What parts of Torah can we still keep today?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
J

jcha

Guest
#1
https://therefinersfire.org/torah_rules1.htm

This is a copy and paste, however I am in full agreement.

[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FBECE9"]Many people have written to The Refiner's Fire to ask about the parts of Torah that apply to them today, and they are especially curious as to whether "being Torah observant" means they have to keep all "613" original commands.
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFFFF"]YHWH (Yahweh) gave us many rules/commands/"laws" that can be found scattered throughout the Torah, the first five Books of the Bible, which contains His Divine Instructions in Righteousness. We must understand, however, that the "numbering" of the original commandments was done by man, not by YHWH (Yahweh) Himself, which means there is no reason to worry about trying to keep "all 613 commands." Not to mention that most of those "613" commands were directed at the cohens (priests) of the day; some were only for men; some only for women, and some were only for a certain timeframe.
But some were meant to last FOREVER - and those are the ones that believers must pay attention to.
While YHWH eventually recorded ten in stone, we must remember, these ten are just part of the larger picture taken from YHWH's Torah which He said would stand forever. Many Christians balk at this idea because they are under the erroneous impression that they don't even have to bother even keeping the TEN Commandments anymore (let alone the "613"); but, rather, just two - and they cite the following as "proof":
Matthew 22: 36. "Teacher, which Commandment in Torah is the greatest?" 37. And Y'shua said to him, that "You should love Master YHWH your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might and with all your mind." 38. This is the first and the greatest Commandment. 39. And the second is like it. That "You should love your neighbor as yourself." 40. On these two commandments hang Torah and the prophets. (Aramaic English New Testament)
We would ask those who insist they only need to keep two commandments to please re-read verse 40 with the help of the Ruach haKodesh (Holy Spirit). Does verse 40 imply that all of God's original instructions have been done away with? NO! The Torah and the Prophets HANG/ARE DEPENDENT ON those two commands! There's more to it than just "loving God and loving your neighbor!
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E6E8D8"]Anybody who proclaims to love God must begin to realize there is more to God than what is taught in Christian churches. They should recognize that nobody including Yeshua (whom Christians call "Jesus") had the right to negate any of the Father's original commands or to insist that His Divine Instructions to mankind are a curse. Without Torah, we would have NO blueprint for holy living (1 John 3:4)! (You can read on this page exactly what Yeshua came to do.)
The verse below from Numbers shows that EVERYONE who accepts the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is to be Torah observant:
Numbers 15: 13 "'Everyone who is native-born must do these things in this way when he brings an offering made by fire as an aroma pleasing to the LORD. 14 For the generations to come, whenever an alien or anyone else living among you presents an offering made by fire as an aroma pleasing to the LORD, he must do exactly as you do. 15 The community is to have the same rules for you and for the alien living among you; this is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. You and the alien shall be the same before the LORD: 16 The same laws and regulations will apply both to you and to the alien living among you.'"
The "aliens" included anyone who wasn't a Torah observant "Hebrew" (a word which means "to cross over"...When Abram obeyed YHWH in Genesis 12, he "crossed over" both spiritually and physically when he left his homeland). "Aliens" include anyone who is "grafted-in" through the blood of Messiah Yeshua. Yeshua Himself was Torah observant - as were all of His Apostles and disciples - yet somehow Christians have decided that "the law is a curse"; that Gentiles don't have to bother with Torah, and that God treats His adopted children differently from His natural ones....
So, what parts of Torah can we still keep today? The chart below is by no means a complete list of what we are to observe today, but it will give you a good start and a lot to think about. For a complete list of the "do's" and "don'ts", please see 613 original commandments.



