Is your church condemned?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
May 20, 2016
406
2
0
#1
Paul says that if anyone preaches a different gospel that what the apostles taught they are condemned.

(Galatians 1:7-8) “Not that there can be more than one Good News; it is merely that some troublemakers among you want to change the Good News of Christ; and let me warn you that if anyone preaches a version of the Good News different from the one you have already heard, he is to be condemned.”

Some of what the apostles/Jesus taught follows does your church teach all of the following scripture?

(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s.”

(Matthew 5:48) “Even the pagans do as much, do they not? You must therefore be perfect just as your heavenly Father is perfect.”

(Matthew 5:39) “You have learnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ But I say this to you: offer the wicked man no resistance.”

(Luke 14:33) “So in the same way, none of you can be my disciple unless he gives up all his possessions.”


(Matthew 6:19) “Do not store up treasures for yourselves on earth, where moths and woodworms destroy them and thieves can break in and steal.”


(Matthew 23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since you have only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, and he is in heaven.”


(1 Corinthians 6:9-19) “You know perfectly well that people who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God: people of immoral lives, idolaters, adulterers, catamites, sodomites, thieves, usurers, drunkards, slanders and

swindlers will never inherit the kingdom of God.”


Immoral lives: bad, wicked, dissolute, dissipated, profligate, referring to conduct, applies to one who acts contrary to or doesnot obey or conform to standards of morality,

Idolaters: a worshiper of idols.

Adulterers: voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than his or her lawful spouse.


Catamites:
a boy or youth who is in a sexual relationship with a man.

Sodomites:
a person who engages in sodomy.
Anal or oral copulation with a member of the opposite sex. Copulation with a member of the same sex.

Copulation:
sexual intercourse.2.a joining together or coupling.

Thieves: a person who steals, especially secretly or without open force; oneguilty of theft or larceny.


2. Obsolete. a person who lends money at interest.


Drunkards: a person who is habitually or frequently
drunk.

Drunk: being in a temporary state in which one's physical and mental facultiesare impaired by an excess of alcoholic
drink; intoxicated:

Slanders: One who gives, a malicious, false, and defamatory statement or report: a slander against his good name.


Swindlers: to cheat (a person, business, etc.) out of money or other assets.

2 to obtain by fraud or deceit.
 

santuzza

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2013
1,609
38
48
#2
So, are YOU condemned?

Remember the one pointing a finger at others is pointing three others back at himself.
 
May 20, 2016
406
2
0
#3
So, are YOU condemned?

Remember the one pointing a finger at others is pointing three others back at himself.
Is that true? Who told you that? All Prophets of God were told by God to point their fingers at people.
 
Apr 22, 2016
1,218
12
0
#4
Paul says that if anyone preaches a different gospel that what the apostles taught they are condemned.

(Galatians 1:7-8) “Not that there can be more than one Good News; it is merely that some troublemakers among you want to change the Good News of Christ; and let me warn you that if anyone preaches a version of the Good News different from the one you have already heard, he is to be condemned.”


There are many. Take your pick. You can start with the obvious ones such as the ones identified as cults because they deny the deity of Christ. Those are the easy ones to spot. But then it takes a discerning spirit to spot the less obvious ones. The world is full of antichrists.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
6,479
113
#5
What's funny is........(not haha funny, but odd funny) your Screen name is JohnLOVE.......


I know I felt the LOVE pouring out of that post.

Oh, Goodness.............and you are a prophet of God too?
 
May 20, 2016
406
2
0
#6
What's funny is........(not haha funny, but odd funny) your Screen name is JohnLOVE.......


I know I felt the LOVE pouring out of that post.

Oh, Goodness.............and you are a prophet of God too?
The truth hurt it seems.
 
R

RobbyEarl

Guest
#7
The sad truth is that most churches no longer preach the gospel. they preach psychology and how to cope in this world. Altar calls no longer happen. But mostly, psychology with a little Jesus wrapped in it. It is the apostate church. Why do you think that were going to have men on the women college swim team, because the truth is not being preached.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
6,479
113
#8
The truth hurt it seems.
Who's truth? Yours?

Don't you guys EVER get tired of finding someone/something to CONDEMN?

.............goodness.............

The Gospel of Christ is a Gospel of Love............NOT condemnation.

It's called the GOOD NEWS!
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,095
6,479
113
#9
The sad truth is that most churches no longer preach the gospel. they preach psychology and how to cope in this world. Altar calls no longer happen. But mostly, psychology with a little Jesus wrapped in it. It is the apostate church. Why do you think that were going to have men on the women college swim team, because the truth is not being preached.
there's that word again......sigh...... :)

Honestly, you are not the only one........I think I've seen it three other times today here on CC.

