Why I Am An Apostate

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WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#1
-
My mom had me baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic Church; and
when old enough; enrolled me in catechism where I eventually completed
First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

My aunt and uncle were Catholics, their son is a Catholic, one of my half
brothers is now a semi-retired Friar. My father-in-law was a Catholic, as was
my mother-in-law. Everybody alive on my wife's side are Catholics; her
aunts and uncles, and her cousins. My sister-in-law was a nun for a number
of years before falling out with the hierarchy that controlled her order.

I have things to thank the Church for. It instilled within me an unshakable
confidence in the Holy Bible as the final authority in all matters pertaining to
faith and practice. It also instilled within me a trust in the integrity of Jesus
Christ. Very early in my youth; I began to believe that Christ knew what he
was talking about and meant what he said.

I was very proud to be affiliated with Roman Catholicism, and confident as
all get out that it is the one true religion. Some Catholics see red whenever
the Church is criticized and/or critiqued, but I never did. Some Catholics see
criticism and/or critique of the Church's beliefs and practices as hatred for
Catholics. I have never understood that mentality. Ironically, one of the
Church's enemies, the Jehovah's Witnesses, sometimes react the same way
when somebody criticizes and/or critiques the Watch Tower Society. For
some odd reason, it translates in their minds as hatred for Jehovah's
Witnesses. I think some people have trouble telling the difference between a
sport and a sport's fans; if you know what I mean.

Oddly, though I was confident that the Bible was the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice; I had never actually sat down and
read it. A co-worker in a metal shop where I worked as a welder suggested
that I buy one and see what it says. He took me to a book store where I
picked out a cheap copy of the Scofield Reference Bible. Back in 1968, it was
available in only the KJV: not the original KJV of 1611, but a revised version;
which is quite a bit easier to read and understand than the original 1611.

Everything went smoothly till I got to the New Testament, and in no time at
all I began to realize that Rome does not always agree with the Holy Bible;
nor does it always agree with Christ. Well; that was not cool with me because I
was, and still am, confident that the Holy Bible as the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice, and that Christ knew what he was
talking about and meant what he said.

Well; I soon became confronted with a very serious decision. Do I follow
Rome and its Christ; or do I follow the Holy Bible and its Christ?

The decision was a no-brainer due to my confidence in the Holy Bible as
the final authority in all matters pertaining to faith and practice' and due to
my trust in the integrity of Jesus Christ-- that he knew what he was talking
about and meant what he said.

Ironically, the Church sabotaged itself by instilling within me the justification
to defect. They say: Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Give him
some fishing tackle, and you feed him forever. Well; the Church had
inadvertently given me some fishing tackle, so to speak, and here I am
today 48 years later still a Protestant. That's not forever, but it's a start.

==========================================
 
Last edited:
F

flob

Guest
#2
Interesting... An honest reader.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#3
-
Well; I soon became confronted with a very serious decision. Do I follow
Rome and its Christ; or do I follow the Holy Bible and its Christ?

The decision was a no-brainer due to my confidence in the Holy Bible as
the final authority in all matters pertaining to faith and practice' and due to
my trust in the integrity of Jesus Christ-- that he knew what he was talking
about and meant what he said.
The Lord Jesus states,

John 16:13
Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

A perplexing question is how is the Holy Spirit somehow failing those, in rebellion against truth, if they are born again? Is there some percentage of error a person can worship, like perhaps only Baal's left arm and foot, then the remainder the God of scripture? Or must worship be wholly the God of scripture,
"must worship Him in spirit and in truth?" Again, I don't know, only God knows, but if the latter question is the case, some people need to get scared, very scared!

Philippians 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#4
-
Christ spoke for God.

†. John 3:34 . . For he is sent by God. He speaks God's words, for God's
Spirit is upon him without measure or limit

†. John 8:26 . . He that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those
things which I have heard of Him.

†. John 8:28 . . I do nothing on my own initiative, but I speak these things
as the Father taught me.

†. John 12:49 . . I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me,
He gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.

†. John 14:24 . .The word which you hear is not mine, but the Father's who
sent me.

†. Heb 1:1-2 . . In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the
prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has
spoken to us by His son

It is his Father's wishes that people heed Christ.

†. Matt 17:5 . .While he was still speaking, behold, a bright cloud
overshadowed them; and behold, a voice out of the cloud, saying: This is My
beloved son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to him!

