Do you know why you are a protestant???

KenAllan · Jul 18, 2015

John 10:30
[SUP]30 [/SUP] I and My Father are one."

Jesus Christ IS God and the Father IS God and the Holy Spirit IS God.

We pray to God who IS the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

Praying to Jesus IS praying to God. Praying to the Father IS praying to God.

You can pray to the Father, or Jesus Christ, or God, it does not make any difference!

Gr8grace · Jul 18, 2015

KenAllan said:

What would be the best way for me to approach you on this subject?

Well true Christians know how to pray. You, Ken are foolish to think that you can pray in an improper way and still think you are saved.

Because true Christians pray to the Father, in Jesus Christs name, through the power of the Holy Spirit.

Or

Well, from my studies, believers are to pray to the Father, in Jesus Christs name, through the power of the Holy Spirit.

If we have not followed the proper way of prayer, we have an advocate that speaks for us. But when we have learned the proper order and way of prayer( To whom much is given,much is required) we are expected to follow that protocol. If we do not, divine discipline may come our way.

VCO · Jul 18, 2015

Gr8grace said:

Scripture refers to the dwelling place of the Holy Spirit within us, as being relative to our heart.

Romans 5:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us.

Psalm 4:7 (HCSB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] You have put more joy in my heart than they have when their grain and new wine abound.

Psalm 51:10 (NRSV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Create in me a clean heart, O God, and put a new and right spirit within me.

Ezekiel 36:26-27 (ASV)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you; and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you a heart of flesh.
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep mine ordinances, and do them.

Ezekiel 18:31 (ASV)
[SUP]31 [/SUP] Cast away from you all your transgressions, wherein ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

2 Corinthians 3:3 (NRSV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] and you show that you are a letter of Christ, prepared by us, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.

Isaiah 57:15 (NKJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] For thus says the High and Lofty One Who inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy: "I dwell in the high and holy place, With him who has a contrite and humble spirit, To revive the spirit of the humble, And to revive the heart of the contrite ones.

So I have no problem with someone saying, "Pray from the Heart" IF he means by that, AFTER I have Repented of Sin and Received Jesus Christ as LORD, meaning MASTER, I can pray as the Holy Spirit Leads me.

HOWEVER, if he or she uses that expression while still hating the Catholics, THEY ARE PRAYING FROM AN UNSAVED, STONY HEART, THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT HAS NOT YET PENETRATED and broken into a Contrite Heart. NO, charismatic tongues proves nothing; because they are nothing like what the Apostles did; where every time unbelieving Jews heard every word in their own native dialects.

1 John 2:9 (BBE)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] He who says that he is in the light, and has hate in his heart for his brother, is still in the dark.
{They are STILL not Born Again.}

KenAllan · Jul 18, 2015

In response to your question Gr8grace, "Did the catholic church do you harm personally in some way?".

YES!

The Catholic Church has harmed me to the very depths of my Soul! A harm so great that it still plagues me to this day!

I'll start from the beginning. I was born and raised in the Catholic Church. Every Sunday my dad insisted i go to the Catholic Church for Mass, even though he never went with me.

At age 8 a Father in the Catholic Church thought I would make a very good Altar boy. I will not mention his name. My dad was very proud and said yes to my being an Alter boy.

I loved being an Altar boy!

Until one day the priest took me aside and wanted to teach me something else i could do for the Church. The something he showed me was how to be molested!

For 5 solid years this Priest molested me over and over again. I wanted to quick being an Altar boy but my dad refused to let me stop.

Finally i had enough and told my dad what was happening. My dad was mad, but not mad at the priest, he was mad at me!

He blamed it all on me for what happened. He said he had to change to a different Parish because of me!

To the very day he died my dad still blamed me for what happened.

Only a few people have i shared this with. To this day it still hurts deep down inside of me.

Gr8grace · Jul 18, 2015

KenAllan said:

In response to your question Gr8grace, "Did the catholic church do you harm personally in some way?".

YES!

The Catholic Church has harmed me to the very depths of my Soul! A harm so great that it still plagues me to this day!

I'll start from the beginning. I was born and raised in the Catholic Church. Every Sunday my dad insisted i go to the Catholic Church for Mass, even though he never went with me.

At age 8 a Father in the Catholic Church thought I would make a very good Altar boy. I will not mention his name. My dad was very proud and said yes to my being an Alter boy.

I loved being an Altar boy!

Until one day the priest took me aside and wanted to teach me something else i could do for the Church. The something he showed me was how to be molested!

For 5 solid years this Priest molested me over and over again. I wanted to quick being an Altar boy but my dad refused to let me stop.

