My husband and I are Christians and we belong to a great church. Right now, we are giving financially what we can to the church, and we participate in all the activities and volunteer opportunities the church, as well as traveling overseas on missions trips to help up in every single way we can to be a blessing to others. We attended the Dave Ramsey Financial Peace program over a year ago and started eliminating debt through his debt snowball program. In 1 year, we have eliminated over $55,000 in debt, and we have 1 more bill and then our house to pay off. My gut is telling me that we should be tithing 10% of our income first to the church, and then paying bills, but my husband wants to get the debt paid off so that we can live and give like no other, much more than we ever have been able to for our church and community. Because of this, we use most of our cash to pay the bills and we give a smaller amount than we want to for the church weekly. We both know that the Bible says to not be "slave to the lender" and we know that it will be less than one year before we are debt free and can give so much more. Is this way of thinking right, or should we not work on the bills with as much intensity and tithe first? God has been good to us and we are being blessed in SO many ways right now -- but I am not sure if we are doing the right thing?
Tithing While Eliminating Debt
- Thread starter Cindy12
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Let me tell you about tithing. First is tithing is about the heart first not the money, when you give God is far more interested in the heart behind the giving than the amount of money or the money itself. tithing is good but God wants you to take care of yourself as well, also God accepts any amount not just 10% and sometimes you are unable to give which is fine with him as well. God is not after the money he is after your heart
I've been sending folks to him for years. Whatever debt you owe that resulted from spending a creditor's money should be returned ASAP since you owe that to them. In other words, you had a "false" gain substituting for actual earned gain. From my understanding of Dave's teaching, that amount is not subject to tithes since it is a borrowed sum, not income. Your income now is supposed to be retiring that debt. and whatever is left over is yours to tithe on. Using another's money to tithe doesn't seem wise.
Secondly, God prescribed tithing to be done at specific points in time, like in the Fall after final major harvests, then again in Spring after those harvests. From that I don't believe the Lord expects all our tithing weekly or even monthly, but when we have abundance. The idea was not to put a burden on those farmers having to jeopardize their finances continually.
I pay our catch-up tithe when our tax records indicate more income than we guessed at though the year. Once you are free of that debt I'm certain the Lord will bless you mightily to catch up, according to the promises to tithers, it being GOD that gives to you. Those are continuous however often we actually remit tithes.
He won't stop blessing our business just because we don't tithe every Sunday. You are also being blessed to be able to do all that from freewill offerings which have their own lesser promises, such as reimbursement+, according to your generous measure, received from MEN, pressed down, shaken together. overflowing.
God knows your checkbook and your heart. Let tithing be a blessing with no burden. The only caution I can put in here is if you have been tithing on a schedule that will change significantly, and your church depends on it to meet a budget, it would be best to discuss that with your pastor, who might need a little notice to make an adjustment. Usually only a tiny percent of members tithe to actually substantially support their church mission (80% of a well planned budget), so tithers need to remain as responsible as possible. A member that could tithe but gives less than that (nationally less than 3% of income), statistically all together doing that making up an average of 20% of the budget, is far less likely to have an impact on their church.
Nice job you did so far! You'll have a lot of fun being a bigger giver.
Secondly, God prescribed tithing to be done at specific points in time, like in the Fall after final major harvests, then again in Spring after those harvests. From that I don't believe the Lord expects all our tithing weekly or even monthly, but when we have abundance. The idea was not to put a burden on those farmers having to jeopardize their finances continually.
I pay our catch-up tithe when our tax records indicate more income than we guessed at though the year. Once you are free of that debt I'm certain the Lord will bless you mightily to catch up, according to the promises to tithers, it being GOD that gives to you. Those are continuous however often we actually remit tithes.
He won't stop blessing our business just because we don't tithe every Sunday. You are also being blessed to be able to do all that from freewill offerings which have their own lesser promises, such as reimbursement+, according to your generous measure, received from MEN, pressed down, shaken together. overflowing.
God knows your checkbook and your heart. Let tithing be a blessing with no burden. The only caution I can put in here is if you have been tithing on a schedule that will change significantly, and your church depends on it to meet a budget, it would be best to discuss that with your pastor, who might need a little notice to make an adjustment. Usually only a tiny percent of members tithe to actually substantially support their church mission (80% of a well planned budget), so tithers need to remain as responsible as possible. A member that could tithe but gives less than that (nationally less than 3% of income), statistically all together doing that making up an average of 20% of the budget, is far less likely to have an impact on their church.
Nice job you did so far! You'll have a lot of fun being a bigger giver.
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The tithing of today is a tradition of men. In about 564 AD the Catholic Church toyed with the idea in the Macon council. In 777 AD the true body of Christ picked up on it. The modern tithe, as it is done, cannot be validated by either old or new testaments.
Paul said there are two sources for our giving. The traveling preacher and the poor. It should be of free will, as one purposes in his heart to give, not by constraint but with joy. Not beyond what you can afford.
Acts 20 tells us that the elders/pastors are to work jobs and not sponge off the folks nor 'lord it over His heritage.'
So there is a lot in play here. For deep studies on the subject, see: truthforfree.com and wickedshepherds.com
Dont let anyone place a yoke of bondage on you! Study this thing through and be free. Be blessed!
Paul said there are two sources for our giving. The traveling preacher and the poor. It should be of free will, as one purposes in his heart to give, not by constraint but with joy. Not beyond what you can afford.
Acts 20 tells us that the elders/pastors are to work jobs and not sponge off the folks nor 'lord it over His heritage.'
So there is a lot in play here. For deep studies on the subject, see: truthforfree.com and wickedshepherds.com
Dont let anyone place a yoke of bondage on you! Study this thing through and be free. Be blessed!
Just so you hear the other side of the story, here is a link showing that giving tithes in not Biblical. It's long, but pretty thorough. It goes deeply into the Bible, and history, and the Jews.
The Tithe is Illegal
That being said, I tithe because my husband wants us to. We are debt free, and have been for many years. But we were also very frugal, our entire marriage. The only debt we ever had was a small amount for a mortgage. We never spent more than we took in. We never had a new car till 2 years ago. My husband bought old clunkers and fixed them. We bought things when we had the money.
It worked! I hope you can come to some kind of resolution of your question. But certainly, do not feel guilty about how much you give to your church. God loves a cheerful giver, not someone bound in misinterpreted Old Testament law.
The Tithe is Illegal
That being said, I tithe because my husband wants us to. We are debt free, and have been for many years. But we were also very frugal, our entire marriage. The only debt we ever had was a small amount for a mortgage. We never spent more than we took in. We never had a new car till 2 years ago. My husband bought old clunkers and fixed them. We bought things when we had the money.
It worked! I hope you can come to some kind of resolution of your question. But certainly, do not feel guilty about how much you give to your church. God loves a cheerful giver, not someone bound in misinterpreted Old Testament law.
We are not commanded to tithe, as were the Jews under the law of Moses. I tithe because Abraham did without a commandment 430 years before any law required it, and he experienced great blessings because of it. So have I been blessed far beyond what anyone thought I might experience, not being smart enough early enough to enter into some high paying career in my youth like some cousins did.
I learned more about it from Hebrews 7, that Jesus receives tithes while in Heaven as rightfully as men on earth did that died.
I also learned that ministers who tend the altar for my sake deserve to make their living off the gospel.
1 Corinthians 9:13-14 (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.
Those men of the temple existed by the tithe, the offerings being special blessings beyond their minimum needs. Even so, then, wouldn't our Christian ministers deserve no less, according to Paul? They need to set a ministry budget around a reasonable collection that will fund it, get it approved in a business meeting, and expect it to come in. Folks that object to a tithe are always the ones that also offer little, come to Sunday School early to get in on the free full breakfast bar designed for the needy assumed to be coming, drop a dollar in the donation jar on the table, go to the bathroom or visit in the lobby during the offering time in church service, then leave in their F-250 Platinum. Multiply that to most attending, who are always the complainers about how things are done or not done.
I'm very happy I always knew what my paychecks would be in advance, employers and clients committed to pay me a living wage. I can't imagine living off the hope of tips, or ordering a fine meal in a restaurant, then offering $2 when it ought to be $20 plus a customary tip for the waitress. They have lots of seats in movie theaters, but that's no excuse for anyone to occupy one without paying just because you think they charge too much. The idea is you shouldn't get to sit there benefiting.