[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[FONT=&quot]The parts of Torah that apply today
[/FONT]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F4CECA"]The Ten Commandments (Exodus 20 and 34 - which included several "forever" commandments). We need to pay attention to ALL of YHWH's Torah; but - as mentioned above - "we" cannot possibly "do" all those commands. So we DO what we can!
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFFFF"]The Seventh Day Sabbath (Exodus 31:13; Exodus 31:16-17; Leviticus 23:3). God told us that the Sabbath would forever be a signbetween Him and the children of Israel (which includes every believer, grafted-in or otherwise!) In the end times (which we are in now) the seventh day Sabbath will distinguish TRUE believers from the "lukewarm" - especially when the Antichrist starts putting pressure on people to conform to his rules:
Exodus 31: 13 "Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: 'Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and youthroughout your generations, that you may know that I am the Lord who sanctifies you."
Exodus 31: 16 "Therefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant. 17 It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever; for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day He rested and was refreshed.'"
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5FFFF"]The Biblical feasts are outlined in Leviticus 23 which states after each feast: "it shall be a statute for ever in all your dwellings throughout your generations."
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFFFF"]Keeping kosher. Yes, eating "clean" foods was a "forever" commandment. You can search the Bible through, but you will never see that command negated. Kosher Law always was, and still is, YHWH's Law. He never said pork, shellfish, etc. were food! People called it food in rebellion against God. The NT passages (which Christians like to use as proof that appear to suggest we can eat whatever we want) deal with animals God gave us to eat and whether they are ceremonially clean and can be eaten at that time. Even in Peter's vision (Acts 11), Peter would never have eaten the kosher animals that had been in contact with treife (non-kosher) animals. Peter's vision was to show that the kosher animals were no longer considered unclean because they were among the treife. This was illustrating that the Gentiles were now to be accepted! The rest of the passage in Acts 11 shows that this is the correct interpretation and what the vision was all about....
For a complete outline, See Deuteronomy 14:1-21 and Leviticus 11.
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E6E8D8"]Wearing tzit-zit, the "tassels" on the four corners of our garments. Today, we don't have "four-cornered" garments, but we can loop them through our belt loops or wear special shirts that have tzit-tzit attached. (Google tzit-tzit for more info.) Please see our articles ontzit-tzits and tallits.
Numbers 15: 37 ADONAI said to Moshe, 38 "Speak to the people of Isra'el (this includes women!), instructing them to make, through all their generations, tzitziyot on the corners of their garments, and to put with the tzitzit on each corner a blue thread. 39 It is to be a tzitzit for you to look at and thereby remember all of ADONAI's mitzvot and obey them, so that you won't go around wherever your own heart and eyes lead you to prostitute yourselves; 40 but it will help you remember and obey all my mitzvot and be holy for your God. 41 I am ADONAI your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt in order to be your God. I am ADONAI your God."
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFFFF"]Christians insist that "Jesus abolished the law" and that all one has to do today is to "believe in Jesus." Hardly anyone seems to realize that, what Yeshua attempted to "do away with" was not the Father's divine instructions, but the rabbinical, man-made "stuff". Even Paul verified this when he said: Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law. (Romans 3:31). You will find Yahweh's original commandments sprinkled throughout Torah in places like Genesis 26:2-5; Exodus 15:25-27, 16, 20:6; Leviticus 22, 26, 27; Numbers 15 and 36; and Deuteronomy 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 10, 11, 13, 26, 27, 28, 30, 31.
God said His Torah would stand FOREVER (2 Chronicles 7:14-22), and that's why we are to do our best to try to discern His "do's" and "don't's" because they are all for good reason. Most Christians seem to think Torah was abolished, which is a major misunderstanding because Torah is God's blueprint for moral behavior! Why would that have been abolished on the cross?
Matthew 5: 17 Don't think that I have come to abolish the Torah or the Prophets. I have come not to abolish but to complete. 18 Yes indeed! I tell you that until heaven and earth pass away, not so much as a yud or a stroke will pass from the Torah - not until everything that must happen has happened. 19 So whoever disobeys the least of these mitzvot (words/commands) and teaches others to do so will be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven. But whoever obeys them and so teaches will be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness is far greater than that of the Torah-teachers and P'rushim, you will certainly not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Has everything happened that must happen? Have heaven and earth passed away yet? Yeshua even said He didn't come to abolish but to complete/fulfill. That did not mean "put an end to"...
Rev. 12:17 - And the dragon was enraged against the woman; and he went to make war upon the remnant of her seed who keep the Commandments of Elohim and have the testimony of Y'shua. (AENT)
Rev. 14:12 - Here is the patience of the Set Apart believers who keep the commandments of Elohim, and the faith of Y'shua. (AENT)
Some versions use "saint" as opposed to "God's people." But who exactly is a "saint"? Certainly not someone who refuses to be Torah observant! Without Torah we have no blueprint for moral, godly behavior (as is amply evident in our fallen world, including throughout the various churches.) Who are those who obey God's commandments? They are the Jews and Messianic believers. Who are those who hold to the testimony of Yeshua and remain faithful to Him? The Messianic Believers! Jews don't believe in Yeshua and Christians don't believe in being Torah observant; and therefore Christians don't adhere to the commandments/Torah - which include the keeping of the Seventh Day Sabbath and the seven feasts, and eating only "clean" foods. Both Jews and Christians are missing "the rest of the story"....
An interesting aside: Most bible versions will say: 14 How blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they have the right to eat from the Tree of Life and go through the gates into the city!
Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they who do His (Master YHWH's) Mitzvot, that they may have a right to the tree of life and may enter through the gates into the city. (AENT)
Footnote: Very important! Y'shua is talking, so these are YHWH's Mitzvot (Commandments), not his. This is also the original reading in Revelation. The "wash your robes" line was substituted later, as a way to downplay the obvious pro-Torah message at the end of the NT. This is, in effect, the last speech Y'shua gives to the world. There are actually two ancient Greek witnesses that are split on the matter, and one may have arisen as a scribal error to the other between poiountes tas entolas (do his commandments) and plunontes tas stolas (wash their robes).