It's risky to ignore the words that Jesus Christ spoke for God.

†. John 12:48 . . He who rejects me, and does not receive my sayings, has
one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.

According to the words that Jesus Christ spoke for God: non believers are
supposed to be evangelized first and baptized afterwards (Matt 28:18-20,
Mark 16:15-16). Seeing as how infants are de facto incapable of believing,
then their baptism has to be held off until they're old enough to understand.

There are Christian churches out there who've got the cart before the horse
and by doing so declare themselves Christ's opponents.

†. John 15:14 . .You are my friends if you do as I wish.

And they don't think much of him much neither.

†. John 14:15 . . If you love me, you will comply with what I command.

†. John 14:21 . .Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one
who loves me.

†. John 14:23-24 . . If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching . . He who
does not love me will not obey my teaching.

I've noted in my many years of Bible study that there are two things that
God values very highly. One is honesty, and the other is loyalty; which
Webster's defines as unswerving in allegiance to one's lawful sovereign or
government.

†. Luke 6:46-49 . .Why do you call me lord and master and do not do what I
say?

. . . Everyone who comes to me, and hears my words, and acts upon them, I
will show you whom he is like: he is like a man building a house, who dug
deep and laid a foundation upon the rock; and when a flood rose, the torrent
burst against that house and could not shake it, because it had been well
built.

. . . But the one who has heard, and has not acted accordingly, is like a man
who built a house upon the ground without any foundation; and the torrent
burst against it and immediately it collapsed, and the ruin of that house was
great.

Churches that circumvent Christ's instructions as per Matt 28:18-20 and
Mark 16:15-16 by baptizing infants are not only disloyal; but they are also
akin to pagans practicing dark arts and/or worshipping Shiva and Vishnu.

†. 1Sam 15:23 . . Rebellion is as the sin of divination, and insubordination
is as iniquity and idolatry.

=============================
 
Jun 23, 2015
1,990
37
0
#5
So happy that you answered when the Holy spirit drew you in!
It is my prayer that many other RC find the truth before it is too late. Amen
 

Apostol2013

Senior Member
Jan 27, 2013
2,105
39
48
#6
The spirit of truth calls out His Children. The same is the spirit of Christ that prophecies in ot
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#7
-
According to Matt 23:23 and Luke 11:42, Christ okayed traditions just so
long as they don't circumvent, replace, repeal, clash with, nor marginalize
the Bible.

For example: Christ drank wine at his final Passover meal. That element isn't
stipulated in God's instructions as per the 12th chapter of Exodus. Passover
wine is rabbi-given rather than God-given. But Christ went along with it
anyway because the tradition is quite harmless; viz: it neither circumvents,
replaces, repeals, clashes with, nor marginalizes Passover's God-given
instructions.

===============================
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#8
-
†. John 6:53 . . Truly, truly, I say to you: unless you eat the flesh of the Son
of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in yourselves.

The kind of life about which Christ spoke is eternal life.

†. John 6:54 . . He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life

Note the grammatical tense of Christ's "has" verb; it's present tense rather
than future, indicating that people who correctly ingest his flesh, and imbibe
his blood, have eternal life right now-- no delay and no waiting period.

Just for the sake of argument, let's suppose that transubstantiation is true.
Then according to John 6:54, Christians who take a full communion on
Sunday morning would be endowed with eternal life the very minute that the
elements went down the hatch. In point of fact, the moment they swallowed
the elements, those who ingested them would be impervious to the wages of
sin seeing as how eternal life is immortal; viz: it's a kind of life over which
death has no power.

†. Rom 6:23 . .The wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life
through Jesus Christ our Lord.

======================================
 
Nov 14, 2012
2,113
4
0
#9
-
My mom had me baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic Church; and
when old enough; enrolled me in catechism where I eventually completed
First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

My aunt and uncle were Catholics, their son is a Catholic, one of my half
brothers is now a semi-retired Friar. My father-in-law was a Catholic, as was
my mother-in-law. Everybody alive on my wife's side are Catholics; her
aunts and uncles, and her cousins. My sister-in-law was a nun for a number
of years before falling out with the hierarchy that controlled her order.

