WHOSE WORK IS GREATER? THE FIRST ADAM'S OR THE SECOND ADAM'S?

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heavenly_bound

Guest
#1
There has been only two men in the history of mankind; the first man Adam and the second and last man Christ.(1 Cor 15: 45-48) These two men defined the rest of humanity at each given time; the first dragged mankind down into the pit while the second, pit mankind out of the pit. my question is this; are they of equal value in their work? in other words, is the act of the first man's destruction equal to the act of the second man's salvation? (Rom 5:12-21).
Your thoughts pls. Thanks

NB: your response should include the comparison of the two Adams pls
 
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BeyondET

Guest
#2
I'd say Christ for Christ didn't sin and was doing His Fathers business.

The first man did sin and wasn't alone in sinning either for man and woman both sinned.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#3
However depraved and vile sin is in Adam and the destruction it brought to those that were in Adam - Jesus was much greater and His grace - hyper abounded more than Adam's condition that had put us all in.

Romans 5:15-21 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] The gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment arose from one transgression resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift arose from many transgressions resulting in justification.

[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.


[SUP]18 [/SUP] So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.

[SUP]19 [/SUP] For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.

[SUP]20 [/SUP] The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,

[SUP]21 [/SUP] so that, as sin reigned in death, even so grace would reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
 
H

heavenly_bound

Guest
#4
I'd say Christ for Christ didn't sin and was doing His Fathers business.

The first man did sin and wasn't alone in sinning either for man and woman both sinned.
pls take note of the beginning of my statement. i didn't talk about us as individuals. The work of these two Adams exclude individuals. so your responses should be based on their global work pls. Thanks. Salvation is not individual( Christ death was on behalf of all men at once) although the experience of it is individual.( individually, we get to experience Sal upon conversion). Thanks
 
H

heavenly_bound

Guest
#5
I'd say Christ for Christ didn't sin and was doing His Fathers business.

The first man did sin and wasn't alone in sinning either for man and woman both sinned.
Also, have you noticed that when eve ate, nothing happened until the man Adam ate. why bc he was the delegated son, the federal head of all humanity. his act was constituted that of all humanity.
 
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BeyondET

Guest
#6
pls take note of the beginning of my statement. i didn't talk about us as individuals. The work of these two Adams exclude individuals. so your responses should be based on their global work pls. Thanks. Salvation is not individual( Christ death was on behalf of all men at once) although the experience of it is individual.( individually, we get to experience Sal upon conversion). Thanks
huh well what do you think happen to Eve after that issue?

you ask what the difference was between the two men, Christ was alone didn't have a wife, there's no comparison at all.
 
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BeyondET

Guest
#7
Evil didn't enter the world through Adam, Adam was tempted thus man was affected by it.
 
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heavenly_bound

Guest
#8
Evil didn't enter the world through Adam, Adam was tempted thus man was affected by it.
i am very curious to hear your inference. can you expound on that by comparing the two Adams stated in the data found in Rom 5; 12-21 pls? thanks
 
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heavenly_bound

Guest
#9
huh well what do you think happen to Eve after that issue?

you ask what the difference was between the two men, Christ was alone didn't have a wife, there's no comparison at all.
when the bible talks of "MAN " it is without gender. Adam is man, representing mankind.
Eve came forth out of Adam, have you forgotten? so eve like every other human from Adam was constituted a sinner.

if there is no difference btwn the two Adams, why would Paul compare them in Rom 5;12-21? why would Paul say the first man Adam was a living soul but the second and last Adam a quickening Spirit?( 1 Cor 15:45)
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
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#10
What was taken out of the body of Adam and was brought forth perishable is being put back in THE BODY of CHRIST and is being brought forth IMPERISHABLE
 
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heavenly_bound

Guest
#11
What was taken out of the body of Adam and was brought forth perishable is being put back in THE BODY of CHRIST and is being brought forth IMPERISHABLE
it was put back,( past tense) and not being put being put back. it was done when Christ died on the cross. he nailed the old man then and when he died, the old man( Adam and all that were in him and his fallen nature) died on the cross. And when Christ was rose from the death, the new creation of God was made.

note that Christ the sinless man did not need to die; Since the law states that any soul that sinneth must die, Christ the sinless one, by identifying with our sin nature, by becoming sin in our stead, had to die in other to fulfill sins demand which is death for every man that sins! The reason he died is bc he had picked up all sinful humanity who fell in Adam(the fallen race), and in order to pay for the penalty of sin( which is death) on behalf of the human race, had to died as them!!!

And when he rose from the the death, do you think he rose for himself alone? no!! when he rose from the death, we rose together with him, and when he ascended into heaven, we ascended together with him; and when he sad down at the right hand of majesty on high, we equally sad down together with him!! that is why Ephesians tells us that we are sited in heavenly places in Christ!! Salvation occurred in Christ and not outside of Him!! HE DID NOT DO SOMETHING FOR US, HE DID SOMETHING WITH US!!
 
