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Actually, Matt got it right, and you got it wrong.
Former means "first" and latter means "last."
In the sentence above, the first statement is "those that do it out of ritual obligation..."
That is the former which he grieves.
He does not grieve those who make the whole seder about remembering Jesus sacrifice, which is the "latter."
I have never attended the former, but a while back, I did have the opportunity to attend the latter. The rabbi was part Jewish, he got his undergrad degree in a Pentecostal seminary, where he was ordained, and then he went to seminary in a Lutheran seminary. I took some lessons in reading Hebrew from him - which mostly consisted of learning the letters and some blessings. But a good start, before I got to seminary to really learn to read the OT in Hebrew.
The entire seder was replete with meaning. Each element was related to the NT and how it was fulfilled in Christ. We danced, and had fun. We wore yamalkas or kippahs and fellowshiped. I enjoyed it thoroughly, but I also found some new meanings for the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross.
I would not personally follow Hebrew Roots for numerous reasons. But I don't think we can be harmed by participating in a Christ oriented feast of any kind, that follows the Bible.
Former means "first" and latter means "last."
In the sentence above, the first statement is "those that do it out of ritual obligation..."
That is the former which he grieves.
He does not grieve those who make the whole seder about remembering Jesus sacrifice, which is the "latter."
I have never attended the former, but a while back, I did have the opportunity to attend the latter. The rabbi was part Jewish, he got his undergrad degree in a Pentecostal seminary, where he was ordained, and then he went to seminary in a Lutheran seminary. I took some lessons in reading Hebrew from him - which mostly consisted of learning the letters and some blessings. But a good start, before I got to seminary to really learn to read the OT in Hebrew.
The entire seder was replete with meaning. Each element was related to the NT and how it was fulfilled in Christ. We danced, and had fun. We wore yamalkas or kippahs and fellowshiped. I enjoyed it thoroughly, but I also found some new meanings for the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross.
I would not personally follow Hebrew Roots for numerous reasons. But I don't think we can be harmed by participating in a Christ oriented feast of any kind, that follows the Bible.
So what is the purpose? The Torah cannot save. Only Jesus saves. Keeping the Torah does not make one Spiritual. Only immersion in Gods word and filling by the Holy Spirit makes one Spiritual. Keeping the Torah could serve to keep one from sin but if that keeps one from Christ then the latter is worse than the first.
Ascribing religious significance to earthly rituals is an interesting thing among mankind.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Ascribing religious significance to earthly rituals is an interesting thing among mankind.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
The 1st step is realizing what you just said: The Torah cannot save. Any attempt to use it as such negates the sacrifice of Jesus.
Once that's been established, keeping the Torah, or ANY commandment in Scripture, show us how to life a life worthy of the calling given us, to help show us how to live as His people and build up His Kingdom. It has to be done through the power of the Holy Spirit, but it should be done nonetheless.
Once that's been established, keeping the Torah, or ANY commandment in Scripture, show us how to life a life worthy of the calling given us, to help show us how to live as His people and build up His Kingdom. It has to be done through the power of the Holy Spirit, but it should be done nonetheless.
It seems like some people don't want a meeting with God.
And YHVH spake unto Moshe, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, [Concerning] the feasts of YHVH, which ye shall proclaim [to be] holy convocations, [even] these [are] my *feasts.
Leviticus 23:1-2 (KJV, MBM)
*feasts = H4150 Transliteration: Mow`ed
- Definition: 1. appointed place, appointed time, meeting
I proclaim these to be holy convocations of YHVH.
(not a burden)
And YHVH spake unto Moshe, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, [Concerning] the feasts of YHVH, which ye shall proclaim [to be] holy convocations, [even] these [are] my *feasts.
Leviticus 23:1-2 (KJV, MBM)
*feasts = H4150 Transliteration: Mow`ed
- Definition: 1. appointed place, appointed time, meeting
I proclaim these to be holy convocations of YHVH.
(not a burden)
L
I actually belonged to a Messianic congregation for about 2 years...and not just as a seat warmer. and yes, they 'did' things differently. I also called Jesus Yeshua during that time, in front of the congregation and in mid-week meetings because I was asked to so as to avoid causing certain Jewish people offense...no pork products either (not in my home but at meals etc so as not to offend), so I have somewhat of an inside view of the 'workings'
I would much prefer to have a meal as per the NT, but hardly any church does that
I cannot say my spirit is grieved in a regular church service though....I figure it is between Jesus and I...I cannot help what anyone else does...or thinks...or says...anymore that you can clear some of the mixed up minds on this or any other Christian forum...while those with a heart after God seem to automatically want to help others, you cannot be others
I read the other posts, what seemed to be a disagreement, and the misunderstanding which was resolved, so I won't get into all of that
if you read the op, you can see what I say I agree with. I love the OT and all that it can teach us...have taught from it many times...both adults and children...but I also concur with the conclusions of the pastor who wrote the article.
I would much prefer to have a meal as per the NT, but hardly any church does that
I cannot say my spirit is grieved in a regular church service though....I figure it is between Jesus and I...I cannot help what anyone else does...or thinks...or says...anymore that you can clear some of the mixed up minds on this or any other Christian forum...while those with a heart after God seem to automatically want to help others, you cannot be others
I read the other posts, what seemed to be a disagreement, and the misunderstanding which was resolved, so I won't get into all of that
if you read the op, you can see what I say I agree with. I love the OT and all that it can teach us...have taught from it many times...both adults and children...but I also concur with the conclusions of the pastor who wrote the article.