I have things to thank the Church for. It instilled within me an unshakable
confidence in the Holy Bible as the final authority in all matters pertaining to
faith and practice. It also instilled within me a trust in the integrity of Jesus
Christ. Very early in my youth; I began to believe that Christ knew what he
was talking about and meant what he said.

I was very proud to be affiliated with Roman Catholicism, and confident as
all get out that it is the one true religion. Some Catholics see red whenever
the Church is criticized and/or critiqued, but I never did. Some Catholics see
criticism and/or critique of the Church's beliefs and practices as hatred for
Catholics. I have never understood that mentality. Ironically, one of the
Church's enemies, the Jehovah's Witnesses, sometimes react the same way
when somebody criticizes and/or critiques the Watch Tower Society. For
some odd reason, it translates in their minds as hatred for Jehovah's
Witnesses. I think some people have trouble telling the difference between a
sport and a sport's fans; if you know what I mean.

Oddly, though I was confident that the Bible was the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice; I had never actually sat down and
read it. A co-worker in a metal shop where I worked as a welder suggested
that I buy one and see what it says. He took me to a book store where I
picked out a cheap copy of the Scofield Reference Bible. Back in 1968, it was
available in only the KJV: not the original KJV of 1611, but a revised version;
which is quite a bit easier to read and understand than the original 1611.

Everything went smoothly till I got to the New Testament, and in no time at
all I began to realize that Rome does not always agree with the Holy Bible;
nor does it always agree with Christ. Well; that was not cool with me because I
was, and still am, confident that the Holy Bible as the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice, and that Christ knew what he was
talking about and meant what he said.

Well; I soon became confronted with a very serious decision. Do I follow
Rome and its Christ; or do I follow the Holy Bible and its Christ?

The decision was a no-brainer due to my confidence in the Holy Bible as
the final authority in all matters pertaining to faith and practice' and due to
my trust in the integrity of Jesus Christ-- that he knew what he was talking
about and meant what he said.

Ironically, the Church sabotaged itself by instilling within me the justification
to defect. They say: Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Give him
some fishing tackle, and you feed him forever. Well; the Church had
inadvertently given me some fishing tackle, so to speak, and here I am
today 48 years later still a Protestant. That's not forever, but it's a start.

==========================================
Nice, another Catholic bashing thread
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#10
-
another Catholic bashing thread
Some Catholics see criticism and/or critique of the Church's beliefs and
practices as hatred for Catholics. I have never understood that mentality.

Ironically, one of the Church's enemies, the Jehovah's Witnesses, sometimes
react the same way when somebody criticizes and/or critiques the Watch
Tower Society. For some odd reason, it translates in their minds as hatred
for Jehovah's Witnesses. I think some people have trouble telling the
difference between a sport and a sport's fans; if you know what I mean.

=================================
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#11
-
Christ's sheep don't pray to Jesus' mom because the spirit of God's son is a
barrier to that kind of behavior.

†. Gal 4:6 . . And because you are sons, God has sent forth the spirit of His
son into your hearts calling out: Abba! Father.

Abba is an Aramaic word that means, among other things, dad, daddy, pop,
papa, padre, dada, or father, et al. Abba isn't a formal title; but rather,
pretty much informal because it's a filial vocative. What I mean is; when I'm
out in the garage working and my son and his mother are in the kitchen
talking about me, the noun "dad" is just who I am to my boy. But when he
wants to get my attention by calling out: Dad! Where are you? Then dad
becomes a vocative.

In other words: when the spirit of His son wants God's attention, he calls out
Abba! But after he has God's attention, he stops using Abba because it isn't
necessary to use a vocative once a child has its father's attention.

Anyway; what it boils down to is this: the spirit of His son always compels
Christ's sheep to call out to a father, never to a mother and the reason for
that is actually quite simple. Christ never prays to a mother; but always to a
father; hence those inhabited by his spirit will do the very same thing.

That, by the way, is a pretty good litmus test. If somebody is comfortable
praying to Christ's mom, then that's pretty good evidence that they are not
inhabited by the spirit of God's son; which means of course that they have
not yet undergone adoption into His home.

†. Rom 8:15-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of bondage again to
fear; but you have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we call out: Abba!
Father. The Spirit itself testifies to our spirit, that we are God's kin.

