mark

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#1
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,196
6,539
113
#2
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
Because King David and those with him did exactly what He and the Disciples were being accused of. Showing the accusers their hypocrisy from OT Scriptures
 

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
1,184
25
0
#3
Because King David and those with him did exactly what He and the Disciples were being accused of. Showing the accusers their hypocrisy from OT Scriptures
How is eating bread from priests and eating grain on the sabbath the same?
 
Feb 5, 2015
87
5
8
#4
David was in need, took of the shewbread and ate. Need breaks the Law
The priests that was doing the sacrifices on the Sabbath was doing physical labor. Necessity breaks the Law.
Elsewhere Jesus which of you who's ox falls into the pit will not rescue it on the Sabbath?
There are circumstances, whether hunger, work related, life & death matters
where it was permissible ["the Sabbath was made for man"] to break the Sabbath law

UNIVERSAL SABBATH

Nowhere is it written that the Sabbath was made for the Jew, but for man
 
Dec 26, 2014
3,757
19
0
#5
yahweh says that david was a man after yahweh's heart. read psalm 119, then 23, then 1, if you would like to be very blessed today.
(potentially)

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
 
Dec 26, 2014
3,757
19
0
#6
they're not the same in some ways.

read elsewhere in torah(scripture) the rules pertaining to the shew bread (for the priests).

"eating" on the sabbath was never against the law, (most regular) sabbaths.

How is eating bread from priests and eating grain on the sabbath the same?
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#7
The will of YHWH is the most important thing on Sabbath

Mattithyah 12:12, "And how much more valuable is a man than a sheep? Therefore, it is Lawful to do righteousness on the Sabbath."

Not someone using it to make people sit and stare at a wall when there are people in need, however this does not give the green light to disregard the 7th day and turn it into whatever I want to do for me and my enjoyment, but again for the will of YHWH.

This is where the heart and being truly led by the Spirit comes in, to know the will of YHWH what is inside the fence and what is outside, not using fake excuses to ignore His day or using His day as an excuse to be selfish. Messiah taught us how to walk, in love, not that any of us are perfect in it but seeking the true intent is key. This is one of the best passages concerning properly honoring Sabbath from the "OT", as the beginning of the book of Isayah YHWH shows He is displeased in what the people have turned the Sabbath into, but here He shows us His will.

Isayah 58:13-14, "If you turn away your foot from breaking the Sabbath: from doing your pleasure; your own business, your own pleasure, on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight; the holy day of Yahweh honorable, and will honor Him by not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor engaging in aidle conversation: Then you will find your joy in Yahweh; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Yaaqob your father--for the mouth of Yahweh has spoken it."

Mattithyah 12:12, "And how much more valuable is a man than a sheep? Therefore, it is Lawful to do righteousness on the Sabbath."

Isayah 58:11-14, "Yahweh will guide you continually, and satisfy your soul in drought, and make fat; (strengthen), your bones. You will be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail. And those of you will rebuild the old waste places; you will raise up the foundations of many generations; and you will be called the Repairer of the Breach, the Restorer of Streets to Dwell In; If you turn away your foot from breaking the Sabbath: from doing your pleasure; your own business, your own pleasure, on My holy day, and call the Sabbath a delight; the holy day of Yahweh honorable, and will honor Him by not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor engaging in aidle conversation: Then you will find your joy in Yahweh; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Yaaqob your father--for the mouth of Yahweh has spoken it."
 
J

JesusistheChrist

Guest
#8
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
Hi, JFSurvivor.

Oftentimes when a text from one of the gospels is vague, we can glean a better understanding of the same by comparing it to the same account as recorded by another gospel writer who has given a little more information by which we can gain better insight into what has actually been said and why. I'm going to cite this same account as recorded in Matthew's gospel to show you what I mean and to hopefully answer your questions:

Matthew chapter 12

[1] At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn, and to eat.
[2] But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.
[3] But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him;
[4] How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests?
[5] Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
[6] But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.
[7] But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.
[8] For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.


