"Work out your own salvation ..."

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Dec 19, 2009
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#1
We all seem to be in agreement that we need Jesus to save us from our sin, so what is Paul talking about here?

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#2
We all seem to be in agreement that we need Jesus to save us from our sin, so what is Paul talking about here?

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
What he isn't talking about is working for your salvation.

Imperatives are always based on indicatives. God’s sufficiency is always the foundation for the fulfillment of those imperatives. Christ doesnt ask anything of us that He is not willing to fulfill in us by faith. The admonition to "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" is the imperative. The indicative that makes it possible is "God is at work in you, both to will and work for His good pleasure.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#3
Fear and trembling is misunderstood sometimes in Phil. 2:12. It means a "lack of trust in one's own abilities." In other words, we are dependent upon Jesus Christ and rest in Him. Look in the other verses that use that saying, even the apostle Paul spoke of preaching with fear and much trembling, meaning distrusting in his own abilities and relying on the Spirit's power.

It is an interesting to study out in the N.T. the term "fear and trembling". It is not what it was in the O.T.

If we let scripture interpret scripture we see that in the 2 other places where "fear and trembling" was used it referred to the woman with the issue of blood and Jesus healed her. She experienced the goodness and love of Jesus and she had awe and reverence for the goodness done to her.

Mark 5:33 (KJV)
[SUP]33 [/SUP] But the woman fearing and trembling, knowing what was done in her, came and fell down before him, and told him all the truth.


The other usage was Paul and he was referring to having no confidence in himself as he was coming to preach the gospel to the Corinthians. 1 Cor. 2:3-5

Fear and trembling = being in awe and reverence of the goodness of God to us and our complete reliance on Him for all things in life...especially in preaching the gospel/ministry to others.

It is never being "afraid" of God. It's knowing His love for us that takes away the bad kind of fear.

1 John 4:17-19 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world.

[SUP]18 [/SUP] There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.

[SUP]19 [/SUP]We love, because He first loved us.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#4
Fit it out.....just like a soldier would armor up....that is the idea behind the statement......such as...ADD TO YOUR FAITH VIRTUE..AND TO VIRTUE ETC.........
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#5
What he isn't talking about is working for your salvation.

Imperatives are always based on indicatives. God’s sufficiency is always the foundation for the fulfillment of those imperatives. Christ doesnt ask anything of us that He is not willing to fulfill in us by faith. The admonition to "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" is the imperative. The indicative that makes it possible is "God is at work in you, both to will and work for His good pleasure.
Imperatives are always based on indicatives? Let's start there. Why are imperatives always based on indictatives?
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#6
Fit it out.....just like a soldier would armor up....that is the idea behind the statement......such as...ADD TO YOUR FAITH VIRTUE..AND TO VIRTUE ETC.........
I think Paul is describing something I have experienced in my life. The Lord saves us from the messes we get ourselves into, but he wants us to learn from our mistakes.
 

Test_F_i_2_Luv

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2009
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#7
Soooo often I hear/read...

For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. Eph 2:8-9


Soooo often neglected is the very next verse...

For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. -Eph 2:10


If we're in Him, then we should show some fruits! Our salvation should reflect in our lives and our lifestyle. :)
 
Jan 27, 2013
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#8
We all seem to be in agreement that we need Jesus to save us from our sin, so what is Paul talking about here?

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
correction , what law did a gentile have. (acts 15) why are you repenting of.

5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith---6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?Galatians 3: By Faith, or by Works of the Law?



Galatians 5: Christ Has Set Us Free
1 For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery.
2 Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you.3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love Galatians 5: Christ Has Set Us Free
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#9
Imperatives are always based on indicatives? Let's start there. Why are imperatives always based on indictatives?
Because in the New anything God asks of us He Himself fulfils in us by faith.
 
Jan 27, 2013
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#10
stay with the gist, nouns and verbs are not adding to faith. if your translation of the bible is wrong.
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
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#11
I posted the short version of Philippians 2:12 yesterday. "You missied the point of why I quoted Philippians 2:12. When it says in the verse to "work out your salvation" it is not talking about working to get saved or working to show that you are saved. That word "salvation" in the context means for the Phillipians who are already saved to work out the "delilverance/solution" of their problems. Read the context starting at vs1."

