Word Of Faith: A Damnable Doctrine

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Aug 15, 2009
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#1
How the Health and Wealth Gospel Twists Scripture

Most Christians have heard some of the following: "You can have what you say," "The reason you haven't been healed is that you don't have enough faith," "We can write our own ticket with God if we decide what we want, believe that it's ours, and confess it," "He wants you rich and healthy," "What is the desire of your heart? Name it , claim it by faith, and it is yours! Your heavenly Father has promised it. It's right there in the Bible."
Such statements reflect the models which set forth a theology of the spoken word (rhematology) or of thought-actualization, commonly known as "positive confession", which stresses the inherent power of words and thoughts.
Some who teach this system argue that just as God, by His faith, spoke (or conceived of the creation in His mind) and matter came into existence (Genesis 1, Psalm 33:6, Hebrews 11:3, 2 Peter 3:5), so theChristian can speak (or conceive of things in his mind) and actually bring them into existence by faith.
Many of those in the Word-Faith movement, such as Charles Capps and Jerry Savelle, teach that God had faith in His faith. They use Scripture texts such as Mark 11:22 and Hebrews 11:3, translating them as "have the faith of God". However, renowned Greek scholar A.T. Robertson, in his books A Short Grammar of the Greek Testament (pp. 227-228) and A Grammar of the Greek New Testament in the Light of Historical Research (p. 500), very adequately shows that the phrase is not to be translated in the subjective genitive (meaning that the noun is the subject of the action - or that God is thesubject of faith) such as "have the faith of God", but is to be translated in the objective genitive (meaning that the noun is the object of the action - that God is the object of faith). He goes on to insist that translating in the subjective genitive is preposterous. He says "it is not the faith that God has, but the faith of which God is the object".

Watchman Fellowship: A Christian Research and Apologetics Ministry


Disclaimer: The use of this website & its information does not mean I am a proponent of it's teachings.
 
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
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#2
What is your opinion of WOF? Do you think it's teachings are from Satan?
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,425
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#3
It is a false doctrine...

1 Timothy 6:KJV
3 ¶If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.

7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.
8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
 

Demi777

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2014
6,877
1,949
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#4
This made me think of this story of Jesus
Mark 1:40-42

[FONT=&quot]40 And there came a leper to him, beseeching him, and kneeling down to him, and saying unto him, If thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]41 And Jesus, moved with compassion, put forth his hand, and touched him, and saith unto him, I will; be thou clean.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]42 And as soon as he had spoken, immediately the leprosy departed from him, and he was cleansed.

That man had no faith. He surrendered and said ''if you want to..do it'' and Jesus said ''I want/I wil''
Its not about faith... Its not even if God wants to, because God wants everyone to be healed. Its about is there something blocking God to heal you.
Teachings of ''faith faith faith blabla'' makes me sick. [/FONT]
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#5
My opinion is that some of the truths expressed are true although I haven't listened to some of the extreme parts of this since the 80's. But in my opinion some have taken these truths and erred in their "application" of it.

We can know truth and yet "apply" this truth in a wrong way. The error for me was when people would say " If you say it enough times - then it will come true".

I believe that some people were trying to "make things happen" by what "they do".

Their faith was in their "confession" instead of what grace had already provided.

So, two people could be saying the exact same thing - only one is trying to make things happen because they are saying it. The other one is saying things because they are true.

It's a subtle difference but it shows what we are really relying on. God's finished word or our work to "make it happen".

True faith is a rest in what Christ has already accomplished. There is no "drumming up" of things but a confident rest in "what already is".

Faith is what God has already done and NOT something we work up or at in order to "get things from God". Faith is a positive response to what grace has already provided for us in the work of Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection.
 
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HisHolly

Guest
#6
This made me think of this story of Jesus
Mark 1:40-42

[FONT=&quot]40 And there came a leper to him, beseeching him, and kneeling down to him, and saying unto him, If thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]41 And Jesus, moved with compassion, put forth his hand, and touched him, and saith unto him, I will; be thou clean.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]42 And as soon as he had spoken, immediately the leprosy departed from him, and he was cleansed.

That man had no faith. He surrendered and said ''if you want to..do it'' and Jesus said ''I want/I wil''
Its not about faith... Its not even if God wants to, because God wants everyone to be healed. Its about is there something blocking God to heal you.
Teachings of ''faith faith faith blabla'' makes me sick. [/FONT]
He believed he could be healed IF Jesus wanted to do it. It was a matter of Jesus' will.. He would turn people away until/ unless they showed faith in Him.. before you come to Him you must believe that He is..
 

Demi777

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2014
6,877
1,949
113
Germany
#7
He believed he could be healed IF Jesus wanted to do it. It was a matter of Jesus' will.. He would turn people away until/ unless they showed faith in Him.. before you come to Him you must believe that He is..
I doubt that in the circumstances that he had a lot of faith. I dont even believe he had much hope. I think that man was ready to again be rejected by him like all other people because of his sickness. Especially because of the Pharisees. I guess this depends on the viewpoint.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#8
all I can say is.

God never promised he would heal all sickness or disease.. Jesus did it in his day, because the OT prophesied, when he came this is what he will do. I can have all the faiht in the world. If it is not in gods will. I will not be healed. and I accept to chose to understand God knows best..

