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Thread: Not By Works

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    How much work does one need to have before they can be saved? None!

    How much work does one need to keep salvation? Wrong question - works is not what keeps you saved!

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    so how much work does one need to have before he is saved, or to keep salvation?

  2. #42
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    You guys talk as if works are totally obsolete and irrelevant.. there not
    as far as BEING saved, They are, No amount of work could ever save us from ONE sin, let alones the millions we are guilty off.

    As far as producing fruit, Your right,

    but something tells me your not talking about that.
    dcontroversal likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Teaching grace only, misleads.. that's all I'm combating
    No this is wrong,

    Teaching WORKS misleads. Because it states one can make it to heaven on his own merit, and works and grace are not something you can mix.
    dcontroversal likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  4. #44
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post

    but something tells me your not talking about that.
    Are you sure?

  5. #45
    Senior Member Grace777x70's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Actually the true teaching of the grace of God is the only thing that teaches us how to deny ungodliness in this present world. Titus 2:11-12

    We are to be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus. 2 Tim. 2:1

    It is grace that gives us the inheritance that is ours in Christ and is able to build us up.

    Acts 20:32 (NASB)
    32 "And now I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and to give you the inheritance among all those who are sanctified.


    The only way we are saved is by the grace of God.

    Acts 15:11 (KJV)
    11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

    We are to fix our hope completely on the grace that is brought to us at the revelation of Christ.


    1 Peter 1:13 (NASB)
    13 Therefore, prepare your minds for action, keep sober in spirit, fix your hope completely on the grace to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ.

    dcontroversal, 20 and Spurgeoncy like this.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Post #35..
    That is misleading, Post 35 is not where you said it.

    Post 19..

    Originally Posted by HisHolly
    You throw out grace like its the subject.. you can count and hope if you want... Faith and walking with Christ produces .. if you have nothing you're doing nothing but reading.. hearer only




    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  7. #47
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Maybe you take it that way.. that's not what I was saying..

    I just repeated what you said.. You said FAITH AND WALKING PRODUCES.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  8. #48
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by Chester View Post
    Are you sure?

    we have had this discussion before. Unless she somehow changed her thinking.. Yes, I am prety sure..(she alwyas gets on me in this subject)

    But then again, I could be wrong,, no one is perfect.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  9. #49
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    No this is wrong,

    Teaching WORKS misleads. Because it states one can make it to heaven on his own merit, and works and grace are not something you can mix.
    Ah, here we go -- now it becomes clear! (To me at least

    Paul taught both grace and he also taught works. (not works as a means to salvation!)

    Ephesians 1-3 give a solid explanation of God's grace. Ephesians 4-6 give a solid explanation of works. When rightly understood and rightly taught they do not contradict.

    But I don't agree that "teaching works misleads"! Paul taught works!

    I do agree that teaching works in a wrong way misleads.
    PeterJens likes this.

  10. #50
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post

    Yes you can throw out works. Unless you think God can not know our faith, God does not need proof, We may, But God does not.
    This is an interesting point.

    In life I have convinced myself I take a particular view on something.
    What I have discovered until I actually do something which corresponds to that view, it
    is just a view.

    So Abraham believed God about his heirs, but this was only proved true when he offered
    Issac to be sacrificed.

    So saying God does not need proof I think is wrong. Nothing is true until proved.
    So many times people appear good friends, but only in hard times do you know who was
    really a friend and who was not.

    Who loves there brother or sister? Someone who wishes someone well or someone who
    actually helps them?

    So we can never separate works and salvation, they are the different sides of the same
    coin.

    The difference here between the groups is should be do good works no matter what,
    on analyse why we do them? I hold we should do them whatever.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

  11. #51
    HisHolly
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Teaching grace only leads to the assumption that folks can do whatever... I've seen it.. #35, you must have a visual if you want to know where you actually stand... Have you heard the true gospel... I never said works save.. I quoted AB believed first.. your something that's telling you, is in your head and it's self-righteousness, pride, to proud to be wrong.. in that you don't take time to understand so you keep your argument going
    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    No this is wrong,

    Teaching WORKS misleads. Because it states one can make it to heaven on his own merit, and works and grace are not something you can mix.

  12. #52
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by Chester View Post
    Ah, here we go -- now it becomes clear! (To me at least

    Paul taught both grace and he also taught works. (not works as a means to salvation!)

    Ephesians 1-3 give a solid explanation of God's grace. Ephesians 4-6 give a solid explanation of works. When rightly understood and rightly taught they do not contradict.

    But I don't agree that "teaching works misleads"! Paul taught works!

    I do agree that teaching works in a wrong way misleads.

    We are talking about salvation. NOT WHAT ONE DOES AFTER THEY ARE SAVED.

    try to keep it in context. ok?

