Progressive sanctification and expiation - how does it work?

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M

Mooky

Guest
#1
Hi all,

I am trying to learn about the above mentioned.I have been taught that the term " the blood of Christ" is interchangeable with " the atonement." ie. His death on the cross to take away our sins.
Apparently at the time of our conversion or regeneration - all our sins are forgiven; past present, and future and that we are continually washed.How does this work? Or is it too supernatural and mysterious to explain?And as we progress in our sanctification - is it normal to become even more aware of how sinful we are?

Thanks in advance for thoughtful answers that explain scriptures posted.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
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#2
Lots can be said on this wonderful subject.

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

The closer you walk with Jesus the less attraction the world has for you.

His robes for mine oh wonderful exchange. By grace I have received the righteousness of Christ and He took my sinfulness upon Him. He received my punishment and I received His blessing.

I suspect we will ponder this subject through out all of eternity.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Marcelo

Senior Member
Feb 4, 2016
2,359
859
113
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#3
Hi all,

I am trying to learn about the above mentioned.I have been taught that the term " the blood of Christ" is interchangeable with " the atonement." ie. His death on the cross to take away our sins.
Apparently at the time of our conversion or regeneration - all our sins are forgiven; past present, and future and that we are continually washed.How does this work? Or is it too supernatural and mysterious to explain?And as we progress in our sanctification - is it normal to become even more aware of how sinful we are?

Thanks in advance for thoughtful answers that explain scriptures posted.
I think that the blood of Christ atoned for all of our past sins and some of our future sins. I can't say that all of our future sins are already forgiven because willful sinners like adulterers and liars, for example, will not be saved (will not be forgiven).

I agree that as we progress in our sanctification we become more and more aware of our sinful nature. Let's not forget that "reverse sanctification" is very common, and we must always be at the feet of the Lord to prevent backsliding.
 

notmyown

Senior Member
May 26, 2016
4,586
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#4
Jan 15, 2011
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#5
Christ's sacrifice on the cross has wiped us clean of our former sins when we come to Him and are born again. His sacrifice has power to keep us from future and present sins as we abide in Him and walk in the Spirit! :)

Here are some scriptures to give some context regarding the notion that our sins past, present, and future are forgiven.

2 Peter 1:5-9 NKJV
5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

Romans 3:21-26 NKJV
21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[h] who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Thankfully, the new grace dynamic we have as born again believers is that we have Christ Jesus as our Mediator and Advocate, so when we do sin, we repent (metanoeo) and He is good to forgive us :).
 
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Nov 22, 2015
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#6
Here are scriptures that say we have complete forgiveness in Christ. That His sacrifice has dealt with all sin. Does this mean we go out and sin all we want? No, a thousand times - No - It means we trust in His sacrifice for our sins when we blow it and run to the Father to tell Him - confess all things now - but not in order to be forgiven because we do believe in what Jesus has done for us by His blood.

Forgiveness is a done deal - either believe it or don't believe it.

On the subject of forgiveness that we have in Christ now because of His precious Blood...here is what the scriptures say.....sometimes the truth in the gospel of the grace of Christ "conflicts" with what we have been religiously taught.

1 John 2:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] I am writing to you, little children, because your sins have been forgiven you for His name's sake.

have been forgiven = perfect passive

perfect =
The perfect tense in Greek is used to describe a completed past action which produced results which are still in effect all the way up to the present time.
It is continuously happening in the present.

passive = voice =
action is happening to you....you are not doing it

Without a doubt this verse says that the sins are forgiven from a past action that remains in a continuous completed state and that was put on them....not something they did.

Ephesians 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

We have redemption = present continuous action...so this means we have present continuous forgiveness of our sins
...

and look...that grace stuff shows up again!...
it's all according to the riches of our loving Father's grace that He has given to us in Christ our Lord.

Colossians 1:13-14 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

[SUP]14 [/SUP] in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Same thing here too...present continuous action = forgiveness of sins


Redemption!..we have been bought with the precious Blood of Jesus... Let's honor His work.



Brethren ...we have a great salvation in our Lord!

Walk in the knowledge of your forgiveness in Christ and in that security we will experience maturity.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#7
Here is a look at forgiveness with some other scriptures. Knowing that we are completely forgiven because of Christ's sacrifice makes us want to run to the Father for grace to walk free of sinning because we know that they are forgiven. That does not make us want to go out and sin. It does the complete opposite. It wants us to grow in the grace and knowledge of God and to be pleasing to Him. We have a new nature now.

We are a new creation in Christ - created in righteousness and holiness.


 
M

Mooky

Guest
#8
Thing is, I have been a christian since I was 5.But lapsed in my faith between 18 and 22.How does the concept of " new creation " apply to me - as I have been a christian for a very long time?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,098
113
#9
Thing is, I have been a christian since I was 5.But lapsed in my faith between 18 and 22.How does the concept of " new creation " apply to me - as I have been a christian for a very long time?

God's kindness is intended to lead you to repentance
(Romans 2:4)

or to put it another way,


♪ Lord you waited so patiently
for all this to finally hit me ♫

[video=youtube;lzpoOV6cXNM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzpoOV6cXNM[/video]



 
Nov 22, 2015
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#10
Thing is, I have been a christian since I was 5.But lapsed in my faith between 18 and 22.How does the concept of " new creation " apply to me - as I have been a christian for a very long time?
I say it applies the very same whether you were born-again today or were born-again for 60 years. The new creation in Christ is the real you in your inner man.

Living by the flesh does not stop making us a new creation in Christ. It makes us deceived by sin and distorts our view of the Lord's love and grace towards us , others and ourselves.

As we learn to walk by the spirit instead of the flesh - then we experience God's kind of life in our lives.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,098
113
#11
I say it applies the very same whether you were born-again today or were born-again for 60 years. The new creation in Christ is the real you in your inner man.

Living by the flesh does not stop making us a new creation in Christ. It makes us deceived by sin and distorts our view of the Lord's love and grace towards us , others and ourselves.

As we learn to walk by the spirit instead of the flesh - then we experience God's kind of life in our lives.

all those things in us that are not of Him will one day be removed, as tares, as we are conformed completely into His image, and all that remains is Him, He in we and we in He, as one, perfectly -- amen!!

and He is bringing this about in His perfect time, in His perfect way, building us up in Himself and raising Himself up in us, perfectly trusting, perfectly loving, perfectly obedient, perfectly at peace in Him, all according to His good pleasure.

"
in absence the heart grows fonder" -- it isn't to say that to fall short is good, but he causes us to rise up again, and every time i realize i've stepped away, i cling all the more tightly when He draws me back to Himself. covered over, held fast, loosening my grip because i know He holds me.
Him, turning all things to our good - all things for His glory

waking up one day and realizing old temptations, pits and snares no longer have any allure, and not even remembering how or when that happened? *
priceless*

♪ His mercies are many
no man can number ♫
 
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Nov 22, 2015
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#12

all those things in us that are not of Him will one day be removed, as tares, as we are conformed completely into His image, and all that remains is Him, He in we and we in He, as one, perfectly -- amen!!

and He is bringing this about in His perfect time, in His perfect way, building us up in Himself and raising Himself up in us, perfectly trusting, perfectly loving, perfectly obedient, perfectly at peace in Him, all according to His good pleasure.

"
in absence the heart grows fonder" -- it isn't to say that to fall short is good, but he causes us to rise up again, and every time i realize i've stepped away, i cling all the more tightly when He draws me back to Himself. covered over, held fast, loosening my grip because i know He holds me.
Him, turning all things to our good - all things for His glory

waking up one day and realizing old temptations, pits and snares no longer have any allure, and not even remembering how or when that happened? *
priceless*

♪ His mercies are many
no man can number ♫
Amen!..Well said.

I have found the very same thing happening in my life. The more I see Christ and what He has done - and the more I agree with His work - the more He becomes manifested in my life and the things of the flesh just have fallen off like dead leaves on a branch.

Transformation is really the emerging new man that is in Christ being manifested in our bodies while we are here on this earth.

This transformation of what already is in us in Christ in our new creation ( It is not called a "new evolution" ) can be seen by man as our minds get renewed to the truth of Christ's work for us. Rom. 12:2

We are simply "being" who we already are when we "put on Christ".

The new man in Christ is like the invisible man - when he put clothes on, people could then see him. We put on Christ and people see the new man in Christ manifested and God gets glorified.