Matthew's account is a bit fuller in that he also records Jesus' mention of the priests in the temple who profane the Sabbath (IOW, their priestly duties might require them to work on the Sabbath) and are blameless AND in that he records Jesus' rebuke of the Pharisees, "but if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice", which is actually a citation from the Old Testament book of Hosea. Before looking at that citation in its original context so that we might "know what it means" ourselves, I'd just like to quickly point out that Jesus had previously rebuked the Pharisees with this same exact citation:

Matthew chapter 9

[9] And as Jesus passed forth from thence, he saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he saith unto him, Follow me. And he arose, and followed him.
[10] And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.
[11] And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?
[12] But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
[13] But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.


Let's now read this citation in its original context:

Hosea chapter 6

[1] Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
[2] After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
[3] Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.
[4] O Ephraim, what shall I do unto thee? O Judah, what shall I do unto thee? for your goodness is as a morning cloud, and as the early dew it goeth away.
[5] Therefore have I hewed them by the prophets; I have slain them by the words of my mouth: and thy judgments are as the light that goeth forth.
[6] For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.
[7]
But they like men have transgressed the covenant: there have they dealt treacherously against me.

Back in Hosea's day, the LORD "desired mercy and the knowledge of God" in that He wanted the people to acknowledge their sins against Him that He might have mercy upon them. He never got any such acknowledgement, but instead He got "sacrifice and burnt offerings" which were merely religiously or outwardly offered without any genuine repentance attached to them. Yes, those who had "transgressed the covenant" and had "dealt treacherously against Him" were OUTWARDLY AND HYPOCRITICALLY "RELIGIOUS" just the same...even as were the Pharisees of Jesus' day. Yes, as Jesus explained in Matthew 9:13, He had come to "call sinners to repentance", but the self-righteous Pharisees refused to repent.

Anyhow, I said all of that to say this:

Although Christ's disciples were doing that which wasn't "lawful" on the Sabbath day, their hearts were penitent before the Lord and they were therefore in a position to receive His mercy...very much UNlike the Pharisees who were condemning them. Jesus reminded the Pharisees out of their own law how that David likewise did that which was "unlawful" when he and his men were running from King Saul who wanted to kill David in that they ate the showbread which was only "lawful" for the priests to eat. Here's the account:

I Samuel chapter 21

[1] Then came David to Nob to Ahimelech the priest: and Ahimelech was afraid at the meeting of David, and said unto him, Why art thou alone, and no man with thee?
[2] And David said unto Ahimelech the priest, The king hath commanded me a business, and hath said unto me, Let no man know any thing of the business whereabout I send thee, and what I have commanded thee: and I have appointed my servants to such and such a place.
[3] Now therefore what is under thine hand? give me five loaves of bread in mine hand, or what there is present.
[4] And the priest answered David, and said, There is no common bread under mine hand, but there is hallowed bread; if the young men have kept themselves at least from women.
[5] And David answered the priest, and said unto him, Of a truth women have been kept from us about these three days, since I came out, and the vessels of the young men are holy, and the bread is in a manner common, yea, though it were sanctified this day in the vessel.
[6] So the priest gave him hallowed bread: for there was no bread there but the shewbread, that was taken from before the LORD, to put hot bread in the day when it was taken away.


Christ gave this example not because eating the shewbread and eating corn are the same exact thing, but because they're similar in that they were both "unlawful". Again, it wasn't "lawful" for anybody but the priests to eat the shewbread and it wasn't "lawful" for the disciples to be plucking corn on the Sabbath in that such could constitute working on the Sabbath.

Anyhow, Christ's overall point was that HE DESIRES MERCY and it's merciful to allow hungry disciples to eat when they're hungry and also merciful to allow one who has been anointed of God to be king (David) to similarly eat when he is hungry. I'm also reminded of when Christ said the following to the Pharisees:

Matthew chapter 23

[23] Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
[24] Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.


