Question about Clean and Unclean Food

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Jesus4ever

Senior Member
May 18, 2015
783
19
18
#1
Dear brothers and sisters,

I know this may have been analysed before, but recently, I started to have questions about eating pork, rabbit and sea food. Well all know that Leviticus 11 tells us that these types of food are forbidden by God. However in the New Testament Jesus said:

- Mark 7:15 - There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

- Matthew 15:11 -
Not that which goes into the mouth defiles a man; but that which comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.


But Jesus also said:

- Matthew 5:17 - Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.



I know that some say that one should obey God´s law regarding Clean and Unclean food and others go for Mark 7:15 and Matthew 15:11. However, I´m not sure what to do. Until I have my answer, I´m stooped eating pork, seafood and I will stop eating rabbit.


What are you thoughts about this?


God bless!
 
Jan 7, 2015
6,057
78
0
#2
The clean and unclean beasts in the OT law hold a deeper spiritual meaning, but I won't get into that because most cannot receive it.

But yes, what Jesus said proves this. There is no food or drink that can enter into your mouth and defile your heart and mind, or defile your spirit. As natural food is for the belly, and the belly for natural food.

Paul said in Romans 14:14 "I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean."

So every man needs to be convinced in his own mind. I can tell you the same, that no food or drink will defile your heart, but you need to be convinced of it yourself. Because if it is not of faith by you, then you yourself might believe it to be sin.

But food and drink does not commend us to God. 1 Corinthians 8:8 "But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,011
212
63
#3
I find it inconsistent of God to call certain animals unclean and unfit for eating for thousands of years, just to change His mind and decide they're actually clean and fit for food.

God wasn't making a random declaration that some animals should be called clean or unclean. He was saying their very make-up and anatomy makes them unclean.

From a health stand-point, it's easy to see that the clean animal's anatomy allows it to be far better food than an unclean animals. I would say God knew what He was doing all along.
 
May 12, 2015
108
2
0
#4
And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

This is the only clean eating
 

Jesus4ever

Senior Member
May 18, 2015
783
19
18
#5
I find it inconsistent of God to call certain animals unclean and unfit for eating for thousands of years, just to change His mind and decide they're actually clean and fit for food.

God wasn't making a random declaration that some animals should be called clean or unclean. He was saying their very make-up and anatomy makes them unclean.

From a health stand-point, it's easy to see that the clean animal's anatomy allows it to be far better food than an unclean animals. I would say God knew what He was doing all along.

Well, you all know that pork is not the most clean meat to eat...! However, rabbit meat is, according to doctors, a good meat to eat. As for seafood, I really can´t tell. Some say shrimp and crab simply eat every thing in the ocean, like pigs eat everything (humans included)...
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,011
212
63
#6
Well, you all know that pork is not the most clean meat to eat...!
Especially when you consider what they eat: garbage and other animals' waste.

As for seafood, I really can´t tell. Some say shrimp and crab simply eat every thing in the ocean, like pigs eat everything (humans included)...
You're right. Shrimp, Crab, Lobster etc, are basically the cockroaches of the sea. You know the adage about what "always runs down hill?" Shrimp, etc. eat everything the falls to the bottom of the ocean.

No thanks.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#7
I find it inconsistent of God to call certain animals unclean and unfit for eating for thousands of years, just to change His mind and decide they're actually clean and fit for food.

God wasn't making a random declaration that some animals should be called clean or unclean. He was saying their very make-up and anatomy makes them unclean.

From a health stand-point, it's easy to see that the clean animal's anatomy allows it to be far better food than an unclean animals. I would say God knew what He was doing all along.
To a specific people during a specific time.
 
A

atwhatcost

Guest
#8
Dear brothers and sisters,

I know this may have been analysed before, but recently, I started to have questions about eating pork, rabbit and sea food. Well all know that Leviticus 11 tells us that these types of food are forbidden by God. However in the New Testament Jesus said:

- Mark 7:15 - There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

- Matthew 15:11 -
Not that which goes into the mouth defiles a man; but that which comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.


But Jesus also said:

- Matthew 5:17 - Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.



I know that some say that one should obey God´s law regarding Clean and Unclean food and others go for Mark 7:15 and Matthew 15:11. However, I´m not sure what to do. Until I have my answer, I´m stooped eating pork, seafood and I will stop eating rabbit.