The pronouns "you" and "we" and "our' in that passage are of course
restricted to people who have been given the spirit of adoption. Obviously
then; those who don't have it, are quite christless; and in grave danger of
the lake of fire depicted at Rev 20:11-15.

†. Rom 8:9 . . If anyone does not have the spirit of Christ, he does not
belong to Christ.

=====================================
 
Nov 14, 2012
2,113
4
0
#12
-


Some Catholics see criticism and/or critique of the Church's beliefs and
practices as hatred for Catholics. I have never understood that mentality.

Ironically, one of the Church's enemies, the Jehovah's Witnesses, sometimes
react the same way when somebody criticizes and/or critiques the Watch
Tower Society. For some odd reason, it translates in their minds as hatred
for Jehovah's Witnesses. I think some people have trouble telling the
difference between a sport and a sport's fans; if you know what I mean.

=================================
You don't think this is another Catholic hate thread? Well, it is just look at OP
 
May 3, 2013
8,719
75
0
#13
I´m a protestant and, according to the RCC´teaching, an apostate...

The minor concer I have, lately, is that eucumenic movement.

If we see it closely, the RCC insist on seizing what God set "legalistically" free from the priesthood of any man which was NOT simply the Lord Jesus.

[video=youtube;LherLzsrYJI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=LherLzsrYJI[/video]
 
May 3, 2013
8,719
75
0
#14
I´m a protestant and, according to the RCC´teaching, an apostate...

The minor concer I have, lately, is that eucumenic movement.

If we see it closely, the RCC insist on seizing what God set "legalistically" free from the priesthood of any man which was NOT simply the Lord Jesus.

[video=youtube;LherLzsrYJI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=LherLzsrYJI[/video]
I don´t know WHO wrote this (below) but I want to share it, before the eucumenical movement seized you:

" The False Prophet

The book of Revelation, chapter 13, gives a description of two beasts. The first 10 verses are devoted to the first beast, who is the man we call the antichrist. Then from verses 11-15 describe the second beast, who is a man we call the false prophet.


Many questions have been asked as to who this person is. Let's start out by saying he is one of the most powerful men that the world has ever known. He becomes the head of the ecumenical movement, ( a conglomeration of church denominations as well as cultic religions of the world). He therefore has to be a religious leader that the population will follow. Here's where we put on our thinking caps.-- There are 1 1/2 billion Catholics in the world today who will only follow the pope, (thinking he is God's representative on earth). There are 2 billion Muslims and 3 billion Chinese. The rest of the world population is divided into everything else.


The Eucumenical movement began at Rome in 1963, by Pope John XXIII. It is named Vatican Council II. It was comprised by the Roman Catholic Bishops. Leaders from Protestant Churches were also invited as guests.

The purpose of the Council meeting was to reach out to all religions with a joining hand, in so doing the Catholic Church no longer considered Martin Luther an insane adulterous perverter of moral. The Jews are no longer charged with the sole responsibility of Christ's death. The Pope publicly embraces and kisses the leader of the Greek Orthodox Church. (as per Lehman Strauss, The Rise and Fall of Babylon).


The Council brought forth new rules. The Catholic Church changed the way it viewed mixed marriages. They would now accept them. They would now also allow a closer tie with Protestants, in fact they would now allow the minister of a mixed marriage to speak at the ceremony.


The Church Council also allowed the changing of pulpits, getting together with all faiths, under the aspects of love, not theology. The real object is to affiliate under the pope. This is the point of ecumenicalism.


So we know this, that the remaining population of the world, (Muslims, Catholics, Protestants, Cults.), will all come under the banner of one person, that being the False Prophet. This will be the 'One World Religion,' of which began in 1963 and is continuing to grow as we speak. (see article 'One World Religion'.)
This will all happen after the Church is Raptured, and the antichrist comes to power.




Now let's examine the text.


Revelation 13: 11-15
v-11= Another beast comes on the scene,-(out of the earth), not out of heaven. -(that’s a tip off=He’s not Christ ). Compare to the 1st beast who comes out of the sea or waters, (nations), (Rev 17:15). -This person will have the appearance of a religious man.


His Description:
Notice- He had two horns-(Like a lamb.). Lamb denotes a religious leader.
( Jesus was called ‘the Lamb of God.’ John 1:29 )
-however, this person only has two horns-(he doesn’t have the power of the 1st beast who has 10 horns-).
(this person will masquerade has the true Christ, but his description shows otherwise, he’s a false Christ.


