The Lie of the Prosperity Gospel

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peacenik

Senior Member
May 11, 2016
3,071
26
38
#21
We all recall the story of the rich young man (also known as the rich young ruler) and how Jesus told him that he could be saved if he sold his possessions and gave to the poor. St Louis de Monfort taught that this was proof one should love poverty. Indeed, many churches have taught this over the centuries. However, they failed to understand that just a few verses after the young man left Jesus's side, the Messiah said that had he given money to the poor, he would have had a 100 fold increase: Matt 19:29; Mark 10:30. That among these increases were "houses and lands" which are materiality. Therefore, there is some truth to prosperity gospel teaching. It is a sign of divine grace. However, it brings an obligation to be generous towards the less fortunate.
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#22
We all recall the story of the rich young man (also known as the rich young ruler) and how Jesus told him that he could be saved if he sold his possessions and gave to the poor. St Louis de Monfort taught that this was proof one should love poverty. Indeed, many churches have taught this over the centuries.
Since Jesus never saying he could be saved if he sold all his possessions but in consideration of the Parable of the Sower, it does follow.

Mark 4:14-20
14 The sower soweth the word.
15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.
16 And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness;
17 And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended.
18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,
19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.
20 And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some an hundred.

The young ruler asked how to inherit eternal life, seeing that a person without treasure in heaven is the poorest of all since the days of the flesh are only a hundred and twenty years, you can search the scriptures like Jesus said, "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me." Since the eternal doesn't have a beginning, or birth seeing that the eternal is that which has always been, which is and which will alway be then marvel not you must be reborn to become eternal.

And wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times, and strength of salvation: the fear of the LORD is his treasure.
Isa 33:6

However, they failed to understand that just a few verses after the young man left Jesus's side, the Messiah said that had he given money to the poor, he would have had a 100 fold increase: Matt 19:29; Mark 10:30.
Maybe you failed to understand no prophesy of scripture is of any private interpretation since one who receives the seed of the Sower receives treasure in heaven.

Whosoever shall receive one of such children in my name, receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me, receiveth not me, but him that sent me. Mark 9:37

And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. Matt 19:29

For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding. Prov 2:6

And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's, But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

Mark 10:29-30

The blessing of the LORD, it maketh rich, and he addeth no sorrow with it. Prov 10:22

That among these increases were "houses and lands" which are materiality. Therefore, there is some truth to prosperity gospel teaching. It is a sign of divine grace. However, it brings an obligation to be generous towards the less fortunate.
For the poor always ye have with you; but me ye have not always. John 12:8

Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. John 12:35
 
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peacenik

Senior Member
May 11, 2016
3,071
26
38
#23
So I guess you are saying that there is at least some truth to the idea of "prosperity gospel".
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#24
I think it prosperity comes with the gospel, and if the gospel be hid it is hid to them that are lost.

Wealth gotten by vanity shall be diminished: but he that gathereth by labour shall increase. Prov 13:11

Treasures of wickedness profit nothing: but righteousness delivereth from death. Proverbs 10:2


Labour not to be rich: cease from thine own wisdom .Prov 23:4


18 Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.
19 My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.
20 I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment:
Prov 8:18-20


The rich and poor meet together: the LORD is the maker of them all.Prov 22:2
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
3,198
303
83
#25
I believe there is no such thing as a "prosperity gospel" But the Gospel causes prosperity and God's favor in all ways to the believer. How could being IN Christ bring anything but blessings in every area of our lives?

Today's devotional I read this morning is a good example.


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[TD="class: yiv3271144020mcnTextContent, align: center"]So Ruth the Moabitess said to Naomi, “Please let me go to the field, and glean heads of grain after him in whose sight I may find favor.” And she said to her, “Go, my daughter.”
Ruth 2:2[/TD]
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[TD="class: yiv3271144020mcnTextContent"]- FEBRUARY 18 -
BEAT THE ODDS WITH THE FAVOR OF GOD


[HR][/HR]Do you look at yourself and see only lack in the natural? Do you say, “I don’t have a good education”, “I am poor”, “I am too old” or “I am a divorcee”? I have good news for you. As a blood-bought believer and child of God, you have the supernatural favor of God!