Why do I mention it? It is at least a gross overstatement that presents a mistaken image of the Church in my opinion.

There are an untold number of churches in the world today. Given that, there is no way any person could have possibly visited "most" of them to determine what spiritual state they are in. It would not be humanly possible to do so. Because of this, if I or you, or anyone makes the statement "most churches," we are doing so in error, for we can not say with any truth what "most churches" are or are not.

Not picking on you......because I do agree that SOME churches I know of no longer preach the Gospel.......just saying....... :) I've caught myself doing it too, and had to do a quick edit to correct it.

God bless
 
May 20, 2016
406
2
0
#10
Who's truth? Yours?

Don't you guys EVER get tired of finding someone/something to CONDEMN?

.............goodness.............

The Gospel of Christ is a Gospel of Love............NOT condemnation.

It's called the GOOD NEWS!
A sinner does not know God. Yet people believe the false teacher of God, which say all one needs to do is say they believe in Jesus to go to heaven. These same people sin, and scripture says a sinner does not even know God. They believe in someone they don’t even know?
(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”
 
Apr 8, 2016
566
18
0
#11
Who's truth? Yours?

Don't you guys EVER get tired of finding someone/something to CONDEMN?

.............goodness.............

The Gospel of Christ is a Gospel of Love............NOT condemnation.

It's called the GOOD NEWS!
Go back and check the OP's first posts, when he joined on the newbies thread.
He's here again, starting a new thread, (what newbie does THAT right away as soon as he joined a new chat-site, doesn't get to know the ppl or the site, just jumps right in starting his own threads that stir up controversy?!)
And it's almost word for word, and the same scriptures, twisted to support his 'thou shalt not misbehave' bad-news gospel.

Do you really think this is an 81 year old christian man?
Or is this some kid or basement dweller with an agenda?
The posts are out there, or at least, they were.
Discernment, Lord....grant us more discernment. :cool:
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#12
The Gospel of Christ is a Gospel of Love............NOT condemnation.

It's called the GOOD NEWS!

aye! the gospel we believed and were saved & set apart by is a gospel of reconciliation, not a gospel of condemnation :)

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation.
The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.
All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.
Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us.
We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.
For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin,
so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

(2 Corinthians 5:17-21)

what do we think? is it fair to say that a gospel of condemnation is a "different gospel" ?
any gospel which does not involves God reconciling the world to Himself through Jesus, not counting their trespasses against them, is not the gospel of Christ.

a man may go around preaching condemnation of sin and error -- and he may even be right, and no fault be found in what he says. but this is not the gospel of Christ that he is preaching, if it is not the reconciliation of the guilty, and the mercy of God made flesh in the person of Jesus Christ the Messiah, our Redeemer.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#13
JohnHate. We're sick of your bull. Please return beneath the bridge from whence you came.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#14
Remember the one pointing a finger at others is pointing three others back at himself.
Is that true? Who told you that?
it's right here; let me help.

You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge another, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
(Romans 2:1)

 
Jan 15, 2011
736
27
28
#15
Why is it that when anyone has a post regarding conduct and rightly dividing the word, they are jumped on as:
1) works driven
2) twisting
3) bad-news gospel bearing
4) attacking grace and love

It seems that there is a mob based attack on anything that speaks to our need to walk rightly in the sight of God and it happens here quite frequently. Let's take a step back and analyze what the post says first before passing judgment ourselves.

Regarding the OP, yes, the bible specifically says that before the end there will be a great apostasy (people leaving the faith), and that people will heap up teachers to ease their itching ears. There will be every wind of doctrine and people will flock to that instead of the doctrine/s that God gives us in 66 books. The love of many will wax cold meaning that the desire to bring forth God's truth to a lost and dying world and even standing for His truth amidst the intrusions by the world to affect change in the church will begin to lessen in the end times (compromise with the world). And to these churches.... I'd say it would be spiritually beneficial and healthy to find a new church.

The OP may be simply a post of condemnation to throw us down. However, every scripture that God gives us is good. If there are warnings in the bible, it is good for God's children to heed these warning to ensure that it will be well with us. Instead of taking this as a post of condemnation, let's examine it to see if it is a reminder as to what God has shown us in His word.

Let us not forget that giving truth is part of the gospel of Love.
Let us not forget that giving correction in truth is part of the gospel of Love.
Let us not forget that rebuking one another for His truth is part of the gospel of Love.

God's agape love is something that we understand is an action. We give each other what we spiritually need with no thought of reciprocity. Sometimes what we spiritually need doesn't feel good because it pinpoints strongholds of sin and error that remain in our flesh. Paul wrote 1 Corinthians which was a scathing letter of rebuke to the churches at Corinth, pinpointing what was going on in that church and telling them to stop. It was a letter of correction that was very fiery and strong because it was addressing the sin that was running rampant in this church of born again believers. In 2nd Corinthians, Paul wrote:

2 Corinthians 7:8-12 NKJV
8 For even if I made you sorry with my letter, I do not regret it; though I did regret it. For I perceive that the same epistle made you sorry, though only for a while. 9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing. 10 For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death. 11 For observe this very thing, that you sorrowed in a godly manner: What diligence it produced in you, what clearing of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, whatvehement desire, what zeal, what vindication! In all things you proved yourselves to be clear in this matter. 12 Therefore, although I wrote to you, I did not do it for the sake of him who had done the wrong, nor for the sake of him who suffered wrong, but that our care for you in the sight of God might appear to you.

I would say that at first glance, the first letter was very strong and very pointed.... and many people in the church today would say that what Paul wrote at times wasn't very loving... but they look at love in the wrong way. Remember love isn't about making people feel good all the time but giving them what they spiritually need! Paul states here that he did not regret that he made them sorry with the epistle because it brought about godly sorrow that produced repentance leading to salvation for this group of born again believers. Is this not a very important aspect of love?

When I read the OP I don't automatically assume condemnation but am reminded that God does warn His children and it's good for His children to heed His words. Now, I'm not going to say the OP author is a prophet, but we do have to realize that God's prophets today serve the same function as they did in the OT. God's prophets warn His people regarding sin and error and to return to the living God. Most of God's prophets aren't self proclaimed, this is just a reminder.

So when we see posts that speak about conduct, warning, watching out, examining ourselves, etc... Can we not just jump on the individual and automatically ostracize them with posts condemning them? Let's take a step back and mull over what the author of the post said and then give a response. Perhaps someone needs to read that particular post as it addresses something or some situation that is prevalent in their lives. Perhaps the post speaks to an overwhelming issue in the Church that runs counter to 2000 years of tradition in error or very deep held doctrines that may be in error.
 
Last edited:
Mar 2, 2016
8,896
112
0
#17
Why is it that when anyone has a post regarding conduct and rightly dividing the word, they are jumped on as:
1) works driven
2) twisting
3) bad-news gospel bearing
4) attacking grace and love

It feels like a mob based attack on anything that speaks to our need to walk rightly in the sight of God happens here quite frequently. Let's take a step back and analyze what the post says first.

Regarding the OP, yes, the bible specifically says that before the end there will be a great apostasy (people leaving the faith), and that people will heap up teachers to ease their itching ears. There will be every wind of doctrine and people will flock to that instead of the doctrine/s that God gives us in 66 books. The love of many will wax cold meaning that the desire to bring forth God's truth to a lost and dying world and even standing for His truth amidst the intrusions by the world to affect change in the church will begin to lessen in the end times (compromise with the world).

The OP may be simply a post of condemnation to throw us down. However, every scripture that God gives us is good. If there are warnings in the bible, it is good for God's children to heed these warning to ensure that it will be well with us. Instead of taking this as a post of condemnation, let's examine it to see if it is a reminder as to what God has shown us in His word.

Let us not forget that giving truth is part of the gospel of Love.
Let us not forget that giving correction in truth is part of the gospel of Love.
Let us not forget that rebuking one another for His truth is part of the gospel of Love.

God's agape love is something that we understand is an action. We give each other what we spiritually need with no thought of reciprocity. Sometimes what we spiritually need doesn't feel good because it pinpoints strongholds of sin and error that remain in our flesh. Paul wrote 1 Corinthians which was a scathing letter of rebuke to the churches at Corinth, pinpointing what was going on in that church and telling them to stop. It was a letter of correction that was very fiery and strong because it was addressing the sin that was running rampant in this church of born again believers. In 2nd Corinthians, Paul wrote:

2 Corinthians 7:8-12 NKJV
8 For even if I made you sorry with my letter, I do not regret it; though I did regret it. For I perceive that the same epistle made you sorry, though only for a while. 9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing. 10 For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death. 11 For observe this very thing, that you sorrowed in a godly manner: What diligence it produced in you, what clearing of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, whatvehement desire, what zeal, what vindication! In all things you proved yourselves to be clear in this matter. 12 Therefore, although I wrote to you, I did not do it for the sake of him who had done the wrong, nor for the sake of him who suffered wrong, but that our care for you in the sight of God might appear to you.

I would say that at first glance, the first letter was very strong and very pointed.... and many people in the church today would say that what Paul wrote at times wasn't very loving... but they look at love in the wrong way. Remember love isn't about making people feel good all the time but giving them what they spiritually need! Paul states here that he did not regret that he made them sorry with the epistle because it brought about godly sorrow that produced repentance leading to salvation for this group of born again believers. Is this not a very important aspect of love?