[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
 
Feb 9, 2010
2,486
39
0
#2
Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.


Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

The only law we follow in the New Testament is love,and Jesus took the physical ordinances of Israel out of the way,nailing them to His cross,because they were contrary to us,which means they had no significance to give people a spiritual relationship with God,but was temporary until Christ came.

That is why Jesus said a new commandment I give you is to love each other,as I have loved you,for it is not a physical covenant with physical blessings anymore,but a spiritual covenant,with spiritual blessings,and we have to love people by helping them with their needs if possible,and not be concerned with physical blessings,for the early Church sold all they had and distributed to every person that had need.

This is something they could not accomplish in the Old Testament,not having the Spirit,for they never could live up to the spiritual law perfectly,without the Spirit.

The only thing that remains from the Old Testament is the moral laws,laws of love,which Paul said we do not void out that law through faith,but we establish it,and that law is spiritual,and holy,and just,and good,which includes the ten commandments.

Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:
Isa 28:11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
Isa 28:12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.

The Bible says let no judge you in the physical sabbath,which means they cannot tell you to keep them,and it is a spiritual sabbath now.

We only obey the two greatest commandments in the New Testament,love God,and love people,which loving people is the fulfilling of the law,for we can only love people perfectly by the Spirit,and if we have the Spirit we are right with God,and love God.If we love people perfectly we will love God.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,681
13,368
113
#3
Romans: the Law is good, and we are not. Observance of the Law does not make us good; that didn't work for the Jews, and it doesn't work for Gentiles.
Galatians: Jesus plus Law is less than grace.
Hebrews: The Old Covenant has been set aside to make way for the new.

Christians are not under the Mosaic Law. We are acceptable to God not on the basis of lawkeeping, but on the basis of Christ. It really is that simple. God has written the Law on our hearts; by listening to the Holy Spirit we will know when we have transgressed. The solution to our transgression is repentance and acceptance of the finished work of Christ.
 

lv2ski

Senior Member
Aug 20, 2016
542
15
18
#4
Absolutely ! However , there is a lot of wisdom in the Law for everyday living. Remember it was given to govern a nation.

Like, taking your potty out and burying it. Or not eating cats, magpies , or even pork or shell fish. Pork is yummy, but it really is an unhealthy food. Restitution principles . Sexual forbiddens, etc....
 

