BE RAPTURE READY

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MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#21
1 Th 4:14-17
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV

Here we have evidence of the elect being caught up to be with the Lord. The wording here admittedly can be interpreted as either the second coming or a separate event.


Mt 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
KJV


and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other

This appears to indicate that the elect are in heaven to be gathered BEFORE the second coming.


Rv 19:11-14
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
KJV

And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses The armies which were in heaven admittedly could be angelic; and angels are likely included; but the previously cited scripture strongly suggests that the elect are included.

We now have a doctrinal foundation for belief in a rapture that preceeds the second coming.


The words which are translated as tribulation are: צַּ֣ר (Tsar) (Dt 4:30) and θλῖψις (thlipsis) (Mt 24:21)

In all cases, (other than the great tribulation of Revelation) both these words refer to persecution of God's faithful by the world. I do NOT believe that the Church will experience the wrath of God; but may very well experience the wrath of man.

I therefore believe that the rapture will be either pre-trib or pre-wrath.
 

PlainWord

Senior Member
Jun 11, 2013
7,080
151
63
#23
1 Th 4:14-17
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV

Here we have evidence of the elect being caught up to be with the Lord. The wording here admittedly can be interpreted as either the second coming or a separate event.


Mt 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
KJV


and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other

This appears to indicate that the elect are in heaven to be gathered BEFORE the second coming.


Rv 19:11-14
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
KJV

And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses The armies which were in heaven admittedly could be angelic; and angels are likely included; but the previously cited scripture strongly suggests that the elect are included.

We now have a doctrinal foundation for belief in a rapture that preceeds the second coming.



The words which are translated as tribulation are: צַּ֣ר (Tsar) (Dt 4:30) and θλῖψις (thlipsis) (Mt 24:21)

In all cases, (other than the great tribulation of Revelation) both these words refer to persecution of God's faithful by the world. I do NOT believe that the Church will experience the wrath of God; but may very well experience the wrath of man.

I therefore believe that the rapture will be either pre-trib or pre-wrath.
What doctrinal foundation is that? There is no mention of any return of either GOD or Jesus before Satan's Great Tribulation. You said it yourself and I quote:

In all cases, (other than the great tribulation of Revelation) both these words refer to persecution of God's faithful by the world.

The above statement is 100% true. Satan comes first and he comes to deceive and to kill. God actually has to put a stop to it by shortening those days otherwise there would be no flesh left alive.
 

my_adonai_

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2012
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#24
If you're referring to me, then I always choose not to believe unscriptural nonsense like the alleged "pre-tribulation rapture" which isn't taught anywhere in the Bible.
If you say so..
 

my_adonai_

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2012
818
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#25
[video=youtube_share;V7IK2Ztm1RA]http://youtu.be/V7IK2Ztm1RA[/video]

This.......?
I am guessing this mockery, or trying to be funny..
 

my_adonai_

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2012
818
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#26
Luk_13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,021
222
63
#27
Whenever these rapture threads come up, I like to simply say that I don't believe in rapture, and it's not Biblical unless you try REALLY hard to make it that way.

That is all.
 
S

Saved2004

Guest
#28
Rapture ready is simply being born again and following Christ, thats all. When rapture happens it will happen. Simple really.
I agree. As according to Jesus no one knows when he is coming back, and that includes rapture, or when he gathers his church.
The most important thing is to know that you are "Born Again" and saved, then you are ready for anything. Personally, it is more urgent to be ready because the likely-hood of you dying and being transported into God's spirit world is more likely to happen sooner than the "rapture".
 
S

Saved2004

Guest
#29
Whenever these rapture threads come up, I like to simply say that I don't believe in rapture, and it's not Biblical unless you try REALLY hard to make it that way.

That is all.
So, you don't believe that Jesus gathers his church prior to Tribulation?
 
S

Sophia

Guest
#31
Post trib, pre wrath.
No 3rd Coming needed.

We are gathered to His side AT His Coming. We are the army that descends with Him, both dead and alive in Christ. Instantly changed. New bodies and new clothes, and arrayed for battle.

It fits the OT understanding of Messiah saving Israel from it's enclosing enemies,
and fits the NT revealing of the Resurrection at His Coming, and glorious conquest unto restoration.
And fits that we are not to experience His Wrath, as we will be alongside Him as Judges.
 
