Where were we before we were born?
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I do not believe that we existed before we were born,for if we did there would be no reason to be born on this earth,for we would already be with God,then we would have a choice as a spiritual being,and if we rebelled there is no salvation,for it is the flesh that causes a person to repent if they rebel,for all sin resides in the flesh,where an angel cannot be redeemed for there is nothing to put off if they rebel,but they tainted their whole being.
God knew us before we were born like the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,and the prophets blood was shed from the foundation of the world,and all the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
That which is first is natural,then spiritual,not spiritual,natural,then spiritual.
Jesus is the first born of the dead,and the first human spiritual,then the rest of the saints.
Ecc 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
All spirits go back to God who gave them,so the spirit is not important in the spiritual realm being with God,but only on this earth,and God breathed in to Adam and he became a living soul,so we would of not had a soul prior to Adam and Eve.
The spirit and soul came upon this earth as a part of people,and would of not existed prior to that,and we know the flesh would of not existed before Adam and Eve.
er 1:4 Then the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Jer 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
This does not mean that Jeremiah existed before he was born,but "Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations."
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Of course God knows everyone,but states He knows the saints,which would be in a spiritual sense,which God does not know the world that way for they are fleshy.
We did not exist before Adam and Eve,for if we did we would of not had to be born on earth,for we would already be with God.
The soul and spirit,in flesh,started with Adam and Eve,and not beforehand,but God knows the saints spiritually,and knows a person from the womb,or before they were conceived,for He knows there will be a pregnancy,and that He will use that person to do a great work for Him,like God knew the man Christ Jesus before He was conceived,for it was already planned out that the man Christ Jesus would do a great work for God,but the man Christ Jesus got His start in the womb of Mary,which the Son was made of a woman,made under the law,but He is God manifest in the flesh.
God knew us before we were born like the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,and the prophets blood was shed from the foundation of the world,and all the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
That which is first is natural,then spiritual,not spiritual,natural,then spiritual.
Jesus is the first born of the dead,and the first human spiritual,then the rest of the saints.
Ecc 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
All spirits go back to God who gave them,so the spirit is not important in the spiritual realm being with God,but only on this earth,and God breathed in to Adam and he became a living soul,so we would of not had a soul prior to Adam and Eve.
The spirit and soul came upon this earth as a part of people,and would of not existed prior to that,and we know the flesh would of not existed before Adam and Eve.
er 1:4 Then the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
Jer 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
This does not mean that Jeremiah existed before he was born,but "Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations."
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Of course God knows everyone,but states He knows the saints,which would be in a spiritual sense,which God does not know the world that way for they are fleshy.
We did not exist before Adam and Eve,for if we did we would of not had to be born on earth,for we would already be with God.
The soul and spirit,in flesh,started with Adam and Eve,and not beforehand,but God knows the saints spiritually,and knows a person from the womb,or before they were conceived,for He knows there will be a pregnancy,and that He will use that person to do a great work for Him,like God knew the man Christ Jesus before He was conceived,for it was already planned out that the man Christ Jesus would do a great work for God,but the man Christ Jesus got His start in the womb of Mary,which the Son was made of a woman,made under the law,but He is God manifest in the flesh.
LanceA posted one.....decon - had another one about the spirit returning to God...I haven't looked that one up yet....Here is another. There isn't much on this subject in scripture and it is probably for a good reason.
Hebrews 12:9 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
As conscious beings we did not exist before we were born.
If you want to become buddhist, we are parts of God separated from him, and suffer
reincarnations until we progress into the highest form of life and return to God.
But scripture says
The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.
Psalm 90:10
All people are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field;
the grass withers and the flowers fall, but the word of the Lord endures forever.
1 Peter 1:24-25
Now the more mystical in the christian fellowship like the idea we are eternal
beings made mortal through sin, but return to immortality through rebirth.
Unfortunately scripture does not support this, rather we are mortal then the
Lords brings us into immortality.
And example of this is how Jesus described Judas
But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born.
Matt 26:24
So man comes into existance at conception with a potential for immortality.