What are you thoughts about this?


God bless!
If this is any help, there were no rabbits in the area of the OT/NT at that time. When the scholars translated the word the translated it to something they could relate to. Now, all these centuries later, no one knows exactly what that critter was. The learned men think it was a desert-dwelling rodent, (still around), but, even there, they aren't sure.

Pigs, because pig meat goes bad quickly without refrigeration, and what they eat is bad for our health.

Rodents, because they are scavengers, therefore hold the same bacteria, germs, and viruses pigs have, if not worse.

It wasn't seafood that was against the law, it was scavengers -- often coming with shells.

Peter was given a clear sign from God, which was then verified by his next visitor. I think we're free to eat whatever, just as long as whatever won't make us sick or dead. There's stuff that's quite popular today, that I don't think people should eat, because it can, quite easily, make us sick. And, there are some viruses spreading that may well have started by a human eating something truly unclean.
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
8,025
124
63
#9
The basic difference between clean and unclean was that the clean lived and ate in a healthy environment and in a healthy way whereas the unclean did not. They thus provided a lesson in life to Israel. This very fact meant that to eat unclean foods posited danger. Pork, rock food, etc. was dangerous to eat in those days. It is not so today if they have been properly dealt with.

Clean and unclean was a basic lesson in dietary health avoiding what could be doubtxful
 
Last edited:

eternallife7

Senior Member
May 19, 2015
659
6
0
#10
Hey check out Romans 3:19 1 Timothy 1:9 Hebrews 8:13 as well as Hebrews 7:22. Hope it help but I give you warning many on CC do not agree with them.
 

eternallife7

Senior Member
May 19, 2015
659
6
0
#11
Even if people here do not agree, they are vital truths.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,011
212
63
#12
If this is any help, there were no rabbits in the area of the OT/NT at that time. When the scholars translated the word the translated it to something they could relate to. Now, all these centuries later, no one knows exactly what that critter was. The learned men think it was a desert-dwelling rodent, (still around), but, even there, they aren't sure.

Pigs, because pig meat goes bad quickly without refrigeration, and what they eat is bad for our health.

Rodents, because they are scavengers, therefore hold the same bacteria, germs, and viruses pigs have, if not worse.

It wasn't seafood that was against the law, it was scavengers -- often coming with shells.
You make a good point. The specific animals could be debated. Fortunately, God gave the criteria for the animals to determine whether they're clean or unclean. Scavengers is the consistent criteria in everything. If it eats the garbage, feces and diseased and ravage animals, it's unclean.

Peter was given a clear sign from God, which was then verified by his next visitor. I think we're free to eat whatever, just as long as whatever won't make us sick or dead.
Obviously, Peter's vision is the primary instance (and really, only) that people use to say that everything is clean. However right after the vision, God tells Peter what it meant. And it had nothing to do with food; He was using a parable.

I would also take the conclusion that "Everything is clean" to a natural, albeit extreme level. God would also be telling Peter that man can eat feces, and that it is clean to do so.
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,011
212
63
#13
The basic difference between clean and unclean was that the clean lived and ate in a healthy environment and in a healthy way whereas the unclean did not. They thus provided a lesson in life to Israel. This very fact meant that to eat unclean foods posited danger. Pork, rock food, etc. was dangerous to eat in those days. It is not so today if they have been properly dealt with.

Clean and unclean was a basic lesson in dietary health avoiding what could be doubtxful
I agree with much of what you said, particularly the lessons of clean and set apart living for Israel. However, I would offer the correction that God's standards of what was clean and unclean doesn't stop or change once man has supposedly learned how to cook it properly. It's similar to the adage, "You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig."
 

