Law of Moses Dissected: Extracting the Moral Law

[BenFTW]

What are your thoughts on separating the Law of Moses into three distinct parts and saying one still applies to us today? We have the ceremonial law, judicial law and the moral law. The moral law still stands it is said because God's character and morality is unchanging. However, this idea that we are to be obedient to the moral law, is this biblical? What of the Law of Liberty, or the Law of Christ?

The distinction, if there is one, that needs to be made is between the Law of Christ (love) and the moral law (from the Law of Moses). This idea that we isolate one part of the Law and say it still applies, how does this work in conjunction with us being dead to the Law of Moses? Not being under the Law of Moses? Christ being the end of the Law of Moses? These questions go through my mind when people say we are under obligation to be obedient to the moral law.

My question to you and directive, is for you to expound on this. Make a case as why or why not we are to isolate, or extract the moral law from the Law of Moses and whether it is the same as the Law of Christ. Is not the Law of Moses a unit, and therefore inseparable? Expound.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

It's a man-made invention created as a basis to justify law keeping. GOD's law is one. It can't be separated into separate parts for the wiles of men.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

In the spirit of a former sage: The law of Moses is not a bag of trail mix. You can't pick out the pieces you like and ignore the rest.

 

[Nautilus]

In the spirit of a former sage: The law of Moses is not a bag of trail mix. You can't pick out the pieces you like and ignore the rest.

You're absolutely right. Just throw out the whole bag. Go with Christ instead.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You're absolutely right. Just throw out the whole bag. Go with Christ instead.

A healthy idea. It's definitely past it's expiration date.

In calling [the new covenant] new, he has declared the former [covenant] to be old. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is near to disappearing. Hebrews 8:13​

 

[FreeNChrist]

Not. The Law cannot be divided into categories, and certainly not into categories which makes some laws obligatory and others optional, some laws permanent and others temporary, or some laws more important that others. Paul tells us that if one desires to be under the law it necessitates "abiding by all things written in the Book of the Law" (Gal. 3:10), and of being "obligated to keep the whole Law" (Gal. 5:3). James also understood that the Law could not be partitioned for "whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all" (James 2:10). IOW, no slicing and dicing is allowed. If you want to be under the Law, you are under all of it.

 

[gb9]

dividing the Law is a man-made thing. nothing Biblical about it. now that being said, do we really need yet another law vs. grace vs. faith thread?? I understand that this is not the O.P. 's intent, but based on past history that is what we are going to get.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

dividing the Law is a man-made thing.

I Agree.......

 

[BenFTW]

dividing the Law is a man-made thing. nothing Biblical about it. now that being said, do we really need yet another law vs. grace vs. faith thread?? I understand that this is not the O.P. 's intent, but based on past history that is what we are going to get.

This thread isn't so much about Legalism as it is about the distinction between the moral law and the Law of Christ. Also whether it is proper to extract the moral law from the Law of Moses as a measure of something we are to be obedient to. It isn't the usual grace vs law thread, but rather is addressing the idea of obedience to the moral law and if it is okay to dissect the Law of Moses to pull something out that we must be obedient to.

So it is about Legalism in one sense, but it isn't, in that it is addressing the moral Law and not the Law of Moses as a whole. People who dissect the Law of Moses alienate the moral law (from it as a whole), therefore we are addressing something of a legalistic nature but not Legalism itself. The moral law is a set standard, and so in that sense it can be legalistic to demand obedience to it or else, in the form of striving and not rest.

Is the extracting of the moral law from the Law of Moses just a veiled attempt at Legalism? I suppose that too can be where this thread is headed and a question this thread may answer.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

This thread isn't so much about Legalism as it is about the distinction between the moral law and the Law of Christ. Also whether it is proper to extract the moral law from the Law of Moses as a measure of something we are to be obedient to. It isn't the usual grace vs law thread, but rather is addressing the idea of obedience to the moral law and if it is okay to dissect the Law of Moses to pull something out that we must be obedient to.

