a med student's questions on the resurrection

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T

thefightinglamb

Guest
#1
Note: Do not let these questions produce any doubt in the reader, Jesus most certainly did rise from the dead.

My brother is a med student and also a self-confessed atheist now, but he came at me with some questions that I saw as strange and yet somewhat intriguing...as for, I did not know the answers to the questions, and yet I know there has got to be some understanding of what I feel called to believe.

Note: a given of my faith is that Jesus DID raise from the dead, but these questions caused me to ponder what this faith means...

Okay, so now the questions.

1-Was Jesus' blood immediately/spontaneously re-created in his body? Aka. what happened to the blood that Jesus lost, was it back in him, or did he not have blood in his body and yet he was alive?

2-I know that Jesus still had his wounds, Thomas could put his hand in the nail piercings and his side., so it seems some of the wounds remained, but for example if the muscles, nerves and ligaments were torn, was his hands and feet then working in a way that the body has not ever worked? Let me clarify as my brother did to me, confusing me a little bit...if I cut off my hand, and there was a space between it, and then somehow I could move it again, it would make little sense--and as my brother suggested it almost seems like witchcraft. But with Jesus, my faith calls me not to see it that way, and yet I know the wounds were there, and quite likely cut through some pretty important muscles and nerves, and yet I know Jesus moved his hands/feet.

3-I have always held that when the soldier pierced the side of Jesus he went into the heart, and then water and blood gushed out--some other person in church on Sunday suggested that perhaps it was not the heart, but I am unsure what else he would stick his stake into to make sure Jesus was dead...and Thomas could put his hand in his side, to whatever place that obviously the soldier knew meant that he had to be dead...so was the heart pumping? Did Jesus have a beating heart after he was resurrected?

My simple childish question that I have thought of before is 'were the other scars still on Jesus as well? ' Such as the thrashing before the cross, hence he would have looked like a beat up man even after he was resurrected?

So I guess the basis for a lot of these questions is "what exactly was healed on Jesus's physical body and what was not?"

4-Because I somewhat don't mind showing what I have faith in, I even told my brother about the upper room where Jesus appeared before ascending to heaven--though the doors were locked...and then my bother asked if he was a ghost, and I assured him that scripture says clearly He was not a ghost (because He ate bread or fish I believe) and that it was the actual body that died that was seen walking again after his death.

5-My brother says that people suffer unreversible brain damage within hours of death, did Jesus suffer brain damage? I answered this with a psalm that says that 'God would not suffer his Holy One to see decay"--hence I do not believe that his body was decaying though he was dead/absent from his body.

Funny to me that I have faith and know that it happened but had never understood exactly what I am called to believe...

Just some questions, my brother also has a devout Christian as a friend I think he fears discussing with him about his questions...but I think I will and should suggest his friend show him what his 'medical knowledge' has contributed/shown him about his faith...perhaps he can speak medical hoopla that my brother will understand more than the ramblings of me...

Thanks,
and may God grant wisdom and truth to whoever attempts at least a theory on these questions
tony
 
S

SeekinHIM

Guest
#2
Wow that's a good one Coach!!! Truly a puzzling dilemma to say the least! And yet, there are some real clues to the answers to your questions.........

For example: When JESUS rose from the dead, and at one point met Mary Magdalane, WHY DID HE SAY TO HER "DON'T TOUCH ME, FOR I AM NOT YET GLORIFIED??? (HMMMM???)

How did JESUS who, according to literature of the time, was approximately 5' 10'' or so, and probably weighed approximately 175 - 185 lbs., walk across the Sea of Galilea without sinking..............???

Did JESUS BECOME A "PHYSIOSPIRIT" which is a physical being with the ability to permeate or move through solid matter without friction, interference, or hindrance in any form. Could he "MORPH" like this at will in the time that elapsed between His ressurrection and ascension???

I don't know that we will ever know FULLY while in this state of our being................INTERESTING NOTE: We are spirits, that have a soul, (mind, will and emotions) and we temporarily live in these bodies or Earthsuits. 1 Thessalonians 5:23 literally says in this order..........spirit, soul and body.


