The MOST CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENT MADE

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

You know...for those who teach a watered down salvation and the ones who trust into baptism as part of their salvation explain the following....

IF BAPTISM IS NECESSARY FOR SALVATION THEN WHY DID PAUL SAY....

I THANK GOD I BAPTIZED NONE OF YOU but Crispus and Gaius.....1st Corinthians 1:14

This man wrote almost HALF of the N.T. and IF BAPTISM WAS CRITICAL to SALVATION then this has got to be the most controversial statement in the bible and he must have been off of his rocker to pen that statement!

It is also the most anti-evangelistic statement in the scriptures if BAPTISM is NECESSARY....

GOD said...WHEN I SEE THE BLOOD I WILL PASS OVER YOU........

HE DID NOT SAY.....WHEN I SEE THE BLOOD, WATER AND WORKS I WILL PASS OVER YOU!

IF BAPTISM was necessary...PAUL WOULD HAVE BEEN IMMERSING EVERYBODY that he could get HIS HANDS ON as his hearts desire was to win everyone to the truth and eternal life!

JesusIsAll · Oct 23, 2014

Luke 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire.

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

JesusIsAll said:

No doubt.....wonder why none of the water for salvation pushers wont answer this OP......I am sure they will come up with some lame excuse based upon scriptures so twisted out of proportion that it will resemble Mr. Twisty and His cousin OUTTA WHACK!

Jason0047 · Oct 23, 2014

I agree that water baptism does not save. I also believe works do not save a person, either. We are saved by God's mercy and grace because if we slip up, we would have failed to keep the Law perfectly as Christ had done. But God's grace is there for us (See 1 John 2:1, 1 John 1:9) so as to walk perfectly and not to walk in doing evil or sinful things (As if it was a way of life that you don't think you could ever change). For a born again person will naturally result in good fruit or works. If there is no fruit or works, it is a dead faith and proves God is not living within that person. God does the work in the believer; That is why it is not salvation by works. A believer merely walks with God and allows Him to work thru their heart and lives. Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith. But walking in the Light as He is in the Light proves that the BLOOD will be applied to you and proves you are born again (See 1 John 1:6-7, 1 John 2:3-6, 1 John 3:6, and 1 John 3:9).

Pemican · Oct 23, 2014

Remember the thief on the cross. He believed in Christ but was too busy dying to get down and be baptized or do any good works. What a picture. Two thieves, one believed and one didn't. One saved, one lost and Christ divides the two of them and the whole world.

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

Pemican said:

I totally agree...the problem is the fact that the water for salvation peddlers will argue that this is not an example of N.T. salvation....my response is found in the letters B.S...yeah BULL SNOT...better qualify my letters there so as not to offend a weaker brother.....

JesusIsAll · Oct 23, 2014

John 6:28-29 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

ThomistColin · Oct 23, 2014

Then explain Peter's comment that "baptism...now saves us."

breno785au · Oct 23, 2014

I'm not going against what you believe about baptism and salvation by saying this but I think Pauls statement is being misunderstood here. I think what he is saying I'm glad I didn't baptise you because they would have said "I am of Paul" which Paul would of hated.

What do you think?

Yet · Oct 23, 2014

....for the remission. For: Greek: eis, which also is used as-because of, in regard to.

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

JesusIsAll said:

No doubt for sure........!

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

ThomistColin said:

Go study the word saves from the Greek and no offence, but a Catholic believes in the water (sprinkling) which is also contrary to the actual act of IMMERSION

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

breno785au said:

I understand the context as well, but at the same time to say that if BAPTISM is necessary for salvation makes this statement misleading in the very minimum......

Baptism is a picture of what has taken place based upon faith and is our outward testimony of an inward faith....it is the 1st act of obedience and water pushers for salvation take a few scriptures out of context to push that doctrine.....Jesus was the SON of GOD by BIRTH and only came to be identified by his IMMERSION.....which did not add to or complete his sonship....

Jason0047 · Oct 23, 2014

ThomistColin said:

"...when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ" (1 Peter 3:20-21).

In other words, baptism saves you but not for the putting away the filth of the flesh (i.e. sin), but as an answer of a good conscience toward God. This is a "like figure" (i.e. parallel) of how Noah and his family (i.e. the eight souls within the Ark) were saved from the Global Flood. However, Noah already found grace in the eyes of the Lord before building the Ark. Noah already had grace and was saved before building the Ark; Just as Abraham believed God and he accounted to him as righteousness.

See, your works don't save you. God does not weigh your good deeds and your bad deeds. Nor does God save you by what you do, either. God saves you by His mercy and by the washing and regeneration of the Holy Ghost (Titus 3:5). THEN.....

After the transformation (Like a caterpillar turning into a butterfly), will works follow because it is God doing the work thru that person. They are transformed and are saved and they KNOW IT. There is no question of their salvation because the Spirit confirms they are saved.

Anyways, I hope this helps, my friend.

Jason0047 · Oct 23, 2014

Baptism is an outward showing or declaration of our faith in Jesus. Our going down under the water is a picture of being buried with Christ and our raising out of the water is like unto His resurrection.

Here is a beautiful video (That I found that to be very emotional):

[video=youtube;vDLbka_5awQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDLbka_5awQ[/video]

Side Note:

Oh, and yes, I was water baptized (But I did not do it so as to be saved, though; Only Jesus is the source of salvation (1 John 5:12)).

GracethroughfaithinChrist · Oct 23, 2014

dcontroversal said:

Brother dc,
I totally agree with you and might I add what is clearly stated in the Word of God.....

We heard (the Word),we believed (In Jesus Christ our Savior),we received (the Holy Spirit).

To those who say baptism in water or any other work is necessary for salvation you complicate the simplicity of the whole process of faith, hindering those who will enter therein....

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

wattie · Oct 23, 2014

Yah it's really important to read the context in which baptism is put for each part of scripture. A key part of it as has been posted before on what 'save' means.

It is not always about deliverance from sins in being given eternal life. Sometimes it is just getting through a hard trial or being taken out of a destructive situation.

There is also salvaging your life to God after salvation which is also put in the bible- salvaging talents.

Then you also get the likes of in John- being 'born of water and the spirit'- this is water of the WOMB

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

GracethroughfaithinChrist said:

Totally agree with this for sure and AMEN......baptism is a work of righteousness and it states clearly...NOT BY WORKS of righteousness that we have done....Titus 3:5

dcontroversal · Oct 23, 2014

GracethroughfaithinChrist said:

Totally agree with this for sure as Baptism is a work of righteousness and Titus 3:5 clearly teaches...Not by works of righteousness which we have done......

elf3 · Oct 23, 2014

Great forum Dc. I have a cousin who is married to a Baptist pastor. When one of his parishioners wants baptized he actually tells them it's not the baptism that saves them. He runs them through a baptism class twice a week for 3 weeks to explain baptism to them. When I was baptized in 2010 I went through a class also. I was baptized as a public display of my faith to God and the pastor made that clear to the congregation when our "group" was baptized one by one. Mine was before a service, so about 400 people saw my public display of my faith in God.

The MOST CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENT MADE

Banned

JesusIsAll

Guest

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

JesusIsAll

Guest

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

elf3

Guest