So it is about Legalism in one sense, but it isn't, in that it is addressing the moral Law and not the Law of Moses as a whole. People who dissect the Law of Moses alienate the moral law (from it as a whole), therefore we are addressing something of a legalistic nature but not Legalism itself. The moral law is a set standard, and so in that sense it can be legalistic to demand obedience to it or else, in the form of striving and not rest.

Is the extracting of the moral law from the Law of Moses just a veiled attempt at Legalism? I suppose that too can be where this thread is headed and a question this thread may answer.

Quit talking about the moral law as if it is something that exists. It is a contrivance. The law is spiritual. Men who try to define good apart from Christ talk about morality. Morality is of the realm of philosophy.

 

[FreeNChrist]

This thread isn't so much about Legalism as it is about the distinction between the moral law and the Law of Christ.

The distinction I see is that the Law is a ministry of death, 2 Corinthians 3:7. Whereas the Law of Christ is a ministry of life, Romans 8:2, that sets us free from the law of sin and death.

 

[MarcR]

What are your thoughts on separating the Law of Moses into three distinct parts and saying one still applies to us today? We have the ceremonial law, judicial law and the moral law. The moral law still stands it is said because God's character and morality is unchanging. However, this idea that we are to be obedient to the moral law, is this biblical? What of the Law of Liberty, or the Law of Christ?

The distinction, if there is one, that needs to be made is between the Law of Christ (love) and the moral law (from the Law of Moses). This idea that we isolate one part of the Law and say it still applies, how does this work in conjunction with us being dead to the Law of Moses? Not being under the Law of Moses? Christ being the end of the Law of Moses? These questions go through my mind when people say we are under obligation to be obedient to the moral law.

My question to you and directive, is for you to expound on this. Make a case as why or why not we are to isolate, or extract the moral law from the Law of Moses and whether it is the same as the Law of Christ. Is not the Law of Moses a unit, and therefore inseparable? Expound.

All of Jesus' moral and ethical teachings come from the Law of Moses; but not all the moral and ethical teachings of Moses were taught by Jesus.

The Law micromanaged every area of life; while Jesus taught moral principles; and left to the Holy Spirit the task of guiding us through the details.

 

[KennethC]

The "LAW OF MOSES" is the law that is contained in written ordinances.........

The "PERFECT LAW OF LIBERTY IN CHRIST" is the teachings and commands of Jesus Christ from the gospel books.......

The "MORAL LAW OF GOD" is the unchanging Spiritual aspect of God that has existed even before the written form was ever written down.

How do you think we got the concept of the ceremonial laws, sacrificial laws, cleansing laws, moral laws, and such ???

We got those concepts because this is how the Jews divided the laws since the beginning, and since they are the one's who the law was original first given to then we should take from them how the law is to be looked at.

Even throughout the NT the 10 Commandments which are contained both in the written ordinances and moral law are shown all throughout the NT to be upheld by new covenant believers.

Even in Revelation we can see when the Lord says those who keep His commandments He mentions those things contained within the 10. Now these are not to be upheld as a set of written ordinances, but out of love we uphold them because following them is be as a everyday way of life.

In other words our earthly parents raise us up in a set of standards growing up. When we get older do we still follow those standards as rules, or do they just become naturally for you to carry out and obey ???

To me those things are naturally done now, which is how our walk in maturity works in the faith. Those morals of God no longer are looked at as laws/ordinances/rules, they become a natural way to walk as the fruit of the Spirit strengthens us where we are weak to walk in them.

God bless

 

[eternally-gratefull]

This thread isn't so much about Legalism as it is about the distinction between the moral law and the Law of Christ. Also whether it is proper to extract the moral law from the Law of Moses as a measure of something we are to be obedient to. It isn't the usual grace vs law thread, but rather is addressing the idea of obedience to the moral law and if it is okay to dissect the Law of Moses to pull something out that we must be obedient to.