    Teaching works as it relates to salvation is miselading, and will lead peopel away from Christ.

    it is of works, not grace, otherwise grace is no longer grace, those are pauls words.
    dcontroversal likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  13. #53
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post

    we have had this discussion before. Unless she somehow changed her thinking.. Yes, I am prety sure..(she alwyas gets on me in this subject)

    But then again, I could be wrong,, no one is perfect.
    Ah! EG - I like you and your attitude!

  14. #54
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Teaching grace only leads to the assumption that folks can do whatever...
    Nope. If one thinks they can live however they want, they have not repented.

    I've seen it.. #35, you must have a visual if you want to know where you actually stand...
    So we must rely on our work, not Gods promise. THAT Is dangerous. How can one ever have HOPE if they are relying on self?

    Have you heard the true gospel... I never said works save.. I quoted AB believed first.. your something that's telling you, is in your head and it's self-righteousness, pride, to proud to be wrong.. in that you don't take time to understand so you keep your argument going
    Yes I have heard the true gospel.

    Saved by FAITH NOT WORKS..lest anyone should boast.

    Not by works of righteousness WHICH I DID, but By Gods mercy.


    Have you heard the true gospel?
    dcontroversal likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  15. #55
    Senior Member JaumeJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Works will never be anyone's salvation. We are saved by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

    Once we are on the Way, if we are without righteous works, we do not have living faith, for faith without
    works is dead.

    Our zeal by the Holy Spirit after havinng received Him within will not allow any who have
    received the gift of faith to be still.

    When we experience the joy of the infilling of the Holy Spirit pthere are definite indications. Righteous works given us by God, Himself, obedience as best possible, and constant learning in study of the Word in prayer and meditation.

    How will any receive reward in the Kingsom without any works to show for that gift of faith. Faith is likeened unto gold int eh Word. I believe our faith is gold to our Father......we must increase its interest, right?


    Quote Originally Posted by dcontroversal View Post
    It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

    English Standard Version
    he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

    Berean Study Bible
    He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

    Berean Literal Bible
    He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

    New American Standard Bible
    He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

    King James Bible
    Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
    zone likes this.
    From the Mouth of our Lord, Jesus Christ, or do you call Him Yeshua?
    Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


  16. #56
    HisHolly
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Did I comment to you first? I'd have to look back.. if so, I didn't realize you feel as though I target you
    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post

    we have had this discussion before. Unless she somehow changed her thinking.. Yes, I am prety sure..(she alwyas gets on me in this subject)

    But then again, I could be wrong,, no one is perfect.

  17. #57
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Teaching grace only leads to the assumption that folks can do whatever... I've seen it.. #35, you must have a visual if you want to know where you actually stand... Have you heard the true gospel... I never said works save.. I quoted AB believed first.. your something that's telling you, is in your head and it's self-righteousness, pride, to proud to be wrong.. in that you don't take time to understand so you keep your argument going
    ps. Teaching grace PLUS works teaches and leads to phariseeism, religion and legalism. (I know, I grew up in this false hope)


    A child of God walks by faith, not site, He produces works because he is a new creature, not to keep salvation. He needs to be taught to trust in God, not to go out and do works.
    dcontroversal and LaurenTM like this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  18. #58
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace777x70 View Post
    Actually the true teaching of the grace of God is the only thing that teaches us how to deny ungodliness in this present world. Titus 2:11-12
    For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.
    Titus 2:11-14

    We are to live self-controlled, upright, godly lives, Amen.
    Jesus redeems us from all wickedness and purifies us, Amen.

    So why is there such disagreement about living righteously.

    The subtext is you cannot live a godly life or be purified, all is
    actually defiled and those who claim they can are hypocrites.

    So scripture is defied and we are attacked. What a deceptive approach.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

  19. #59
    HisHolly
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    I speak generally.. I wasn't asking you if you have... It how I talk
    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Nope. If one thinks they can live however they want, they have not repented.



    So we must rely on our work, not Gods promise. THAT Is dangerous. How can one ever have HOPE if they are relying on self?



    Yes I have heard the true gospel.

    Saved by FAITH NOT WORKS..lest anyone should boast.

    Not by works of righteousness WHICH I DID, but By Gods mercy.


    Have you heard the true gospel?

  20. #60
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by HisHolly View Post
    Did I comment to you first? I'd have to look back.. if so, I didn't realize you feel as though I target you

    Every time I teach salvation is by faith alone, not works, You seem to come after me.. How else should I feel? and what else would this make me think? Other than you treach we are saved by works..


    Not to mention, you always seem to be defending the ones who PURELY teach that in CC.. (they are not teaching just a child of God should show works, they are teaching their salvation depends on it)

    if you are not, then please forgive me, I have been wrong, and accused you falsely.
    Chester likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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