In the Bible, Ruth was a poor Moabite widow who went with her mother-in-law to live in Bethlehem, a Jewish town where the inhabitants considered Moabites outcasts. But she did not wallow in self-pity and moan about being a poor widow of the wrong race in the wrong place. Instead, she believed that God would favor her and she declared, “I will find favor in the field that I glean from.”

In the natural, Ruth had everything going against her. But because she trusted in the favor of God, she not only became the wife of Bethlehem’s richest man when Boaz married her, she also became the great-grandmother of David and had her name included in the genealogy of Jesus Christ even though she was not a Jewess! That is what God’s supernatural favor did for her. That is the kind of blessing God’s supernatural favor can give you.

A church member shared how, due to unforeseen circumstances, she was late for a job interview. But she confessed God’s favor on herself before the interview and miraculously, the interviewers shortlisted her for a second interview.

There were about 40 other applicants with the right experience. And though she lacked the relevant experience, by the favor of God, she got the job which came with better pay and a car allowance that fully subsidized her car loan. Her new company was even willing to pay for her petrol and cell phone expenses—all because she believed and confessed that she had the favor of God!

Do not look at what you do not have in the natural and see lack. Trust in the favor of God and you will see blessings which your natural abilities cannot bring!

Taken from Destined To Reign Devotional Pastor Joseph Prince.[/TD]
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The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want... When He is my portion, all these other things are added on. He loves to bless His children with good things. Amen.

 

Enow

Banned
Dec 21, 2012
2,901
39
0
#26
I believe there is no such thing as a "prosperity gospel" But the Gospel causes prosperity and God's favor in all ways to the believer. How could being IN Christ bring anything but blessings in every area of our lives?

Today's devotional I read this morning is a good example.


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[TD="class: yiv3271144020mcnTextContent, align: center"]So Ruth the Moabitess said to Naomi, “Please let me go to the field, and glean heads of grain after him in whose sight I may find favor.” And she said to her, “Go, my daughter.”
Ruth 2:2[/TD]
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[TD="class: yiv3271144020mcnTextContent"]- FEBRUARY 18 -
BEAT THE ODDS WITH THE FAVOR OF GOD


[HR][/HR]Do you look at yourself and see only lack in the natural? Do you say, “I don’t have a good education”, “I am poor”, “I am too old” or “I am a divorcee”? I have good news for you. As a blood-bought believer and child of God, you have the supernatural favor of God!

In the Bible, Ruth was a poor Moabite widow who went with her mother-in-law to live in Bethlehem, a Jewish town where the inhabitants considered Moabites outcasts. But she did not wallow in self-pity and moan about being a poor widow of the wrong race in the wrong place. Instead, she believed that God would favor her and she declared, “I will find favor in the field that I glean from.”

In the natural, Ruth had everything going against her. But because she trusted in the favor of God, she not only became the wife of Bethlehem’s richest man when Boaz married her, she also became the great-grandmother of David and had her name included in the genealogy of Jesus Christ even though she was not a Jewess! That is what God’s supernatural favor did for her. That is the kind of blessing God’s supernatural favor can give you.

A church member shared how, due to unforeseen circumstances, she was late for a job interview. But she confessed God’s favor on herself before the interview and miraculously, the interviewers shortlisted her for a second interview.

There were about 40 other applicants with the right experience. And though she lacked the relevant experience, by the favor of God, she got the job which came with better pay and a car allowance that fully subsidized her car loan. Her new company was even willing to pay for her petrol and cell phone expenses—all because she believed and confessed that she had the favor of God!

Do not look at what you do not have in the natural and see lack. Trust in the favor of God and you will see blessings which your natural abilities cannot bring!

Taken from Destined To Reign Devotional Pastor Joseph Prince.[/TD]
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The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want... When He is my portion, all these other things are added on. He loves to bless His children with good things. Amen.


Ecclesiastes 9:[SUP]10 [/SUP]Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.[SUP]11 [/SUP]I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

The point about the falsehood of the prosperity gospel is when ministries use it as a means to get donations. They promote the idea that if you give, God will multiply it and meet your needs & exceed them. And yet God would have us be content with what we have, and not be in wantonness, and it is in that truth that such hype for donations goes against His word.

When God prefer a cheerful giver as it is between him & God and nobody else's business, then ministries should be looking to God to raise up cheerful givers to provide for the ministries and not some fancy sales pitch which is none other than looking to the giver to give to get God's blessings out of the spirit of covetousness. That can never be right.
 
S

Sully

Guest
#27
I prefer the cheap seats personally. Just feels wrong knocking God's creations over to get a front row seat. But, it's not "normal" not to push others down that they might climb.
 
Jun 1, 2016
5,032
121
0
#28
You have all heard it; if you give, God will multiply your gift a thousand fold, because God wants you to prosper.

Not Biblical. In fact, the Bible in the N.T. speaks against it.

1 Timothy 6:[SUP]3 [/SUP]If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;[SUP]4 [/SUP]He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,[SUP]5 [/SUP]Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.[SUP]6 [/SUP]But godliness with contentment is great gain.[SUP]7 [/SUP]For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.[SUP]8 [/SUP]And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.[SUP]9 [/SUP]But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.[SUP]10 [/SUP]For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.[SUP]11 [/SUP]But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.[SUP]12 [/SUP]Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.[SUP]13 [/SUP]I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;[SUP]14 [/SUP]That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

So stop giving to those covetous men that hardly lead by example when they live in the lap of luxury by such givings.

Ask the Lord Jesus Christ for help to forgive them because I am sure the devil may be tempting you to hate them and wish them ill will for misleading you to believe that God will bless you by your giving and yet you are still suffering, if not moreso, for having given it when you need it more than that ministry does.

Seek help from your local church in communicating your needs to them if you are hurting more than ever because you had given.

Philippians 4:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Rejoice in the Lord always: and again I say, Rejoice.[SUP]5 [/SUP]Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand.[SUP]6 [/SUP]Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.[SUP]7 [/SUP]And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.[SUP]9 [/SUP]Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.[SUP]10 [/SUP]But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly, that now at the last your care of me hath flourished again; wherein ye were also careful, but ye lacked opportunity.[SUP]11 [/SUP]Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.[SUP]12 [/SUP]I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.[SUP]13 [/SUP]I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.[SUP]14 [/SUP]Notwithstanding ye have well done, that ye did communicate with my affliction.

If you had died, would you want your spouse & children to seek help from the church? Then you must swallow your pride and ask the church you go to for help by example. You should communicate your immediate needs to the church and not just pray to the Lord for help in meeting what you need.

As it is, the secret for being content is to think on positive things on what you have to give the Father thanks in Jesus's name and if you can't, then ask Him to help you with that too, because Paul suffered need as well and have gone through it to set the example for the rest of us to lean on Christ to strengthen us thru those times.

Never once did Paul teach giving as a means to multiply what you have given to solve your lack of provision, let alone for personal gain.

Giving to the poor and needy is our place, according to what we have in the new testament. i have always detested the prosperity "gospel" because it lacks the focus of giving to the poor and the obligation we have to do so. even from the Law of moses foreward God has always been about helping the poor among us. Some are blessed financially, those are requiored to give more not to already wealthy ministries, but to the needs of those around us in Gods Name. isaiah 58 is a good reference point, and of course the Judgement seat of Christ. some are blessed in money, but others are not because God knows they cant handle it. faithful with little will be blessed with much.