If you want to become buddhist, we are parts of God separated from him, and suffer
reincarnations until we progress into the highest form of life and return to God.
But scripture says
The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.
Psalm 90:10
All people are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field;
the grass withers and the flowers fall, but the word of the Lord endures forever.
1 Peter 1:24-25
Now the more mystical in the christian fellowship like the idea we are eternal
beings made mortal through sin, but return to immortality through rebirth.
Unfortunately scripture does not support this, rather we are mortal then the
Lords brings us into immortality.
And example of this is how Jesus described Judas
But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born.
Matt 26:24
So man comes into existance at conception with a potential for immortality.
That is an interesting theory and it might be correct in some aspects of it. Here is another scripture that is baffling - Paul saying that all the Greeks were in Him and that we live and move and have our being in Him and that we are all His offspring.
There seems to be more to this then what meets the causal eye. Paul did seem to be agreeing with what their 'poets were saying about God" - he just didn't agree with the way they went about looking for Him. - He is not in things we make ourselves - like a golden calf.
Acts 17:27-29 (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
[SUP]28 [/SUP] For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
[SUP]29 [/SUP] Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
There seems to be more to this then what meets the causal eye. Paul did seem to be agreeing with what their 'poets were saying about God" - he just didn't agree with the way they went about looking for Him. - He is not in things we make ourselves - like a golden calf.
Acts 17:27-29 (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
[SUP]28 [/SUP] For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
[SUP]29 [/SUP] Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
Ask King David...
Psalm 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"
There you go.
Some of us, maybe all of us, existed in a place called the "Lowest Parts of the Earth" before we were born.
There is a Truth being hidden from you good Christians.
Can you handle it?
Psalm 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"
There you go.
Some of us, maybe all of us, existed in a place called the "Lowest Parts of the Earth" before we were born.
There is a Truth being hidden from you good Christians.
Can you handle it?
Psa 139:13-17
For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.
I will give thanks unto thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: wonderful are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.
My frame was not hidden from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
Thine eyes did see mine unperfect substance, and in thy book were all my members written, which day by day were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
[SUP]
[/SUP][SUP] [/SUP]
For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.
I will give thanks unto thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: wonderful are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.
My frame was not hidden from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
Thine eyes did see mine unperfect substance, and in thy book were all my members written, which day by day were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
[SUP]
[/SUP][SUP] [/SUP]
secret things - sounds like gnostic thinking.
un-renewed mind - G7 knows the truths that mere mortals do not.
Do we originally come from the Father? - 100% gnostic spirit theology
Funny how a man who 100% supports gnostic style theology, is questioning
whether it is true and he does not know. Fat chance.
Some believe we are actually reincarnated and have memories of other lives.
Some will always fall for the mystic story line. It is so mysterious and intreguing
though heretical.
un-renewed mind - G7 knows the truths that mere mortals do not.
Do we originally come from the Father? - 100% gnostic spirit theology
Funny how a man who 100% supports gnostic style theology, is questioning
whether it is true and he does not know. Fat chance.
Some believe we are actually reincarnated and have memories of other lives.
Some will always fall for the mystic story line. It is so mysterious and intreguing
though heretical.
Deuteronomy 29:29 (KJV)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.
Job 15:8 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Hast thou heard the secret of God? and dost thou restrain wisdom to thyself?
Job 29:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] As I was in the days of my youth, when the secret of God was upon my tabernacle;
Psalm 139:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
There are plenty more scriptures - and of course this is not even looking at the "mysteries of the Lord".
[SUP]29 [/SUP] The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.
Job 15:8 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Hast thou heard the secret of God? and dost thou restrain wisdom to thyself?
Job 29:4 (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] As I was in the days of my youth, when the secret of God was upon my tabernacle;
Psalm 139:15 (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
There are plenty more scriptures - and of course this is not even looking at the "mysteries of the Lord".
Matthew 17:12
"But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them"
Matthew 11:13-14
"For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John"
"And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come"
Not every Christian can 'receive' this Revelation.
"But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them"
Matthew 11:13-14
"For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John"
"And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come"
Not every Christian can 'receive' this Revelation.
