Salvation Poll

[JesusIsAll]

Not usually posting threads, because they die on the vine (heavy traffic a half dozen posts, usually like, may as well, "You're insane..."), but this thread requires no long and drawn out refutations or epithets, is just a poll. If you'd like to comment, even if just for the opportunity to unload something evil, that's alright. Here is the proposition, true or false,

"If a person is saved, it will show in his life. We are not saved by keeping the commandments; we are not saved by walking as Jesus walked; we are not saved by loving our brother; but if we are saved, these things will be present in our lives."

Thank you if you chose to vote!

 

[Jimbone]

I voted "Yes", and it has been my experience that after regeneration we are made all new. Overnight everything changed and habits I have had my whole life no longer interest me, and I started seeing the world with all new eyes. Things I never even saw as “bad” or “wrong” were now set aside because He rearranged my priorities from the inside out. After going through this myself and seeing what He did to me I honestly don’t see how anyone can have God reveal Himself to them and not change completely.

 

[JesusIsAll]

I voted "Yes", and it has been my experience that after regeneration we are made all new. Overnight everything changed and habits I have had my whole life no longer interest me, and I started seeing the world with all new eyes. Things I never even saw as “bad” or “wrong” were now set aside because He rearranged my priorities from the inside out. After going through this myself and seeing what He did to me I honestly don’t see how anyone can have God reveal Himself to them and not change completely.

It sounds like you did better than me. My experience was it took some time to put away a few things, but it's not been my experience God allows us to not get to that radical change, brother! You never have real peace, until you're obedient.

And thank you for the vote. Of course, I'm also a true vote.

 

[Jimbone]

It sounds like you did better than me. My experience was it took some time to put away a few things, but it's not been my experience God allows us to not get to that radical change, brother! You never have real peace, until you're obedient.

And thank you for the vote. Of course, I'm also a true vote.

Thank you for the kind words, but honestly I didn't do anything but fail my whole life, then break. I have an extreme testimony that not everyone gets, but any change that happen was because of His spirit in me, to be honest it was when I realized how incapable of doing anything good I was that He came and saved me. I'm telling you man, it was like right out of the pages of the bible, and all this happened after I thought I was Christian for about 5 years, so the fact is when this happen I wasn’t seeking, I thought I already had Jesus. Here's my testimony for more details if curious, My testimony to Gods glory in my life. It's long but worth a read. It's a little long but a good example of His power to change even an ex-drug dealing, fornicating, selfish, arrogant, prideful, boastful, hateful, angry, degenerate like me. All glory for anything I’ve ever done that could even remotely be considered anything close to good, to Him, because I was lost without Him just like anyone is and am positive nothing would have changed at all without Him saving me.

 

[p_rehbein]

The POLL options are of no value.............nor is the premise of the statement in the OP.........as ONE is the causation and realization of the other........This is a "mind game" thread.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Thank you for the kind words, but honestly I didn't do anything but fail my whole life, then break. I have an extreme testimony that not everyone gets, but any change that happen was because of His spirit in me, to be honest it was when I realized how incapable of doing anything good I was that He came and saved me. I'm telling you man, it was like right out of the pages of the bible, and all this happened after I thought I was Christian for about 5 years, so the fact is when this happen I wasn’t seeking, I thought I already had Jesus. Here's my testimony for more details if curious, My testimony to Gods glory in my life. It's long but worth a read. It's a little long but a good example of His power to change even an ex-drug dealing, fornicating, selfish, arrogant, prideful, boastful, hateful, angry, degenerate like me. All glory for anything I’ve ever done that could even remotely be considered anything close to good, to Him, because I was lost without Him just like anyone is and am positive nothing would have changed at all without Him saving me.

I recall reading your stirring testimony and have heard many similar testimonies of making a cleaner break from extremes. It seems when you're just the average Joe, pursuing what would be a normal life, you can kid yourself into thinking what the world around you is doing is alright, especially when you see some bad habits given a pass in the Christian community. When you think of Paul, though he thought he was doing right, he was a pretty bad man, also having a most dramatic break with his previous life. Other than the Lord Himself, I don't know who else better carried out the gospel work of God, than Paul. Maybe the most perilous position is living in some gray area, thinking you're alright, when you're not? The Scribes and Pharisees in the Bible were the cat's meow to being law abiding and religious, and we know what our Lord Jesus had to say about them, worse than anything he ever said about any regular people. Anyway, I'll read your testimony again, Jimbone, as it is something, praise Jesus!

 

[Jimbone]

The POLL options are of no value.............nor is the premise of the statement in the OP.........as ONE is the causation and realization of the other........This is a "mind game" thread.

If you don't like it the door is right behind you, no need to come slinging mud for no reason.

 

[oldthennew]

Jimbone,

you speak of a well travelled road that so many of us can relate to.
our stories are numerous and for many beyond belief.

yes, over-night many things changed, but over-many years many more things
were routed out and began the change that resulted in the 'new-man's emergence.

 

[p_rehbein]

If you don't like it the door is right behind you, no need to come slinging mud for no reason.

Do you see any mud being slung? I don't. If you don't understand what I said, then ask for clarification. If you can't accept a critique of a post, then......hey, don't post.
t

 

[JesusIsAll]

The POLL options are of no value.............nor is the premise of the statement in the OP.........as ONE is the causation and realization of the other........This is a "mind game" thread.

Doesn't that mean a false, then, no value and a mind game? I'll take that as a false, because you can't then say it's true.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Do you see any mud being slung? I don't. If you don't understand what I said, then ask for clarification. If you can't accept a critique of a post, then......hey, don't post.
t

Honestly? I don't understand what you said, but, on the other hand, don't feel any compulsion for clarification. But if you insist, another "no value" going on for pages isn't a revolution around here, and you seem to be enjoying it, for some odd reason, no?