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
3,021
1,020
113
New Zealand
#5
Old Testament there are covenants and promises. Mosaic and Levitcal laws .. part of this.. these were part of a system that failed and were replaced by the New Testament system of service in churches. From the synagogue to the New Testament assembly of saved baptised believers.

I am not talking about eternal salvation here though. There is no change to that from OT to NT. Salvation by grace thru faith in Christ.. OT and NT.

Something that has not been super-ceded though.. is the 10 commandments. It was in the OT system and is in the NT system. The way it is ministered by the Holy Spirit is not the same.. from the synagogue to the church.. from animal sacrifices to personal sacrifices in the New Testament system of churches.

But to look at this fully.. you gotta look at the Abrahamic Covenant.. the Mosaic Law.. the Levitical Law compared with the New Testament system of service in churches.

One example of the way it has worked is in Deuteronomy when Israel was in the wilderness you have a way of discipline with two or three being gathered to resolve a sin issue in the Israel assembled mass in the wilderness.

Come forward to Matthew 18 in the New Testament.. and the practice has been kept in the running of a New Testament church.

'Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am with them'.. this is referring to this process of resolving disputes and sin issues in a New Testament church and is also an update on what was practiced with Israel in wilderness.

Deuteronomy 19:15 One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established.

Sound familiar?

Look at this:

Matthew_18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Matthew_18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
 

vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
1,653
199
63
44
#6
Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

shalom

 
T

TrailofTruth

Guest
#7
"What parts of the Torah (first five books of the bible) can we keep today? Absolutely all of it! With the understanding that God's law did not change, only the way we are to obey it. Under Moses it was done physically, under Christ it is done spiritually. Some examples are...

Just as David killed his tens of thousands physically, Ephesians 6 explains how to kill spiritually- that is to put to death the old sinful man. The word of God is like a double-edged sword. The people were cut to the heart and asked what they might do to be saved, and Peter replied to repent and be baptized for the remission of sins.

We no longer physically sacrifice a physically perfect lamb. The perfect Lamb of God is our spiritual sacrifice, once for all who were in the Old Testament who obeyed God, and for all in the New Testament who obey God. The blood of animals never saved from sin. Those then, who wish to go back to the laws of Moses (the physical way) are disobeying Romans 7:1-4. So do we ignore the Ten Commandments because they were under the old physical law? No, we fulfill it spiritually instead of physically. Love, which is spiritual not physical, fulfills the law of God even better than the physical way- for if you love God and your neighbor, you automatically will not murder them or steal from them.

So what about the sabbath? How do we obey this law spiritually instead of physically? We rest in our minds knowing we will inherit eternal life, a rest that begins now and will continue for all eternity when we rest with God. There still remains a sabbath rest for God's people- a spiritual rest- it is the peace that surpasses all understanding. The worldly cannot understand Paul, in prison, in torture, and he is singing and glad to suffer for Christ because of his reward to come.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#8
"What parts of the Torah (first five books of the bible) can we keep today? Absolutely all of it! With the understanding that God's law did not change, only the way we are to obey it. Under Moses it was done physically, under Christ it is done spiritually. Some examples are...
Would love to hear your thoughts about the Gospel written in the passage of 1 Tim 2:12, provided of course you are not married, then you might want to listen to why all men are created equal as written in Genesis 5:1-2.
 
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,430
0
#9
We are under NONE of the Law of Moses. We are under the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. We are in the New Covenant - NOT the Old Covenant.

We Gentiles are NOT Jewish no matter what we try to do to make ourselves into one and the Law was not made for us but for the Israelites.


Romans 3:19-20 (NASB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God
;
[SUP]20 [/SUP] because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.


Romans 6:14-15 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

[SUP]15 [/SUP] What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

We have the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus now - NOT the Law for life and living. We don't need to "obey" Lev. 18:23 to stop having sex with animals - the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus will stop that. We can trust the Holy spirit in this New Covenant. The Old Covenant is now obsolete.

Jesus has fulfilled the Law and now we live in Him. He is enough.
 
P

pottersclay

Guest
#10
Why strive to keep the law of the Lord when we are found in the Lord that keeps the law?
 