I do believe that once we die, or lose this mortal incumbrence, we also like JESUS, might be enabled somehow, spiritually, to move through solid objects as He did...........On the Blood issue, I believe He no longer needed blood, even His heart pumping, or any "organ" function as we know it..........

REASON: The FATHER raised Him from the dead, and no doubt EMPOWERED HIM for the remaining time, or else WHY would He have said that to Mary?
So somehow, beyond Earthly "science" or medical knowledge that we currently have or use, Him being Spirit, changed the "source" of function from physio- to spiritual.

Thanks that is truly a "brain" teaser....................lol

SeekinHIM
 
S

SeekinHIM

Guest
#3
Oh by the way fightinglamb,

After I posted my reply to your query, a rather humorous thought came to me...................please bear in mind, I IN NO WAY, WOULD EVER DENEGRATE OR MOCK ANY OF THE SCENARIOS SURROUNDING THE DEATH, BURIEL AND RESSURRECTION OF MY SAVIOR................EVER!!!

HOWEVER................I was pondering your questions............just sitting quietly, and all of a sudden the weirdest thougt came to me.............

I PICTURED M.C. HAMMER SINGING HIS FAMOUS RENDITION OF " CAN'T TOUCH THIS"......................(I'm sorry if that affends anyone)

I have to say, I just about lost it, I'm here, in my home, it's 2:10 AM EST. AND I AM CRACKING UP..........................Now I know I serve a Wonderful, Merciful, HUMOROUS, Savior, but that was just over the top for me....................And trust me, I have GREAT RESPECT AND HONOR FOR MY KING, BUT THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME HE HAS "SUGGESTED" HUMOROUS THINGS TO ME, JUST TO BREAK THE TENSION.................


ANYWAY....................HERE'S A THOUGT THAT CAME WITH THAT................." I LOVE IT WHEN MY PEOPLE TALK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED BACK THEN, AND THEY HUNGER AND THIRST FOR THE TRUTH..........

I believe the LORD is well pleased that we are discussing this with tenacious desire to BE FILLED...............

SeekinHIM
 
G

giantone

Guest
#4
1. Jesus's blood was poured out on the Earth as Able's blood was poured out and speaks "Judgement, Judgement!"
Genesis 4:10 *And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
Jesus's blood says better things forgiveness
Hebrews 12:24 *And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
2. I don't understand what you mean but you would think the hands would move a little because in order to breath on the cross Jesus would have to lift His body. Also you would think people at the time saw many crusifictions and if it was unusual or demonic it would have been noted.
3. I don't know but Thomas doubted and Jesus had him see what he needed to see.

Hebrews 9:19 - 28 Jesus entered heaven once as a sacrifice for our sins, I would think He will keep His scars forever. I don't know if anything was healed except Satan had no legal right for Jesus to die so death couldn't have Him.

4. If I had any other examples of something like this no one would believe it but if we believe in heaven and hell they are places we nomaly don't see or feel in this realm.
5. If Jesus was reserected in three minutes that wouln't be too impressive.

I like reading about the human body and the way the blood works it builds my faith. Blood has a memory I think it is 65 years it remembers diseases it encounters and is like a city in it's complexity. The brain is even more impressive.
 
I

Israel

Guest
#5
Note: Do not let these questions produce any doubt in the reader, Jesus most certainly did rise from the dead.

My brother is a med student and also a self-confessed atheist now, but he came at me with some questions that I saw as strange and yet somewhat intriguing...as for, I did not know the answers to the questions, and yet I know there has got to be some understanding of what I feel called to believe.

Note: a given of my faith is that Jesus DID raise from the dead, but these questions caused me to ponder what this faith means...

Okay, so now the questions.

1-Was Jesus' blood immediately/spontaneously re-created in his body? Aka. what happened to the blood that Jesus lost, was it back in him, or did he not have blood in his body and yet he was alive?