This all happens by grace through faith in what Christ has done and we participate in it with Him for it is God who is at work in us both to will and to do of His good pleasure. He will be faithful to us. Phil. 2:13
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#13
Hi all,

I am trying to learn about the above mentioned.I have been taught that the term " the blood of Christ" is interchangeable with " the atonement." ie. His death on the cross to take away our sins.
Apparently at the time of our conversion or regeneration - all our sins are forgiven; past present, and future and that we are continually washed.How does this work? Or is it too supernatural and mysterious to explain?And as we progress in our sanctification - is it normal to become even more aware of how sinful we are?

Thanks in advance for thoughtful answers that explain scriptures posted.
we must first accept the truth that we are sinners, in order to submit to the need for Jesus salvation. To stare into the gospel will indeed reveal how sinful we are. there are alot of doctrines that teach us to ignore the things that show us plainly Our sin and do nothing about it Just " rest in the Knowledge of the cross" things along those Lines. sanctification is found in believing Jesus words. Paul taughtthe same design as Jesus " you are not condemned- Now go and sin no more"

When the gospel brings whatever sin to light, there is no condemnation because Jesus taught so much about believing in Him. what sanctifies is following His truth that is revealed in fixing upon Him.we each and all at some point are Like that woman caught in adultery. the Law of moses is our accuser for it says " the sinner must be put to death" thats the reasonm those men dragged this woman before Jesus, they were following the mosaic Law. Yet Jesus did not follow the mosaic Law and stone the woman, He forgave Her, and told Her to go and leave her life of Sin. His whole ministry is that way if a person learns the gospel and realizes for instance " I pursue money far more than I pursue God" Jesus still tells us " Niether do i condemn you, now repent" Jesus is the One who died on our behalf, therefore God gave Him authority to forgive our sins and teach us what is truly right. sanctification comes through His ministry. and Forgiveness comes through showing Mercy because we understand He has given us mercy forgiving our sins according to the mosaic Law. there is really no scripture im aware of saying "past , present and future" Jesus changed forgiveness according to the old law of sacrifice by becoming the sacrifice for us. forgiveness in the old testament was through the blood of bulls and gost sacrificed to God, the new is through Jesus blood, sacrificed for us, By God. Because He is eternal, so is the power of His blood and blood represents Life. as Do the words of God. we are sanctified through Jesus words alone, through Keeping them alicve in us and refusing to omit the thoings we dont want to Here...Believing those things that offend our sin is the very things that take our sin away. Yet, those words have to be taken with the rest that say " neither do i condemn you" so we are convicted by the spirit, and also sanctified By it. and the spirit is spoken By Jesus into us through faith

John 6:63
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#14
I think that the blood of Christ atoned for all of our past sins and some of our future sins. I can't say that all of our future sins are already forgiven because willful sinners like adulterers and liars, for example, will not be saved (will not be forgiven).

I agree that as we progress in our sanctification we become more and more aware of our sinful nature. Let's not forget that "reverse sanctification" is very common, and we must always be at the feet of the Lord to prevent backsliding.
atthe feet of Jesus is the p[lace to be for certain, and we Know this

Hebrews 9:15 "For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance--now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant."

He died to forgive transgression of the first covenant. forgiveness under the new is found as all things in His words

matthew 6:15 "For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."

Our precious Lord taught this more than once. and we see it in His teachings together with forgiveness of the old in the parable of the unforgiving debtor

matthew 18:21-35...paying close attention to v 35. to forgive others is our forgiveness as children of God, who follow after the one who forgave us, He taught " blessed are the merciful for they will be shown mercy" as James taught " Mercy triumphs over Judgement" its no longer stone the sinner and sacrifice a goat for forgiveness, but to goive other sinners the forgiveness inside of us that comes from the Lords word to those willing to sit at His feet
 
Dec 9, 2011
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#15
Thing is, I have been a christian since I was 5.But lapsed in my faith between 18 and 22.How does the concept of " new creation " apply to me - as I have been a christian for a very long time?
If the spirit was made perfect then the reborn person Is a member of the body of CHRIST and In HIM there Is no darkness but the flesh has not been glorified yet and still sins as we walk In this fallen world.


