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Thread: Not By Works

  1. #8801
    Senior Member NoNameMcgee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    I know what point your trying to make. you want me to say they repented, and their salvation was as dependent on this, otherwise they would lose salvation.




    So so the answer is no, you can't live in sin if you are truly a child of God, but remember, just because one claims to be a child does not mean they are
    wrong

    thats not at all the point im trying to make....

    but i completely agree with your answer

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by gb9 View Post
    I'm not sure if it's a lack of understanding, it seems to be a backward understanding. many churches and denominations teach that we have to be " good " people, so that God will accept us. this is FALSE. no one can be " good " enough to get into the Kingdom.

    and people that have been taught " be good, get in ", have a hard time grasping the concept of grace salvation ( Titus 3 ). to them, it sounds like a free pass. ( but we know is not ).
    That's why they are so judgmental. And hate grace and people who tech it, it negates all their hard work and claims it was useless,

    and untilthey realise it is useless ( In determining their saved state) they will never understand it
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    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by NoNameMcgee View Post
    wrong

    thats not at all the point im trying to make....

    but i completely agree with your answer
    forgive me then it sure seemed that way, I do not like to focus on sin, I like to focus on grace, we all have sinned, non of us deserve eternal life more than the other. When people try to focus on sin, I get suspicious.

    But again, forgive me
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    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    That's why they are so judgmental. And hate grace and people who tech it, it negates all their hard work and claims it was useless,

    and untilthey realise it is useless ( In determining their saved state) they will never understand it
    It is a blindness and the truth is we have all had it in some degree and still have it in certain truths but as we trust in the Lord for the Holy Spirit that is in us to reveal the things of God and of Christ to us - we will "see" as we should for the reality of the things that already "are".
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Jaime, NO ONE HERE has said, or is saying, that we can sin all we want after we're saved. We are saying that WORKS DO NOT SAVE US. It's that simple, even a kid can understand. No matter how many works we do, they DO NOT give us salvation, nor keep us saved.

    For whatever crazy reasons they have, some here refuse to believe that works don't save us, even though the bible SPECIFICALLY says they don't..


    Quote Originally Posted by NoNameMcgee View Post
    this thread is more hostile and silly than it is helpful at this point .... heres a question for the cake takers (works earn salvation)
    AND those who believe they have fire insurance... a lets sin get out of hell free card (faith without works)


    if it dont apply let it fly
    this aint for true lovers of God


    if you have faith
    which creates works in you
    someone spikes your water with drugs
    leaves you open to demonic influence, so much so you fall into fornication with a vile woman or man who offends you to the point you push them...
    they fall crack their head and die
    you go to run but not being sober lose your footing fall and die too (crazy scenerio i know i know)

    where do you go?

    heaven or hell
    gb9 likes this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    forgive me then it sure seemed that way, I do not like to focus on sin, I like to focus on grace, we all have sinned, non of us deserve eternal life more than the other. When people try to focus on sin, I get suspicious.

    But again, forgive me
    im not at all offended man i can see how you would think that

    also the question mainly for people who have a buncha cake stacked up

    or a brand new shiny get outta hell free card

    lol

    you used understanding and scripture after ur innitial response


    i only double checked because based on your first answer i wasnt sure if you had a shiny card or not

    but you seem to know God

    i appreciate you answering me haha

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Warning warning

    Once you repent of your sin, though you commit sin again you do not have to repent
    of it again, because it is already forgiven, except you did not know you would commit it
    so it must be a magic automatic repeat blanket repentance.

    So if as a child you repent of your sins, when you grow up as a homicidal maniac, these
    are forgiven, even though you had no clue this would happen, or any commitment to stop
    it or the consequences or what to do about it. It is like you gain forgiveness for a stranger.
    Maybe forgiveness of the future self, is the same as forgiveness for everyone.
    And so mr universalism arrives, no one is going to hell, they will all be saved, because people
    are not really that bad, a quick step of faith, a quick prayer, new hearts, done deal. God to
    fly..... lol....smh some people will believe anything to appease guilt.

    Sin and repentance...

