Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
Blessed is the one
who does not walk in step with the wicked
or stand in the way that sinners take
or sit in the company of mockers,
2 but whose delight is in the law of the Lord,
and who meditates on his law day and night.
3 That person is like a tree planted by streams of water,
which yields its fruit in season
and whose leaf does not wither—
whatever they do prospers.
4 Not so the wicked!
They are like chaff
that the wind blows away.
5 Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment,
nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous.
6 For the Lord watches over the way of the righteous,
but the way of the wicked leads to destruction.
Psalm 1

For I will be like a lion to Ephraim,
like a great lion to Judah.
I will tear them to pieces and go away;
I will carry them off, with no one to rescue them.
15 Then I will return to my lair
until they have borne their guilt
and seek my face—
in their misery
they will earnestly seek me.
Hosiah 5:14-15
 
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
179
0
Reading the last few pages here give me the impression that at least one needs to put away the wine bottle, get a cup of coffee (or tea), turn off the computer, go into his prayer closet, and spend some quality time with Jesus.
Yeah, at least two..... maybe four or five with the others egging him on..... like it's alright to egg him on to see where he goes.

That's every bit as sinful, if not more to promote someone to sin by egging sin on.

Even more sinful for one who egged him on & then told you how right you are..... like his sin don't stink, like he did nothing wrong.

Openly pathetic. Openly sinful.

Definitely not edifying.

But that's okay..... he's forever forgiven, doesn't have to repent, didn't hurt his salvation a bit.

What do they always say? Those truly saved won't want to sin like that.

Riiiiiiight.:rolleyes:
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,034
13,041
113
58
Talk about rambling on....and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.............
So it's not just me. :eek:

A wise man speaks because he has something to say.

Others speak because they have to say something. ;)
 
Last edited:
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
So it's not just me. :eek:

Some people speak because they have something to say.

Others speak because they have to say something. ;)
Absolutely...like the post above yours....99% of the time he has nothing but derogatory remarks and insults while judging....a joke for sure......!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
Yeah, at least two..... maybe four or five with the others egging him on..... like it's alright to egg him on to see where he goes.

That's every bit as sinful, if not more to promote someone to sin by egging sin on.

Even more sinful for one who egged him on & then told you how right you are..... like his sin don't stink, like he did nothing wrong.

Openly pathetic. Openly sinful.

Definitely not edifying.

But that's okay..... he's forever forgiven, doesn't have to repent, didn't hurt his salvation a bit.

What do they always say? Those truly saved won't want to sin like that.

Riiiiiiight.:rolleyes:
Do you ever have anything to say other than derogatory, mouthy, condemning, judgmental remarks? You should go read how you talk to people in here....The above is the epitome of a sinful, judgmental attitude which pours from you non-stop and in about 99% of your posts.....! And you identify as a Christian that works for his salvation?
 
Last edited:
S

Sully

Guest
Those believers who dismiss God's grace, the same who are unworthy of unmerited favor, are missing reality and misrepresenting the nature of God.
 

fredoheaven

Senior Member
Nov 17, 2015
3,992
927
113
I don't know what your talking about......what is your point....this thread is about salvation based upon faith void of works....

One is saved to do the works...not saved because of the works.....and your Hebrews quote has nothing to do with salvation, but rather forsaking the assembly and counting the blood of Jesus a common ordinary base thing.....

so...again I ask what is your point?
Hi DC,

This now I think clears your OP. "One is saved to do the works...not saved because of the works."

Thanks and God bless...
 
Feb 18, 2017
779
12
0
I'm beginning to agree...never see these post at the same time.
He is exactly why I started the fruit and works thread. It is ONLY by their doctrines(fruit) that we can discern false teachers.

It is crazy and NUTS that a professed unbeliever, a professed unsaved person without the Holy Spirit, makes sense to some believers here!!!!! I would seriously stop and think about what I believe and what I am doing if I was giving credence to what a PROFESSED unbeliever was saying about salvation.
 
S

Sully

Guest
He is exactly why I started the fruit and works thread. It is ONLY by their doctrines(fruit) that we can discern false teachers.

It is crazy and NUTS that a professed unbeliever, a professed unsaved person without the Holy Spirit, makes sense to some believers here!!!!! I would seriously stop and think about what I believe and what I am doing if I was giving credence to what a PROFESSED unbeliever was saying about salvation.
Profound critical thinking skills. Even IF (not likely) turns out to be off the mark, it does apply out in the "real world" so it's totally viable and worth consideration imo.
 