KohenMatt

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2013
4,011
212
63
#14
Hey check out Romans 3:19 1 Timothy 1:9 Hebrews 8:13 as well as Hebrews 7:22. Hope it help but I give you warning many on CC do not agree with them.
While these verses can lead back to a different argument....

there is a difference between instructions on how to live, and God's decrees of what animals ARE clean and which animals ARE NOT clean.
(I personally don't believe their is a distinction between the instructions being valid for those who are/aren't "under the law", but that's a different topic.)
 

eternallife7

Senior Member
May 19, 2015
659
6
0
#15
Told you not all people believe these scriptures I posted. However know this it is not me they are not agreeing with it is scripture. Because as you see above all I did was tell you to check out four scriptures. And look very carefully I made no argument with them I just posted them.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#16
Dear brothers and sisters,

I know this may have been analysed before, but recently, I started to have questions about eating pork, rabbit and sea food. Well all know that Leviticus 11 tells us that these types of food are forbidden by God. However in the New Testament Jesus said:

- Mark 7:15 - There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

- Matthew 15:11 -
Not that which goes into the mouth defiles a man; but that which comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.


But Jesus also said:

- Matthew 5:17 - Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.



I know that some say that one should obey God´s law regarding Clean and Unclean food and others go for Mark 7:15 and Matthew 15:11. However, I´m not sure what to do. Until I have my answer, I´m stooped eating pork, seafood and I will stop eating rabbit.


What are you thoughts about this?


God bless!

I believe that Leviticus chapter 11 is a parenthesis between Ge 9:3-4

3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
4 But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
KJV

and

1 Ti 4:1-5
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
KJV


Since men of Israel did NOT walk about with their circumcision on display, I believe that Lev chapter 11 was intend as a visible sign of the covenant God made with Israel.

With all the food fads in modern society, I don't believe that Leviticus 11 continues to serve that purpose.

In any case, 1Tim 4:1-5 clearly indicates that whatever God's purpose was for Lev chapter 11; His instructions have returned to those in Ge chapter 9.
 
Jan 6, 2014
991
27
0
#17
Christ died for all the sins of the world. 1 John Thus making all humanity clean through Him. Without Jesus nothing is clean, with Jesus all things are made clean.
It is interesting that the council in Jerusalem in 51 ad ruled that gentile believers were not to eat the blood of animals or eat meat that was not drained of the blood (strangeled), again in reference to Christ and his blood which cleanses from sin.
Acts 15

We learn from the New Testament that Jesus Christ changed everything:

Love God and love one another, by this the law if fulfilled.
Worship in spirit and in truth, no longer obligated to return to Jerusalem to worship God.
ended the need for the Levitical Priesthood with its ordinances and sacrificial system, Jesus is our sacrifice.
ended the separation of Jew and gentile, ALL are one in Christ.
ended justification for war, Love your enemies.
ended nationalism, ethnic and racial separation, again ALL are one in Christ.
instituted the sacraments of the Church, Water Baptism, Spiritual Baptism, Communion, Repentance, Anointing the sick, Ordination and Matrimony.

That all are not in agreement with these things has led to the separation and divisions within Christendom. Christ have mercy.

Just a thought.
 
Dec 26, 2014
3,757
19
0
#18
.....Jesus .. said:
- Matthew 5:17 - Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

I know that some say that one should obey God´s law regarding Clean and Unclean food and others go for Mark 7:15 and Matthew 15:11. However, I´m not sure what to do. Until I have my answer, I´m stooped eating pork, seafood and I will stop eating rabbit.
stick with what jesus says (said). it hasn't changed. and if you agree with jesus, that's life. switch to what man says, that's death.
 
B

Biblelogic01

Guest
#19
Hey check out Romans 3:19 1 Timothy 1:9 Hebrews 8:13 as well as Hebrews 7:22. Hope it help but I give you warning many on CC do not agree with them.
We can agree to disagree on this, but here is what I see in scripture with these verses. (I am not saying what I see is better than the way you see it, I'm just explaining)

Romans 3:19-20
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. [SUP]20 [/SUP]Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Looking at the context, not just an individual verse.
To me, you cannot read 19 without 20; 20 is just stating, "the law is the knowledge of sin." Also meaning, makes you aware of what sinning is. To me I would want to be aware of what sin is, because I would want to try and live a lifestyle that is not of sin. Yes I'm a sinner, we all are, but should we not try to live away from sin?

1 Timothy 1:8-11
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, [SUP]9 [/SUP]knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, [SUP]10 [/SUP]for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, [SUP]11 [/SUP]according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust.