2-I know that Jesus still had his wounds, Thomas could put his hand in the nail piercings and his side., so it seems some of the wounds remained, but for example if the muscles, nerves and ligaments were torn, was his hands and feet then working in a way that the body has not ever worked? Let me clarify as my brother did to me, confusing me a little bit...if I cut off my hand, and there was a space between it, and then somehow I could move it again, it would make little sense--and as my brother suggested it almost seems like witchcraft. But with Jesus, my faith calls me not to see it that way, and yet I know the wounds were there, and quite likely cut through some pretty important muscles and nerves, and yet I know Jesus moved his hands/feet.

3-I have always held that when the soldier pierced the side of Jesus he went into the heart, and then water and blood gushed out--some other person in church on Sunday suggested that perhaps it was not the heart, but I am unsure what else he would stick his stake into to make sure Jesus was dead...and Thomas could put his hand in his side, to whatever place that obviously the soldier knew meant that he had to be dead...so was the heart pumping? Did Jesus have a beating heart after he was resurrected?

My simple childish question that I have thought of before is 'were the other scars still on Jesus as well? ' Such as the thrashing before the cross, hence he would have looked like a beat up man even after he was resurrected?

So I guess the basis for a lot of these questions is "what exactly was healed on Jesus's physical body and what was not?"

4-Because I somewhat don't mind showing what I have faith in, I even told my brother about the upper room where Jesus appeared before ascending to heaven--though the doors were locked...and then my bother asked if he was a ghost, and I assured him that scripture says clearly He was not a ghost (because He ate bread or fish I believe) and that it was the actual body that died that was seen walking again after his death.

5-My brother says that people suffer unreversible brain damage within hours of death, did Jesus suffer brain damage? I answered this with a psalm that says that 'God would not suffer his Holy One to see decay"--hence I do not believe that his body was decaying though he was dead/absent from his body.

Funny to me that I have faith and know that it happened but had never understood exactly what I am called to believe...

Just some questions, my brother also has a devout Christian as a friend I think he fears discussing with him about his questions...but I think I will and should suggest his friend show him what his 'medical knowledge' has contributed/shown him about his faith...perhaps he can speak medical hoopla that my brother will understand more than the ramblings of me...

Thanks,
and may God grant wisdom and truth to whoever attempts at least a theory on these questions
tony
Before the resurrection, Jesus had a physical, sinless body. Physically, How was Jesus' life maintained?

Leviticus 17:11
For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

Genesis 2:7
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Since the fall man has been corrupted and tainted.

Genesis 3:19
In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Was Jesus simply a living soul?

1 Corinthians 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Jesus said in
John 6:63
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Being made of the Spirit, life is in the Word.

When Jesus died, He rose from the grave no longer in corruptible flesh, but in a spirit body.

1 Corinthians 15:42
So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

Now once being changed into incorruptible spirit bodies:

John 3:8
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Hebrews 1:13-14
But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Genesis 32:24-28
And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.

25And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob's thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him.
26And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me.
27And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. 28And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast

Hosea 12: 4 tells us who this man was:
Yea, he had power over the angel, and prevailed: he wept, and made supplication unto him: he found him in Bethel, and there he spake with us;

So the angel, a spirit had manifested himself physically. It is the same with Jesus in His resurrected body. He is no longer flesh and blood.

1 Corinthians 15:50
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Jesus appeared to Thomas with his wounds so that he could believe! He appeared to others without them.
 
G

greatkraw

Guest
#6
Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

NO BLOOD
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#7
I think this is an interesting series of questions. First, I must say that I believe in heaven that Jesus may be the only one with scars. I may be disappointed as the description of Jesus in Revelation seems to be glorified. I think that Jesus was in a uniquely "in between" state for that brief time between the resurrection and the ascension. I believe this accounts for his reaction to Mary Magdalene. Your brother is noting the peculiarities of that state.