Yonah

Senior Member
Oct 31, 2014
1,074
103
48
#11
Jos 24:15 “And if it seems evil in your eyes to serve יהוה, choose for yourselves this day whom you are going to serve, whether the mighty ones which your fathers served that were beyond the River, or the mighty ones of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell. But I and my house, we serve יהוה.”
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#12
We are under NONE of the Law of Moses. We are under the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. We are in the New Covenant - NOT the Old Covenant.

We Gentiles are NOT Jewish no matter what we try to do to make ourselves into one and the Law was not made for us but for the Israelites.


Romans 3:19-20 (NASB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God
;
[SUP]20 [/SUP] because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.


Romans 6:14-15 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

[SUP]15 [/SUP] What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

We have the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus now - NOT the Law for life and living. We don't need to "obey" Lev. 18:23 to stop having sex with animals - the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus will stop that. We can trust the Holy spirit in this New Covenant. The Old Covenant is now obsolete.

Jesus has fulfilled the Law and now we live in Him. He is enough.
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. Rom 8:7

Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.Rom 3:31


The law of truth was in his mouth, and iniquity was not found in his lips: he walked with me in peace and equity, and did turn many away from iniquity. Mal 2:6



A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh. Luke 6:45
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#13
LOL. There are no "parts" of the Law, there is just the Law.
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#14
[h=2]What parts of Torah can we still keep today?[/h]


parts?

you break one teeny one, you broke them all

in effect, therefore, you cannot keep even the smallest one
 
J

jcha

Guest
#16
parts?

you break one teeny one, you broke them all

in effect, therefore, you cannot keep even the smallest one
Thank God for grace. So your saying it is a curse or too hard or too harsh for you?

Deuteronomy 30:10if you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, if you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul. 11"For this commandmentwhich I command you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. 12"It is not in heaven, that you should say, 'Who will go up to heaven for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?'…


1 John 5:
2By this we know that we love the children of God: when we love God and keep His commandments. 3Forthis is the love of God, that we keep Hiscommandments. And His commandments are notburdensome, 4because everyone born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world: our faith.…
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#17
Thank God for grace. So your saying it is a curse or too hard or too harsh for you?

Deuteronomy 30:10if you obey the LORD your God to keep His commandments and His statutes which are written in this book of the law, if you turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and soul. 11"For this commandmentwhich I command you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. 12"It is not in heaven, that you should say, 'Who will go up to heaven for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?'…


1 John 5:
2By this we know that we love the children of God: when we love God and keep His commandments. 3Forthis is the love of God, that we keep Hiscommandments. And His commandments are notburdensome, 4because everyone born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world: our faith.…
seems you are trying to tell me what I am saying and not actually asking me

so, in order to end confusion, I have provided the handy link below..also works as a plug for my new thread



I'm saying this
 
J

jcha

Guest
#18
We are under NONE of the Law of Moses. We are under the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. We are in the New Covenant - NOT the Old Covenant.

We Gentiles are NOT Jewish no matter what we try to do to make ourselves into one and the Law was not made for us but for the Israelites.


Romans 3:19-20 (NASB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God
;
[SUP]20 [/SUP] because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.


Romans 6:14-15 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

[SUP]15 [/SUP] What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

We have the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus now - NOT the Law for life and living. We don't need to "obey" Lev. 18:23 to stop having sex with animals - the law of the spirit of life in Christ Jesus will stop that. We can trust the Holy spirit in this New Covenant. The Old Covenant is now obsolete.

Jesus has fulfilled the Law and now we live in Him. He is enough.
Right. You are above the law and the law is dead for you.
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#19
To act now as if Messiah came but did not affect our relation to the Law is—as I said before—to deny with our lives what our mouths profess.

Baruch Maoz, Israeli pastor
 
L

LaurenTM

Guest
#20
Right. You are above the law and the law is dead for you.

it's the opposite...you appear to be confused as to what the scriptures actually state because you put the OT AHEAD of the new or perhaps ignore it altogether?

we are dead to the law

if you are not, then you are under the curse of the law