Forced health care vs religous beliefs

InSpiritInTruth · Mar 3, 2015

I was reading in the news this morning about hundreds of parents being arrested in Pakistan over refusal of meds for their children against polio. Here's the article Pakistan arrests parents for refusing children's polio vaccinations

We here in the US already have a type of forced health care, but how many believe the government has the right to force people to take meds, even if it is against their religous beliefs?

MarcR · Mar 3, 2015

You have a valid concern imo.

kennethcadwell · Mar 3, 2015

I don't believe the government has the right to force people to take meds if they do not want to, or if it is against their religious beliefs. However I would also add that for those who do not believe in meds to have common sense and think about the well being of others. If you do not like meds do not put other people's life in jeopardy.
I saw a story just a little while back where a women's baby died from catching the disease from another woman's child because that woman refused to vaccinate her kids, and still took them out in public while being sick. The woman lost her child for the insensitivity of another woman for not vaccinating hers and still going to a public park putting other kids at risk.

3Scoreand10 · Mar 3, 2015

I don't like for the government to force anybody to do anything.
But I also think it is irresponsible for parents to put their kids at risk when God has given doctors the knowledge and medicine to prevent some diseases.
I think their religious convections on this matter are wrong.
Protect your kids.

p_rehbein · Mar 3, 2015

InSpiritInTruth said:

Constitutionally speaking, the Courts have held that the Government does have the right when doing so protects the health of the greater population. And I can understand that. Were it not for the Government mandated vaccinations of Americas school age youth in the 50's and up, Polio, and many other deadly diseases would still be rampant within our society.

Speaking ONLY about the US. If a parent or parents do NOT want their child/children vaccinated, then they have only to opt out of the Public Education System and Home-school their child/children. That way, their religious beliefs are protected, and so is the general population of Americas youth.

InSpiritInTruth · Mar 3, 2015

p_rehbein said:

Sounds like some law makers in California are trying to remove the personal and religious beliefs option as well....
CaliFornia SB 277 mandatory vaccinations - CALIFORNIA SB 277 Mandated Vaccination EVERY CHILD in California

Here's a quote from the article "Thus, every resident in the state of CA from preschool to the age of 18 will be forced to be vaccinated with every mandated vaccine in order to reside here and to be eligible for any public, private, or home school. Since education is compulsory, opting for no schooling will not be an option. When vaccine mandates are law, the only way a parent can protect their children from the known and unknown dangers of vaccines and/or from the known and unknown problems with the current vaccine schedule is through the use of exemptions. If SB 277 passes, there will soon be no more exemptions for such protections.

This bill would eliminate the right of parents to opt out of any vaccines for their children for personal or religious reasons. As a result, unless a child has a medical reason for not receiving a particular vaccine (which essentially means that the child can prove damage by a vaccine), children will be forcibly injected with every vaccine the government deems appropriate."

InSpiritInTruth · Mar 3, 2015

MarcR said:

Yea, I guess if it were shown like having to bow down to "their gods" then it might be viewed differently. lol

dcontroversal · Mar 3, 2015

I was vaccinated as a young child and even had a small pox vaccination...dont know if it will cause probems of not...2 years to the big 50 and seem ok and didnt lose my ability to walk, get sick, die etc.......My kid has a compromised lung and gets Pnumavax to keep him from getting Pnumonia (spelling?) He has also been vaccinated against RSV, chickenpox, and a few other things...not by governmental direction, but rather by suggestion and choice.......!

Angela53510 · Mar 3, 2015

It is ridiculous this anti-vaccine nonsense that is being propagated on place like FB.

I remember polio. The son of a man my father worked with got it, in the early 50's. I remember the braces on his legs, and how he could not run. I remember my high school guidance counselor had braces on his legs in the 60's because he had polio and was never able to walk properly

We won't go into all the people who died, or had to live out their lives in iron lungs. Google that, if you think individual freedom runs to infecting other people with a deadly disease, because you didn't take a simple vaccine that could have saved your child's life and others.

I had red measles and almost died. There was no vaccine available then. I made sure my children were vaccinated, and they never got those diseases. I only wish there was a vaccine for chicken pox as shingles has made my adult life hardly worth living FOUR TIMES!

Individual freedom does not extend to stupidity, and spreading of diseases which can easily be prevented. Diphtheria used to kill thousands, including in North America.

Pakistan is obviously falling under the spell of the media of stupidity, in which lies and more lies pass for truth.

I had all my children fully vaccinated, and just had the pneumovax vaccine. It has saved my husband's life on several occasions, as he has no spleen, and almost died twice in the days before the vaccine was available. Not that it is standard.

I remember the small pox vaccine. I got quite sick, and I have a scar to this day from it. I was part of the last generation that had the small pox vaccine before the disease was eradicated from the earth. I would give it to my children and grandchildren in a heart beat, if small pox suddenly spread again.

These diseases are very serious, and if people do not want the vaccines, then they need to be isolated from the rest of humanity. The more I hear this nonsense, the more I want to puke!

Vaccines are not about religious beliefs. It is about the public health of the whole world. The sooner people wake up and realize this, the sooner these serious diseases can be stopped from destroying the lives of millions of people.

Angela53510 · Mar 3, 2015

Just read the article. More nonsense by the Taliban???

Really, in a forum that totally condemns everything that Islam is and does, you think they have the right to refuse vaccinations for a hideous and dangerous disease??

Now I have heard everything!

DesiredHaven · Mar 3, 2015

kennethcadwell said:

I dont get it, if the child at the park was vaccinated why did the child die because the other one was not vaccinated?