When I read the OP I don't automatically assume condemnation but am reminded that God does warn His children and it's good for His children to heed His words. Now, I'm not going to say the OP author is a prophet, but we do have to realize that God's prophets today serve the same function as they did in the OT. God's prophets warn His people regarding sin and error and to return to the living God. Most of God's prophets aren't self proclaimed, this is just a reminder.

So when we see posts that speak about conduct, warning, watching out, examining ourselves, etc... Can we not just jump on the individual and automatically ostracize them with posts condemning them? Let's take a step back and mull over what the author of the post said and then give a response. Perhaps someone needs to read that particular post as it addresses something or some situation that is prevalent in their lives. Perhaps the post speaks to an overwhelming issue in the Church that runs counter to 2000 years of tradition in error or very deep held doctrines that may be in error.
I can't speak for everyone but for me it has more to do with the set up and the presentation as to whether I will allow someone get my attention for meaningful dialogue. If it comes across as just throwing rocks at people, my old nature that grew up on a reservation and really had rocks thrown at him just wants to run to the nearest alley and start chucking them back.....and making someone cry.....which really happened. Lol.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#18

in re: 1 John 3:6 -- is this properly "
anyone who sins"
or "
anyone who goes on sinning" ?

i.e. "
anyone who make a practice of sinning" ?

look at the context, the Greek construction, and the fact that this same apostle said anyone who claims to be without sin is a liar.

this difference in how the actual message of the scripture is expressed in English, and the conflicting connotation, is the basis of this thread, is it not?


[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD][TABLE="class: maintext, width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: top, width: 17%, bgcolor: #0099FF"]Strong's[/TD]
[TD="class: top, width: 20%, bgcolor: #0099FF"]Transliteration[/TD]
[TD="class: top, width: 21%, bgcolor: #0099FF"]Greek[/TD]
[TD="class: top, width: 21%, bgcolor: #0099FF"]English[/TD]
[TD="class: top, width: 21%, bgcolor: #0099FF"]Morphology[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3956 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]pas[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]πᾶς[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]Anyone[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Adj-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3588 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]ho[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"][/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]-[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Art-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]1722 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]en[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]ἐν[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]in[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Prep[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]846 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]autō[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]αὐτῷ[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]him[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]PPro-DM3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3306 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]menōn[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]μένων[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]abiding[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]V-PPA-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3756 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]ouch[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]οὐχ[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]not,[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Adv[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]264 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]hamartanei[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]ἁμαρτάνει·[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]sins;[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]V-PIA-3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3956 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]pas[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]πᾶς[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]anyone[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Adj-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3588 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]ho[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"][/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]-[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Art-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]264 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]hamartanōn[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]ἁμαρτάνων[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]sinning,[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]V-PPA-NMS[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3756 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]ouch[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]οὐχ[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]not[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Adv[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3708 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]heōraken[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]ἑώρακεν[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]has seen[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]V-RIA-3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]846 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]auton[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]αὐτὸν[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]him,[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]PPro-AM3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]3761 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]oude[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]οὐδὲ[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]nor[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]Conj[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]1097 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]egnōken[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]ἔγνωκεν[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]has he known[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]V-RIA-3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="class: strongsnt"]846 [e][/TD]
[TD="class: translit"]auton[/TD]
[TD="class: greek2"]αὐτόν.[/TD]
[TD="class: eng"]him.[/TD]
[TD="class: pos"]PPro-AM3S[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 
Apr 8, 2016
566
18
0
#19
NRD, do you really expect seasoned members to engage in serious dialogue with a child that just joined the site and instantly starts his own threads (plural) with the same intent of condemning the churches we attend, plus the fact of what posthuman just pointed out re: this nonsense from a year ago?

You're actually going to take that seriously, and try to lecture/chastise posthuman, sirk, tintin, p_rehbein, santuzza, me and others, because we don't?!
Wake up, brother...you should know better, (or are you another one that's in on it, lol)
 
Jan 15, 2011
736
27
28
#20
NRD, do you really expect seasoned members to engage in serious dialogue with a child that just joined the site and instantly starts his own threads (plural) with the same intent of condemning the churches we attend, plus the fact of what posthuman just pointed out re: this nonsense from a year ago?

You're actually going to take that seriously, and try to lecture/chastise posthuman, sirk, tintin, p_rehbein, santuzza, me and others, because we don't?!
Wake up, brother...you should know better, (or are you another one that's in on it, lol)

Actually my post was in reference to all of the bashing that goes on with any thread that talks about this topic or any related topic.
I'm not lecturing or chastizing anyone in particular, but asking that instead of jumping on people we take a step back first and analyze it.

And for the record, age on a forum doesn't indicate spiritual maturity :p
(Not specifically talking about the OP)