L
you are so busy spreading your Hebrew Roots agenda, that you do not acknowledge or even try to understand what is being said here,,,and people need to understand that Hebrew Roots is NOT Messianic Christianity!
first of all, what do you mean some people don't want a meeting with God? Who do you think you are? I have a mediator, His Name is Jesus...Jesus...you know, God wanted to speak to the Israelites face to face but they would not because they were terrified of the sight of the mountain..so God had Moses as His mediator.
we do not need a human mediator any longer...you insult every believer when you say some don't want a meeting with God as though, by exclusion of everyone else in your personal assumed superiority, you alone here were longing for the face of God. I don't get that longing on your part when I read your posts.
Second YOU are not a part of the children of Israel...I have probably come closer to that myself being a member of a Messianic congregation and part of the worship team, singing in Hebrew...partaking of the meals...and studying with them...you know, actual Jewish people who were Jewish. REAL Israelites. No one was above the other...we were all saved the same way...not with using special names or proclaiming anything but 'this is the day that the Lord has made'
I can probably pronouce Hebrew words better than you and I can certainly sing them.
I can sing the Shema like a Jew and love how beautiful it is
so you know, just stop with your fake I am a Jew. it means nothing.
you do not understand the heart of the Jewish people and you do not understand what it is to actually be one
first of all, what do you mean some people don't want a meeting with God? Who do you think you are? I have a mediator, His Name is Jesus...Jesus...you know, God wanted to speak to the Israelites face to face but they would not because they were terrified of the sight of the mountain..so God had Moses as His mediator.
we do not need a human mediator any longer...you insult every believer when you say some don't want a meeting with God as though, by exclusion of everyone else in your personal assumed superiority, you alone here were longing for the face of God. I don't get that longing on your part when I read your posts.
Second YOU are not a part of the children of Israel...I have probably come closer to that myself being a member of a Messianic congregation and part of the worship team, singing in Hebrew...partaking of the meals...and studying with them...you know, actual Jewish people who were Jewish. REAL Israelites. No one was above the other...we were all saved the same way...not with using special names or proclaiming anything but 'this is the day that the Lord has made'
I can probably pronouce Hebrew words better than you and I can certainly sing them.
I can sing the Shema like a Jew and love how beautiful it is
so you know, just stop with your fake I am a Jew. it means nothing.
you do not understand the heart of the Jewish people and you do not understand what it is to actually be one
L
The Law of Moses was part of a covenant that God made with Israel at a particular time and in a particular place. With the coming of Christ, the New Covenant prophesied by Jeremiah has come into effect and we are no longer under the Old Covenant.
The fact is that for the past two thousand years it has been impossible to observe all the commandments of the Law of Moses because so many of them depend on the existence of a Temple, a priesthood, animal sacrifices and living as a theocratic nation within the Land of Israel. Orthodox Judaism recognizes this, and when the Temple was destroyed in A.D. 70, Judaism was reconstructed as a religion without a Temple or a priesthood, a religion dependent on the authority and decisions of the rabbis. Reform Judaism, a recent movement of the past 250 years, views the Law as often antiquated and outdated, but useful as a reminder of our history, a symbol of our people and a source of ethics.
It is, however, equally important to note that the recognition that we are not intended to keep the Law of Moses today does not mean that Christians believe in lawlessness! The specific commands of the Law of Moses each reflected something of the nature of God, and behind each commandment is a principle. Those principles, reflecting God Himself, are still incumbent on all Christians today.
The fact is that for the past two thousand years it has been impossible to observe all the commandments of the Law of Moses because so many of them depend on the existence of a Temple, a priesthood, animal sacrifices and living as a theocratic nation within the Land of Israel. Orthodox Judaism recognizes this, and when the Temple was destroyed in A.D. 70, Judaism was reconstructed as a religion without a Temple or a priesthood, a religion dependent on the authority and decisions of the rabbis. Reform Judaism, a recent movement of the past 250 years, views the Law as often antiquated and outdated, but useful as a reminder of our history, a symbol of our people and a source of ethics.
It is, however, equally important to note that the recognition that we are not intended to keep the Law of Moses today does not mean that Christians believe in lawlessness! The specific commands of the Law of Moses each reflected something of the nature of God, and behind each commandment is a principle. Those principles, reflecting God Himself, are still incumbent on all Christians today.
And YHVH spake unto Moshe, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, [Concerning] the feasts of YHVH, which ye shall proclaim [to be] holy convocations, [even] these [are] my *feasts.
Leviticus 23:1-2 (KJV, MBM)
*feasts = H4150 Transliteration: Mow`ed
- Definition: 1. appointed place, appointed time, meeting
I proclaim these to be holy convocations of YHVH.
(not a burden)
Leviticus 23:1-2 (KJV, MBM)
*feasts = H4150 Transliteration: Mow`ed
- Definition: 1. appointed place, appointed time, meeting
I proclaim these to be holy convocations of YHVH.
(not a burden)