Finally i had enough and told my dad what was happening. My dad was mad, but not mad at the priest, he was mad at me!

He blamed it all on me for what happened. He said he had to change to a different Parish because of me!

To the very day he died my dad still blamed me for what happened.

Only a few people have i shared this with. To this day it still hurts deep down inside of me.

Thank You Ken. I honestly did get the feeling of pain in reading a lot of your posts. I don't have words Brother.

VCO · Jul 18, 2015

KenAllan said:

And so because of the sins of two men, you hate all CATHOLICS?

I have heard of the same thing happening in Protestant Churches. Pedophiles love to weasel their way into a position and trust, and then betray it by abusing Children. They seek out jobs like Priests, Pastors, Boys Scout Leaders, Grade School Teachers, School Janitors, Baby Sitting Services, Swimming Instructors, Community Volunteers, ETC. Literally any thing that will get them Close to children, while remaining somewhat above suspicion. It is a HEINOUS Crime, that far too often is never reported to the Police. Those Sick Criminals are counting on that. The fact that it occasionally happens in a Church, is horribly disheartening. It does not, however, make the entire Church body or Denomination EVIL; only the perps and those who would cover it up, rather than REPORT IT TO THE POLICE. If you don't believe it happens in Protestant Churches too, I have heard of it several times, but it NEVER gets the publicity that it does when it is a Priest. Even Reporters, love to HATE CATHOLICS.

"25 MORE SHOCKING ARRESTS": Pastors Charged With Sex Crimes - Awkward Moments Children's Bible | Awkward Moments (Not Found In Your Average) Children's Bible - Horus Gilgamesh

And then there is the Opposite Crime, of falsely accusing a Pastor or Youth Leader; and I have heard of several instances of that too. So what are we to do? Not go to Church? NO, we are to get involved, and make sure it does not happen in our local Churches. How do we do that? Do a THOROUGH background investigation before hiring anyone. Spend the money for Security Cameras, encourage MORE VOLUNTEERISM, so that there is NEVER, a lone adult with Children or opportunities to be alone with any other person, especially Children.

The Church that I attended in California, before I moved, even passed a rule that a woman, could not come into to speak to the Pastor unless there was another person in the building, which usually was the Secretary and one of the other Assistant Pastors at all times. THEN to maintain privacy, that would be above suspicion, a window was installed in the wall between the Pastor's Office and the Church Secretary's Office. The furniture was arranged so that the person wanting to talk to the Pastor was seated with their back to the window; and the Secretary's desk was on the opposite wall so that she was seated facing that Security Window across the room.

Those kind of Changes are not overly expensive, considering they go a LONG ways toward creating Trust Worthy environment that is above reproach.

VCO · Jul 18, 2015

KenAllan said:

Thank you Ken for sharing, and my heart is saddened by what really happened. I pray that from this moment on, that GOD will allow the spiritual and physical healing to come to you, one step at a time, until all the hurt is gone.

Will be praying for you,
VCO

Gr8grace · Jul 18, 2015

VCO said:

And so because of the sins of two men, you hate all CATHOLICS?

I have heard of the same thing happening in Protestant Churches. Pedophiles love to weasel their way into a position and trust, and then betray it by abusing Children. They seek out jobs like Priests, Pastors, Boys Scout Leaders, Grade School Teachers, School Janitors, Baby Sitting Services, Swimming Instructors, Community Volunteers, ETC. Literally any thing that will get them Close to children, while remaining somewhat above suspicion. It is a HEINOUS Crime, that far too often is never reported to the Police. Those Sick Criminals are counting on that. The fact that it occasionally happens in a Church, is horribly disheartening. It does not, however, make the entire Church body or Denomination EVIL; only the perps and those who would cover it up, rather than REPORT IT TO THE POLICE. If you don't believe it happens in Protestant Churches too, I have heard of it several times, but it NEVER gets the publicity that it does when it is a Priest. Even Reporters, love to HATE CATHOLICS.

"25 MORE SHOCKING ARRESTS": Pastors Charged With Sex Crimes - Awkward Moments Children's Bible | Awkward Moments (Not Found In Your Average) Children's Bible - Horus Gilgamesh

And then there is the Opposite Crime, of falsely accusing a Pastor or Youth Leader; and I have heard of several instances of that too. So what are we to do? Not go to Church? NO, we are to get involved, and make sure it does not happen in our local Churches. How do we do that? Do a THOROUGH background investigation before hiring anyone. Spend the money for Security Cameras, encourage MORE VOLUNTEERISM, so that there is NEVER, a lone adult with Children or opportunities to be alone with any other person, especially Children.

