You will not get out until you have paid the last penny?

[OwenHeidenreich]

Before this turns into a "hell doesn't exist" thread, I want to address the fact that I believe in eternal hell.

Is this parable about hell? If so, why does Jesus reference a "getting out" if it is for ever and ever?

57 “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right? 58 As you are going with your adversary to the magistrate, try hard to be reconciled on the way, or your adversary may drag you off to the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison. 59 I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.”

 

[resurrection33]

Before this turns into a "hell doesn't exist" thread, I want to address the fact that I believe in eternal hell.

Is this parable about hell? If so, why does Jesus reference a "getting out" if it is for ever and ever?

57 “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?58 As you are going with your adversary to the magistrate, try hard to be reconciled on the way, or your adversary may drag you off to the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison.59 I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.”

I believe hell is the way the Lord disciplines us. When the discipline is complete, you are released. The Lord is as gentle to us as possible, but some people don't want to make the effort to learn, and the Lord needs to be more severe with them.

 

[DesiredHaven]

In Mat 18:30 a fellow servant handed one over to prison and the Lord of that servant handed him over to the tormentors, that verse was for the discples whose Heavenly Father would do to them if they did not forgive their brethren from their hearts.

In that picture it shows the Father handing any of us over to the tormentors for it, and there (until) one pays all.

I had a post on this one

 

[dcontroversal]

I believe hell is the way the Lord disciplines us. When the discipline is complete, you are released. The Lord is as gentle to us as possible, but some people don't want to make the effort to learn, and the Lord needs to be more severe with them.

Two points to ponder...

1. The smoke of their torment "ascendeth forever and ever" does not jive with getting out....
2. There is a way to (get out) of hell and that is to never go there to begin with...trust into Jesus Christ as your savior......!

 

[breno785au]

I believe hell is the way the Lord disciplines us. When the discipline is complete, you are released. The Lord is as gentle to us as possible, but some people don't want to make the effort to learn, and the Lord needs to be more severe with them.

I thought the debt was unpayable? As in too large for us to pay off, that's where Jesus steps in.

 

[DesiredHaven]

I thought the debt was unpayable? As in too large for us to pay off, that's where Jesus steps in.

His debt was was was forgiven though, it was the forgiven servant who became the wicked sevant

Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:

To me shows the robbery of the wicked given they dont pay again (in respects to paying mercy out)

The robbery of the wicked shall destroy them; because they refuse to do judgment.

Whereas the wicked mans Lord said, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:

Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?

See it?

The robbery of the wicked shall destroy them; because they refuse to do judgment.

What is true judgment?

Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Execute true judgment, and shew mercy and compassions every man to his brother:

And because he did not forgive his brother and his judgment being executed in the earth could very well teach such a one through chastisement (handed over to the tormentors)

The debt could be shown this way (since the mans own debt was paid first)

Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law

Like learning through chastisement to pay out mercy to others (which was already extended to him).

I never saw this as a lake of fire verse for the disciples though. This was how the Heaven Father would treat them if they didnt forgive one another, I see the tormentors as that which persuades them (through whatever tactic this is that is applied)

 

[Willie-T]

There is also the fact that what we interpreted "eternal" didn't necessarily meant forever in their languages.

 

[DesiredHaven]

There is also the fact that what we interpreted "eternal" didn't necessarily meant forever in their languages.

This is what I have

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Before this turns into a "hell doesn't exist" thread, I want to address the fact that I believe in eternal hell.

Is this parable about hell? If so, why does Jesus reference a "getting out" if it is for ever and ever?

57 “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?58 As you are going with your adversary to the magistrate, try hard to be reconciled on the way, or your adversary may drag you off to the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison.59 I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.”

This might help shed more light on the subject...

Matthew 5:21-25[SUP]21 [/SUP]Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison."

 

[kennethcadwell]

This passage has nothing to do with hell.
It is about the consequences that sin has while in the flesh, as some sins do have worldly consequences and if you break the rules of the land then if you can not work out an arrangement with the one/s you wronged then you will be brought before the worldly courts and have to serve whatever time they deem fit. This has nothing to do with judgment after death, and being sent to hell to be punished before getting eternal life. Believers do not get punished they miss out on rewards....

 

[DesiredHaven]

This might help shed more light on the subject...

Matthew 5:21-25[SUP]21 [/SUP]Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison."

You put this together well.

Yeah we must eat crow lol

 

[blue_ladybug]

You put this together well.

Yeah we must eat crow lol

crow is tough and gamey.. wait, what?

 

[KJV1611]

Before this turns into a "hell doesn't exist" thread, I want to address the fact that I believe in eternal hell.

Is this parable about hell? If so, why does Jesus reference a "getting out" if it is for ever and ever?

57 “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?58 As you are going with your adversary to the magistrate, try hard to be reconciled on the way, or your adversary may drag you off to the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison.59 I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.”

I think this passage is talking about both hell and life in the here and now. Matthew 5 gives a little more understanding to this than Luke does.

Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

This parable like all parables is written in symbolic language. The adversary is the accuser of the brethren, the judge is Moses or the law. Our adversary uses the law to accuse us. On the eternal level, if we agree with our adversary that we truly are guilty as charged of breaking the law then we avoid hell because Jesus paid the uttermost farthing for us.

On the temporal level, if we agree with our adversary that we are still guilty of breaking the law even after salvation and rest in the finished works of Jesus, then we avoid the prison of works salvation.

In both scenarios, we can't in and of ourselves pay the uttermost farthing, Jesus has to pay it.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

You put this together well.

Yeah we must eat crow lol

I did a great copy paste huh? LOL And eat crow? I had Robin once when I was a kid, and it was terrible! LOL My mom made me and brother eat a whole bunch of em after we both went on a shooting spree with our new Red Rider BB guns. LOL My mom taught us both a good lesson that day, don't shoot it unless your prepared to eat it.

 

[DesiredHaven]

crow is tough and gamey.. wait, what?

You've had it?

LOL!

 

[DesiredHaven]

I did a great copy paste huh? LOL And eat crow? I had Robin once when I was a kid, and it was terrible! LOL My mom made me and brother eat a whole bunch of em after we both went on a shooting spree with our new Red Rider BB guns. LOL My mom taught us both a good lesson that day, don't shoot it unless your prepared to eat it.

Im so glad your mom was your mom (and not mine) LOL

Thats gross, but I bet you were a real bad kid and your mom was desparate LOL

 

[Elin]

Before this turns into a "hell doesn't exist" thread, I want to address the fact that I believe in eternal hell.

Is this parable about hell? If so, why does Jesus reference a "getting out" if it is for ever and ever?

57 “Why don’t you judge for yourselves what is right?58 As you are going with your adversary to the magistrate, try hard to be reconciled on the way, or your adversary may drag you off to the judge, and the judge turn you over to the officer, and the officer throw you into prison.59 I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.”

That assumes fallen humanity can actually pay in full the debt they owe to God's justice.

 

[blue_ladybug]

You've had it?

LOL!

ewww, woman! no of course not..i was makin' a funny..

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Im so glad your mom was your mom (and not mine) LOL

Thats gross, but I bet you were a real bad kid and your mom was desparate LOL

My mom was a tough old bird herself when she got riled up, but I suppose, like the song goes, I might have been the only hell my Mama ever raised. LOL

 

[DesiredHaven]

ewww, woman! no of course not..i was makin' a funny..

Not literally (eat crow) you nut, figuratively (eat crow) LOL!

You might never have (even that way) but Im really good at it

I dont have to search my mind for a time and date Ive just plain lost count of them all LOL

Sigh... lol