Jeremiah 1:5, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
The Lord knew Jeremiah before he was formed in the belly. It is in not way saying that the Lord knew Jeremiah before Jeremiah was conceived, rather before Jeremiah was formed. See Psalm 139 below.
Psalm 139:16, Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
His substance was in the belly after conception, yet being unperfect, unformed. He was not completely formed with all members of his body, yet God knew him at this stage of life.
The Lord knew Jeremiah before he was formed in the belly. It is in not way saying that the Lord knew Jeremiah before Jeremiah was conceived, rather before Jeremiah was formed. See Psalm 139 below.
Psalm 139:16, Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
His substance was in the belly after conception, yet being unperfect, unformed. He was not completely formed with all members of his body, yet God knew him at this stage of life.
Has anyone reading through a topic, such as Grace posted up (hi Gracie...been awhile...lol), exploring thoughts, ideas, possible insights, and when reading "some" posts, ever "feel", like a "box", is trying to be imposed upon YOUR thoughts, or explorations, AS you are reading said posting?....Or is it just me? When I feel this happening to me, I just HAVE to skip the rest of the post, although, I would rather attempt TO carry on reading, but finding, I just cannot. And, because of this, I feel kinda "bummed out", cuz, although, as MUCH as I would LOVE to comment, and/or aid, to the post/er, just the mere reading on of the post seems to "feel" detrimental to MY spiritual journey. Such as (literally/physically!), my neck starts feeling "stiff"! Or, a part of my brain, starts feeling "mushy", like I'm becoming "ate up with the d--b -rse", and another part of my brain/mind is wanting to "whisk-away" to some "la la land", or pipe dream place, of "disconnectivity" from where I be striving to go, or be at!
Methinks, this happens more to some of us, then others, or, are more cognizant of it then others, or, because of some authorative (real or, imagined) position, are unable to admit/confess a "thing" such as this...EVEN, to oneself! For some "sense" of that "revealing" would in some way DISCREDIT one's credibility, OR authority (real, or imagined), in any/every matter.
Having finished my "rant", so to speak, SOME of us REALLY BELIEVE what Not JUST the Father, in the O.T., but, ALSO Christ, in the N.T....the words "spoken/written" that, "THEY (BOTH Father AND Son), would NEVER LEAVE us, nor FORSAKE us!".....Elijah, before God took him up in a whirlwind, asked the Father to remove the "scales" from his protege, Elishah. So, Elishah could SEE the MYRAID OF ANGELS, in the hevenlies. Do ya think that was just a 1 time deal meant ONLY for Elishah?.....THINK AGAIN, Brothers and Sisters!....THINK...AGAIN!
Methinks, this happens more to some of us, then others, or, are more cognizant of it then others, or, because of some authorative (real or, imagined) position, are unable to admit/confess a "thing" such as this...EVEN, to oneself! For some "sense" of that "revealing" would in some way DISCREDIT one's credibility, OR authority (real, or imagined), in any/every matter.
Having finished my "rant", so to speak, SOME of us REALLY BELIEVE what Not JUST the Father, in the O.T., but, ALSO Christ, in the N.T....the words "spoken/written" that, "THEY (BOTH Father AND Son), would NEVER LEAVE us, nor FORSAKE us!".....Elijah, before God took him up in a whirlwind, asked the Father to remove the "scales" from his protege, Elishah. So, Elishah could SEE the MYRAID OF ANGELS, in the hevenlies. Do ya think that was just a 1 time deal meant ONLY for Elishah?.....THINK AGAIN, Brothers and Sisters!....THINK...AGAIN!
well, we can least understand the sperm and the ovum part - there's not enough said
about it really for us to spend our time trying to figure it out - another of our
Creator's mysteries which apparently He is keeping to Himself...
hay, we're just thankful that He gave us life and that we are here and are able
to have a relationship of real Love with Him...all of our Faith-Hope-Future is in His precious hands...
about it really for us to spend our time trying to figure it out - another of our
Creator's mysteries which apparently He is keeping to Himself...
hay, we're just thankful that He gave us life and that we are here and are able
to have a relationship of real Love with Him...all of our Faith-Hope-Future is in His precious hands...
