Member
#37
Oct 13, 2011
4,612
274
83
#37
crossnote said:
So it's an instant up/down yo yo effect?
Click to expand...
LOL! Too good, bro. Never forget that first time I heard about the "yo-yo" mentioned by a brother. Some good laff there.
 
Mem

Mem

Senior Member
#39
Sep 23, 2014
5,886
1,675
113
#39
crossnote said:
So it's an instant up/down yo yo effect?
Click to expand...
He is going to lift us up and vacuum under us. ;)

Rev 15 says no one is allowed in the temple until the seven plagues are poured out.
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#40
#40
crossnote said:
Are you playing dumb?
Click to expand...
i cant find a verse thats says there are three comings but you seem to have them i know of this following verse though

Hebrews 9:28King James Version (KJV)

28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation
 
You must log in or register to reply here.