If Man Has No Role In His Own Salvation......
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If one reads Romans 2:6-10 in isolation from the rest of the book of Romans, one might conclude that Paul was teaching salvation by works. However, as you read and study these passages, it is imperative to keep in mind that these verses do not describe how one becomes saved, but the way the saved and the unsaved conduct their lives. These good deeds done are the result of, not the means or basis of receiving salvation.
Patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (vs. 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life, but as a description of those to whom God does render life eternal. Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (vs. 9). What those passages convey is that though our deeds are judged by God, it's not the good deeds themselves which are the basis or means of receiving salvation, but the type of deeds expose whether our heart was saved, or not. Good deeds are produced out of genuine faith, thus "everyone who does good." Deeds produced without faith are tainted with sin, thus "everyone who does evil." Without faith it is impossible to please God no matter how many so called good deeds that you attempt to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to save yourself by works.
Patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (vs. 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life, but as a description of those to whom God does render life eternal. Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (vs. 9). What those passages convey is that though our deeds are judged by God, it's not the good deeds themselves which are the basis or means of receiving salvation, but the type of deeds expose whether our heart was saved, or not. Good deeds are produced out of genuine faith, thus "everyone who does good." Deeds produced without faith are tainted with sin, thus "everyone who does evil." Without faith it is impossible to please God no matter how many so called good deeds that you attempt to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to save yourself by works.
You know...I will not argue with you and your fallacies as if you want to keep on twisting scripture to fit your works for salvation then go for it...as for me I will trust Jesus at his word and the simple fact that he saves those who believe and trust into his finished work....
BY grace are you saved dia faith
Believe and thou shalt be saved
It pleased God to save those who BELIEVE
NOT BY WORKS of righteousness which we HAVE DONE but according to HIS MERCY has HE SAVED US
SO...keep ignoring the truth and trusting into works and water and see where it gets you dude!
BY grace are you saved dia faith
Believe and thou shalt be saved
It pleased God to save those who BELIEVE
NOT BY WORKS of righteousness which we HAVE DONE but according to HIS MERCY has HE SAVED US
SO...keep ignoring the truth and trusting into works and water and see where it gets you dude!
How does God draw men?
Jn 6:45 "It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me."
God draws men by His word when me are "taught" "heard" and "learn" with a result of men coming to Christ.
Simply put: God draws, men come.
So man's role when drawn is "cometh unto me".
Again your tainted view does not allow you to understand that the salvation that is to be (fitted out) is ALREADY present and the Works (fitting out) have NOTHING to do with the already present salvation which is based upon FAITH.
You will never understand it...EVER!.....until you get over yourself and your own abilities while being blind to the first man who trusted into HIS OWN OWRKS and is called a FALSE teacher in JUDE...that being CAIN......!
You will never understand it...EVER!.....until you get over yourself and your own abilities while being blind to the first man who trusted into HIS OWN OWRKS and is called a FALSE teacher in JUDE...that being CAIN......!
Paul is teaching one's eternal destiny is determined by the type of works he does in Rom 2.
Just as Paul said one first obeys then is justified Rom 6:17,18 as James say one is justified by works James 2:24.
Rom 2:8 "But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;"
What one DOES is why he is lost, he obeys unrighteousness, does evil. Since what one DOES is the reason for him being lost, then what one DOES is the reason for him being saved:
Rom 2:7 "To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:"
Since God renders man according to his DEEDS in verse 6, here in v7 Paul states what DEEDS are necessary to be rendered "eternal life".
You say the EXACT OPPOSITE when you posted "Patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (vs. 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life,"
Paul says "eternal life"
You say "not..eternal life"
In verse 7 those who "seek" are set in contrast to those in verse 8 who obey not the truth, obey unrighteousness, doeth evil. Seekers are the ones who do obey the truth, the ones who DOETH righteousness.
Whiteside commentated (my emp) "Eternal life is conditional, for eternal life must be sought by patience and well-doing. In the 8th and 9th verses, Paul affirms that tribulation and anguish will be visited upon those who do evil. If damnation is conditional, then salvation also must be conditional. One cannot be conditional and the other unconditional, if doing wrong causes a person to be lost, then to be saved, he must leave off the wrong and do right. If being lost is conditional, so is being saved"
Coffman noted on Rom 2:7 "It should be noticed in the above reference that Paul did not set up a special category for "disobedient believers," who through faith and nothing but faith would be saved anyway! Nor yet was there provision made for another class of disobedient who had had God's forensic righteousness transferred to them through faith only."
Why pray for anyone to be saved, why would we want God to violate someone's will at all? Even in telling them the gospel, are we not trying to control them?
This is the same argument i read in a paper about not telling people to smoke, because then you are helping to force them to change their mind which is changing them to your image of what you think is right. Which causes what they defined humanity to be is their choice
This is the same argument i read in a paper about not telling people to smoke, because then you are helping to force them to change their mind which is changing them to your image of what you think is right. Which causes what they defined humanity to be is their choice
You presented nothing biblical here at all:
1) Nowhere did Jesus say just belief only in my finished work and be saved.
2) you cherry pick verses that mention belief while purposely ignoring verses where Jesus said one must repent Lk 13:3,5 confess Mt 10:32,33 and be baptized Mk 16:16.
3) you misunderstand Tts 3:5 and therefore misuse it. Tts 3:5 requires water baptism (washing of regeneration) and contrasts water baptism from works of merit (righteous works we have done)
4) I'll keeping ignoring the falsehoods of faith only and overcome, keeping Christ works, Rev 2:26.
1) Nowhere did Jesus say just belief only in my finished work and be saved.
2) you cherry pick verses that mention belief while purposely ignoring verses where Jesus said one must repent Lk 13:3,5 confess Mt 10:32,33 and be baptized Mk 16:16.
3) you misunderstand Tts 3:5 and therefore misuse it. Tts 3:5 requires water baptism (washing of regeneration) and contrasts water baptism from works of merit (righteous works we have done)
4) I'll keeping ignoring the falsehoods of faith only and overcome, keeping Christ works, Rev 2:26.