Aug 15, 2009
9,745
179
0
Do you ever have anything to say other than derogatory, mouthy, condemning, judgmental remarks?
Said like a true sinner who wants the blame bounced on the one who called out their sin. Every sinner & self-righteous hypocrite does that.

So, we see in this thread that you sin & in your eyes, your sin don't stink in the nostrils of God. God just forgives them now & in the future so you sin any way you want.

You should go read how you talk to people in here....The above is the epitome of a sinful, judgmental attitude which pours from you non-stop and in about 99% of your posts.....!
Maybe you need to go back & read how you egged your brother on in here to sin & sin more, as well as mock him for doing it.

And you identify as a Christian that works for his salvation?
Again, this is deflection of your sin & accusing the one who called you out on your sin. Everyone who doesn't believe in OSAS & Hyp------e gets the same treatment.

You can treat someone like a dog & it's alright, cause your sin don't stink. The epitome of a self -righteous bigot.
 
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
He is exactly why I started the fruit and works thread. It is ONLY by their doctrines(fruit) that we can discern false teachers.

It is crazy and NUTS that a professed unbeliever, a professed unsaved person without the Holy Spirit, makes sense to some believers here!!!!! I would seriously stop and think about what I believe and what I am doing if I was giving credence to what a PROFESSED unbeliever was saying about salvation.
I can't figure out why some people haven't just stopped having conversation with him...why would you continue?
 

DiscipleDave

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2012
3,095
69
48
Originally Posted by DiscipleDave


You believe you know the TRUTH, yet do not know that the Disciples were not even Saved, until after the Holy Ghost fell upon them. While they were with Jesus they commited sins, they doubted, they feared, they lacked faith, they did not Truly believe He was the Son of GOD until Jesus revealed Himself to them alive after being crucified. ONLY at that time did they actually believe that Jesus was the Son of God. You do error thinking they were SAVED while they walked with the man, Jesus Christ. They were SAVED when the Believed that Jesus was in TRUTH the Son of God after seeing Him alive from the dead, and the Holy Spirit of God entered into them. This is when they were SAVED and started walking as Jesus walked from that point on.



It speaks volumes to me, those who try to defend sinning. Scriptures speaks volumes about those who think they can't cease from sin, even calling them Cursed Children. Scriptures speaks volumes how to get sin out of your life, how to overcome all sins, and even teaches to get rid of the sin that so easily besets you. It speaks volumes to me all those who continue to live in sin, all the while casing stones at those who claim they don't. God shall judge all.


^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
Well said and may i thank you for leading me to hope for salvation,, you are truly blessed and im so thankfull for your truth from God,, That you have most undoubtingly studied hard and search for truth with an open heart to recieve this knowledge.. to which i can only say im truly grateful for what the lord God can do in peoples lifes,,amen bro and please take my sincere apolagies for me not understanding your knowledge to begin with...
Brother, you give me credit that is not mine to take. What i teach is what God has told me. That is what i teach. i am but a messenger, not the author or inventor of what i teach. If a King tells the messenger to tell the village "________" and the village rejoices and want to praise the man who delivered the message, That man would be evil if he took the credit as if that information came from himself. This man would be a good man, if He told the TRUTH and told the villagers the message is not from himself but comes from the KING Himself.

If i teach something that comes from me, and is my opinion, then give me the credit. But if what i teach comes from Him who told me these things, then i can't accept the credit. Give God the glory, i am but a simple messenger.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
 

DiscipleDave

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2012
3,095
69
48
Huh. That's a lot more verbose than "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."
The Problem with this generation isn't that verse, the problem with this generation, is that is the ONLY very they believe and all verses that specifically say believing to be Saved.

The above verse says whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be Saved, that is TRUE, but this verse does not negate, make void, all the other verses which specifically teach what it takes to be SAVED.

Mar_13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Mar_16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.


A perfect example of FAITH + WORKS = SAVED. Believing is the Faith part, the getting baptised is the WORK part, but this generation thinks FAITH ONLY is enough, they believe the one verse above, and ignore, void, or interpret away all the other verses that teach what it means to be SAVED.

Joh_10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.


So believing is NOT enough, you must ENTER in, to be Saved.

Rom_8:24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?


HOPE and believing are entirely different things.

Rom_10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.


Yet another verse that plainly teaches FAITH + WORKS = SAVED. Believe that Jesus was raised from the dead= Faith. CONFESS = WORKS

1Co_15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.


