Can a person repent if laws do not apply to them?

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Jul 1, 2016
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#1
was john a false prophet?
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
[our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (KJV)
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#2
was john a false prophet?
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
[our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (KJV)
Uh. No. John wasn't a false prophet. Why would you say that?
 
Sep 4, 2012
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#3
You seem to be hung up on the idea that sin is only defined by the law of Moses. Sin is unrighteous behavior. All men have the witness that they are unrighteous by nature.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,097
6,480
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#4
was john a false prophet?
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
[our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (KJV)
Why limit your weird speculations to just John? The very first sermon Jesus preached was...........wait, .......... wait, ....... wait for it........

REPENT

See Matthew, Chapter 4.

17)
From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,097
6,480
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#5
After reading your Profile Page, I see what you are doing here is trying to "back door" the Law into salvation. Ok, you are not the first to try and do that.
 
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
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#6
being NOT 'under' the Law does not negate the Law, because, sin obviously exists, and
John's particular definition of 'sin', is the 'transgression of the Law'...
and it is also written,
GAL. 2:19.
For I through the Law am dead to the Law, that I might live unto God.

this is more proof that the Law still exists, for through it, we are made DEAD to it...
for we are Baptized into the 'death of Christ', then death has no more 'dominion over us' -
'For the wages of sin is 'death', but the GIFT of God is Eternal Life through Jesus Christ our Lord'...

it is evident that we are dead to the Law, but is it also evident that we are not to be slaves of sin...
for if we are 'sin's slaves, then we serve the master of sin and it is written,
'You cannot serve two masters'...and it is written again, 'You cannot be partakers of The Lord's table,
and the table of devils..' and again, (Lukewarm is like vomit in God's mouth)...

'A double-minded man is unstable in all his ways, for Faith without Works is dead'...
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#7
Can a person repent if laws do not apply to them?


begs the question do laws cause a person to repent?

well of course not; which is why there are so many accidents on the highways

on that note, have people stopped sinning?

any indication to assert they do stop sinning, is a failure to comprehend what exactly is sin

Isaiah talks about our righteousness and how God views it

only in Christ are we righteous; the law does not save
 
Sep 4, 2012
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#8
Has no one ever heard a boss say, "I AM the law!"?
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#9
Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Galatians 3:11-12
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.


I suppose we have to know exactly what repentance is and what we are repenting of.

If your work at the law is not of faith, but it is sin, then trying even harder to obey your understanding of the law is futile in order to become sinless and justified before God. You'll have to find another way in order to reconcile the above scriptures.

If only someone could tell you what that other way is. What wisdom and treasure it must be!!
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#10
The only reason ANY law is given is to be able to prosecute a person who breaks that law.

Moses law was given to show that any one who does not obey every letter is cursed. Also to show the people of Israel if God punished them, This is why, These are my commands, and you do not obey them at all..

A follower of God did not need the law. He obeyed out of love for God.. (He was not perfect, but was seen as a person who followed Gods commands)

As someone said early, putting a speed limit sign out does not get people to obey that command, (except when the see a SHP care on the road and they slow down)

Yet people who care about others, and know the dangers of driving fast according to the circumstance of the road. Would never need to be told a speed limit.. the law is for law breakers..
 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#11
being NOT 'under' the Law does not negate the Law, because, sin obviously exists, and
John's particular definition of 'sin', is the 'transgression of the Law'...
and it is also written,
GAL. 2:19.
For I through the Law am dead to the Law, that I might live unto God.

this is more proof that the Law still exists, for through it, we are made DEAD to it...
for we are Baptized into the 'death of Christ', then death has no more 'dominion over us' -
'For the wages of sin is 'death', but the GIFT of God is Eternal Life through Jesus Christ our Lord'...

it is evident that we are dead to the Law, but is it also evident that we are not to be slaves of sin...
for if we are 'sin's slaves, then we serve the master of sin and it is written,
'You cannot serve two masters'...and it is written again, 'You cannot be partakers of The Lord's table,
and the table of devils..' and again, (Lukewarm is like vomit in God's mouth)...