(Everyone wants a religious leader.= The Barna poll says 71 % said they never doubted the existence of God and 61% said they believe miracles come from God, and 53 % said prayer is important to daily life. But at the same time, the approximation is that only 10% are born again Christians.!-and only 2% read their Bibles.




-Notice also - He spoke as a Dragon!-( Had the nature of Satan!!)


His title & Destiny:= Rev 16:13 this is the false trinity— the Anti Christ, Satan, and this person, The False Prophet.
Rev 19:20 -gives him the title-False Prophet.
Rev 20:10-gives his destiny, the Lake of Fire.

His Purpose:=(to imitate the Holy Spirit).
-V-12 says " He exercises all the power of the 1st Beast".-(he also gets his power from Satan, as the first does.)
-( He never becomes the object of worship because he causes the people to worship the Beast. This is the work of a true prophet. -( as John the Baptist pointed to Jesus).
Remember everything God does, Satan tries to imitate. (here he tries to imitate the Holy Spirit Who points people to Jesus and gives glory to Him.)


-(this person will want the establishment of One World Religion, those who will follow him and he in turn will point them to the 1st beast, (the antichrist).
To accomplish his mission he will have to have a common thread that will cause all religions to come together, this will be a throw back to the Tower of Babel, when they all came together (Gen 11:9)- but the Lord separated them .


To accomplish his mission:
v-13-says " he will perform miracles"--(Fire from heaven)--like Elijah.-(II Kings 1: 10-12) or imitation of Pentecost,( Acts 2:3).
Does the devil have the power to do miracles.? Yes.-(He can heal and make appearances by manifesting himself, sometimes as a woman or a person of prayer, to draw attention astray! -(away from Jesus and onto an apparition).


v-14- says “he deceived the people of the earth and ordered them to set up an image
in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived.”



V-15- he will bring the image to life. (actually he will give breath! ) ( The K.J version says ' lif'e, but the Greek word here is “pneuma” which means spirit or breath, quite different from the Greek word for life which is “ZOE”.
The devil does not have the power to give life.!
-( However, if you have been following the computer system, they are now involving Artificial intelligence, creating mechanical robots with the ability to respond. Now they are teaching them to think using an intelligence.
Before long they will be able to imitate humans.
_(the Technology they are presently working on is a new computer chip made of protein-it is alive, and it will increase computing power by 50,000 times.


The U.S. has published that we have a Super Computers, capable of computing millions of bytes of information in less than a nano second.


The French have created a chip they install behind the eye-(it’s been experimental)- and they want it to record your thoughts and the data from your brain, so that when you die the information you possess can be placed into a computer and the data will be there.
–(or if perhaps you die but are cloned, you would have an image and by placing the chip inside your clone, it would be as though this new cloned image was you! It would think like you, have your knowledge, look like you, but would not be you, only your image.)


Have they cloned a human being? Or could this image is a cloning? Or
is it a statue or a robot that can speak? We probably have the technology for all of these things now. (when the scriptures say 'image', I believe it to be accurate.)


V-16- causes all to receive a mark.-on the right hand or forehead. Perhaps a computer chip! They can already place all your information on a chip, your s/s #, your bank account #, your faith, (or lack of), your health problems, and so on.


(This is a parallel to what the Lord did to the Righteous in Ezekial 9:4, where the Lord placed a Mark on the Forehead of those who were righteous and despised the sins of the ungodly, and so the Lord had six men come along and kill all those who did not have the Mark of God on their foreheads.)


Also- The shema in Deut 6:8, which is “Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength.”-(the Jews were to take the Word of God and “tie them as symbols on their hands and bind them on their foreheads.”)


Here again we see the imitation of what the Lord has done.


Here people are called on to receive a mark, and it’s on the hand or forehead.
.-( this will be Economic dependence, without the mark there will be no ability to purchase, and the only alternative is to steal. Survival is limited to those who will honor the antichrist.)


So the purpose of the False Prophet is to congregate all religions, cults, denominations together and create a One World Religion. Then he will have all his followers acknowledge the antichrist and follow him, and take his mark on their foreheads or hand.
Is there a man on the earth at this time that can fill this description?
Think about it."
 
