Gospel of the Kingdom vs the Gospel Paul preached

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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#61
Jesus knew as well as the Baptist from the beginning that He would be the Lamb of God to take away the sins of the world.

John the Baptist doubted at one point. Why? Was he becoming King, taking the government upon His shoulders? No, John didn't completely understand what Jesus came to do.

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[TD][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Matthew 11:2 Now when John had heard in the prison the works of Christ, he sent two of his disciples, [/FONT][/TD]
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[TD][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]11:3 And said unto him, Art thou he that should come, or do we look for another?[/FONT][/TD]
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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,617
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#62
Could be...I just happened to see that in my email this morning.....I never gave it much thought as to the difference and most likely won't as I really have no inward witness to focus on that now in my life....whatever happens..I do know it's going to be good!
I understand what you're saying, but if one does not discern the difference, we may lay kingdom doctrine upon people in the Church Age. A young lady on another thread is struggling with this right now in the "once saved, always saved" discussion. Rightly dividing the word of truth is vital! Not rightly dividing is why we get so many different denominations believing in different things like works for salvation, the loss of salvation, etc..
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#63
Cool!..give me an example of that?...now you have my interest...thanks


I understand what you're saying, but if one does not discern the difference, we may lay kingdom doctrine upon people in the Church Age. A young lady on another thread is struggling with this right now in the "once saved, always saved" discussion. Rightly dividing the word of truth is vital! Not rightly dividing is why we get so many different denominations believing in different things like works for salvation, the loss of salvation, etc..
 

iwant2serve

Senior Member
Apr 12, 2009
513
28
28
#64
I do not in no way want to offend anyone by saying this. After reading many of the post I am scratching my head asking how many people understand kingdom. Or what kingdom Jesus came to establish for what time and where will it be established?
 
N

nuldesperandum

Guest
#65
True that...there seems to be some special Kingdom full of Jews involved. maybe unicorns also
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,617
3,530
113
#66
I do not in no way want to offend anyone by saying this. After reading many of the post I am scratching my head asking how many people understand kingdom. Or what kingdom Jesus came to establish for what time and where will it be established?
Jesus came to establish the Kingdom promised to Israel with the rightful King sitting on the throne of David. But before He could give them the physical, He would have to take care of their spiritual need of salvation. The Jews didn't understand that part of it because it was hid from them by God (see earlier posts for Scripture references). They were searching for a king to establish the earthly kingdom not die on a cross. Even the disciples went back to business as usual after His death, but after His resurrection the Lord started to open up their minds to the truth of why He came. But still, the nation of Israel as a whole rejected Jesus so the physical kingdom was put on hold. From then on, the Lord would use the Apostle Paul to reach the Gentile world with the message of the death, burial, and resurrection. When the fullness of the Gentiles is come, God will turn His attention back to the nation of Israel and establish His kingdom on earth with Jesus as King. The Church, the body of Christ made up of mostly Gentiles will return with Him to reign on the earth 1,000 years. After that, the final judgment of Satan and man, then...eternity! Praise God! Great is the mystery of godliness!
 
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nuldesperandum

Guest
#67
I am not sure Israel actually existed then though. I am unclear on this personally, but the received wisdom is that Israel was disbanded in 721BC, so I am not sure how Jesus would set up the physical kingdom of Israel if no such country existed.

I guess that is why the disciples asked (Acts 1:6)



When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
 
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I

Is

Guest
#68
I always thought that the kingdom was within us because of being in Christ...

Luke 17:21 (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.Romans 14:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

We certainly have the righteousness and peace and joy in Christ so I'm assuming the kingdom is in us now..
I believe that is generally considered to be the Kingdom of God, the Kingdom of Heaven is Jesus's earthly rule.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#69
Look Christ before His cross and Christ raised and seated at the Fathers right hand ...of course the gospels are going to relate the Lord and work to redeem man according to the law... Paul is teaching the results of His Work and sacrifice ... There is no conflict at all in these terms folks seem to be getting caught up on.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#70
I believe that is generally considered to be the Kingdom of God, the Kingdom of Heaven is Jesus's earthly rule.
Exactly! Before the physical could be given the spiritual had to be fixed. But the spiritual kingdom was hid until after Jesus defeated the cross. Seek ye first the kingdom of God, then all the physical promises will be added. Jesus was preparing them for the cross without telling them about the cross.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,617
3,530
113
#71
Cool!..give me an example of that?...now you have my interest...thanks
Much of the kingdom doctrine is outlined in the sermon on the mount, Matthew 5-7. Don't explain it away, take it literal. If I don't take the Bible literal, then I can make it say whatever I want it to say.
 
N

nuldesperandum

Guest
#72
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

So you saying the pharisees went around constructing walls and fences?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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#73
Even after the resurrection the disciples were concerned about the physical kingdom:

Acts 1:6, "When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?"

Not now guys, just go preach what you've witness.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#74
which kingdom is that?..God or heaven..that you think the mount talks were about?


Much of the kingdom doctrine is outlined in the sermon on the mount, Matthew 5-7. Don't explain it away, take it literal. If I don't take the Bible literal, then I can make it say whatever I want it to say.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,617
3,530
113
#75
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

So you saying the pharisees went around constructing walls and fences?
Their rejection would lead many others to reject it, thus shutting them out.
 
I

Is

Guest
#77
Luke 18:32-34 Jesus is telling his disciples, "For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on; And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and on the third day he shall rise again." Is this not our gospel message? Verse 34, "And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken."

So what gospel did Jesus and the disciples go around preaching? The disciples had no idea about the cross. Peter tried to stop it from happening. After His death, the disciples weren't gathered around anxiously awaiting His resurrection.


The gospel of the Kingdom was specifically given to the Jews. Matthew 10:5-7, "These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand." Did the disciples go around preaching a gospel they didn't understand?[/QUOTE]

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In the beginning Peter saw the Gospel as pertaining to the Jews only:

"For the promise is unto you and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:39

It wasn't until Acts 10:9 when God showed him what was clean and unclean and his dealings with Cornelius that Peter changed his opinion.
 
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John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,617
3,530
113
#79
Ok..thanks....so I don't have to chop my hand off or pluck out my eyes now..that's a good thing...:)
I hear preachers all the time explaining away as they go through sermon on the mount. Some things they'll take, some they spiritualize it. The doctrine of the Church has been given mostly through Paul's letters to the body of Christ.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#80
I hear preachers all the time explaining away as they go through sermon on the mount. Some things they'll take, some they spiritualize it. The doctrine of the Church has been given mostly through Paul's letters to the body of Christ.
Well the sermon on the mount was to those under the law ...Christ could not have preached His finished work ..until He finished the work and was raised ....of course you can see it in His teaches and words ...after knowing the gospel of Grace and put His Words into context. There is no conflict...