'A double-minded man is unstable in all his ways, for Faith without Works is dead'...
I've heard others mention the faith without Works is dead many times, what would be the works part for faith not to be dead, what does a person need to work what is the Works?
 
Sep 4, 2012
14,424
689
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#12
I've heard others mention the faith without Works is dead many times, what would be the works part for faith not to be dead, what does a person need to work what is the Works?
James 2:1`5-16 is a good example. Not a list of does and don'ts, but genuine love and faith.
 
Feb 28, 2016
11,311
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#13
I've heard others mention the faith without Works is dead many times, what would be the works part for faith not to be dead, what does a person need to work what is the Works?
==========================================================

HEB. 11:4.
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness
that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

11:7.
By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving
of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance,
obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

in each of these examples FAITH is accompanied by an ACTION - and even so, it is not the ACTION itself,
it is the OBEDIENCE to the 'will of God' that matters...for Abel could have offered a more excellent sacrifice,
Noah could have built an ARK, Abraham could have left his home-land, but the actions absent without
the will of God, would have been 'meaningless'...

now, how this applies to OUR everyday life is that we cannot HIDE our CANDLE under a bushel basket,
we HAVE to let it SHINE....

if our Saviour asks us to 'step-out' of our comfort zones or our daily routines' for any reason of His,
in order to SERVE, HELP, ENCOURAGE, or UPHOLD or FEED, we will humble ourselves for His sake
and produce the FIRST FRUIT of THE SPIRIT, which is LOVE and the other FRUITS will follow, in haste...
 
Dec 19, 2009
27,513
128
0
71
#14
was john a false prophet?
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
[our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (KJV)
No, John was not a false prophet. I see nothing wrong with the statement he made.

I do not understand your original question:

Can a person repent if laws do not apply to them?

We can debate all day and night what constitutes a law and whether or not we are under the law. However, some actions are clearly sinful, such as murder. These actions are sinful for all people, not just some. To repent means that we will stop committing sin, to the best of our ability. We have all sinned.
 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#15
==========================================================

HEB. 11:4.
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness
that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

11:7.
By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving
of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance,
obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

in each of these examples FAITH is accompanied by an ACTION - and even so, it is not the ACTION itself,
it is the OBEDIENCE to the 'will of God' that matters...for Abel could have offered a more excellent sacrifice,
Noah could have built an ARK, Abraham could have left his home-land, but the actions absent without
the will of God, would have been 'meaningless'...

now, how this applies to OUR everyday life is that we cannot HIDE our CANDLE under a bushel basket,
we HAVE to let it SHINE....

if our Saviour asks us to 'step-out' of our comfort zones or our daily routines' for any reason of His,
in order to SERVE, HELP, ENCOURAGE, or UPHOLD or FEED, we will humble ourselves for His sake
and produce the FIRST FRUIT of THE SPIRIT, which is LOVE and the other FRUITS will follow, in haste...
well the first part is the old testament when man was under law which indeed is about being faith obedient. Jesus asking to step-out is faith Love, which Love is serving,helping,encouraging,feeding, and exceptance of others for how can a person of faith reach a person who is in need of these things unless the faith person excepts them for who they are as sinners unbelievers Gentile or Jew which that would also include letting your Love shine works. So faith Isn't dead when a person shows Love to another and Love is not a work but of your own will to do it not because Christ says you should because He Loves, but it's doing it because you want to Love thus the heart will be like Christ who also Loved not because His Father Loved him but because He loved people.

Stepping back to your first post about Galatians 2 the latter speaks volume on just that about works. 16 - 21