SAVED if we keep in memory what the Apostle Paul told us. Not believe what he told us, but to keep in memory what he told us, yet another WORK.

So people of this generation teaches that Faith ONLY is enough, yet Scriptures plainly teach that to be SAVED requires Faith AND Works.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
 
S

Sully

Guest
A perfect example of FAITH + WORKS = SAVED.
Ok, then the burden of proof is on you. What "works" precisely are needed to supplement faith alone in Jesus Christ alone to accomplish salvation?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
*Verse 39 - But we are not of those who draw back to perdition, but of those who believe to the saving of the soul. Those who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul and those who believe to the saving of the soul do not draw back to perdition.

From beginning "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) to end "receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls" (1 Peter 1:9) salvation is through faith and is not by works. Now once again, James is not using the word "justified" to mean "accounted as righteous" but is "shown to be righteous." James is discussing the proof of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18), not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3). Works bear out the justification that already came by faith.

People who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul, which is not proper faith. Shallow, temporary belief that has no root and draws back to perdition was never saving faith in Christ to begin with. Either we are in the flesh and cannot please God or else we are in the Spirit and belong to Christ (Romans 8:6-10).

The Jews were in the olive tree to begin with because they were the "natural branches" and not because they were all saved. Because of their unbelief and hard hearts God removed His gracious hand from them as a people overall and broke them off from His goodness (but only for a time after which they will be restored). We Gentiles have now been grafted into God's goodness and are the recipients of His blessings. Paul's warning is that we should not get arrogant because we might lose the goodness and blessings of God just like the Jews lost the goodness and blessings of God -- but this doesn't speak of losing salvation.

*Notice - Brethren, if anyone "among" you wanders from the truth..turns a "sinner" from the error of his way.. Some would argue that James says this one who turned from the truth was a "sinner," and was "among" but "not of" the Brethren, then he wasn’t previously saved. That fits 1 John 2:19 - They went out "from" us, but they were "not of" us..

IF this person was a genuine believer, yet how do we know for sure this is the second death in the lake of fire? In Matthew 26:38, Jesus said: "My soul [psuche] is deeply grieved, to the point of death." Jesus was not saying that His soul was deeply grieved to the point of spiritual death, Rather, Jesus was talking about physical death, his human life. In Revelation 16:3, "The second angel poured out his bowl into the sea, and it became blood like that of a dead man; and every living soul [psuche] in the sea died". In 1 Peter 3:20 "... God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, [psuche-souls] were brought safely (saved from drowning, physical death) through the water" by the ark (Hebrews 11:7).

"Soul" is rendered from the Greek word "psuche" and is also translated as "life". The word "psuche" is never translated as "spirit." In 1 Corinthians 5:5, we read - I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, (physical death) so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus (no second death).

Jesus covered our sins in one way (Romans 4:7) by bringing forgiveness for all believers, yet sins can also be covered in a different way. In Proverbs 10:12, we read: Hatred stirs up strife, But love covers all sins. In 1 Peter 4:8, we read: And above all things have fervent love for one another, for "love will cover a multitude of sins." Where there is strife, there is hatred and unless love prevails, the strife will get worse. Love covers offenses and sins when a believer turns back from error.

So is this wanderer a professing Christian, whose faith is not genuine, or a sinning Christian, who needs to be restored? For the former, the death spoken of in vs. 20 is the "second death" (Revelation 21:8); for the latter, it is physical death (1 Corinthians 11:29-32; 1 John 5:16).
two great posts.

Your like a precision bomber, Come in, drop a few 5000 lb bunker bombs, which hit the spot. then move on.. I just wish the target would see the truth so they would not have to suffer such devastating hits..
 
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
The wicked are like chaff.

They will be burnt up and destroyed. Nothing will remain of them, or will they
be valued in the halls of the Most High.
 

notmyown

Senior Member
May 26, 2016
4,646
1,100
113
hey, Peter?

Jesus lived Psalm 1 FOR His people.

and He's creating Psalm 1 IN His people.

let's not look at righteousness in the Bible and pretend to see ourselves.
we ought to see Christ.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
hey, Peter?

Jesus lived Psalm 1 FOR His people.

and He's creating Psalm 1 IN His people.

let's not look at righteousness in the Bible and pretend to see ourselves.
we ought to see Christ.
Amen and Amen.. This post deserves many reps!!