I hate the messages like rod parsley always His sermons turn into How God told Him if you give just 300 dollars, or evenb a thousand or whatever amount he "heard" God tell him then you will receive a special blessing. i cant understand why He is a mega pastor, and what is worse is He building bible colleges based on his twised version of the gospel. God does promise reward for giving, TO THE POOR and needy among us, in His name. from o.t. to n.t. that promise is there. it doesnt always mean well "reap a harvest" or riches, but those treasures in Heaven are far more.

proverbs 19:17 "He that hath pity upon the poor lendeth unto the LORD; and that which he hath given will he pay him again."


a consistant theme in Gods word from the Law to Paul
 
Jun 1, 2016
5,032
121
0
#29
Not when it is written further that the Macedonians wanted to supply his needs to minister to others. Paul was bragging about them of their charity that way too, even though he felt that he did not deserve it since it is God that ministers and not himself... which is probably why he felt like he was robbing them.

So no... not the typical covetous type of robbing that you are thinking of when reading that verse alone, but f you take all the verses in light of that topic, you can guess why Paul felt undeserving of that support when it is God causing the increase, but God allowed it because He is the One raising up cheerful givers for His ministry thru Paul.

Paul is hardly demanding any one to give to himself, and hardly preaching that if any one gives, God will increase what he has given which is what the prosperity gospel is about.

And Paul is hardly living in the lap of luxury as those teleministries that use the "prosperity gospel" for.



Hah. Look at those that receive for preaching the prosperity gospel. Pot calling kettle black.

So no. You cannot defend them with Jesus's words as if Jesus was talking about giving up everything on earth to the ministry as if that is how you not lay up treasures on earth and therefore by laying up treasures for yourself in Heaven.

There is such a thing as a rich christian.

1 Timothy 6:[SUP]17 [/SUP]Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not highminded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy;[SUP]18 [/SUP]That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate;[SUP]19 [/SUP]Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.

If there wasn't a thing such as a rich christian, James would not have to write this letter to the churches about how the churches that were mistreating the poor in showing favoritism to the rich as James 2nd chapter talks about that abuse, thus validating that a christian can be rich even in church.

So have you given up everything? No. You can never say that because you still have your computer, your electricity, and thus a place to live for you to be typing here trying to defend the prosperity gospel when television ministry that uses the prosperity gospel for conning donations can never avoid the appearance of covetousness as they live in luxury.

theres sooo much about Love that is equated to giving to help the poor. also it is very effective to share the gospel. for instance if we have plenty and maybe know an elderly widow at our church, or a single mother we Know struggles and again if we are able maybe pay a monthly bill or something, or fill thier fridge with food once a month. I have noticed when you are actively Loving people that way, they are much more open to praying with them, and sharing scripture...they also tend to open up a bit more. i think it helps to show them you arent a hypocrite or a self righteous person preaching at them.


I believe in regard to harvesting, that if we turn our ability to help Gods poor people all around us, that He will always provide for our needs. im not saying hell make us rich, but when we develope a truly generous Heart, Those are they who He wills have blessed ability in that area. because He knows it will serve much good and real help to someone who has a real need, is powerful even small things like a water bill you can pay for someone who is losing thier water, or electricity. we chould always look for ways to help others, and share the Word in truth and Love.


Great op something people should really examine
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
3,198
303
83
#30
Ecclesiastes 9:[SUP]10 [/SUP]Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.[SUP]11 [/SUP]I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

The point about the falsehood of the prosperity gospel is when ministries use it as a means to get donations. They promote the idea that if you give, God will multiply it and meet your needs & exceed them. And yet God would have us be content with what we have, and not be in wantonness, and it is in that truth that such hype for donations goes against His word.

When God prefer a cheerful giver as it is between him & God and nobody else's business, then ministries should be looking to God to raise up cheerful givers to provide for the ministries and not some fancy sales pitch which is none other than looking to the giver to give to get God's blessings out of the spirit of covetousness. That can never be right.


The thing about money is it represents a lot going on in a person's life. How you get it., what you do with it when you get it. It represents to the world people's value of time and work done by an individual so much so that the world judges you based on how much of it you have. Money is a major thing everyone thinks about but for some reason don't want to talk about and consider an unapproachable subject.

But the church of all places should teach believers how God thinks about money therefore showing us how we should think about money. It's a pastors responsibility to not fear going 'there' despite the "tabu" of our community and society at large.