According to the context starting at vs1-3 the Apostle Paul at vs3 is telling them to do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humilty of mind let each of you regard one another as more important than himself. Paul then uses Jesus Christ as the supreme example of putting others first from vs5-11. So when we get to vs12 Paul is saying to work out the solution or the deliverance/salvation of your problems with fear and trembling because (vs13) for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

And vs14 is in line with the attitude of the Philippians at vs3. It is true, that a lot of people do understand vs12 to mean to work out your salvation in order to be saved. This is "NOT" the case according to the context. :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#12
correction , what law did a gentile have. (acts 15) why are you repenting of.

5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith---6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?Galatians 3: By Faith, or by Works of the Law?



Galatians 5: Christ Has Set Us Free
1 For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery.
2 Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you.3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love Galatians 5: Christ Has Set Us Free
Are you correcting Paul or are you correcting me? I thought we all agreed we needed Jesus to save us from our sin. As for Paul, it seems to me he is making a good point.
 

wattie

Senior Member
Feb 24, 2009
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New Zealand
#16
We all seem to be in agreement that we need Jesus to save us from our sin, so what is Paul talking about here?

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
Context is key around this verse.

'Salvation' isn't everytime about being given eternal life once for all.

Someone could 'save' you from drowning.. that isn't being delivered eternally.

It depends if eternal life is the subject.. or something else.

Like the verse 'he who endureth to the end will be saved'..

That verse context is about saved as in 'delivered from trials and tribulation'.. not about being given eternal life.

So a believers spirit is converted.. but then afterwards can be completely salvaged to Christ. Daily faith in service to Christ will salvage a believers life.
 

nowyouseem033

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2014
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#17
If we accept that the bible uses salvation in a number of ways, for example, it tells us that 'we are saved', we are being saved, 'we will be saved' it therefore is very important when dealing with texts like this. What it is not is telling us to work for our salvation for there are a numerous amount of scriptures that clearly go against that false teaching. IMO i take it to mean that we are to make our salvation sure. Paul says work out 'YOUR SALVATION". This implies he is talking to people that are saved already. Then he says "knowing it is God who works in you". God doesnt work within unbelievers but rather his children/ his believers, thanks to the spirit which dwells in us. Paul concludes it is God who works salvation in you and you are to work to make it sure, not to attain it. You are confirming and making salvation sure in your life by testing it under refined fire and faith.
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
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#18
There is only one thing that distracts me from working out my own salvation- judgful people. I know God is my only Judge, yet I get entangled in the emotions and stress of trying to make myself correct in their eyes, that it pauses me making sure I'm correct in Gods eyes. God is patient, He understands that truly changing from within takes time. Judgful people are not patient, they want to see instant change, so I pretend on the surface instead of doing the change from within that will eventually be seen on the surface.

They are like mosquitoes, pestering and sucking the life out of you- you spend your time swatting them away instead of what you are supposed to be doing. Their judging only prolongs you working on whatever they are judging you about. It's only times that they back off that I'm able to grow.

They dont even even know that I am the biggest judge of myself anyways. I do work out my salivation with fear and trembling, when they leave me alone to do so. And when I do, God protects me from excessive sorrow, from being so overwhelmed that I would have a heartache and die. We have fellowship, and I grow in my love and knowledge of Him- which causes me to make better decisions- which is where the war is- for sin is first in the mind before it's carried out physically. And like the Bible says, my mind becomes more like the Holy Spirit. And this change in my mind and in my heart comes out in my words, actions, and attitude.

I know that God will forgive what I do wrong because I'm trying to do right, but falling short and disappointing Him is the deepest grieve of my soul.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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#19
We all seem to be in agreement that we need Jesus to save us from our sin, so what is Paul talking about here?

[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
I think it simply means "live according to your salvation".

The same as James or Jude says.
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#20
What do you mean by "fulfills in us"?
I mean that God never commands us to do anything, but what He provides complete sufficiency for by His grace. He is Himself the very dynamic of His own demands.