P
[h=2] Yes, we pre-exist our life here, in a spiritual form - the soul. The following may be helpful for some.
Who is Jesus?[/h]~ For There Came the Love of Eternal Divine Forces from the Pastures of the Brilliant One, that being our Father-Mother and Creator who would visit His Heart before and upon all men thru the Life and Light of this Son. This Masterful Soul and Our Brother in Spirit being Holy Anointed as the Path Maker of Our Great Brotherhood of Souls, bears True Witness and Companionship with Our Father and His Creative Purposes, Essence of Will and Love thereof ~
He walked among us so that men could hear, see and know of the Great Truth of His own Heritage. Jesus taught one should earnestly seek and pray to know the Will of Our Father’s Spirit within, and awaken the Kingdom of God. You embody within your soul the Eternal Spark of the Father, the Priceless Pearl of your Divine Nature. This is the Living Truth of Everyman and Entity Incarnate upon the Material Journey. Throughout the all and unending Heavenly Kingdoms and Spiritual Domains of the Soul, as well as here in physical realms, we are called to Remember that We are the Suns of Our Fathers Love and Our Destiny is wholly assured and perfected in Him as Companions of the Infinite Expression of Creative Forces within all Life.
We are the Immortal and Blessed Sons of God, and the Great Revelation of this Truth was then manifested within the experience of man thru the Material bestowal of the Life of Jesus. Our Elder Brother being both a man and yet One married in complete attunement to the Will of the Divine Forces of the Fathering Spirit of Creation, or God. And He handed us the keys to the Kingdom of Our Father as he taught, “Love the Father with all your heart and soul, and yourself, brother and neighbor as being that same Self, just as I have loved you.”
The Whispering Voice of Compassion, Love and Mercy, that beats upon the doors of Man’s Heart is the Language of the Soul. If you would know the Heart of your Father then Seek to know your Own for they are One and the Same. The Graciousness of This Attending Presence and Perfect Intention lives always within your Journey. Loving one another is simply respecting our Truth and giving Honor to All Life and the One Source.
~the author~
© 2013 James Francis
Who is Jesus?[/h]~ For There Came the Love of Eternal Divine Forces from the Pastures of the Brilliant One, that being our Father-Mother and Creator who would visit His Heart before and upon all men thru the Life and Light of this Son. This Masterful Soul and Our Brother in Spirit being Holy Anointed as the Path Maker of Our Great Brotherhood of Souls, bears True Witness and Companionship with Our Father and His Creative Purposes, Essence of Will and Love thereof ~
He walked among us so that men could hear, see and know of the Great Truth of His own Heritage. Jesus taught one should earnestly seek and pray to know the Will of Our Father’s Spirit within, and awaken the Kingdom of God. You embody within your soul the Eternal Spark of the Father, the Priceless Pearl of your Divine Nature. This is the Living Truth of Everyman and Entity Incarnate upon the Material Journey. Throughout the all and unending Heavenly Kingdoms and Spiritual Domains of the Soul, as well as here in physical realms, we are called to Remember that We are the Suns of Our Fathers Love and Our Destiny is wholly assured and perfected in Him as Companions of the Infinite Expression of Creative Forces within all Life.
We are the Immortal and Blessed Sons of God, and the Great Revelation of this Truth was then manifested within the experience of man thru the Material bestowal of the Life of Jesus. Our Elder Brother being both a man and yet One married in complete attunement to the Will of the Divine Forces of the Fathering Spirit of Creation, or God. And He handed us the keys to the Kingdom of Our Father as he taught, “Love the Father with all your heart and soul, and yourself, brother and neighbor as being that same Self, just as I have loved you.”
The Whispering Voice of Compassion, Love and Mercy, that beats upon the doors of Man’s Heart is the Language of the Soul. If you would know the Heart of your Father then Seek to know your Own for they are One and the Same. The Graciousness of This Attending Presence and Perfect Intention lives always within your Journey. Loving one another is simply respecting our Truth and giving Honor to All Life and the One Source.
~the author~
© 2013 James Francis