Not By Works

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UnderGrace

Guest
#55,981
#55,981
Sigh!! :(

You have defined the unbeliever in a variety of ways in this thread..... and if I can find the patience to do so, I will go back and post them for you.

You can blame, Free Grace, you can blame Calvinism, you can blame Hyper Grace, Reformed, OSAS....and so forth...

but really your problem is ultimately with the Gospel of Christ Jesus, the Saviour, crucified and risen and His all encompassing

eternal work and His promises to His children, because you find it difficult to accept that the gift of eternal life is eternal, and

so instead you redefine it as temporal state of being (earthly moment by earthly moment ) which it is not.






Ralph- said:
Uh, no........you can sift through the abundance of my posts and see that I have not changed my beliefs in this thread.



BINGO! That's what I've been saying. If a person is believing, they are by definition NOT REJECTING THE BLOOD OF CHRIST.

I agree completely that it is those who DO NOT BELIEVE that reject the blood of Christ. And them living in sin is the sign of that unbelief. But all is well because Freegrace doctrine is close at hand to tickle the ears of the person living in sin and unbelief telling them they remain saved despite their unbelief and resultant slide into a life of sin.


The second type of soil believer in the Parable of the Sower begs to differ with you. Jesus said he believes for a while but then falls away when trouble comes his way. And nowadays, Freegrace doctrine is there to catch him and assure him that he is still saved despite his falling away into sin and unbelief.


Jesus shows us that it is the 2nd type of soil believer who can become an unbeliever. That is a danger to the new, weak, and not deeply rooted believer. Only people of the fourth type of soil (you know, the kind that gets beat up around here for being holier than thou) have roots that go down deep enough to keep them from falling away and firmly planted in Christ.
Click to expand...
 
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VCO

VCO

Senior Member
#55,982
Oct 14, 2013
11,969
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113
#55,982
Here are some verses that someone has ignored:

><> t <><

Ecclesiastes 9:1 (ASV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] For all this I laid to my heart, even to explore all this: that the righteous, and the wise, and their works, are in the hand of God; whether it be love or hatred, man knoweth it not; all is before them.

Romans 8:28 (NCV)
[SUP]28 [/SUP] We know that in everything God works for the good of those who love him. They are the people he called, because that was his plan.

Galatians 5:6 (NCV)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] When we are in Christ Jesus, it is not important if we are circumcised or not. The important thing is faith—the kind of faith that works through love.

 
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ElAmor

Banned
#55,983
Dec 22, 2017
278
3
0
#55,983
gb9 said:
if I could add to this list- saved really doesn't mean saved, forgiven really doesn't mean forgiven, believe really means work for.

same old twisting and plucking out of context and double speak, all the workers have the same playbook.
Click to expand...
New International Version 1984 John 7:18 He who speaks on his own does so to gain honor for himself, but he who works for the honor of the one who sent him is a man of truth; there is nothing false about him.

But ZOMBIES are just WALKING DEAD deceiving and being deceived all the while by thinking they're alive when their not.
 
VCO

VCO

Senior Member
#55,984
Oct 14, 2013
11,969
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113
#55,984
Now this is more like I believe:
><> t​ <><

Psalm 116:1 (HCSB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] I love the LORD because He has heard my appeal for mercy.

Psalm 116:4-5 (HCSB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Then I called on the name of Yahweh: “Yahweh, save me!”
[SUP]5 [/SUP] The LORD is gracious and righteous; our God is compassionate.

Psalm 32:5 (CSBBible)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Then I acknowledged my sin to youand did not conceal my iniquity.
I said,
"I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,"
and you forgave the guilt of my sin.
Selah

Psalm 40:16 (ESV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But may all who seek you rejoice and be glad in you; may those who love your salvation say continually, “Great is the LORD!”

Psalm 89:1 (HCSB)
[SUP]1[/SUP] I will sing about the LORD’s faithful love forever; I will proclaim Your faithfulness to all generations with my mouth.



Who says you cannot teach the Gospel through the Psalms?
 
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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#55,985
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#55,985
VCO said:
Now this is more like I believe:
><> t​ <><

Psalm 116:1 (HCSB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] I love the LORD because He has heard my appeal for mercy.

Psalm 116:4-5 (HCSB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Then I called on the name of Yahweh: “Yahweh, save me!”
[SUP]5 [/SUP] The LORD is gracious and righteous; our God is compassionate.

Psalm 32:5 (CSBBible)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Then I acknowledged my sin to youand did not conceal my iniquity.
I said,
"I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,"
and you forgave the guilt of my sin.
Selah

Psalm 40:16 (ESV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] But may all who seek you rejoice and be glad in you; may those who love your salvation say continually, “Great is the LORD!”

Psalm 89:1 (HCSB)
[SUP]1[/SUP] I will sing about the LORD’s faithful love forever; I will proclaim Your faithfulness to all generations with my mouth.