What made the other child die (if that child was vacinated against what the sick one had?)

RickyZ · Mar 3, 2015

InSpiritInTruth said:

What kind of forced health care in the US are you talking about? The kind where if you get sick and have no insurance, I am forced to pay your bill for you thru my insurance and taxes? How about we do it the free-market way ... no money no treatment?

ThomistColin · Mar 4, 2015

Here's the thing...if we are talking about diseases like TB or Polio. The government, and all citizens, have a responsibility to get vaccinated. These two diseases alone spread like wild fire, and were almost entirely wiped out in the past century. So, yes, I do believe there are certain medications and vaccinations that should be mandatory.

posthuman · Mar 4, 2015

i don't believe being compelled to be vaccinated against infectious diseases is tantamount to being marked by the beast.

isn't it the duty of a citizen to restrain himself from harming his neighbor?

posthuman · Mar 4, 2015

if i burn my field in a fallow year and i don't constrain the fire from spreading,

surely i sin against the whole town.

Nick01 · Mar 4, 2015

I have 'forced' health care in Australia. Doesn't bother me. Similarly, doesn't bother me that I got polio, diptheria, and tetanus injections when a baby (didn't get the full whooping cough vaccine because I reacted to that part of the course). In the second case, particularly, it is one of those things where large numbers of people need to take it, otherwise the benefits are exponentially lessened the more people who are not immunised.

wwjd_kilden · Mar 4, 2015

as long as forced health care does not extent to keeping people alive against their will I think it makes sense ,
as in when used to protect the "pack". Many of the diseases that were more or less wiped out are coming back, because people stop giving their children vaccines. This is a threat to those who cannot get them due to allergies or diseases that mess up their immune system. I think it is selfish to not get the "basic" vaccinations if one can safely take them

4enlightment · Mar 4, 2015

InSpiritInTruth said:

Almost prophetically, Thomas Jefferson gave us this warning: "If people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." Remember, this statement was made about 100 years before there ever even was an FDA!

Learn more: The Bible condemns drugs and says to use herbs as medicine (Opinion) - NaturalNews.com

If they want to be the parent, then they should be totally responsible for our well-being, but not going into one direction by taking from their children and not giving back. They'd approved food that isn't good for our bodies to help those that has gotten them into office like the bio tech cooperation, and to tell us to eat up and shut up about the so called foods that we doesn't know what we are eating, and then doesn't want their checks to be reduced, and so they makes the tax payers and the poor that help them to receive that government check, to pay for their own healthcare to covered the illnesses that comes from the foods that we eat that they'd approved. And so if they want to play the role of being Big Daddy, then they should play it all the way.

At least they should let us to track down what is making us sick, so that we doesn't have to bankrupt our healthcare insurance company.

People should get involve:

Coalition of States for GMO Labeling

p_rehbein · Mar 4, 2015

InSpiritInTruth said:

First thought........this Bill must pass......then must stand up to the appeals that will follow if it does pass......neither of which is a certainly.

Second thought........I do not see children being FORCIBLY injected......as in the Police hunting them down, handcuffing them, taking them to a Medical Facility and holding them down while someone jabs a needle in their arm. Could be wrong, but I don't see that happening. This kind of Government implementation of programs is what would lead up to parents and possible kids being gunned down by Police for resisting their attempts to apprehend the wee criminals and have them injected.

InSpiritInTruth · Mar 4, 2015

They say it's all about protecting the children, but is it really? Lets look at some numbers.....

Abortions in the United States

Total number of abortions in the U.S. 1973-2011: 54.5 million+

234 abortions per 1,000 live births (according to the Centers for Disease Control)
Abortions per year: 1.2 million
Abortions per day: 3,288
Abortions per hour: 137
9 abortions every 4 minutes
1 abortion every 26 seconds

These statistics include only surgical and medical abortions. Because many contraceptive measures are abortifacients (drugs that induce or cause abortions), it is important not to overlook the number of children killed by chemical abortions. Since 1965, an average of 11 million women have used abortifacient methods of birth control in the United States at any given time. Using formulas based on the way the birth control pill works, pharmacy experts project that about 14 million chemical abortions occur in the United States each year, providing a projected total of well in excess of 610 million chemical abortions between 1965 and 2009.

Now let's look at some Polio stats for US.

How common was polio in the United States?

"Polio was one of the most dreaded childhood diseases of the 20th century in the United States. Periodic epidemics occurred since the late 19th century and they increase in size and frequency in the late 1940s and early 1950s. An average of over 35,000 cases were reported during this time period. With the introduction of Salk inactivated poliovirus vaccine (IPV) in 1955, the number of cases rapidly declined to under 2,500 cases in 1957. By 1965, only 61 cases of paralytic polio were reported. Less than 1% of polio cases result in paralysis of the limbs (usually the legs). Of those cases resulting in paralysis, 5-10% of the patients die when the respiratory muscles are paralyzed. The risk of paralysis increases with age."

So according to those numbers from the CDC there has been over 60 million children murdered by surgical abortion, and more than 610 million children killed by chemical abortion during that time, and as we know abortion is allowed by "choice" and is legal.

But the numbers of polio cases at there highest point in the US pale in comparison, with only a small fraction of those infected (less than 1%) actually resulting in paralysis, and even a smaller percentage of those actually dying from the disease. (abortion has a 100% kill rate)

So it's legal and by choice to kill millions, but they want to remove all choice when it comes to injections, because after all, it's all about the children. Right! LOL

Forced health care vs religous beliefs

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