    If any member of the community sins unintentionally and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, when they realize their guilt and the sin they have committed becomes known, they must bring as their offering for the sin they committed a female goat without defect.
    Lev 4:27-28

    Knowing individual sin and dealing with it is important to God.
    Repentance is not a general all in the pot job, it is working through ones sins
    and resolving them, commiting to walk in love and Gods ways.

    Ofcourse if you want blanket forgiveness and a once off repentance, this
    reality has to be ignored. This is why it is unbiblical nonsense.

    It does not make sense because dealing theft is different than dealing with
    murder.
    Seohce likes this.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

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    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Get outta here with your "salvation is a magic wand" and "magic repentance" bunk.. God is not a genie in a bottle and you're bordering on blasphemy, IMO..


    CHRISTIANS STILL SIN SOMETIMES. There, I said it, for all who don't want to accept it, to see..Let the "burn the heretic" comments begin. :/ Since y'all like posting those stupid frickin' memes.

    CHRISTIANS SIN. Deal with it...


    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Warning warning

    Once you repent of your sin, though you commit sin again you do not have to repent
    of it again, because it is already forgiven, except you did not know you would commit it
    so it must be a magic automatic repeat blanket repentance.

    So if as a child you repent of your sins, when you grow up as a homicidal maniac, these
    are forgiven, even though you had no clue this would happen, or any commitment to stop
    it or the consequences or what to do about it. It is like you gain forgiveness for a stranger.
    Maybe forgiveness of the future self, is the same as forgiveness for everyone.
    And so mr universalism arrives, no one is going to hell, they will all be saved, because people
    are not really that bad, a quick step of faith, a quick prayer, new hearts, done deal. God to
    fly..... lol....smh some people will believe anything to appease guilt.

    Sin and repentance...

    If any member of the community sins unintentionally and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, when they realize their guilt and the sin they have committed becomes known, they must bring as their offering for the sin they committed a female goat without defect.
    Lev 4:27-28

    Knowing individual sin and dealing with it is important to God.
    Repentance is not a general all in the pot job, it is working through ones sins
    and resolving them, commiting to walk in love and Gods ways.

    Ofcourse if you want blanket forgiveness and a once off repentance, this
    reality has to be ignored. This is why it is unbiblical nonsense.

    It does not make sense because dealing theft is different than dealing with
    murder.
    gb9 likes this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by NoNameMcgee View Post
    im not at all offended man i can see how you would think that

    also the question mainly for people who have a buncha cake stacked up

    or a brand new shiny get outta hell free card

    lol

    you used understanding and scripture after ur innitial response


    i only double checked because based on your first answer i wasnt sure if you had a shiny card or not

    but you seem to know God

    i appreciate you answering me haha
    Better to ask than assume that you for that, I should have asked also.. I need to practice what I Preach, good lesson for me to learn and repent from..
    NoNameMcgee likes this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member PeterJens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    warning, warning

    You are not allowed to sin as much as you like, only you will never
    resolve your sin issues because God and Christ never brought us victory,
    or real purity or holiness or reality, it is always hypocracy and failure until
    we meet him, just realising it more and more each day.

    This belief is called total inability, and has dominated reformed thought for centuries.

    The claim is Christ can save us despite our continued sinning.
    I would ask, surely if Christ went to the Cross it is because He can bring real righteousness,
    love and victory into our lives when we follow Him.

    Now when you discover the same people who preach defeat hate the sermon on the mount
    as a passage of condemnation and not spiritual inspiration, you begin to see the real picture.

    And the real focus needs to be on love, the love Christ gave us through the cross flowing
    out to others, except for different groups, it does not seem to be flowing.

    Who is Christ to you? Is He the bringer of life and love to our souls through the Holy Spirit?
    Amen, glory to God, for He overcame sin and death, our living example of the path we must
    follow.
    Seohce likes this.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    Get outta here with your "salvation is a magic wand" and "magic repentance" bunk.. God is not a genie in a bottle and you're bordering on blasphemy, IMO..


    CHRISTIANS STILL SIN SOMETIMES. There, I said it, for all who don't want to accept it, to see..Let the "burn the heretic" comments begin. :/ Since y'all like posting those stupid frickin' memes.

    CHRISTIANS SIN. Deal with it...
    Funny but I do not post such things, this is the opposition on your side, smh

    And the magic wand is pass to heaven without collecting a righteous walk
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    Get outta here with your "salvation is a magic wand" and "magic repentance" bunk.. God is not a genie in a bottle and you're bordering on blasphemy, IMO..


    CHRISTIANS STILL SIN SOMETIMES. There, I said it, for all who don't want to accept it, to see..Let the "burn the heretic" comments begin. :/ Since y'all like posting those stupid frickin' memes.

    CHRISTIANS SIN. Deal with it...
    2 Timothy 3

    3 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.

    2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

    3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,

    4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;

    5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

    6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
    PeterJens and Seohce like this.

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Warning warning

    Once you repent of your sin, though you commit sin again you do not have to repent
    of it again, because it is already forgiven, except you did not know you would commit it
    so it must be a magic automatic repeat blanket repentance.

    So if as a child you repent of your sins, when you grow up as a homicidal maniac, these
    are forgiven, even though you had no clue this would happen, or any commitment to stop
    it or the consequences or what to do about it. It is like you gain forgiveness for a stranger.
    Maybe forgiveness of the future self, is the same as forgiveness for everyone.
    And so mr universalism arrives, no one is going to hell, they will all be saved, because people
    are not really that bad, a quick step of faith, a quick prayer, new hearts, done deal. God to
    fly..... lol....smh some people will believe anything to appease guilt.

    Sin and repentance...

    If any member of the community sins unintentionally and does what is forbidden in any of the Lord’s commands, when they realize their guilt and the sin they have committed becomes known, they must bring as their offering for the sin they committed a female goat without defect.
    Lev 4:27-28

    Knowing individual sin and dealing with it is important to God.
    Repentance is not a general all in the pot job, it is working through ones sins
    and resolving them, commiting to walk in love and Gods ways.

    Ofcourse if you want blanket forgiveness and a once off repentance, this
    reality has to be ignored. This is why it is unbiblical nonsense.

    It does not make sense because dealing theft is different than dealing with
    murder.
    thanks peter, more proof your trying to save yourself and not let God save you,

    we repent of sin, of being guilty, of our pride that covers it all. Because in repenting, we also acknowledge we have no hope apart from Christ, because we know we will continue to fail to live to his standard,

    so in Reality, we are asking God (who knows our every thought and action from birth to death as if it had already happened) to save us KNOWING ever sin we will commit from this day forward, even if we do not know it, because he is the all merciful God, and promises to save us forever based on his sons work, not our own.

    see this way, when w do sin, we realisem wow, God saved me KNOWING I would do that sin, what an awesome God he is, and what a wretched soul I am, thank you God for forgiving me, help me next time to have more strength,

    thanksgiving and and gratitude for god unfailing love is what causes us to love hose who sin against us, because we are not innocent, look at what we are forgive, that is what empowers our live, which empowers our Christian growth,m

    not laws, not religion, not repenting every time we THINK we have sinned and thinking that makes us holy.. I personally think God sits in heaven and screams NOOOOO! That is not what I want, you got it all wrong" every time someon does that. It is based on Pride, not humility

    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  14. #8814


    gb9
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Funny but I do not post such things, this is the opposition on your side, smh

    And the magic wand is pass to heaven without collecting a righteous walk
    to further what blue said, YOU sin. speak the truth about. or continue to live in denial.

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    At the bottom of the day, when we take that last breath, and our times of choosing are over, then it will be up to God to decide where we go and what kind of a judgment we will have. In my mind I can see people in utter shock when they realize God is not going to let them into Heaven. In this life I know one thing for sure, in this realm God has given us the opportunity to be forgiven if we repent and ask for forgiveness in Jesus name, I plan on using that gift from God all I can...while I can. Also, what pleases God is for us to walk in truth, be certain that it is the truth of God and not some fabricated pseudo truth.
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    There is only one sin that cannot be forgiven. Blaspheming the Holy Spirit.
    This means refusing THE GOSPEL. If you WILL die, and refuse the ONLY cure that saves you, you have blasphemed the Holy Spirit.
    So it's silly to talk about any other sin sending someone to hell.
    Now for those that don't understand Grace, this seems like an endorsement of sin.
    We can tell them til we're blue in the face, but until the Holy Spirit reveals this Truth to them, as He did to me, they will continue to kick against the goads.
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Let us get real about life. As children we learn it is infinitely complex and sometimes very simple.

    Not all the issues are dealt with in one day which is why we spend 12 years in school, and often
    3 years at university. And we are still pretty dumb at the end.

    So in one realisation of God and our need, reaching out to God in repentance and faith is all
    there ever needs to be? Nope.
    It is why we have a bible of 66 books with vast issues and complexities touched on but not
    resolved.

    Ofcourse the one off zappers brigade want to condemn as leading you to hell anything that
    says we have a walk, a progression, a relationship. But just look at the life you are born into,
    everything is a walk, nothing is zap you have arrived. If you want a definative statement,
    those who claim it is a simple single event are always going to be wrong. Events are beginnings
    with a lead up and consequences that roll from them, but they acknowledge the flow and progress
    always looking forward to the next step.
    Seohce likes this.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by gb9 View Post
    to further what blue said, YOU sin. speak the truth about. or continue to live in denial.
    Odd. I have not said I do not sin in the past, I do not know about the future, that is in Gods
    hands. I cannot deny what I have not said.

    Let us put this in context, some have said they sin every second of the day, which means
    they are not free from sin ever and the cross means nothing.

    This is how confused some are.
    Seohce likes this.
    I share "Jesus Christ and him crucified" 1 cor 2:2
    "He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 cor 15:57

    The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you

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    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not By Works

    I never said YOU post such memes. And no matter how you spin it, salvation is not a magic wand.. We all sin, you included. I sinned earlier this morning when I swore. YES *gasp* I SINNED. lol.. I admit it, why can't you??


    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Funny but I do not post such things, this is the opposition on your side, smh

    And the magic wand is pass to heaven without collecting a righteous walk
    gb9 likes this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



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    Default Re: Not By Works

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Let us get real about life. As children we learn it is infinitely complex and sometimes very simple.

    Not all the issues are dealt with in one day which is why we spend 12 years in school, and often
    3 years at university. And we are still pretty dumb at the end.

    So in one realisation of God and our need, reaching out to God in repentance and faith is all
    there ever needs to be? Nope.
    It is why we have a bible of 66 books with vast issues and complexities touched on but not
    resolved.

    Ofcourse the one off zappers brigade want to condemn as leading you to hell anything that
    says we have a walk, a progression, a relationship. But just look at the life you are born into,
    everything is a walk, nothing is zap you have arrived. If you want a definative statement,
    those who claim it is a simple single event are always going to be wrong. Events are beginnings
    with a lead up and consequences that roll from them, but they acknowledge the flow and progress
    always looking forward to the next step.
    Yeah let's get real,


    peter jeans has, is and will continue to sin and fall short of the glory of God, as will EG, as will every other man woman and child who is living today, has lived in the past, and is yet to be born.

    for this reason, God sent his son, to redeem us from our sin, to restore us to the relationship broke when sin entered the world, and to prove to all creation his unfathonable love, that whoever places their faith in him will not perish into everlasting darkness, but be granted eternal life in Christ, sealed by the HOLY SPIRIT.

    christ being seeded at the right hand of God, makes intercessionwhen the accuser accuses us, he does not say wait, EG has not yet repented, wait for it,,wait forever r it there EG repented of that sin, now I can intercede on his behalf.

    no when the accuser comes, he said, yes EG sinned, and I payed for it on the cross, and I forgave knowing he would do that sin, so satan, please tell me something I do not know,,next!

    I pray ray for you Peter, I pray one day you see it mm the lighbulb goes on, and your like , wow. Ok I get it..
    PennEd and mailmandan like this.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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