Ecclesiastes 9:[SUP]10 [/SUP]Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.[SUP]11 [/SUP]I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

This is true but has to be seen in it's proper context. Eccl. is speaking from a man's viewpoint who has seen life without God. All is vanity. Time and chance are the way unsaved man sees life. Yes, this is true. But should not be the way us believers see and live 'our' lives. We have God the Father and Jesus righteousness and therefore covered by Him when we trust Him. We can put ourselves outside of His blessings by refusing to believe but we are still His sons with access to them at all times.

I believe in the reaping and sowing being in the realm of money. Where I sow is where and what I will reap. But God is so generous and I'm learning more and more about how to use money. I've never had any so it's a new concept. But time and time again He has shown me that if I trust Him for the opportunities in life He brings in finances. It is not coming from me and my striving but from Him.

Although I'm going to work, He provided the job and the money. He provides learning on the job and meeting people on the job and opportunities to learn how to tell about Jesus. There is more to the job than money but that's part of it.

Where the money is put is evidence on what is being trusting in. How precious the money is to a person tells if them if they're more interested in money or in the One who provides it. It's a lesson for us for sure. We humans think we are in charge of our lives when it's God Who is. He sets up jobs for us and gives us favor with people when we give Him place to do so.

I've found He can make a bag of dog food last longer than normal anytime He wants. He does that with many things since He is God. We don't have to fight like the world to get a head. He will make a way for us when we trust Him. He likes to show miracles in a million different ways.

He provides much better than we ever could. I don't know about all ministries but there are some that are not trying to steal from people. I've seen the world and it's their goal in life to find ways to part us from our money. They walk, eat, wake and sleep ways to do it. That is their security. But it should never be ours. Money is a tool we should learn and be-learning to use wisely. And He has taught me that having enough to bless others is important.

So I do not condemn a ministry that teaches about the reaping and sowing principles of money. It's true and we Christians need to learn about it. But we should also have our own personal ministries to people in our lives and local churches to be supporting and sowing into. Sending money off to ministries while not supporting our own churches and ministries is wrong. A good preacher will preach that imo.
 
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Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#31
Giving to the poor and needy is our place, according to what we have in the new testament.
If your place is giving to the poor and the needy then it sounds like you are rich and have not any need.

Likewise, if the Gospel is that the believers have all things in common then what would be your place in giving to the poor and needy seeing that you would have nothing other than your need:

44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
Acts 2:44-45

32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.
33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
34 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold,
35 And laid them down at the apostles' feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.
Acts 4:32-35

Maybe you might consider Revelations 3:17.

i have always detested the prosperity "gospel" because it lacks the focus of giving to the poor and the obligation we have to do so.
So giving to those without is the focus of the "gospel"? [See:Matt 25:8-9]

Isn't your obligation to the LORD? For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always. Mark 14:7

There is that maketh himself rich, yet hath nothing: there is that maketh himself poor, yet hath great riches. Prov 13:7
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,943
113
#32
A good OP, and I agree with you, for once, Enow!

For me, the emphasis should never be on us! That means no matter whether we are poor or rich, we need to use our money, and time for the kingdom of God. It means we don't spend a lot of time worrying about our financial state, instead trusting God, and doing some practical things like a budget, and not overspending. And giving! Give to the church and to the poor!

When my husband and I started out 37 years ago, he said he believed in tithing. I did not really agree, but we gave generously, leaving us at a $0 bank balance for 20 years. In fact, if he had not been paid every 2 weeks, thus giving us a third paycheque every six months, we might have really fallen behind. Instead, we always paid every single bill on time, and had enough to feed the family. I know God used that method of payment for our good!

I admit, I found it incredibly hard to be so "generous." But God did not leave us hanging. We did not live rich, we had old vehicles that my husband fixed with parts from the used auto places. I grew a garden that supplied a great deal of our produce, year round, with freezing. I made everything from scratch, and fast food was not part of our vocabulary.

Suddenly our children were gone, our house went up in value. We started saving money, for the first time in our lives. We paid off our house (which we had built ourselves, saving tens of thousands of dollars!) That was only 16 years ago.