M

Marian29

Guest
#32
RAPTURE SCENARIOS AND HOW MANY WILL BE LEFT BEHIND
(MUST READ AND SHARE)

As I was sharing the word of God from Matthew 22:1-14, I was shuttered and stunned to see many scenarios of people who call themselves born again and yet who will eventually, be found in one group or the other as described below; they will all be left behind as the Lord explained UNLESS SERIOUS REPENTANCE IS FILED BEFORE THE LORD. For many are called but few are chosen (Mat. 22:14)
I also saw a vision where many birds (like eagles) were trying to fly but they all had overweight stones tied to their legs with ropes. They were all making the attempt to fly but could not. They would take off from the ground for flight but unfortunately, they would fall back to the ground.
When I saw this, I instructed the Brethren in the group to pray to the Father, Most Powerful God, to change the situation even at the last second; then I heard the Lord say: It does not work like that. It must be a love relationship. If anyone does not love me, how can he come to My kingdom? As you know fully well, I require a clean, pure as crystal and holy bride. Not less than that. No one with a small fox will enter My Kingdom, for I am Holy and My Kingdom is for My Holy Children. Song of Solomon 2: 15 Catch for us the foxes, the little foxes that ruin the vineyards, our vineyards that are in bloom.
So many Christians are still struggling with foxes (Sins) and little foxes (Little sins). This is a dangerous situation for the Church. REPENT AND REMOVE FROM AMONG YOURSELVES THE FOXES AND THE LITTLE FOXES THAT WILL RUIN YOUR RAPTURE READINESS.
During the mid-night prayers, as we stood in the gap and implored God’s mercy and compassion and cried out inrepentance on behalf of the Church, a member of the Team had a vision in which he saw many stars in the heavens. So many of the stars had crosses (X) on them but very few were clean.
If you find yourself in the scenario below, please repent seriously and seek HOLINESS, RIGHTEOUSNESS AND endeavor to be OBEDIENT UNTO THE LORD.
SCENARIOS OF LEFT-BEHINDS:
I. PASTORS AND SERVANTS OF GOD
1. Many Pastors will be engulfed in power struggle; Pastors and deacons and the boards of deacons will be locked up in a fierce power struggle. WHILE THE DEACONS WILL BE CONSPIRING TO REMOVE THE PASTOR FROM THE CHURCH AND REPLACE HIM WITH ANOTHER, THE RAPTURE WILL FIND THEM IN THESE FIGHTS AND THEY WILL BE LEFT BEHIND. James 4:1-2 From whence come wars and fightings among you? Come they not hence, even of your lusts that war in your members? Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
2. Many Pastors and Servants of God are busy enlarging their coasts to perpetuate their stay on earth. As a result of fights between pastors and servants of God on who should lead, who should be the senior to bring others under their control, the rapture will take place and catch them unawares in these situations and they will be left behind; Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless.
3. Many Pastors will be boasting of huge crowds of people attending their churches and they will take the glory for themselves for having won all those souls. In the process, they will end up persecuting others, bickering about each other as to who has how much power and who is a false servant and who is not. At that point their lives will be compromised with self-glory then the rapture will take place and they will be left behind. 2 Timothy 2:23 Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels.
4. Many pastors are involved in deceitful speech, slander and even many are divided and they have not yet asked each other for forgiveness. They will remain in this state until the rapture finds them and they will be left behind. I Peter 3: 10-13For, whoever would love life and see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from deceitful speech. He must turn from evil and do good; he must seek peace and pursue it. For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous and his ears are attentive to their prayer, but the face of the Lord is against those who do evil. Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good?
5. Many Pastors have married Mammon and are seeking to enlarge their coast everywhere and as a result, they are selling even the anointing oil to get money. These ones will also be left behind. Matthew 6:24 No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.
6. Many Pastors and servants of God are having marital problems and their wives cannot submit or obey, as a result, they have unsolved problems and this is a reason for them to be left behind. Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. Titus 2:5 to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, to be kind, and to be subject to their husbands, so that no one will malign the word of God.
II. GENERAL CROWD
1. Many Christians are struggling with rooted demonic problems and it seems hard for them to live a holy, pure and clean life, they will be in the process of seeking help from other brethren to be set free from these chains and sins when the rapture will take place and they, eventually, will be left behind. Thus says the Lord: Tell them to seek help from me straight, tell them to direct their attention to the Word of God and repent urgently.
2. Many Christians have one sin or the other clinging to them (unforgiveness, bitterness, fornication, impurity, lies, sexual lust and unconfessed sins) and while in this state, the rapture will take place and they will be left behind. Song of Solomon 2: 15 Catch for us the foxes, the little foxes that ruin the vineyards, our vineyards that are in bloom.