Who says you cannot teach the Gospel through the Psalms?
Click to expand...
Amen and David speaks of his salvation in the present tense in the Psalms.....and the presence of the Spirit...........
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#55,986
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#55,986
UnderGrace said:
Sigh!! :(

You have defined the unbeliever in a variety of ways in this thread..... and if I can find the patience to do so, I will go back and post them for you.

You can blame, Free Grace, you can blame Calvinism, you can blame Hyper Grace, Reformed, OSAS....and so forth...

but really your problem is ultimately with the Gospel of Christ Jesus, the Saviour, crucified and risen and His all encompassing

eternal work and His promises to His children, because you find it difficult to accept that the gift of eternal life is eternal, and

so instead you redefine it as temporal state of being (earthly moment by earthly moment ) which it is not.
Click to expand...
Good luck with that.................
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#55,989
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#55,989
I wonder what works the workers for will do today to maintain their salvation?

Those who know Jesus by faith also understand that we are KEPT by the POWER of GOD and do not have to do a thing today to maintain our salvation.........eternal and everlasting mean exactly that when ties to the life given by Christ unto all who have exercised genuine saving faith.
 
L

LightLoveHope

Banned
#55,990
Jan 25, 2018
673
10
0
#55,990
They stripped him and put a scarlet robe on him,
and then twisted together a crown of thorns and set it on his head. They put a staff in
his right hand and knelt in front of him and mocked him. "Hail, king of the Jews!" they said.
They spit on him, and took the staff and struck him on the head again and again.
After they had mocked him, they took off the robe and put his own clothes on him.
Matthew 27:28-31

The soldiers twisted together a crown of thorns and put it on his head. They clothed him in a
purple robe and went up to him again and again, saying, "Hail, king of the Jews!" And they
struck him in the face.
John 19:2-3

They put a purple robe on him, then twisted together a crown of thorns and set it on him.
And they began to call out to him, "Hail, king of the Jews!"
Again and again they struck him on the head with a staff and spit on him. Falling on their
knees, they paid homage to him.
Mark 15:17-19
 
VCO

VCO

Senior Member
#55,992
Oct 14, 2013
11,969
4,586
113
#55,992
dcontroversal said:
I wonder what works the workers for will do today to maintain their salvation?

Those who know Jesus by faith also understand that we are KEPT by the POWER of GOD and do not have to do a thing today to maintain our salvation.........eternal and everlasting mean exactly that when ties to the life given by Christ unto all who have exercised genuine saving faith.
Click to expand...

><> t​ <><


You have to wonder, and what part of these verses do they NOT UNDERSTAND.

Romans 4:2-5 (HCSB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to brag about—but not before God.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Now to the one who works, pay is not considered as a gift, but as something owed.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But to the one who does not work, but believes on Him who declares the ungodly to be righteous, his faith is credited for righteousness.




Be thankful for everything:

I live in a City that has about 280,000 residents, and sometimes I think it is about 270,000 thousand too much. However, all I have to do is look at this picture, and the first thing that crosses my mind is: "THANK GOD, I do not live in this inner City." Sorry if this is how you have to live, but it is not my cup of tea.



 
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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#55,994
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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#55,994
VCO said:
><> t​ <><


You have to wonder, and what part of these verses do they NOT UNDERSTAND.

Romans 4:2-5 (HCSB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to brag about—but not before God.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Now to the one who works, pay is not considered as a gift, but as something owed.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But to the one who does not work, but believes on Him who declares the ungodly to be righteous, his faith is credited for righteousness.




Be thankful for everything:

I live in a City that has about 280,000 residents, and sometimes I think it is about 270,000 thousand too much. However, all I have to do is look at this picture, and the first thing that crosses my mind is: "THANK GOD, I do not live in this inner City." Sorry if this is how you have to live, but it is not my cup of tea.



Click to expand...
My place is 20 plus miles to nearest town and in the middle of Mark Twain National forest in Missouri....
 
BillG

BillG

Senior Member
#55,996
Feb 15, 2017
8,879
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#55,996
Hi everyone,

I hope all is well with you. I hope your day has gone well or is going well.

I just wanted to post the following lyrics from one of my favourite worship songs.

My post here won't be insightful

I fix my eyes upon the crossReaching out with all I've gotI'm letting go to start again





I need your love that's why I'm hereWaiting outside my life it callsSo while I'm here I'll give my allYou are my peace within the stormHere at the cross I find my homeYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allThan it allGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus, is greaterGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus, is greaterI fix my eyes upon the crossReaching out with all I've gotI'm letting go to start againI need your love that's why I'm hereWaiting outside my life it callsSo while I'm here I'll give my allYou are my peace within the stormHere at the cross I find my homeYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater, than it allYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater, than it allGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greaterGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greater

Lord I believe You rose againSo I don't believe this is the endYou never fail, You have a planMy life You hold within Your handsSo I'll walk by faith and not by sightYou are my source, You are my lightIn You I live, I will not dieYou stretched these wings now I can flyYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allThan it allGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greaterGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greaterYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allYou are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it allThan it allGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greaterGrace and Mercy found meOh, the blood of Jesus is greater.