 

[oldthennew]

true horsemen know their reins -

a horses mouth is their life-line for survival......

 

[JesusIsAll]

true horsemen know their reins -

a horses mouth is their life-line for survival......

In the case of some horses, you think also their rears?

 

[Jimbone]

Jimbone,

you speak of a well travelled road that so many of us can relate to.
our stories are numerous and for many beyond belief.

yes, over-night many things changed, but over-many years many more things
were routed out and began the change that resulted in the 'new-man's emergence.

I absolutely agree, and I wasn't saying that to boast or anything, it was more for the people like my wife that were able to give their life to Him in a room alone. I just know my wife has felt bad because her regeneration wasn't as "big" as mine. I told her that in this world it may seem that way but when we are standing before the Lord giving our account, who's testimony would you rather have? Yours where you came to Him and submitted to His will and was saved in a quiet room alone, or mine where He had to beat me in the head over and over, then took a limb to show me I’m not all that great? I'd rather have hers on that day. I also realize that this is now a lifelong process and that we are to grow closer and gain understanding every day. I was not trying to put myself in a different class, or anything crazy like that, I was just trying to convey that I had an extreme case where it happen like that, and that not everyone goes through it like that in regards to when he said "It sounds like you did better than me". But I agree with your comment 100% and thank you for the kind words as well.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Thank you for the kind words, but honestly I didn't do anything but fail my whole life, then break. I have an extreme testimony that not everyone gets, but any change that happen was because of His spirit in me, to be honest it was when I realized how incapable of doing anything good I was that He came and saved me. I'm telling you man, it was like right out of the pages of the bible, and all this happened after I thought I was Christian for about 5 years, so the fact is when this happen I wasn’t seeking, I thought I already had Jesus. Here's my testimony for more details if curious, My testimony to Gods glory in my life. It's long but worth a read. It's a little long but a good example of His power to change even an ex-drug dealing, fornicating, selfish, arrogant, prideful, boastful, hateful, angry, degenerate like me. All glory for anything I’ve ever done that could even remotely be considered anything close to good, to Him, because I was lost without Him just like anyone is and am positive nothing would have changed at all without Him saving me.

Heavens! Your testimony expanded. Cool! Nice touch of technology there, a text document, click and downloaded. Thank you!

 

[p_rehbein]

Honestly? I don't understand what you said, but, on the other hand, don't feel any compulsion for clarification. But if you insist, another "no value" going on for pages isn't a revolution around here, and you seem to be enjoying it, for some odd reason, no?

I'm finding no pleasure in having to explain "salvation" on a Christian Forum. Where is there pleasure to be found in that? If your neck is so stiff that you can't receive criticism for a statement you made, then that is your problem.

Why didn't you research the Word of God before stating your assertion? Which was:


"If a person is saved, it will show in his life. We are not saved by keeping the commandments; we are not saved by walking as Jesus walked; we are not saved by loving our brother; but if we are saved, these things will be present in our lives."

Yes, these things WILL be present in the lives of believers. No, works salvation is not Biblical in my opinion. However, Jesus said on more than one occasion.................IF YOU LOVE ME, YOU WILL.............He also said HE THAT ENDURES........ and many other things which makes the choices in the POLL of no avail.........because either could be true, and either could be false. If you don't see that, then that's you........

Now, clearly, you were not completely sincere in the writing of your Original Post, for you said:

If you'd like to comment, even if just for the opportunity to unload something evil, that's alright. Here is the proposition, true or false,


You quickly invite unbelievers to comment, but you are upset when a believer takes issue? How is that sincere?

This pretty well sums it up:

Ephesians 2:8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 .) Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 .) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[JesusIsAll]

You quickly invite unbelievers to comment, but you are upset when a believer takes issue? How is that sincere?

Being Christian and saying evil things is not mutually exclusive, this you must very well know, at least it seems. Much of what is said here can be contentious and evil, and that was more a joke, than anything else. But, frankly, I don't care when somebody comes along, with underwear three sizes too small. After all, this is a personal problem, and not mine.

 

[MarcR]

p_rehbein,

I can understand your take but I don't share it. I see the poll as an attempt at clarifying the grace vs works argument.

The issue in question is do good works contribute to Salvation or stem from Salvation.

 

[p_rehbein]

p_rehbein,

I can understand your take but I don't share it. I see the poll as an attempt at clarifying the grace vs works argument.

The issue in question is do good works contribute to Salvation or stem from Salvation.

Brother Marc...............EXACTLY, and thus I commented the OP was a "mind game." It was simply a back door approach to YET ANOTHER thread arguing Grace vs. Works salvation. Is that a "sincere" approach to such an important issue? Not in my opinion. I fully support, teach, and live SALVATION BY THE GRACE OF GOD............but, I'm not going to try and back door the issue, and "muddy the waters" of such a debate by pretending something else.

He should have been honest enough in his beliefs to call the thread what it is..............

 

[JesusIsAll]

p_rehbein,

I can understand your take but I don't share it. I see the poll as an attempt at clarifying the grace vs works argument.

The issue in question is do good works contribute to Salvation or stem from Salvation.

The primary intent wasn't to clarify in terms of preaching, though, rather wanting to know where people stand on some things, as there's much legalism afoot, and I have seen statements made very contrary to the premises. This being the case, it's a bit surprising, and most pleasantly so, there are so many trues. But it was some honest "just wondering" what folks believe.