Now, God has blessed us. We have found all sorts of wonderful and interesting ways to help the poor and needy, sometimes with money, sometimes in other ways, which are just as important.

Which is all to say, we never "named it and claimed it." We never "confessed favour" or any other Word Faith, Prosperity Gospel or other unbiblical nonsense. NO! We obeyed God, served him, and yes, we are blessed, in ways that I never imagined we would be. Now we can bless others, and we have helped our children by homes in hot Canadian real estate markets. We give to numerous organizatons, including a church near our church which has the express ministry of preaching the gospel to, and helping the street people in our city.


Sadly, the Prosperity Gospel is a lie. It twists Scriptures with the express purpose of tricking the the unwary and greedy into some false principle of "sowing and reaping." It is appalling to me that these ministries continue to fleece money of people who can barely afford it. I've told this story before, of a woman I met taking a course in seminary with me. She said they gave all of their pension and savings to a ministry that claimed they would be blessed a hundred fold. Sowing and reaping I guess. She and her husband finally realized that they had been badly fleeced, and badly taught not just about money, but about the basics of who God is. She said she was taking courses to learn about God, and to how to correctly read the Bible.

I do have a good pamphlet by Gordan Fee, one of the top scholars in the world and a Pentecostal, who wrote the Scriptural reasons why the Prosperity is a total and fabricated lie! Let me know in a post here or shoot me a pm, and I will do a synopsis of his exegetical examination of this topic. For now, here is a passage that Paul wrote that sums it up for me.

"I
am not saying this because I am in need, for I have learned to be content whatever the circumstances. 12 I know what it is to be in need, and I know what it is to have plenty. I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation, whether well fed or hungry, whether living in plenty or in want. 13 I can do all this through him who gives me strength." Phil 4:11-13
 
Dec 21, 2012
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#33
******the extreme teachings of prosperity are wrong----but God wants His people to prosper----it is good to give expecting nothing in return---excellent start----our hearts and attitudes are right----now let's build on that---trust God to prosper us to support the gospel---- .
When it is His will to be content with what we have, then how can any one expect God to prosper them? They can expect God as the Father to take care of them, but to prosper? It is best to trust God to take care of them and to be content with what we have has to void expectations on God to prosper them for He makes the poor and the rich.

1 Samuel 2:[SUP]7 [/SUP]The Lord maketh poor, and maketh rich: he bringeth low, and lifteth up.[SUP]8 [/SUP]He raiseth up the poor out of the dust, and lifteth up the beggar from the dunghill, to set them among princes, and to make them inherit the throne of glory: for the pillars of the earth are the Lord's, and he hath set the world upon them.

Considering the prophesy for the eternal prosperity on the poor of the earth; some would be blessed to be content.

Proverbs 22:1 A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold.[SUP]2 [/SUP]The rich and poor meet together: the Lord is the maker of them all.

The only prosperity worth seeking from God is the one a believer shall receive in Heaven and so we should seek His help to be content with what we have rather than seek a better life on earth that would ensnare us to not want to leave it when the Bridegroom comes at the pre tribulational rapture event.

Luke 21:[SUP]33 [/SUP]Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.[SUP]34 [/SUP]And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.[SUP]35 [/SUP]For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.[SUP]36 [/SUP]Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Imagine a believer winning the lottery when the Bridegroom shows up. So remember Lot's wife & hope in Him to escape.

Luke 17:[SUP]26 [/SUP]And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.[SUP]27 [/SUP]They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.[SUP]28 [/SUP]Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;[SUP]29 [/SUP]But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.[SUP]30 [/SUP]Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.[SUP]31 [/SUP]In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.[SUP]32 [/SUP]Remember Lot's wife.[SUP]33 [/SUP]Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

Matthew 6:[SUP]19 [/SUP]Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:[SUP]20 [/SUP]But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:[SUP]21 [/SUP]For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
 

1ofthem

Senior Member
Mar 30, 2016
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#34
Hebrews 13:5
[FONT=&quot]Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.[/FONT]
 

peping

Junior Member
Apr 6, 2016
21
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#35
Please consider my understanding of that verse (MT 19:16-29). To become rich and wealthy outside of seeking the Kingdom of GOD first, one has to cheat and exploit others, hence, the disciples were shocked from the answer and response of The LORD because they were all guilty. But their saving grace was that they left everything and followed The LORD - they seek the Kingdom of GOD. And the answer of The LORD for me was beyond comprehension - vv. 26, 29.

When one seeks wealth and power above all things, he is driven by selfishness and greed, hence, worshipping the devil. That's what the devil was tempting Jesus in Lk 4:5-8. When one seeks the Kingdom of GOD he can't avoid becoming wealthy because GOD made HIS promise - LK 12:31 when he is not driven by selfishness and greed but in his heart is the desire to serve others, be it monetary or otherwise. That's why in Mt 25:24-29 those who were given ability will face reckoning with The LORD how he utilized that ability. And those who received blessing should share and distribute his blessing from GOD - LK 16:9-13.
 
M

MattTooFor

Guest
#36
You have all heard it; if you give, God will multiply your gift a thousand fold, because God wants you to prosper.

Not Biblical. In fact, the Bible in the N.T. speaks against it.

1 Timothy 6:[SUP]3 [/SUP]If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;[SUP]4 [/SUP]He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,[SUP]5 [/SUP]Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.[SUP]6 [/SUP]But godliness with contentment is great gain.[SUP]7 [/SUP]For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out.[SUP]8 [/SUP]And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.[SUP]9 [/SUP]But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.[SUP]10 [/SUP]For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.[SUP]11 [/SUP]But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.[SUP]12 [/SUP]Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.[SUP]13 [/SUP]I give thee charge in the sight of God, who quickeneth all things, and before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession;[SUP]14 [/SUP]That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:

So stop giving to those covetous men that hardly lead by example when they live in the lap of luxury by such givings.

Ask the Lord Jesus Christ for help to forgive them because I am sure the devil may be tempting you to hate them and wish them ill will for misleading you to believe that God will bless you by your giving and yet you are still suffering, if not moreso, for having given it when you need it more than that ministry does.

Seek help from your local church in communicating your needs to them if you are hurting more than ever because you had given.

Philippians 4:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Rejoice in the Lord always: and again I say, Rejoice.[SUP]5 [/SUP]Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand.[SUP]6 [/SUP]Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.[SUP]7 [/SUP]And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.[SUP]9 [/SUP]Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.[SUP]10 [/SUP]But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly, that now at the last your care of me hath flourished again; wherein ye were also careful, but ye lacked opportunity.[SUP]11 [/SUP]Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.[SUP]12 [/SUP]I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.[SUP]13 [/SUP]I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.[SUP]14 [/SUP]Notwithstanding ye have well done, that ye did communicate with my affliction.

If you had died, would you want your spouse & children to seek help from the church? Then you must swallow your pride and ask the church you go to for help by example. You should communicate your immediate needs to the church and not just pray to the Lord for help in meeting what you need.

As it is, the secret for being content is to think on positive things on what you have to give the Father thanks in Jesus's name and if you can't, then ask Him to help you with that too, because Paul suffered need as well and have gone through it to set the example for the rest of us to lean on Christ to strengthen us thru those times.

Never once did Paul teach giving as a means to multiply what you have given to solve your lack of provision, let alone for personal gain.
Hey, sorry about creating a bit of a redundant thread. Didn't notice yours earlier.
 
Dec 21, 2012
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#37
Hey, sorry about creating a bit of a redundant thread. Didn't notice yours earlier.
No problem, brother. Glad to know others seek to prevent believers from being exploited by this prosperity gospel.
 
May 13, 2017
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#38
God is a prosperity preacher....Unless He lied?

Proverbs 11:10
[SUP]10 [/SUP]When the righteous prosper, the city rejoices;
and when the wicked perish, there is joy.