Hebrews 12:23
King James version(KJV)

23.) To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
+++
Romans 12:1-2
King James version(KJV)

1.)I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

2.)And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
 
Feb 24, 2015
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#16
Hi all,

I am trying to learn about the above mentioned.I have been taught that the term " the blood of Christ" is interchangeable with " the atonement." ie. His death on the cross to take away our sins.
Apparently at the time of our conversion or regeneration - all our sins are forgiven; past present, and future and that we are continually washed.How does this work? Or is it too supernatural and mysterious to explain?And as we progress in our sanctification - is it normal to become even more aware of how sinful we are?

Thanks in advance for thoughtful answers that explain scriptures posted.
Everything is dependent on the relationship and how you trust and have faith in Christ.

We are forgiven when we come to Christ in repentance but can always be defiled by
sin. Once you remove the defiling you remove holiness.

The problem has always been walking in the Spirit and those who are caught in legalism
always confuse the issues because they never found this place.
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
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#17
God's forgiveness has always been conditional, so the below is wrong.

Christ is the message of love, power and victory, so do not disbelieve like G7
he sounds spiritual but this is just going soft on sin and love.




Here is a look at forgiveness with some other scriptures. Knowing that we are completely forgiven because of Christ's sacrifice makes us want to run to the Father for grace to walk free of sinning because we know that they are forgiven. That does not make us want to go out and sin. It does the complete opposite. It wants us to grow in the grace and knowledge of God and to be pleasing to Him. We have a new nature now.

We are a new creation in Christ - created in righteousness and holiness.


 
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
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#18
There are no New Covenant scriptures that say we must forgive in order to be forgiven now.

We do forgive in the New Covenant because we have been forgiven already from Christ's completed work on the cross. It is a fruit of His life in us now.

I wonder why Peter and Paul never said anything about this when they preached the gospel? ( the truth is that Jesus elevated the law as He often did to show people that they really couldn't keep it and that they needed a Savior )

People who lived under the Old Covenant did not have a means of lasting forgiveness as a part of the covenant under which they lived which is why it was "conditional."

Here are the very scriptures again - remember these are word-for-word accounts of the true gospel of the grace of Christ being preached.

Here's Peter....shouldn't he have said "
You need to forgive anyone first before you can receive God's forgiveness by the blood of Jesus"??

Acts 10:43 (NASB)
[SUP]43 [/SUP] "Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins."


And the same thing for Paul - he didn't say 'You need to forgive first before we you can be forgiven by the blood of Jesus"
??


Acts 13:38 (NASB)
[SUP]38 [/SUP] "Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through Him forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you,

Or is it possible Jesus was talking about the law when He gave those words out for His disciples at the time they were still under law then? The New Covenant didn't come into effect until Jesus died and rose again to obtain our eternal forgiveness.

Here Paul says that forgiveness is all based on "according to the riches of His grace "..not if we forgive first.

Ephesians 1:7 (NASB)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace
 
Jan 15, 2011
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#19
Regarding forgiving others in the new covenant

Matthew 6:8-15 NKJV
8 “Therefore do not be like them. For your Father knows the things you have need of before you ask Him. 9 In this manner, therefore, pray:


Our Father in heaven,
Hallowed be Your name.
10 Your kingdom come.
Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
As we forgive our debtors.
13 And do not lead us into temptation,
But deliver us from the evil one.
For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.[c]
14 “For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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#20
The New Covenant does not start at Matthew 1:1 - it starts at the death of the Lord Jesus Christ.

The New Covenant doesn't start until the death of the testator which is Christ Jesus. Jesus said the night He was betrayed - "This is the blood of the New Covenant."


Hebrews 9:16-17 (NASB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For where a covenant is, there must of necessity be the death of the one who made it. ( Testator )

[SUP]17 [/SUP] For a covenant is valid only when men are dead, for it is never in force while the one who made it lives. ( Testator )

Hebrews 9:24 (NASB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]
For Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands, a mere copy of the true one, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;

Luke 22:20 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] And in the same way He took the cup after they had eaten, saying,
"This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood.

Jesus' blood speaks of better things then the blood of Abel which cried out for vengeance. Jesus's blood cries out "Forgiven"

Hebrews 12:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]
And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.


 
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