Again, context, not singling out a verse.
I'm a sinner and do not claim any selfrighteousness, onyl God can judge the level of my righteousness, but I do try my hardest to be on a righteous walk with Yeshua. With that being said just read the scripture and it speaks for itself. If someone is perfect and sinless then they can drop the law. Verse 8 the law is good if one uses it lawfully.

Hebrews 7
It's pretty lengthy to copy/paste the context.
With Hebrews 7 it's talking about Yeshua being out High Priest and that the new covenant is better than the old. Which I agree with, according to the new covenant Yeshua is our High Priest and it is not a Levitical order. This means Yeshua is our final judge, and He is a flawless and righteous judge. Yeshua can just snap His fingers and we're forgiven, but He also wants us to repent of our sins, in other words turn away from our sins. Yeshua took away death and conquored it, He gave us access to the Holy Spirit to guide us on our walk. With the old covenant we didn't have that access, because only the Levitical Priests had that access, with Yeshua in us we have that access now (I know that sentence is kind of redundant).

Hebews 8
In context is talking about the NC vs OC. The OC was written on a tablet, and on paper. The NC is written in our minds, and in our heart. It never says as far as what the OT vs NT is changed. It states how it's given it's changed.

I kind of put in like school work:
Old Covenant: Here's your book, study it well and follow the equations and you'll pass the class (on your test you get no calculator).
New covenant: All the equation are written in your mind and on your heart, and for your test here's a calculator to help double check your work; therefor there is no need for studying these equations, you already know the answers, and you have a guide to help with those answers.
So in this algebra=the covenant. In the OC it's hard to get everything down and it can be stressful (hence why some of the apostles call being under the law a burden). But in the NC everything we need is written inside us and is on our mind, and we're given a guide (the calculator for the test= Holy Spirit, our guide in life), thus the NC is easier to follow and align with.
Now I'm not saying throw out salvation, kind of like someone who has no math background can just been thrown algebra. You have to come to Yeshua and recognize Him as the Messiah and accept Him and then He opens the way of learning to us and Yeshua & the Holy Spirit teach and guide us on our walk, kind of like you start off with basic math before going on to algebra.

Now I know many will not agree with what I've stated here, but this is what I've learned as far as my walk when I've studied, and it's the way I understand it. And overall it makes sense to me.

Also if in anyway I do/did offend someone by the camparison between the scripture and math, I do apologize.

I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong. I'm just expressing what those verses mean to me.
 

JimmieD

Senior Member
Apr 11, 2014
895
18
18
#20
Dear brothers and sisters,

I know this may have been analysed before, but recently, I started to have questions about eating pork, rabbit and sea food. Well all know that Leviticus 11 tells us that these types of food are forbidden by God. However in the New Testament Jesus said:

- Mark 7:15 - There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

- Matthew 15:11 -
Not that which goes into the mouth defiles a man; but that which comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.


But Jesus also said:

- Matthew 5:17 - Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.



I know that some say that one should obey God´s law regarding Clean and Unclean food and others go for Mark 7:15 and Matthew 15:11. However, I´m not sure what to do. Until I have my answer, I´m stooped eating pork, seafood and I will stop eating rabbit.


What are you thoughts about this?


God bless!
Declaring a food clean or unclean had a purpose to it in ancient Israel - namely, preventing disease and death. People living in the bronze and iron ages didn't necessarily have the methods and means to process food and water that we do today. Though it eventually became a cultural marker, the initial purpose of banning certain foods served to prevent disease and death. Other rules served the same purpose. Having a latrine in the camp could have threatened to bring contaminants and other disease bearing things into the population, so there was a law to have the latrine outside the camp (Deut 23:12).

These rules weren't arbitrary. There actually was a point to them - most of them having something to do with life and/or property. Is it ok to eat a pig today? I dunno - I wouldn't pick one up off the farm, kill it and eat it raw. I would say it depends on the methods used to process it and ensure that it was safe to eat. We do the same thing with water. I wouldn't drink dirty water, but I would drink water that had been filtered and/or purified properly. I wouldn't put my body's waste in the house, but a toilet to flush it away seems fine to me; I don't think God demands I use an outhouse instead.

These laws in the OT weren't simply arbitrary rules made for the sake of making some rules. They served particular purposes and functions. I think it's wisest to see what the purpose was, and apply appropriately.