God also never promised riches Physical) He promised riches (spiritual).. Prosperity doctrine is leading people astray.
 
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HisHolly

Guest
#9
My opinion is that some of the truths expressed are true although I haven't listened to some of the extreme parts of this since the 80's. But in my opinion some have taken these truths and erred in their "application" of it.

We can know truth and yet "apply" this truth in a wrong way. The error for me was when people would say " If you say it enough times - then it will come true".

I believe that some people were trying to "make things happen" by what "they do".

Their faith was in their "confession" instead of what grace had already provided.

So, two people could be saying the exact same thing - only one is trying to make things happen because they are saying it. The other one is saying things because they are true.

It's a subtle difference but it shows what we are really relying on. God's finished word or our work to "make it happen".

True faith is a rest in what Christ has already accomplished. There is no "drumming up" of things but a confident rest in "what already is".

Faith is what God has already done and NOT something we work up or at in order to "get things from God". Faith is a positive response to what grace has already provided for us in the work of Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection.
Why is noted that the disciples said increase our faith? He gave the mustard seed analogy.. Faith grows.. For what?
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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#10
It is never a good idea to endeavor to manipulate God. Of the two criminals crucified alongside Christ one sought mercy and received it. The other attempted to manipulate Jesus to misuse His authority and release them from the cross.

Who is the Jesus you believe in? Why do you believe in Jesus? What do you want from Jesus? Use your answers for self evaluation not public comment.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#11
If people want to sit and get what falls on their lap bc they don't think wof is correct.. do it.. if not, let them believe.. Why would you tell someone who believes God can do anything, that they're wrong? It's a stumbling block.. Their affection and trust is in God, not the world.. false doctrine takes God out of the equation.. They may say things you disarwith but it's far stretch for all to be labeled false
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#12
It is never a good idea to endeavor to manipulate God. Of the two criminals crucified alongside Christ one sought mercy and received it. The other attempted to manipulate Jesus to misuse His authority and release them from the cross.

Who is the Jesus you believe in? Why do you believe in Jesus? What do you want from Jesus? Use your answers for self evaluation not public comment.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Manipulation is your opinion. If they have a relationship with God and understand something different bc you reject it, it doesn't make it Manipulation.
 
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
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#13
It is never a good idea to endeavor to manipulate God. Of the two criminals crucified alongside Christ one sought mercy and received it. The other attempted to manipulate Jesus to misuse His authority and release them from the cross.

Who is the Jesus you believe in? Why do you believe in Jesus? What do you want from Jesus? Use your answers for self evaluation not public comment.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
For once we agree. Manipulation of ANY KIND in doctrine is sin IMO.
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#14
Are atheists who claim you to be a fool correct bc they reject and don't understand bc they reject? No bc God is real. Same thing
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#15
Why is noted that the disciples said increase our faith? He gave the mustard seed analogy.. Faith grows.. For what?
I agree that our faith can grow and mature as we keep our eyes on Christ Himself and not ourselves or the situations we are in.

I also believe in the parable of the mustard seed somewhat differently then the traditional view.

I view the mustard plant had faith in what it was even though it was the smallest of seeds. The mustard seed had the life already in it to become what it already is. It didn't look at the other plants but just "was being itself" and it grew to be what it already had within it. - a big plant.

I can see the truth of this can be applied to us in Christ. As we see who we are in Christ and that it is His life in us and He gives us His desires as we delight in Him - then we too will grow up to be who we already are in Him.

Anyway....that's my take on the mustard seed thing and I do believe we can grow in our faith - ( trust) in what God has done for us in Christ. I don't believe we have to produce it ourselves or drum it up in some fashion but it comes as we hear the message of Christ.

Romans 10:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ
.
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#16
For once we agree. Manipulation of ANY KIND in doctrine is sin IMO.
In doctrine.. do you have a relationship with letter or the living God? Huge difference.. HS is the inspiration for everything written.. How can one who's open for Gods manifold wisdom be manipulating? You can't receive what you choose to reject..
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
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#17
Manipulation is your opinion. If they have a relationship with God and understand something different bc you reject it, it doesn't make it Manipulation.
Can you change Gods mind? Can you change anything that God has purposed to do? Is Gods wisdom above our wisdom? Manipulation is anytime you tell God what He must do because you believe He must.

Jas 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#18
In doctrine.. do you have a relationship with letter or the living God? Huge difference.. HS is the inspiration for everything written.. How can one who's open for Gods manifold wisdom be manipulating? You can't receive what you choose to reject..
How will you separate God from His word?

Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#19
Manipulation is your opinion. If they have a relationship with God and understand something different bc you reject it, it doesn't make it Manipulation.

sorry, but the amount of people who left walking wiht God because they did not get healed. And they are told that they did not have enough faith.

That is because of manipulation.
 
Jan 7, 2015
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#20
I believe this health, wealth, prosperity, name it and claim it doctrine is false in that it seeks worldly things, things of the flesh, and not according to God's will.

James 4:3

Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

Paul was a man of faith who received an infirmity in his flesh, and Paul asked the Lord to remove it, but it was given to Paul to keep him humble, so it served a greater spiritual purpose. Paul later found out this purpose and why the Lord denied his request 3 times. So asking in faith according to God's will is what we can expect to receive, not our own fleshy and worldly desires.

1 John 5:14

And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us: