Did Jesus consider himself God?

[UndoubtingThomas]

I don't think so based on multiple references most specifically...

Matthew 27
45 From the sixth hour until the ninth hour darkness came over all the land. 46 About the ninth hour, Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” which means, “My God, My God, why have you forsaken Me?” 47 When some of those standing there heard this, they said, “He is calling Elijah.”…

Now consider...
Deuteronomy 4
4 Now, Israel, hear the decrees and laws I am about to teach you. Follow them so that you may live and may go in and take possession of the land the Lord, the God of your ancestors, is giving you. 2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the Lord your God that I give you.


So God said, no one can change the law (add or subtract) and by law I am talking specifically about the 10 commandments (not all the sacrifice rules, slavery etc (for the sake of argument)) so if Jesus must obey God's law and he cannot change it, why do so many people think it has been changed? Given this what does the underlined say about any man made laws?

Please just use references from the Bible for reasoning. I am not arguing with it, I am simply looking for sound logic based on texts. For my understanding as well as for those that would like clarity.

 

[FreeNChrist]

[h=1]John 8:58[/h]“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I AM!”

 

[KenAllan]

John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 20:31
[SUP]31 [/SUP]but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name.

Jesus Christ IS God!

 

[CeileDe]

John 10:30
"The Father and I are one"

Jesus also states a few times that when you see Him you are seeing God (John 14:9)(John 12:45)

 

[UndoubtingThomas]

John 8:58

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I AM!”

So when he talked about his Father, he was talking about himself? Again just for clarity...

 

[Magenta]

The law has been nailed to the cross as Paul plainly states. Neither jot nor tittle
shall be removed because the law condemns those not covered by grace. There
is now no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus, Who knows Who He was and is.

I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

 

[FreeNChrist]

So when he talked about his Father, he was talking about himself? Again just for clarity...

......Nope.

 

[CS1]

I don't think so based on multiple references most specifically...

Matthew 27
45 From the sixth hour until the ninth hour darkness came over all the land. 46 About the ninth hour, Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” which means, “My God, My God, why have you forsaken Me?” 47 When some of those standing there heard this, they said, “He is calling Elijah.”…

Now consider...
Deuteronomy 4
4 Now, Israel, hear the decrees and laws I am about to teach you. Follow them so that you may live and may go in and take possession of the land the Lord, the God of your ancestors, is giving you. 2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the Lord your God that I give you.


So God said, no one can change the law (add or subtract) and by law I am talking specifically about the 10 commandments (not all the sacrifice rules, slavery etc (for the sake of argument)) so if Jesus must obey God's law and he cannot change it, why do so many people think it has been changed? Given this what does the underlined say about any man made laws?

Please just use references from the Bible for reasoning. I am not arguing with it, I am simply looking for sound logic based on texts. For my understanding as well as for those that would like clarity.

Jesus did not consider Himself God. HE stated that HE is as HE and HIS Father our ONE.

John 1:1-3

[FONT=&quot]Basic outline of John:
[/FONT]

• More than a just a prophet: Jn 6
• V 29 A prophet Believe in Him whom God has sent
• V 30-34 A prophet equal to Moses: What sign? Manna from heaven
• V 41,42 greater than Moses: "I have come down out of heaven'
• Jn 5:17,18 I and Father are working: equality
• Jn 8:53-59 "Tell them "I AM" sent you." (see Ex 3:14)
• Jn 10:30-33 I and Father are one: equality
• Climax of book: Jn 20:27,28: "my Lord and my God'
• Conclusion of book: Jn 20:31 "these have been written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name"

And many many more Scriptures to this truth.

 

[Magenta]

So when he talked about his Father, he was talking about himself? Again just for clarity...

Jesus many times clarified that He only said and did that which His Father
in heaven gave Him to say and to do, and that it was for our benefit that
He said and did the things He did. Does this escape you?

 

[UndoubtingThomas]

Jesus many times clarified that He only said and did that which His Father
in heaven gave Him to say and to do, and that it was for our benefit that
He said and did the things He did. Does this escape you?

No the concept doesn't but what does stump me somewhat is this:
Matthew 5
17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18 For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished

 

[Magenta]

Jesus is the living Word of God, and the Word became flesh. He is eternal. He is the creator of the universe, the author and finisher of our faith, the great architect, the giver of life, in Whom all things live and move.

Matthew 1:23 - “Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.”

Isaiah 9:6 - For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor,Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 43:10,11 - “You are My witnesses,” says the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, and understand that I am He.Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.”
Revelation 1:17-18; Revelation 2:8 - (Jesus is the First and the Last)

Isaiah 44:6 - (God is the Redeemer)
2 Peter 1:1(Jesus is the Redeemer) - “To those who have obtained like precious faith with us by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ”

Isaiah 44:24 -(God created the world by Himself alone)
John 1:3; Colossians 1:16 - (Jesus made all things)

John 1:1 -In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... 1:14 - And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us,

John 5:17,18 - “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

John 5:23 - that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

John 8:24 - “Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM [He], you will die in your sins.”

John 8:58- Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:30-33 - Jesus answered them, “I and My Father are one.” Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”

John 14:6-7 - Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, the truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.”

John 14:9-11 - Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?”

John 20:28 - And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”

Acts 4:12 - “Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

Acts 20:28 - (God purchased us with His own blood)
Revelation 1:5-6; Revelation 5:8-9 - (Jesus' blood purchased us)

Philippians 2:5-7 - Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bond-servant, and coming in the likeness of men.

Colossians 2:9 - For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily

1 Timothy 3:16 - And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory.

Titus 2:13 - looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ

Hebrews 1:8-9 - But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

2 John 1:7 - For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Revelation 1:8 - “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 22:13 - “I AM the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and theLast.”... 22:16 - “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches.”

1 Timothy 6:14-16 - “our Lord Jesus Christ's appearing, which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen.”

 

[Magenta]

Jesus is the Rock of our salvation. God is the only Rock of our salvation.

Psalm 78:35
And they remembered that God was their rock, And the Most High God their Redeemer.

Genesis 49:24
But his bow remained firm, And his arms were agile, From the hands of the Mighty One of Jacob (From there is the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel),

Deuteronomy 32:15
"But Jeshurun grew fat and kicked-- You are grown fat, thick, and sleek-- Then he forsook God who made him, And scorned the Rock of his salvation.

2 Samuel 23:3
"The God of Israel said, The Rock of Israel spoke to me, 'He who rules over men righteously, Who rules in the fear of God,

Psalm 42:9
I will say to God my rock, "Why have You forgotten me? Why do I go mourning because of the oppression of the enemy?"

Isaiah 30:29
You will have songs as in the night when you keep the festival, And gladness of heart as when one marches to the sound of the flute, To go to the mountain of the LORD, to the Rock of Israel.

Habakkuk 1:12
Are You not from everlasting, O LORD, my God, my Holy One? We will not die You, O LORD, have appointed them to judge; And You, O Rock, have established them to correct.

2 Samuel 22:32
"For who is God, besides the LORD? And who is a rock, besides our God?

Psalm 18:31
For who is God, but the LORD? And who is a rock, except our God,

1 Samuel 2:2
"There is no one holy like the LORD, Indeed, there is no one besides You, Nor is there any rock like our God.

Isaiah 44:8
'Do not tremble and do not be afraid; Have I not long since announced it to you and declared it? And you are My witnesses Is there any God besides Me, Or is there any other Rock? I know of none.'"

Deuteronomy 32:31
"Indeed their rock is not like our Rock, Even our enemies themselves judge this.

Deuteronomy 32:37
"And He will say, 'Where are their gods, The rock in which they sought refuge?

Psalm 144:1
Blessed be the LORD, my rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle;

Deuteronomy 32:4
"The Rock! His work is perfect, For all His ways are just; A God of faithfulness and without injustice, Righteous and upright is He.

Psalm 92:15
To declare that the LORD is upright; He is my rock, and there is no unrighteousness in Him.

Psalm 62:7
On God my salvation and my glory rest; The rock of my strength, my refuge is in God.

Psalm 28:1
To You, O LORD, I call; My rock, do not be deaf to me, For if You are silent to me, I will become like those who go down to the pit.

Psalm 31:1-3
In You, O LORD, I have taken refuge; Let me never be ashamed; In Your righteousness deliver me. Incline Your ear to me, rescue me quickly; Be to me a rock of strength, A stronghold to save me. For You are my rock and my fortress; For Your name's sake You will lead me and guide me.