1-Was Jesus' blood immediately/spontaneously re-created in his body? Aka. what happened to the blood that Jesus lost, was it back in him, or did he not have blood in his body and yet he was alive?
I think he had something like blood, created at the moment of resurrection.

2-I know that Jesus still had his wounds, Thomas could put his hand in the nail piercings and his side., so it seems some of the wounds remained, but for example if the muscles, nerves and ligaments were torn, was his hands and feet then working in a way that the body has not ever worked? Let me clarify as my brother did to me, confusing me a little bit...if I cut off my hand, and there was a space between it, and then somehow I could move it again, it would make little sense--and as my brother suggested it almost seems like witchcraft. But with Jesus, my faith calls me not to see it that way, and yet I know the wounds were there, and quite likely cut through some pretty important muscles and nerves, and yet I know Jesus moved his hands/feet.
I believe the scars were important, the aftersign of the fulfillment of the prophecy--by his stripes we are healed. But the functionality of his limbs was completely restored

3-I have always held that when the soldier pierced the side of Jesus he went into the heart, and then water and blood gushed out--some other person in church on Sunday suggested that perhaps it was not the heart, but I am unsure what else he would stick his stake into to make sure Jesus was dead...and Thomas could put his hand in his side, to whatever place that obviously the soldier knew meant that he had to be dead...so was the heart pumping? Did Jesus have a beating heart after he was resurrected?
This is a bit of popular teaching that I repeat anecdotally. The teaching is that the position of hanging builds fluid up in the lung and heart cavity until the heart explode or collapses. (I don't remember which as it may be the fluid inside the heart itself. The Romans, well acquanted with the particulars of crucifiction, could chekc for death by carefully placing a lance's tip between the ribs, puncturing the heart cavity. If clear liquid flowed, then the heart had not burst/collapsed. If blood and water flowed, then the victim was sick. I believe that he had a healed heart, though it was something greater.

My simple childish question that I have thought of before is 'were the other scars still on Jesus as well? ' Such as the thrashing before the cross, hence he would have looked like a beat up man even after he was resurrected?
I think so. But when he ascended there was a further transformation, if John's vision is to be used as a measure.

So I guess the basis for a lot of these questions is "what exactly was healed on Jesus's physical body and what was not?"

4-Because I somewhat don't mind showing what I have faith in, I even told my brother about the upper room where Jesus appeared before ascending to heaven--though the doors were locked...and then my bother asked if he was a ghost, and I assured him that scripture says clearly He was not a ghost (because He ate bread or fish I believe) and that it was the actual body that died that was seen walking again after his death.
So, he had a physical body, not subject to the time-space-matter continium. We are mostly space, closer to the density of "space" then to the density of stars. It is possible to walk through a wall except for this odd thing called space. We do not fully know why our atoms keep a certain distance between them, but they do. He was not so, so He could walk through a wall. Matter was subject to His will.

5-My brother says that people suffer unreversible brain damage within hours of death, did Jesus suffer brain damage? I answered this with a psalm that says that 'God would not suffer his Holy One to see decay"--hence I do not believe that his body was decaying though he was dead/absent from his body.
A basic difference between a resurrection and a recessitation. The essence of who we are leaves the body upon death. In Jesus case, that essence retrurned to a transformed and restored "brain".

Understand that most of what we say is speculation based on observation. We do not know whether His post-resurrection body is an accurate representation of our post-resurrection bodies. I think it was something in between. To truly be the first-fruits of the resurrection there must be some degree of similitude, yet Jesus also must have taken up those divine attributes which he put aside when he became flesh.
 

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
2,987
1,014
113
New Zealand
#8
I think the medical term for what happened when Jesus was on the cross

when he was nailed onto the cross he would have to pull himself up everytime he had to breathe.. this would not only hurt his back rubbing against the wood but cause a build up of fluid around his lungs and heart.

I think when he was stabbed and 'blood and water' came out this is called a 'pericardial effussion'.. where the liquid built up around the heart and lungs.. and the blood of the heart come out together.

Pretty distasteful but helps to underpin the reality of Jesus' death.