1Fourteen years later I went up again to Jerusalem, accompanied by Barnabas. I took Titus along also. 2I went in response to a revelation and set before them the gospel that I preach among the Gentiles. But I spoke privately to those recognized as leaders, to ensure that I was not running or had already run in vain. 3Yet not even Titus, who was with me, was compelled to be circumcised, even though he was a Greek. 4This issue arose because some false brothers were brought in under false pretenses to spy on our freedom in Christ Jesus, in order to enslave us. 5We did not give in to them for a moment, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you. 6But as for the highly esteemed, whatever they were makes no difference to me; God does not show favoritism. For those leaders added nothing to my message. 7On the contrary, they saw that I had been entrusted to preach the gospel to the Gentiles,a just as Peter had been to the Jews.b 8For God, who was at work in Peter’s apostleship to the Jews, was also at work in my apostleship to the Gentiles. 9And recognizing the grace I had been given, James, Cephas,c and John—those reputed to be pillars—gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, so that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the Jews. 10They only asked us to be mindful of the poor, the very thing I was eager to do. 11When Cephas came to Antioch, however, I opposed him to his face, because he stood to be condemned. 12For before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself, for fear of those in the circumcision group. 13The other Jews joined in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray. 14When I saw that they were not walking in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in front of them all, “If you, who are a Jew, live like a Gentile and not like a Jew, how can you compel the Gentiles to live like Jews? 15We who are Jews by birth and not Gentile ‘sinners,’ 16know that a man is not justified by works of the Law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have believed in Christ Jesus, that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the Law, because by works of the Law no one will be justified. 17But if, while we seek to be justified in Christ, we ourselves are found to be sinners, does that make Christ a minister of sin? Absolutely not! 18If I rebuild what I have already torn down, I prove myself to be a lawbreaker. 19For through the Law I died to the Law so that I might live to God. 20I have been crucified with Christ, and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me. 21I do not set aside the grace of God. For if righteousness comes through the Law, Christ died for nothing.”
 
Dec 10, 2015
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#16
We are sinners because Adam sinned. Because Adam sinned, sin was passed down to us. This is why we are sinners.

The Law does not apply to us today. We are no longer under the Law.

We are under Grace today.

1 John 1:7
[SUP]7 [/SUP]but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.

We have no sin today. We will not be Judged by our sins. We will be Judged by our acceptance or rejection of Jesus Christ.
 
Jul 1, 2016
2,639
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#17
We are sinners because Adam sinned. Because Adam sinned, sin was passed down to us. This is why we are sinners.

The Law does not apply to us today. We are no longer under the Law.

We are under Grace today.

1 John 1:7
[SUP]7 [/SUP]but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.

We have no sin today. We will not be Judged by our sins. We will be Judged by our acceptance or rejection of Jesus Christ.
The blood of Messiah can cleanse us of our sins. However, the fact is, not all believers become perfect right away. Believers may struggle with temptations. My point is, even though we are not "under" the law, (Torah), of God, the law is righteous, even perfect. Law, as instructions from an all knowing Creator, is not an ugly word.
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#18
was john a false prophet?
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
[our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (KJV)
No. John was not a false prophet.
John ALSO said, if anyone sins, we have an advocate with the FATHER.
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,097
6,480
113
#19
The blood of Messiah can cleanse us of our sins. However, the fact is, not all believers become perfect right away. Believers may struggle with temptations. My point is, even though we are not "under" the law, (Torah), of God, the law is righteous, even perfect. Law, as instructions from an all knowing Creator, is not an ugly word.
Maybe you should read from Hebrews?

Hebrews
10



1 .) For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
2 .) For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
3 .) But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
4 .) For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
5 .) Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
6 .) In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.
7 .) Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
8 .) Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
9 .) Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.
10 .) By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11 .) And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:
12 .) But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;
13 .) From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.
14 .) For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
15 .) Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16 .) This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 .) And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
18 .) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
19 .) Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 .) By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
21 .) And having an high priest over the house of God;
22 .) Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 .) Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised
24 .) And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25 .) Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
26 .) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 .) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 .) He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 .) Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 .) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
31 .) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
32 .) But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
33 .) Partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
34 .) For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
35 .) Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36 .) For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 .) For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 .) Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 .) But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#20
The blood of Messiah can cleanse us of our sins. However, the fact is, not all believers become perfect right away. Believers may struggle with temptations. My point is, even though we are not "under" the law, (Torah), of God, the law is righteous, even perfect. Law, as instructions from an all knowing Creator, is not an ugly word.

CAN cleanse us from sin?

well, there are always heifers and doves and lambs :rolleyes: