the righteous

[PeterJens]

Can a believer come to faith in Jesus, through knowing Jesus and the cross,
having a deep conviction of sin, repenting, putting their faith in Christ for
the forgiveness of their sins, start walking in love and obedience to Christ
end up in works salvation?


My answer would be no.

Many people grow up in churches and absorb the culture trying very hard to
be obedient and put on a show. They are prime targets for works salvation.

Others join a church where conforming is all that matters and sin or conviction is not
a problem, it is just praise and grace, They are prime targets for works salvation.


Others join a church who live the nice life, and all their friends christian or
otherwise are nice people. They are prime targets for works salvation.


Now those who are redeemed sinners, who abide in Christ and walk in love
they are the fulfillment of the promise, they are our example, the goal to
which we should be desiring to walk. Amen.

Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. The one who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous. 8 The one who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil’s work.
1 John 3:7-8

You are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.
1 Peter 2:9

 

[dcontroversal]

For he who had not known sin made himself to become sin in your place, that we would become the righteousness of God in him.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed unto ALL who believe

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

 

[Grace777x70]

For he who had not known sin made himself to become sin in your place, that we would become the righteousness of God in him.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed unto ALL who believe

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Amen...

Not understanding the gift of righteousness that comes by grace through faith alone in Christ's finished work is the basis for all "works-based mindsets".

They like Israel and are trying to do things to maintain and create righteousness and in doing so they stumble over Christ Himself as He is the stumbling stone in this matter.

Romans 1:17-17 = the gospel where the righteousness of God is revealed

Romans 5:17 = the gift of righteousness along with the abundance of grace.

Romans 5:21 = grace reigns or rules in righteousness - not understanding the gift of righteousness will stop grace from operating in our lives like it should.

Romans 10:1-10 = Israel ( an example for all works-based mindsets ) trying to "obtain and maintain" righteousness.

Romans 9:30-33 = People stumbling over the stumbling stone of Christ in the area of understanding righteousness.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Can a believer come to faith in Jesus, through knowing Jesus and the cross, having a deep conviction of sin, repenting, putting their faith in Christ for
the forgiveness of their sins, start walking in love and obedience to Christ
end up in works salvation?

My answer would be no.

Interesting that you question, and answer that question with "no", but then provide examples that answer your question "yes".


So it appears that in 3 of the 4 scenarios the answer is "yes" a believer can come to faith in Christ and end up in works salvation.


Does this mean that those who find themselves in the "yes" category are no longer born again?

 

[mailmandan]

Romans 4:4 - Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. 5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

 

[PeterJens]

Interesting that you question, and answer that question with "no", but then provide examples that answer your question "yes".


So it appears that in 3 of the 4 scenarios the answer is "yes" a believer can come to faith in Christ and end up in works salvation.


Does this mean that those who find themselves in the "yes" category are no longer born again?

My experience is these people never came to faith and do not understand
repentance. Most people who go to church never are asked to give a testimony
or personally work through what is faith, so fall between the cracks.

When you start talking to them what comes out is often completely random.

 

[PeterJens]

If you come to Christ in a real way, you do not end up in works salvation.
It is impossible. To know Christ is to know the gulf between His glorious
life and love, and the imeasurable nature of the gift of the cross and forgiveness
any work or action is just an offering to the King as a response to His love.

 

[Grace777x70]

Galatians 3:1-3 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

[SUP]2 [/SUP] This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

[SUP]3 [/SUP] Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

 

[dcontroversal]

Galatians 3:1-3 (KJV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

[SUP]2 [/SUP] This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

[SUP]3 [/SUP] Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Love the play on "another" in verses 6-8 in chapter 1.....a gospel of a different kind, double cursed and no power to save...

Faith + works for salvation ^

 

[PeterJens]

You got to notice - Galatians talking about becoming full Jews with circumcision
being applied to believers who say we should walk doing the right things, ie
in righteousness.

Now if Peter, Paul and John say we should walk in purity, holiness and without sin
you might think this message may get through this is not legalism or putting yourself
under the law, but actually walking in the light without sin.

But then to those who do not know what righteousness or walking in the light is,
everything is darkness and failure, so for them they have no choice they have to
excuse their sin and make it appear it is irrelevant or even against Christ to say
we are called to be clean and pure.

What sin do they find so hard to shake off with the love of Christ?
Maybe they do not have this love, so obviously they have no answer!!!

 

[reneweddaybyday]

My experience is these people never cam to faith and do not understand repentance. Most people who go to church never are asked to give a testimony or personally work through what is faith, so fall between the cracks.

When you start talking to them what comes out is often completely random.

ok. I misunderstood the OP. In the first 3 scenarios, there never was salvation, and no amount of works will bring about salvation.

 

[PeterJens]

ok. I misunderstood the OP. In the first 3 scenarios, there never was salvation, and no amount of works will bring about salvation.

I agree. The point I am making is suggesting people who understand salvation,
who walk with Christ are not the people to preach anti-salvation by works concepts
at, because they are the people most likely to know exactly what walking with the
Lord is.

So people who understand faith and desire to walk in righteousness, halleluyah,
they are the people we want to encourage and walk as brothers and sisters with.
This is the heart of God, it is what Jesus came to die for so that this is possible.

 

[PeterJens]

So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us.
God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
1 John 4:16