The Church that I attended in California, before I moved, even passed a rule that a woman, could not come into to speak to the Pastor unless there was another person in the building, which usually was the Secretary and one of the other Assistant Pastors at all times. THEN to maintain privacy, that would be above suspicion, a window was installed in the wall between the Pastor's Office and the Church Secretary's Office. The furniture was arranged so that the person wanting to talk to the Pastor was seated with their back to the window; and the Secretary's desk was on the opposite wall so that she was seated facing that Security Window across the room.

Those kind of Changes are not overly expensive, considering they go a LONG ways toward creating Trust Worthy environment that is above reproach.

BUT. What about when the rubber meets the road? We are leaving individuals high and dry when something like this DOES happen. They have no way to cope and have no problem solving devices in their SOUL.

This not just the catholic church, it is the majority of churches in the USA. The doctrine people need to handle problems has been replaced by some dog and pony show.

If something like this happens to a believer, what is the very first step the bible lays out for us to do?

Mec99 · Jul 18, 2015

WOW!

I thought I had problems! Compared to you Ken my problems look very small.

My Heart goes out to you for the Evil the Catholic Church has visited upon you. I know its hard but you really need to look at the people individually here and judge them by only what they did to you.

Do not look it then with Catholic Church lenses. Do not visit upon them what happened to you, but only judge them by their sin only.

mwc68 · Jul 18, 2015

Mec99 said:

Please explain how "the evil of the Catholic Church" has visited upon Ken and not the Evil of a pedophile?

VCO · Jul 18, 2015

Gr8grace said:

Love and restore him. Which is what I try to do, but restoring him means to bring him back to the Faith, so that he too can Love all the Brethren again.

Remember, Corrie Ten Boom, was not fully restored until she got down off that stage and hugged the Nazi Guard who had abused her and her sister.

Gr8grace · Jul 18, 2015

VCO said:

Thank you Brother. Forgiveness is the first step. It may be a long walk, but we cannot carry on with hate,guilt,worry,fear.

And I would guess that Kens dad didn't really blame him. His dad just didn't know what to do with the situation.

Thats easy for me to say though considering the magnitude of what happened.

VCO · Jul 19, 2015

Mec99 said:

Do you know the full story behind the expression [FONT=Gentium !important]battalogeô[/FONT] that KJV translators worded "vain repetitions"?

The Greek word is [FONT=Gentium !important]battalogeô[/FONT] and even you should recognize the second half of the word, which would be "words" in English. But where does "batta" come from? In the Worship of Zeus and some of the other Mystery Religions, the Pagan Priests taught their followers to Pray in tongues by telling them, "Say batta, batta, batta over and over again as fast as you can and the gods will turn it into a prayer language that only they can understand." That can be traced back in the Mystery Religions at least as far as 400 years before Christ. Even Plato referred to it as "Divine Ecstasy" claiming it felt like he had connected with the gods. A better English Translation for that Greek word [FONT=Gentium !important]battalogeô[/FONT] would be "babbling words".

KenAllan · Jul 19, 2015

Like i said before, I do not hate the Catholics, I feel sorry and sad for them.

I do hate the Catholic Church and what it has ALLOWED Priests to do to children!

How they have blamed the children for what has happened to them. For years the Catholic Church blamed ME for what the Priest did. That somehow I encouraged the Priest to molest me.

Later on in life because of what happened I left the Catholic Church. My whole family rejected me and refused to even speak to me because i left the Catholic Church.

All of my family is now dead. Its interesting i was the oldest child but yet i outlived all of them. I see the Hand of God in this.

VCO · Jul 19, 2015

KenAllan said:

I wouldn't phrase it "ALLOWED", because that would mean they condone sin. HOWEVER, I do think they COVERED IT UP, to protect their reputation, lest it reduced the amount of money that came in via the Collection Plate. It is sad that the money was more important to them than doing what was right. What was right would have been to turn the Pedophile over to the Police immediately. Going to confession, may have made things right spiritually with GOD, but there remains a debt to society for ANY CRIME committed, especially this one; because he WILL do it again, and again, and again, until he is arrested and put in prison.

I was a Volunteer Prison Chaplain and I ministered to inmates in the "Hole" at Pelican Bay State Prison, in California. A certain percentage of the inmates there were Pedophiles. That is where we had to house them, because they were Dead Men on the Yard, because that is a crime even other inmates will not tolerate. If they asked to speak to me, I ignored what their crime was, and poured my heart out to reach that man for Christ. In my opinion, only the Born Again experience, where the Holy Spirit enters the heart, pouring out the LOVE of GOD there (Rom. 5:5), and bringing that dead human spirit to eternal life, so that the Pedophile can genuinely receive Jesus Christ as Lord, meaning MASTER; can deliver that man from the addiction to the Sin of Pedophilia. Yes they received Psychological Counseling too, but without becoming Born again, they will eventually return to that addiction to Pedophilia.

So how do you get past the hurt? It is not easy, but it requires forgiving the man, and being totally willing to let GOD deal with his SIN.

Deuteronomy 32:35 (HCSB)
[SUP]35 [/SUP] Vengeance belongs to Me; I will repay. In time their foot will slip, for their day of disaster is near, and their doom is coming quickly.”

Matthew 6:12 (ISV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] and forgive us our sins, as we have forgiven those who have sinned against us.

Luke 6:37 (NRSV)
[SUP]37 [/SUP] "Do not judge, and you will not be judged; do not condemn, and you will not be condemned.
Forgive, and you will be forgiven;

I know forgiving is hard, but it is what needs to be done. Here is a link to part of Corrie ten Boom's testimony, it may help: Corrie Ten Boom Story on Forgiving

mwc68 · Jul 19, 2015

I in no way support the pedophiles or the cover up scandal that has been exosed in the Catholic Church. It is a terrible crime that destroys lives and cannot be tolerated! These are evil individuals acting on their own authority. I can only imagine the pain a victim must feel, and not come close!

I know for a fact that Catholic Church doctrine does not in any way support these evil acts. The Evil men who have done this are to blame, not the Church! (hope this doesn't sound cold)

HQ · Jul 19, 2015

Surhope said:

I was born into a Catholic home, got confirmed and ended up marrying a Catholic girl. But one day I got roped into a bible study group at work and after about 6 months started self-identifying as Protestant, even though I continue to this day to attend Catholic mass with my wife (who does not appreciate the radical Protestant rogues who stole her husband's soul lol). But truth be told terms like "Catholic" (capital C) and Protestant are just words. Anyone can obtain saving grace by simply picking up a bible, reading what Jesus had to say, accepting Him into your heart and then doing your best to trust and obey. That's the simple and beautiful gift from God. And yet even though it's so simple, the truth of God's eternal plan can be so hard to find in churches these days. And political correctness in the U.S. has made speaking the name of "Jesus" practically a hate crime. What a sad state of affairs we are in.

VCO · Jul 19, 2015

HQ said:

I know exactly what you mean by "the radical Protestant rogues who stole her husband's soul". I was raised in an equally bigoted environment. I was raised Lutheran, and my Mom in those days was the most denominationally bigoted person that I ever knew. In her opinion, if you were not Lutheran, you were going straight to hell when you died. She even told me when I started attending a Bible Teaching Church where the sermons were 45-60 minutes long instead of 10-15 minutes; "SO, now you are going to dessert THEE FAITH." Years later, after that Church got a new Pastor who actually was born again and really Taught the Word, she did get saved and knew that the other Denominations were leading people to be saved too. That experience is largely why I now attend a non-denominational Bible Church; where they cannot pin any label on me other than Christian.

I want to commend you for being wise enough to go to mass too with your wife. God will bless you if you are faithful to showing respect for her beliefs, while also honoring your beliefs, by also attending a Bible Teaching Church. In time she will feel a need to reciprocate and start attending with you, to respect your beliefs. And the Beauty of that will be:

Romans 10:17 (NKJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:14-15 (NKJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!"

When that time comes, Pray the entire Service or Services for your wife to HEAR with spiritual ears, and for your Pastor to be led to Preach what she needs to HEAR with spiritual understanding. Until that day, GOD will give you the patience to persevere and all that time let her see the JOY, the PEACE, the KINDNESS, and the Gentleness, HE has given YOU.

Mec99 · Jul 19, 2015

Its interesting its the very Popes of the Catholic Church that has covered up what these Priests were doing to children. How can a Pope be a representative of God if he see's nothing wrong with covering up these crimes against children?

Does this not prove the Catholic Church is a false church?

HQ · Jul 19, 2015

VCO said:

I want to commend you for being wise enough to go to mass too with your wife. God will bless you if you are faithful to showing respect for her beliefs, while also honoring your beliefs, by also attending a Bible Teaching Church. In time she will feel a need to reciprocate and start attending with you, to respect your beliefs. And the Beauty of that will be:

Romans 10:17 (NKJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:14-15 (NKJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!"

Thanks for the kind words.

Do you know why you are a protestant???

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