I

Is

Guest
#15
-
According to Matt 23:23 and Luke 11:42, Christ okayed traditions just so
long as they don't circumvent, replace, repeal, clash with, nor marginalize
the Bible.

For example: Christ drank wine at his final Passover meal. That element isn't
stipulated in God's instructions as per the 12th chapter of Exodus. Passover
wine is rabbi-given rather than God-given. But Christ went along with it
anyway because the tradition is quite harmless; viz: it neither circumvents,
replaces, repeals, clashes with, nor marginalizes Passover's God-given
instructions.

===============================
I have no idea where you come to the conclusion that Jesus ok'd man made traditions by quoting Matt.23 and Luke 11:42.

What Jesus is saying is that the Pharisees were so concerned in such little matters as paying tithes on spices and even though they kept the Law they had completely overlooked its more important precepts.
 

Elin

Banned
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#16
-
My mom had me baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic Church; and
when old enough; enrolled me in catechism where I eventually completed
First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

My aunt and uncle were Catholics, their son is a Catholic, one of my half
brothers is now a semi-retired Friar. My father-in-law was a Catholic, as was
my mother-in-law. Everybody alive on my wife's side are Catholics; her
aunts and uncles, and her cousins. My sister-in-law was a nun for a number
of years before falling out with the hierarchy that controlled her order.

I have things to thank the Church for. It instilled within me an unshakable
confidence in the Holy Bible as the final authority in all matters pertaining to
faith and practice. It also instilled within me a trust in the integrity of Jesus
Christ. Very early in my youth; I began to believe that Christ knew what he
was talking about and meant what he said.

I was very proud to be affiliated with Roman Catholicism, and confident as
all get out that it is the one true religion. Some Catholics see red whenever
the Church is criticized and/or critiqued, but I never did. Some Catholics see
criticism and/or critique of the Church's beliefs and practices as hatred for
Catholics. I have never understood that mentality. Ironically, one of the
Church's enemies, the Jehovah's Witnesses, sometimes react the same way
when somebody criticizes and/or critiques the Watch Tower Society. For
some odd reason, it translates in their minds as hatred for Jehovah's
Witnesses. I think some people have trouble telling the difference between a
sport and a sport's fans; if you know what I mean.

Oddly, though I was confident that the Bible was the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice; I had never actually sat down and
read it. A co-worker in a metal shop where I worked as a welder suggested
that I buy one and see what it says. He took me to a book store where I
picked out a cheap copy of the Scofield Reference Bible. Back in 1968, it was
available in only the KJV: not the original KJV of 1611, but a revised version;
which is quite a bit easier to read and understand than the original 1611.

Everything went smoothly till I got to the New Testament, and in no time at
all I began to realize that Rome does not always agree with the Holy Bible;
nor does it always agree with Christ. Well; that was not cool with me because I
was, and still am, confident that the Holy Bible as the final authority in all
matters pertaining to faith and practice, and that Christ knew what he was
talking about and meant what he said.

Well; I soon became confronted with a very serious decision. Do I follow
Rome and its Christ; or do I follow the Holy Bible and its Christ?

The decision was a no-brainer due to my confidence in the Holy Bible as
the final authority in all matters pertaining to faith and practice' and due to
my trust in the integrity of Jesus Christ-- that he knew what he was talking
about and meant what he said.

Ironically, the Church sabotaged itself by instilling within me the justification
to defect. They say: Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Give him
some fishing tackle, and you feed him forever. Well; the Church had
inadvertently given me some fishing tackle, so to speak, and here I am
today 48 years later still a Protestant. That's not forever, but it's a start.
You were different than the usual Catholic in that you did not see the Catholic church as the final authority, which really gave you a leg-up in deciding the truth of the Scriptures when they did not agree with Catholicism.
 
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WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#17
-
You were different than the usual Catholic in that you did not see the
Catholic church as the final authority
The Bible is highly recommended by the Church.

"The Scriptures are sacred and canonical because: Having been written by
inspiration of the Holy Ghost, they have God for their author, and as such
have been handed down to the Church" (Vatican Council; Sess. III, c. ii)

"In its pages we recognize His voice, we hear a message of deep significance
for every one of us. Through the spiritual dynamism and prophetic force of
the Bible, the Holy Spirit spreads His light and His warmth over all men, in
whatever historical or sociological situation they find themselves." (Paulus PP
VI, from the Vatican, September 18, 1970)

So then; according to that Vatican Council and to Paulus PP VI; when I listen
to the Bible; I'm listening to the voice of God, and I'm also listening to that
which the Holy Spirit utilizes to spread His light and His warmth over all
men. Ironically, it was by my listening to the voice of God on the pages of the
Bible that the Holy Spirit led me to part company with Rome.