3. Many Christians will be found driving in the highways with expired car documents when the police will stop them. They will be in the process of lying to the Police to escape from paying the fine. At that very moment, the rapture will take place like lightning and they will be left behind.
4. Many Christians are still in gross and premeditated rebellion and disobedience to the Lord. They will be criticizing others, evaluating and judging the messages being preached out of the pulpits and belittling others when the rapture will take place and they will all be left behind.
III. TO YOUNG PEOPLE:
1. Many young Christians sing in choirs in churches but have double lives, abominable things, filthy sexual impurities, vanity, pride, and all sorts of sins and until now they are still waiting for a day to repent. Before that day arrives the rapture will take place and they will be left behind; Revelation 17:4 The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet, and was glittering with gold, precious stones and pearls. She held a golden cup in her hand, filled with abominable things and the filth of her adulteries.
2. Many young Christians will be at school and college having fun, loving and talking on Facebook and loving it more than Christ; they will adore technology be full of vanity, depicting adolescent behaviors contrary to the teachings of Christ due to peer-pressure. They will be arguing about worldly things and lying to each other, when the rapture will take place and they will be left behind; I John 1:15-16 Do not love this world nor the things it offers you, for when you love the world, you do not have the love of the Father in you. For the world offers only a craving for physical pleasure, a craving for everything we see, and pride in our achievements and possessions. These are not from the Father, but are from this world.
3. Many young Christians will be in full-fledged pride parades and glorying in themselves, parading in admiration in front of mirrors admiring their own beauties and trading in the commerce of the great mother of Babylon and Jezebel at the time of the rapture and as a result they will be left behind. Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall. Revelation 18:2 with a mighty voice he shouted: "Fallen! Fallen is Babylon the Great! She has become a home for demons and a haunt for every evil spirit, a haunt for every unclean and detestable bird.
IV. TO WIVES AND COUPLES:
1. Many wives show caprices or tricks in their marital homes. These are forms of manipulations or control towards their husbands, and when they will be in the process of doing this, the rapture will take place and they will be left behind.
2. Many wives manage the sexual activity in their marriage; they only have intimacy when they want, and because of this the husbands lust after others. These couples have serious problems consider obeying I Corinthians 7:1 Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
•LUST OF THE FLESH AND THE EYES: Men think that they must manage and relate with their wives when they want or desire and because of this, they will be left behind. 1Co 7:2 nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.
•THE BODY OF THE WO MAN BELONGS TO THE HUSBAND: couples deprive themselves of this blessed relationship and because of this; they are not qualified to be raptured. 1Co 7:3 Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.
•YOU BELONG TO EACH OTHER (WIFE CANNOT SAY NO TO THE HUSBAND NOR EVEN THE HUSBAND OVER HIS OWN BODY): Couples think that they can do whatever they want and because of disobedience to this verse, couples will be left behind. 1Co 7:4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.
•DEFRAUD NOT EACH OTHER: couples defraud each other concerning sex and they think they will be raptured; it does not work like that. 1Co 7:5 Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.
Because of the above many will be left behind.
3. Many wives will be in the process of waiting for their husbands to ask forgiveness about situations that arose in their marital homes; while considering talking things over, the rapture will take place and they will have no time to neither ask forgiveness nor even talk things over.
4. Couples with marital problems:
•FINANCIAL POBLEMS: The wife has a job and is well paid and she feels and thinks that she is independent and therefore the husband should not dictate or give rules in the house, so she is overly proud and imposing her rules in the house;
•PROBLEMS OF UNSUBMISSIVENESS OF THE WIFE and Husband trying to impose himself as the man in the house;
The will be at a Pastoral counseling in the Church and there will be many others waiting to receive counseling when the Rapture will take place and all of them will be left behind.
5. Many engaged Christians (Fiancée hood) will be in the process of visiting each other and caressing and kissing to satisfy the lust of their flesh when all of a sudden, like lightening, the rapture will take place and they will be left behind.
This is very serious brethren!!!!!!! Change your ways and start living a Holy and pure Life. The Lord is calling for serious, unadulterated and pure dedication in order to walk with Him in Holiness and obedience.
God bless you,The Postman of the Lord, Bro. Augusto
very watchful thread, thanks for posting it. May the Lord guide us through His will, and path, so we won't be confused by this passing world...