Yes, the Pharisees were renowned for "straining at a gnat" or for noticing the tiniest infraction while they themselves were busy "omitting the weightier matters of the law", such as "MERCY", or while they were busy "swallowing a camel".

Anyhow, that was a bit wordy (sorry about that), but I hope that it helps.
 
Last edited:

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,142
612
113
69
Alabama
#9
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
To illustrate the fact that the Law was intended to meet the needs of the people. Not the other way around. The needs of the people are more important than the severity of the Law.
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#10
"some would say it was the picking , gathering of grain there that was too much for the sabbath, like." :p
Jesus Christ
Him Crucified
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#11
David was in need, took of the shewbread and ate. Need breaks the Law
The priests that was doing the sacrifices on the Sabbath was doing physical labor. Necessity breaks the Law.
Elsewhere Jesus which of you who's ox falls into the pit will not rescue it on the Sabbath?
There are circumstances, whether hunger, work related, life & death matters
where it was permissible ["the Sabbath was made for man"] to break the Sabbath law

UNIVERSAL SABBATH

Nowhere is it written that the Sabbath was made for the Jew, but for man
well, i can't much debate you, just i some quitewhat or so suggest not claiming to face of Christ any need-theory.
"The Cross Is Done. only In Christ Can You See you don't much see a need for it. or lack awareness" :p
Jesus Christ
Him Crucified
Hurrah
<3
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,196
6,539
113
#12
they're not the same in some ways.

read elsewhere in torah(scripture) the rules pertaining to the shew bread (for the priests).

"eating" on the sabbath was never against the law, (most regular) sabbaths.
wow, really? Did Jesus lie to us?

Mark 2:23 .) And it came to pass, that he went through the corn fields on the sabbath day; and his disciples began, as they went, to pluck the ears of corn.
24 .) And the Pharisees said unto him, Behold, why do they on the sabbath day that which is not lawful?
25 .) And he said unto them, Have ye never read what David did, when he had need, and was an hungred, he, and they that were with him?
26 .) How he went into the house of God in the days of Abiathar the high priest, and did eat the shewbread, which is not lawful to eat but for the priests, and gave also to them which were with him?
27 .) And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
28 .) Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

If Jesus did not believe the comparison between what His disciples did and what David did, He would not have made the comparison would He? (just saying)
 
May 15, 2013
4,307
27
0
#13
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
The Sabbath was to serve us, to remove us from all wickedness so that we can be at rest; but instead, we has made it a rest day for God and which God doesn't need to rest, because He is the rest, and without Him, there is no rest.

Psalm 51:11 Do not cast me from your presence or take your Holy Spirit from me.

2 Samuel 7:8 “Now then, tell my servant David, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty says: I took you from the pasture, from tending the flock, and appointed you ruler over my people Israel. 9 I have been with you wherever you have gone, and I have cut off all your enemies from before you. Now I will make your name great, like the names of the greatest men on earth. 10 And I will provide a place for my people Israel and will plant them so that they can have a home of their own and no longer be disturbed. Wicked people will not oppress them anymore, as they did at the beginning 11 and have done ever since the time I appointed leaders over my people Israel. I will also give you rest from all your enemies.

Psalm 95:11 So I declared on oath in my anger, ‘They shall never enter my rest.’”
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#14
The Sabbath was to serve us, to remove us from all wickedness so that we can be at rest; but instead, we has made it a rest day for God and which God doesn't need to rest, because He is the rest, and without Him, there is no rest.

Psalm 51:11 Do not cast me from your presence or take your Holy Spirit from me.

2 Samuel 7:8 “Now then, tell my servant David, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty says: I took you from the pasture, from tending the flock, and appointed you ruler over my people Israel. 9 I have been with you wherever you have gone, and I have cut off all your enemies from before you. Now I will make your name great, like the names of the greatest men on earth. 10 And I will provide a place for my people Israel and will plant them so that they can have a home of their own and no longer be disturbed. Wicked people will not oppress them anymore, as they did at the beginning 11 and have done ever since the time I appointed leaders over my people Israel. I will also give you rest from all your enemies.