†. John 5:24 . . I assure you: those who listen to my message, and believe
in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for
their sins, but they have already passed from death into life.

=================================
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#18
-
†. Luke 11:1-2 . . One day Jesus was praying in a certain place. When he
finished, one of his disciples said to him: Lord, teach us to pray, just as John
taught his disciples. He said to them: When you pray, say: Father

There are no instances of the Lord and Master of New Testament
Christianity-- nor of any of the inspired New Testament writers --either
commanding, teaching, encouraging, leading by example, or even so much
as suggesting --that prayer be made to celestial beings and/or deceased
human beings: and for good reason. Christ-- himself a devoted, observant
Jew --never prayed to his mother, nor to celestial beings, nor to deceased
human beings, nor to anybody other than the one true God of the Jews: his
Father.

Since that was the Son's habit (and also his instructions), then that very
same compulsion should be evident in all God's kin since they are supposed
to be recipients of the only begotten Son's filial mentality.

†. Gal 4:6a . . And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the spirit of His
son into your hearts

The nature of a son's spirit is quite a bit different than the nature of a
father's spirit or the nature of a mother's spirit. In particular; Christ's spirit is
the mentality of God's offspring. So that anyone who truly has the Son's
spirit in their hearts should be experiencing the very same personal filial
bond with the Father that Jesus experiences.

Recipients of the spirit of His son are also recipients of another kind of sprit
too.

†. Rom 8:15-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of bondage again to
fear; but you have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we call out: Abba!
Father.

Here's how the spirit of adoption works:

If I were to meet President Barack Hussein Obama, I would have to make an
appointment first; and then stand back and address him as Sir or Mister
President. But his two daughters Sasha and Malia can run right up uninvited
and cling to his arm because he's their father; and they call him daddy. Now
if the Obama's should adopt a little boy some day, he will have all the very
same rights and privileges as the Obama's natural born daughters; including
a right to inherit. Their new son would have every right to run up uninvited
to Mr. Obama yelling: Daddy! Daddy! Daddy! and cling to his other arm.

In other words: the spirit of adoption imparts to God's legal children a
heartfelt bond with God that enables them to feel the love, and the
friendship, and the security feelings that normal boys and girls feel with their
birth parents.

Some professing Christians think it's disrespectful to regard the Bible's God
as a dad. But that kind of thinking isn't the mentality of a child in the home;
no, that is the mentality of hired hands, and subjects, and vassals, and
slaves. I am none of those; no, I am kin to The King. There's a place of my
own all set around the table in His home waiting for me to arrive.

Do you see now why I cannot pray to Christ's mom? It's just simply
impossible to overcome not only my family ties to Christ's Father, but also
the powerful impulses of the spirit of adoption. The spirit of adoption always
wins out over all other spirits when it comes time for me to pray because it
just naturally compels me to use a vocative to get my adoptive Father's
attention without my even thinking about it.

Adoption severs any and all obligations related to one's biological parents;
and in the eyes of the law, one's adoptive parents are just as "biological" as
the originals. Though I was at one time the son of an earthly father, I am
now the legal son of a celestial father so that Christ is not only my master;
but also my sibling; and in point of fact, since his mom is a Christian, then
she too is my sibling; and all three of us share the same paterfamilias
together.

†. John 20:17 . . Go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my
Father, and unto your Father; and unto my God, and unto your God.

What this all boils down to is that God's kin should feel an overwhelming
compulsion to pray to their adoptive Father without their having to be told
to. It should come naturally (so to speak), just as naturally as it came to
Jesus. And they should feel an equally overwhelming revulsion praying to
somebody else.

So then, people with a habit of praying to celestial beings, and/or ordinary
human beings like Christ's mom and departed saints, obviously have neither
the spirit of God's son in their heart, nor the spirit of adoption, compelling
them to call out to its Father. No, the spirit in their heart compels them to
call out to pagan gods.