Psalm 61:2
From the end of the earth I call to You when my heart is faint; Lead me to the rock that is higher than I.

Psalm 71:3
Be to me a rock of habitation to which I may continually come; You have given commandment to save me, For You are my rock and my fortress.

Isaiah 26:4
"Trust in the LORD forever, For in GOD the LORD, we have an everlasting Rock.

Psalm 94:22
But the LORD has been my stronghold, And my God the rock of my refuge.

2 Samuel 22:3
My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge, My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold and my refuge; My savior, You save me from violence.

Psalm 18:2
The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.

Psalm 95:1
O come, let us sing for joy to the LORD, Let us shout joyfully to the rock of our salvation.

2 Samuel 22:47
"The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock; And exalted be God, the rock of my salvation,

Psalm 18:46
The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock; And exalted be the God of my salvation,

To be Continued

 

[FreeNChrist]

Jesus did not consider Himself God.

Is that a typo?????

 

[Magenta]

No the concept doesn't but what does stump me somewhat is this:
Matthew 5
17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18 For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished

I already explained that. Do you not understand that the law brings death and Christ brings life? Whosoever is found in Christ is not under the condemnation of the law. Neither jot nor tittle is removed because it is still condemning the unbeliever. Did that escape you?

 

[Magenta]

Psalm 19:14
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer.

Psalm 62:2
He only is my rock and my salvation, My stronghold; I shall not be greatly shaken.

Psalm 89:26
"He will cry to Me, 'You are my Father, My God, and the rock of my salvation.'

Isaiah 17:10
For you have forgotten the God of your salvation And have not remembered the rock of your refuge. Therefore you plant delightful plants And set them with vine slips of a strange god.

Isaiah 8:14
"Then He shall become a sanctuary; But to both the houses of Israel, a stone to strike and a rock to stumble over, And a snare and a trap for the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone, A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed. He who believes in it will not be disturbed.

Psalm 118:22
The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief corner stone.

Matthew 21:42
Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES'?

Mark 12:10
"Have you not even read this Scripture: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone;

Luke 20:17
But Jesus looked at them and said, "What then is this that is written: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone'?

Acts 4:11
"He is the STONE WHICH WAS REJECTED by you, THE BUILDERS, but WHICH BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone.

1 Peter 2:6-7
For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for those who disbelieve, "THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE VERY CORNER stone,"

Matthew 21:44
"And he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."

Luke 20:18
"Everyone who falls on that stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."

Romans 9:32-33
Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone, just as it is written, "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

1 Peter 2:4-8
And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

 

[CS1]

No the concept doesn't but what does stump me somewhat is this:
Matthew 5
17 Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18 For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished

The law id Fulfilled in Christ Jesus said on the Christ " It is Finished". John 19:30. Now we are under the Law of grace gal 5 as we follow Christ in obedience we are free from the Law because when we are indeed following Christ HE (Christ) will not lead us to break the law.

 

[CS1]

Is that a typo?????

it's not a typo read the full statement

 

[UndoubtingThomas]

I already explained that. Do you not understand that the law brings death and Christ brings life? Whosoever is found in Christ is not under the condemnation of the law. Neither jot nor tittle is removed because it is still condemning the unbeliever. Did that escape you?

No, I think I just need to go look at those areas that you have pointed out. I have no question that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. I thought initially that Jesus was a man having the Spirit of Christ (GOD) within him and when he was crucified, it was only Jesus's body that died and the Spirit of Christ (GOD) that returned to resurrect Jesus as CHRIST. Seeing so much evidence though, I need to go back and re-read (obviously).

 

[oyster67]

Satan seems to think He can get us hanged on the idea that we must choose whether Jesus was God or man. This is error and this is a lie. Jesus was both. He is now sitting at the right hand of God. Trinity means three in one. Jesus was man AND God, and no, there are not two Gods sitting in Heaven right now.

 

[CS1]

Satan seems to think He can get us hanged on the idea that we must choose whether Jesus was God or man. This is error and this is a lie. Jesus was both. He is now sitting at the right hand of God. Trinity means three in one. Jesus was man AND God, and no, there are not two Gods sitting in Heaven right now.

very good Point was both fully man and Fully God