Psalm 95:11 So I declared on oath in my anger, ‘They shall never enter my rest.’”
thanks :)
this some kind of think the "sabbath for man," was to be taken as a gift - you could say Hi to O...
Well Saved With Christ Now You Passed The Sabbath. and Is Told To Love! :)
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
#15
How is eating bread from priests and eating grain on the sabbath the same?
Israel went into captivity for two major sins...

Eze 20:24 Because they had not executed my judgments, but had despised my statutes, and had polluted my sabbaths, and their eyes were after their fathers' idols.

Sabbath breaking and idolatry.

So the Pharisees came up with fences around these Laws, they went to extremes over and above the Law to protect people from getting close to breaking the Law. Christ condemned these "traditions of men"...

Mar 7:1 Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem.
Mar 7:2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault.
Mar 7:3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.
Mar 7:4 And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables.
Mar 7:5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
Mar 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mar 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#16
David was in need, took of the shewbread and ate. Need breaks the Law
The priests that was doing the sacrifices on the Sabbath was doing physical labor. Necessity breaks the Law.
Elsewhere Jesus which of you who's ox falls into the pit will not rescue it on the Sabbath?
There are circumstances, whether hunger, work related, life & death matters
where it was permissible ["the Sabbath was made for man"] to break the Sabbath law

UNIVERSAL SABBATH

Nowhere is it written that the Sabbath was made for the Jew, but for man
"some read man there as jew," they say.
"i Can Confess Christ" :p
to Him the peoples had their hopes placed HALLELUJAH.
Fear He...
CHRIST SAVING LOVE ;)
 

Nick01

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2013
1,272
26
48
#17
To the OP, very simply:

David and his gang ate the sacred bread in the Temple, which it was not permitted for people to eat, because they were hungry and were in need, and this was more important than the sanctity rules of the Temple

In the same way, the disciples picking and eating on the Sabbath is permitted because the point of the rules (in David's example, the Temple, in this case, the Sabbath) is not to cause people to go hungry, or to die, or to be subjected to arbitrary burden, but to cause people to rest.

Stopping people picking grain, or stopping people eating sacred brea, does not serve the ultimate purposes of the the rules that people use to prevent those activities, which are to be obedient and to serve God, and to serve each other. The Sabbath is made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#18
Mark 2:25-28 ESV

And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did, when he was in need and was hungry, he and those who were with him: how he entered the house of God, in the time of Abiathar the high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and also gave it to those who were with him?” And he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.”

Can someone explain these verses to me? Why does Jesus use David as an example?
To both Jews and Christians Scripture is (or is expected to be) authoritative.

Since before the Babylonian Captivity, there has been a written body of Rabbinic tradition (now called the Talmud), that politically motivated people in leadership elevated to the same authority as Scripture.

Jesus was trying to teach two principles:

1) Rabbinic commentary does NOT have the authority of Scripture.

2) Moral principles drawn from the Spirit of the Law are of greater value than the fine points of the letter of the Law.

What David did was an illustration of both principles.

I hope this helps.
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#19
To the OP, very simply:

David and his gang ate the sacred bread in the Temple, which it was not permitted for people to eat, because they were hungry and were in need, and this was more important than the sanctity rules of the Temple

In the same way, the disciples picking and eating on the Sabbath is permitted because the point of the rules (in David's example, the Temple, in this case, the Sabbath) is not to cause people to go hungry, or to die, or to be subjected to arbitrary burden, but to cause people to rest.

Stopping people picking grain, or stopping people eating sacred brea, does not serve the ultimate purposes of the the rules that people use to prevent those activities, which are to be obedient and to serve God, and to serve each other. The Sabbath is made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
"thinks SOME were at home With Love. naturally free to run around any time, anywhere" :)
 
S

sveinen

Guest
#20
"thinks SOME were at home With Love. naturally free to run around any time, anywhere" :)
strangers to greed, really...

..and to quick to arise discussion which disciples were With Life In The Fields :p - Life Was Present :)