=====================================
 

Elin

Banned
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
0
#19
-
†. Luke 11:1-2 . . One day Jesus was praying in a certain place. When he
finished, one of his disciples said to him: Lord, teach us to pray, just as John
taught his disciples. He said to them: When you pray, say: Father

There are no instances of the Lord and Master of New Testament
Christianity-- nor of any of the inspired New Testament writers --either
commanding, teaching, encouraging, leading by example, or even so much
as suggesting --that prayer be made to celestial beings and/or deceased
human beings: and for good reason. Christ-- himself a devoted, observant
Jew --never prayed to his mother, nor to celestial beings, nor to deceased
human beings, nor to anybody other than the one true God of the Jews: his
Father.

Since that was the Son's habit (and also his instructions), then that very
same compulsion should be evident in all God's kin since they are supposed
to be recipients of the only begotten Son's filial mentality.

†. Gal 4:6a . . And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the spirit of His
son into your hearts

The nature of a son's spirit is quite a bit different than the nature of a
father's spirit or the nature of a mother's spirit. In particular; Christ's spirit is
the mentality of God's offspring. So that anyone who truly has the Son's
spirit in their hearts should be experiencing the very same personal filial
bond with the Father that Jesus experiences.

Recipients of the spirit of His son are also recipients of another kind of sprit
too.

†. Rom 8:15-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of bondage again to
fear; but you have received a spirit of adoption, whereby we call out: Abba!
Father.

Here's how the spirit of adoption works:

If I were to meet President Barack Hussein Obama, I would have to make an
appointment first; and then stand back and address him as Sir or Mister
President. But his two daughters Sasha and Malia can run right up uninvited
and cling to his arm because he's their father; and they call him daddy. Now
if the Obama's should adopt a little boy some day, he will have all the very
same rights and privileges as the Obama's natural born daughters; including
a right to inherit. Their new son would have every right to run up uninvited
to Mr. Obama yelling: Daddy! Daddy! Daddy! and cling to his other arm.

In other words: the spirit of adoption imparts to God's legal children a
heartfelt bond with God that enables them to feel the love, and the
friendship, and the security feelings that normal boys and girls feel with their
birth parents.

Some professing Christians think it's disrespectful to regard the Bible's God
as a dad. But that kind of thinking isn't the mentality of a child in the home;
no, that is the mentality of hired hands, and subjects, and vassals, and
slaves. I am none of those; no, I am kin to The King. There's a place of my
own all set around the table in His home waiting for me to arrive.

Do you see now why I cannot pray to Christ's mom? It's just simply
impossible to overcome not only my family ties to Christ's Father, but also
the powerful impulses of the spirit of adoption. The spirit of adoption always
wins out over all other spirits when it comes time for me to pray because it
just naturally compels me to use a vocative to get my adoptive Father's
attention without my even thinking about it.

Adoption severs any and all obligations related to one's biological parents;
and in the eyes of the law, one's adoptive parents are just as "biological" as
the originals. Though I was at one time the son of an earthly father, I am
now the legal son of a celestial father so that Christ is not only my master;
but also my sibling; and in point of fact, since his mom is a Christian, then
she too is my sibling; and all three of us share the same paterfamilias
together.

†. John 20:17 . . Go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my
Father, and unto your Father; and unto my God, and unto your God.

What this all boils down to is that God's kin should feel an overwhelming
compulsion to pray to their adoptive Father without their having to be told
to. It should come naturally (so to speak), just as naturally as it came to
Jesus. And they should feel an equally overwhelming revulsion praying to
somebody else.

So then, people with a habit of praying to celestial beings, and/or ordinary
human beings like Christ's mom and departed saints, obviously have neither
the spirit of God's son in their heart, nor the spirit of adoption, compelling
them to call out to its Father. No, the spirit in their heart compels them to
call out to pagan gods.
You were not the usual Catholic, for in all these matters the Catholic Church claims authority to interpret the meaning of the Scriptures.

You did not believe in their authority to do so. . .that's a big deal to them.
 
Nov 14, 2012
2,113
4
0
#20
You were not the usual Catholic, for in all these matters the Catholic Church claims authority to interpret the meaning of the Scriptures.

You did not believe in their authority to do so. . .that's a big deal to them.
I'm sorry but this is just sad. Congratulating a person who became a hater