I have been thinking and asking
What is it that God wants from us?
Our works or our hearts?
Do we sacrifice our hearts to do works in order to be saved?
Or do we sacrifice our hearts to God because we are saved which leads to works?
Or do we sacrifice our hearts to seek relationship?
What's the focus and what is the correct focus?


Psalms 51:16-17
16 For You do not desire sacrifice, or else I would give it;
You do not delight in burnt offering.
17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,
A broken and a contrite heart—
These, O God, You will not despise.

It seems to me that God just wants our hearts.
The one and only perfect sacrifice happened when Jesus said "It is finished"
The reason being to restore the broken relationship with the Father, forgiveness of sins that blocked the relationship.
So we can cry out Abba Father.

So we sacrifice our hearts based on the ultimate sacrifice of Jesus.
When we do that we do so because we know we have been forgiven, that God loved us so much that Jesus died for us while we were sinners.

We already have the love of God toward us because he wants a relationship.

As a result of that, relationship is what we should seek out of which works will follow.

The focus should be and should never be deflected from this.








 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#55,997
Apr 7, 2014
25,043
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#55,997
VCO said:
Very Nice, we are almost neighbors. I am in Lincoln, Nebraska.
Click to expand...
I’ve been to Omaha Nebraska numerous times. That’s where I first discovered Runza fast food restaurant. :)

DADA22A1-37ED-4318-9EDF-2CAABC663019.jpg
 
BillG

BillG

Senior Member
#55,998
Feb 15, 2017
8,879
4,334
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#55,998
Sorry people I tried to edit the above post of mine, but I ran out of time.

The following is the lyrics not jumble up

I fix my eyes upon the cross Reaching out with all I've gotI'm letting go to start again
I need your love that's why I'm here Waiting outside my life it calls
So while I'm here I'll give my all
You are my peace within the storm
Here at the cross I find my home

You are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it all
You are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it all Than it all
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus, is greater
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus, is greater

I fix my eyes upon the cross
Reaching out with all I've got I'm letting go to start again I need your love that's why I'm here
Waiting outside my life it calls
So while I'm here I'll give my all You are my peace within the storm
Here at the cross I find my home

You are greater, Jesus, You are greater, than it all
You are greater, Jesus, You are greater, than it all
Grace and Mercy found me
Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater
Grace and Mercy found me
Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater

Lord I believe You rose again
So I don't believe this is the end
You never fail, You have a plan
My life You hold within Your hands
So I'll walk by faith and not by sight You are my source, You are my light In You I live, I will not die
You stretched these wings now I can fly

You are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it all
You are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it all Than it all
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater
You are greater, Jesus, You are greater than it all You are greater,
Jesus, You are greater than it all Than it all
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater
Grace and Mercy found me Oh, the blood of Jesus is greater.

I have been thinking and asking
What is it that God wants from us?
Our works or our hearts?
Do we sacrifice our hearts to do works in order to be saved?
Or do we sacrifice our hearts to God because we are saved which leads to works?
Or do we sacrifice our hearts to seek relationship?
What's the focus and what is the correct focus?


Psalms 51:16-17
16 For You do not desire sacrifice, or else I would give it;
You do not delight in burnt offering.
17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit,
A broken and a contrite heart—
These, O God, You will not despise.

It seems to me that God just wants our hearts.
The one and only perfect sacrifice happened when Jesus said "It is finished"
The reason being to restore the broken relationship with the Father, forgiveness of sins that blocked the relationship.
So we can cry out Abba Father.

So we sacrifice our hearts based on the ultimate sacrifice of Jesus.
When we do that we do so because we know we have been forgiven, that God loved us so much that Jesus died for us while we were sinners.

We already have the love of God toward us because he wants a relationship.

As a result of that, relationship is what we should seek out of which works will follow.

The focus should be and should never be deflected from this.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#55,999
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
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113
#55,999
The bible states we are kept by the power of God......and does God fail....NEVER.....for us to lose salvation God must fail....the power of God must fail....the promises of JESUS must fail...Jesus said I WILL NEVER leave thee nor forsake thee....and HE WILL complete the work of FAITH he began IN US....

Those who say we can lose it or forfeit it absolutely reject the above truths and chunk Jesus under the bus!!
 
BillG

BillG

Senior Member
#56,000
Feb 15, 2017
8,879
4,334
113
#56,000
dcontroversal said:
The bible states we are kept by the power of God......and does God fail....NEVER.....for us to lose salvation God must fail....the power of God must fail....the promises of JESUS must fail...Jesus said I WILL NEVER leave thee nor forsake thee....and HE WILL complete the work of FAITH he began IN US....

Those who say we can lose it or forfeit it absolutely reject the above truths and chunk Jesus under the bus!!
Click to expand...
Ah but see, the power of God does fail.
That is why should not fail.

If we do then we are under the same bus.

If only we could trust in Jesus like he did with the Father then we ride in the bus.

My beautiful wife and I were taking earlier on about a situation that has arisen.

I said to her and for me I believe it's true.

"If we could just grasp 1% of the truth then we would be totally different people"
 
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