So it is about Legalism in one sense, but it isn't, in that it is addressing the moral Law and not the Law of Moses as a whole. People who dissect the Law of Moses alienate the moral law (from it as a whole), therefore we are addressing something of a legalistic nature but not Legalism itself. The moral law is a set standard, and so in that sense it can be legalistic to demand obedience to it or else, in the form of striving and not rest.

Is the extracting of the moral law from the Law of Moses just a veiled attempt at Legalism? I suppose that too can be where this thread is headed and a question this thread may answer.

Its a good thread, if we can keep it civil. When I get time I would like to open a thread and try to discuss how paul used the law and prophets starting all the way back to Gen 3: 15 to show who the messiah would be and what he would do.

When jesus walked wiht the two men and he explained using the OT all things concerning messiah, And their eyes were opened, I wish so badly we had a video tape or at least a cassette tape of this teaching.. Imagine how powerful that was.

We can not know Jesus words, or pauls words.. But I think it would be a benefit to try to figure out what they said. for all of us.

between a thread like this, and that. we might actually learn something..

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

The "LAW OF MOSES" is the law that is contained in written ordinances.........

The "PERFECT LAW OF LIBERTY IN CHRIST" is the teachings and commands of Jesus Christ from the gospel books.......

The "MORAL LAW OF GOD" is the unchanging Spiritual aspect of God that has existed even before the written form was ever written down.

How do you think we got the concept of the ceremonial laws, sacrificial laws, cleansing laws, moral laws, and such ???

We got those concepts because this is how the Jews divided the laws since the beginning, and since they are the one's who the law was original first given to then we should take from them how the law is to be looked at.

Even throughout the NT the 10 Commandments which are contained both in the written ordinances and moral law are shown all throughout the NT to be upheld by new covenant believers.

Even in Revelation we can see when the Lord says those who keep His commandments He mentions those things contained within the 10. Now these are not to be upheld as a set of written ordinances, but out of love we uphold them because following them is be as a everyday way of life.

In other words our earthly parents raise us up in a set of standards growing up. When we get older do we still follow those standards as rules, or do they just become naturally for you to carry out and obey ???

To me those things are naturally done now, which is how our walk in maturity works in the faith. Those morals of God no longer are looked at as laws/ordinances/rules, they become a natural way to walk as the fruit of the Spirit strengthens us where we are weak to walk in them.

God bless

Man-made contrivance...

 

[crossnote]

The law can't be divided, as James said if you fail to keep one point you have broken all.
We have died with Christ (who are in Christ) to that system and are under the New Covenant...an unconditional one.

 

[KennethC]

Man-made contrivance...

How many times does the NT say that no liar will inherit eternal life/see the kingdom of heaven ???

Look it up and you will see it as well as others are still stated in the NT including in Revelation, and that of being a liar is the 9th commandment.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

The bible says that if you are going to do the law then you are to do it all, so then a person can't say I'll keep this section but the other part I am under Grace.
Trying to add a little help to GOD's perfection is an insult.

IE
A kid once asked his dad if he could go to the movies to see a movie and his dad said no that movie has things in it I don't want you to see and the kid said I know but it's only a little bit,so the dad said invite your friends over for some cookies and we'll talk about it so the kids friends came over and the dad told them I made some cookies and I put just a little bit of doggy-do in it and it won't hurt so you guys go ahead and eat some and the kids said I don't think we want them.

In other words trying to add on to GOD's perfect work just pollutes it.

 

[mailmandan]

I hear people error by interpreting Ephesians 2:8,9 like this - saved by grace through faith "and good works" just not works of the law. Faith is faith and works are works and we cannot dissect good works from the moral aspect of the law and then teach we are saved by "these" works, just not "those" works.

 

[oldhermit]

The ten commandments served as the foundation of the entire Law. They were nothing more than the embodiment of eternal principles that are rooted in the reality of God and man's relationship to God. The New testament as well as the Old are built on these generalized principles which still stand as the foundation of man's relationship to God and man's relationship to man. Everything else within the Law of Moses was simply regulations and ordinances that instructed ISRAEL in how THEY were to honor these eternal principles.