I choose to be among the blessed. Everything we own lasts way beyond expected life. We still watch a Sony Grand Wega TV with wonderful speakers, the first fairly "smart" TV, we knew about that we bought 14 years ago. My tires reach double advertised miles, replaced only because they look too old and scuffed. My health is excellent. I'm mostly retired on far less earnings, but lifestyle the same. A lot of it really can't be accounted for. Every person I know that tithes is blessed beyond their ability to earn.
So, I know when people slam tithing I know they are passing up a lot of help and blessing from God, yet through some giving, experience some blessing. It's all relevant to whatever measure you send out determining how it comes back. His heavenly economic system is based on tithes + offerings.
I learned more about it from Hebrews 7, that Jesus receives tithes while in Heaven as rightfully as men on earth did that died.
I also learned that ministers who tend the altar for my sake deserve to make their living off the gospel.
1 Corinthians 9:13-14 (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
[SUP]14 [/SUP] Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.
Those men of the temple existed by the tithe, the offerings being special blessings beyond their minimum needs. Even so, then, wouldn't our Christian ministers deserve no less, according to Paul? They need to set a ministry budget around a reasonable collection that will fund it, get it approved in a business meeting, and expect it to come in. Folks that object to a tithe are always the ones that also offer little, come to Sunday School early to get in on the free full breakfast bar designed for the needy assumed to be coming, drop a dollar in the donation jar on the table, go to the bathroom or visit in the lobby during the offering time in church service, then leave in their F-250 Platinum. Multiply that to most attending, who are always the complainers about how things are done or not done.
I'm very happy I always knew what my paychecks would be in advance, employers and clients committed to pay me a living wage. I can't imagine living off the hope of tips, or ordering a fine meal in a restaurant, then offering $2 when it ought to be $20 plus a customary tip for the waitress. They have lots of seats in movie theaters, but that's no excuse for anyone to occupy one without paying just because you think they charge too much. The idea is you shouldn't get to sit there benefiting.
I choose to be among the blessed. Everything we own lasts way beyond expected life. We still watch a Sony Grand Wega TV with wonderful speakers, the first fairly "smart" TV, we knew about that we bought 14 years ago. My tires reach double advertised miles, replaced only because they look too old and scuffed. My health is excellent. I'm mostly retired on far less earnings, but lifestyle the same. A lot of it really can't be accounted for. Every person I know that tithes is blessed beyond their ability to earn.
So, I know when people slam tithing I know they are passing up a lot of help and blessing from God, yet through some giving, experience some blessing. It's all relevant to whatever measure you send out determining how it comes back. His heavenly economic system is based on tithes + offerings.
True tithing from the Word is 10% of your annual profit. If one is truly in debt, no tithing is asked. The word, tithe, is totally misused by Christians since there is no single country, not Temple, and no governing faith. Today a collection for the assembly and the church expenses is taken from any and all who give voluntarily. Nothing should be expected of anyone who is truly in a debt situation. That person is in need. I speak of the truly in debt, not those living beyond their own means.
Very many biblically sound people here, but the body of Christ should only CONFIRM what the Holy Spirit tells you personally. And since in the NT there is only the admonition to give as you feel led to give, what I said still stands. Pray as a couple first - I do believe the Lord will give you direction.
E
Pray to God. He is the one who gives the increase. As Jesus said, Give to ceasar what is ceasar and God what is God's
As for tithing, Study, that is not a NT term, nor is it required, it is a work of the law, and is not even money, it was giving ten % of crops to the priests before you took for yourself, and sold to anyone else.
It does not mean we do not give with an open heart. What we should do is what we feel led to do. Just make sure that is not satan leading us..lol
As for tithing, Study, that is not a NT term, nor is it required, it is a work of the law, and is not even money, it was giving ten % of crops to the priests before you took for yourself, and sold to anyone else.
It does not mean we do not give with an open heart. What we should do is what we feel led to do. Just make sure that is not satan leading us..lol