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BeyondET

Guest
#12
Also, have you noticed that when eve ate, nothing happened until the man Adam ate. why bc he was the delegated son, the federal head of all humanity. his act was constituted that of all humanity.
Both Adam and Eve where at the tree together so what happened pretty much happened to them both at the same time.
To what had happened they where both deceived by Satan and disobedient to God thus death of the human flesh came to all humans because of their actions. The scripture below is the deception part that the food was good to eat and pleasing to the eye. For God told them both Adam and Eve they can eat from any tree in the garden except from the tree of knowledge.

Genesis 3:6
When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it.


 
B

BeyondET

Guest
#13
when the bible talks of "MAN " it is without gender. Adam is man, representing mankind.
Eve came forth out of Adam, have you forgotten? so eve like every other human from Adam was constituted a sinner.

if there is no difference btwn the two Adams, why would Paul compare them in Rom 5;12-21? why would Paul say the first man Adam was a living soul but the second and last Adam a quickening Spirit?( 1 Cor 15:45)
when the bible speaks of a single man in the beginning that's when Adam was alone for its not good for man to be alone thus God created the woman. Plural then there was two humans. Eve was not constituted a sinner after being created, both man and woman became sinners after they both ate the forbidden fruit.
 
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BeyondET

Guest
#14
Excuse me Adam wasn't deceived but Eve was deceived and was in transgression

1 Tim 2:14
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
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#15
it was put back,( past tense) and not being put being put back. it was done when Christ died on the cross. he nailed the old man then and when he died, the old man( Adam and all that were in him and his fallen nature) died on the cross. And when Christ was rose from the death, the new creation of God was made.

note that Christ the sinless man did not need to die; Since the law states that any soul that sinneth must die, Christ the sinless one, by identifying with our sin nature, by becoming sin in our stead, had to die in other to fulfill sins demand which is death for every man that sins! The reason he died is bc he had picked up all sinful humanity who fell in Adam(the fallen race), and in order to pay for the penalty of sin( which is death) on behalf of the human race, had to died as them!!!

And when he rose from the the death, do you think he rose for himself alone? no!! when he rose from the death, we rose together with him, and when he ascended into heaven, we ascended together with him; and when he sad down at the right hand of majesty on high, we equally sad down together with him!! that is why Ephesians tells us that we are sited in heavenly places in Christ!! Salvation occurred in Christ and not outside of Him!! HE DID NOT DO SOMETHING FOR US, HE DID SOMETHING WITH US!!
you are thinking only of yourself and not those who are still outside the DOOR
If all had been put back as you suggest there then is no longer a need to preach THE GOSPEL. No longer a need to listen to HIS COMMAND to "go" and gather
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
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#16
pls take note of the beginning of my statement. i didn't talk about us as individuals. The work of these two Adams exclude individuals. so your responses should be based on their global work pls. Thanks. Salvation is not individual( Christ death was on behalf of all men at once) although the experience of it is individual.( individually, we get to experience Sal upon conversion). Thanks
Then why is the GOSPEL even preached
and why did HE say to those who did not believe in HIM that they could not follow HIM and if they did not believe who HE claimed HIMSELF to be they would die in their sins?

why did CHRIST say HE did not come to being peace

what does blessed are those who have not seen and believe mean?

do you think we all have to have a hit over the head conversion to get us to wake up and understand that we had salvation all along or for us to get to understand that we didn't?
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#17
Excuse me Adam wasn't deceived but Eve was deceived and was in transgression

1 Tim 2:14
Eve became the mother of all living

And she didn't bear only female offspring
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#18
when the bible speaks of a single man in the beginning that's when Adam was alone for its not good for man to be alone thus God created the woman. Plural then there was two humans. Eve was not constituted a sinner after being created, both man and woman became sinners after they both ate the forbidden fruit.
Eve came from Adam and the two were LITERALLY one flesh.
And wve could not bear perishable offspring apart from Adam

sin passed to all
 

1ofthem

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
3,729
1,912
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#19
Also, have you noticed that when eve ate, nothing happened until the man Adam ate. why bc he was the delegated son, the federal head of all humanity. his act was constituted that of all humanity.
Just asking, but is there a part in the Bible that says that Eve ate the fruit of the tree and nothing happened until Adam ate it. Because all I know that the scripture says about it is this:
Gen. 3:6-7
6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

I can't see where it says she ate it before him in too long of a period of time and nothing happened to her because the scripture says that he was right there with her. Also I don’t see that the scripture says that their eyes were opened immediately and at the same time. All I can see is that it talks about what they had done and then afterwards their eyes were opened. It doesn’t really specify if their eyes were opened at the same exact moment in time, or if it took Adam eating the fruit before Eve’s eyes were opened too.

All I know for sure is that they both sinned and were both punished for their sin, but there could be a scripture that says nothing happened when Eve ate of the fruit. I just don’t remember reading it if there is one.
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
588
113
#20
Also, have you noticed that when eve ate, nothing happened until the man Adam ate. why bc he was the delegated son, the federal head of all humanity. his act was constituted that of all humanity.
And yet GOD's first command to Adam and Eve already forespoke HIS OMNISCIENCE knowing that a day was coming when they "man" (since HE called them both "man") that they would eat of the tree which HE had commanded them not to eat of