by the way, just noticed, the Bible verse you mentioned in the "III TO YOUNG PEOPLE" topic, item 2, instead of 1 John 1:15-16, it is indeed 1 John 2:15-16...

God bless!... :)
 
S

Sophia

Guest
#33
Hebrews 3:13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called "Today," so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

Tomorrow is not guaranteed us. TODAY is the day of Salvation, and every day we are to renew our minds in Christ.
Death is just as imminent as Rapture. Rapture is not the focus of our preparation. Rapture is for only one generation. The Resurrection is for all generations.

Prepare your hearts and minds for the Resurrection, and you will be prepared also for the Rapture if it comes during your days. Escape theory is not helpful in instructing in righteousness, as the Apostles did not use such things when instructing the brethren in righteousness. Stick to the Biblical motivation for pursuing holiness.

BE RESURRECTION READY
 
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Feb 7, 2015
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#34
Hebrews 3:13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called "Today," so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

Tomorrow is not guaranteed us. TODAY is the day of Salvation, and every day we are to renew our minds in Christ.
Death is just as imminent as Rapture. Rapture is not the focus of our preparation. Rapture is for only one generation. The Resurrection is for all generations.

Prepare your hearts and minds for the Resurrection, and you will be prepared also for the Rapture if it comes during your days. Escape theory is not helpful in instructing in righteousness, as the Apostles did not use such things when instructing the brethren in righteousness. Stick to the Biblical motivation for pursuing holiness.
Even though I think "The Rapture" is man's fictional myth, the rest of this post is so true.
 
S

Sophia

Guest
#35
Even though I think "The Rapture" is man's fictional myth, the rest of this post is so true.
In the sense of it being "pre-trib", I agree with you.
In the sense of those alive being Raptured (caught up and instantly transformed) at Christ's Return, it is true and stated plainly.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#36
In the sense of it being "pre-trib", I agree.
In the sense of those alive being Raptured (caught up and instantly transformed) at Christ's Return, it is true and stated plainly.
That, also, is true, but it is not "The Rapture" theory invented in the 1500's... it is simply the method Jesus will use to transport us homeward.
 

PlainWord

Senior Member
Jun 11, 2013
7,080
151
63
#37
Hebrews 3:13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called "Today," so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

Tomorrow is not guaranteed us. TODAY is the day of Salvation, and every day we are to renew our minds in Christ.
Death is just as imminent as Rapture. Rapture is not the focus of our preparation. Rapture is for only one generation. The Resurrection is for all generations.

Prepare your hearts and minds for the Resurrection, and you will be prepared also for the Rapture if it comes during your days. Escape theory is not helpful in instructing in righteousness, as the Apostles did not use such things when instructing the brethren in righteousness. Stick to the Biblical motivation for pursuing holiness.

BE RESURRECTION READY
The Rapture comes at the end of earth, on the very last day, after the Tribulation, after the millennium. We don't even need to be thinking about the Rapture as it will not occur in our lifetimes.
 
P

popeye

Guest
#38
I prefer the resurrection (so did Paul, I Cor 15) since the word resurrection does not imply or has not been misconstrued as some "secret" event that occurs prior to the Tribulation. The church is NOT removed from the earth during the Tribulation but rather it is protected in a place of safety.

The "secret rapture" was originally congealed and taught by Francisco Ribera in the mid 1500's AD and then popularized by John Nelson Darby in/around 1830AD.
That dead saint rabbit trail has dust on it.

Anyway,why did Jesus gather his Jewish remnant in rev 14, in strict disobedience to 1 thes 4????

Is it a misprint?

Was Paul wrong,or was Jesus wrong?
 

PlainWord

Senior Member
Jun 11, 2013
7,080
151
63
#39
To me the issue isn't whether or not there is a Rapture (catching up of believers) it is when the rapture takes place. Paul teaches quite clearly that the Rapture happens just after the resurrection.

1 Thes 4: ...that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.

John confirms that the resurrection comes before the Return of the Lord.

Rev 11: [SUP]11 [/SUP]Now after the three-and-a-half days the breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and great fear fell on those who saw them. [SUP]12 [/SUP]And they heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, “Come up here.”

The Rapture is always associated with the Return of the Lord. But notice, the Rapture is NEVER associated with the Great Tribulation. These two events are not linked by any scripture. However, the Return of the Lord is linked to His Wrath which comes after the Great Tribulation of Israel.

Key Chronology of End Time Events:

1. Children of Israel attacked where they have been scattered for 1900 years.
2. Israel Restored to the Land
3. Gospel is preached to all Nations
4. Tribulation = Overwhelming attack on the Church where 1/3 of all Christians are killed
5. Great Tribulation = The final massive attack on Israel by evil forces to its North which follow the Mother of all False Religions
6. God' Wrath = Comes in Response and is aimed only on those who attacked Israel and the wicked
7. Resurrection
8. Return of the Lord
9. Rapture
10. Judgment
11. Reign

You see, the Rapture is after the Resurrection. The Resurrection does not happen until after the Power of the Holy People has been completely shattered which occurs by the Great Tribulation. Dan 12 confirms this.

Dan 12: [SUP]2 [/SUP]And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, Some to everlasting life, Some to shame and everlasting contempt...and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.

The Power of the Holy People (Israel) has to be completely shattered before the Resurrection. Since the Resurrection happens after Israel has been completely shattered, the Rapture must come after the Great Tribulation of Israel.
 
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