Hebrews 11:6 And without faith, it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to Him must believe that he exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him.
PSALM 1:1-3 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly; nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. But his delight is in the law of the Lord; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
PSALM 23:1 The Lord is my shepherd I shall not want.
PSALM 35:27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favor my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the Lord be magnified, "which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.
PSALM 37:3-5,11 Trust in the Lord, and do good; so shalt thou dwell in the land, and verily thou shalt be fed. Delight thyself also in the Lord: and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart. Commit thy way unto the Lord; trust also in him; and he shall bring it to pass. But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.
PSALM 37:25-26 I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, or his seed begging bread. He is ever merciful, and lendeth; and his seed is blessed.
PSALM 84:11-12 For the Lord God is a sun and shield: the Lord will give grace and glory: no good thing will he withhold from them that walk uprightly
PSALM 85:12 Yea, the Lord shall give that which is good; and our land shall yield her increase.
PSALM 92:12-15 The righteous shall flourish like a palm tree: he shall grow like a cedar in Lebanon. Those that be planted in the house of the Lord shall flourish in the courts of our God. They shall bring forth fruit in old age; they shall be fat and flourishing. To shew that the Lord is upright: he is my rock, and there is no unrighteousness in him.
PSALM 115:12-16 The Lord hath been mindful of us: he will bless us; he will bless the house of Israel; he will bless the house of Aaron. He will bless them that fear the Lord, both small and great. The Lord shall increase you more and more, you and your children.

PSALM 122:6-7 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee. Peace be within thy walls, and prosperity within thy palaces.
MATTHEW 6:31-33 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink: or, wherewithal shall we be clothed? (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
. 1 JOHN 5:14-15 And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us: And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.
ACTS 14:17 Nevertheless he left not himself without witness, in that he did good, and gave us rain from heaven, and fruitful season, filling our hearts with food and gladness.
PROVERBS 3:9-10 Honor thy Lord with thy substance, and with the firstfruits of all thine increase: So shall thy barns be filled with plenty, and thy presses shall burst out with new wine.
PROVERBS 8:18-21 Riches and honour are with me: yea, durable riches and righteousness. My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver. I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment; That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures.
PHILIPPIANS 4:19 And my God will meet all your needs according to his glorious riches by the Anointed Jesus.
1 CHRONICLES 29:11-12 Yours, O Lord, is the greatness and the power and the glory and the majesty and the splendor, for everything in heaven and earth is yours. Yours, O Lord, is the kingdom; you are exalted as head over all. Wealth and honor come from you; you are the ruler of all things. In your hands are strength and power to exalt and give strength to all.
JOSHUA 1:8 This book of the law shall not depart out of thy mouth; but thou shalt meditate therein day and night, that thou mayest observe to do according to all that is written therein: for then thou shalt make thy way prosperous, and then thou shalt have good success.
DEUTERONOMY 7:12-13 wherefore,it shall come to pass, if ye hearken to these judgments,and keep, and do them, that the Lord thy God shall keep unto thee for the covenant and the mercy which he sware unto thy fathers: and he will love thee, and bless thee, and multiply thee: He will also bless the fruit of thy womb,and the fruit of thy land, thy corn, and the wine, and thine oil, the increase thy kine, and the flocks of thy sheep, in the land which he sware unto thy fathers to give thee.
JAMES 1:5-7 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and up-braideth not: and it shall be given him. But let him ask in faith, nothering wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
1 KINGS 2:3 And keep the charge of the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, to keep his statutes, and his commandments, and his judgments, and his testimonies, as it is written in the law of Moses, that thou mayest prosper in all that thou doest, and whithersoever thou turnest thyself:
ECCLESIASTES 11:1 Cast thy bread upon the waters: for thou shalt find it after many days.
PROVERBS 28:27 He who gives to the poor will not lack, But he who hides his eyes will have many curses.
ECCLESIASTES 5:19 As for every man to whom God has given riches and wealth, and given him power to eat of it, to receive his heritage and rejoice in his labor—this is the gift of God.
PROVERBS 10:2-6 Treasures of wickedness profit nothing, But righteousness delivers from death. The LORD will not allow the righteous soul to famish,But He casts away the desire of the wicked. He who has a slack hand becomes poor, But the hand of the diligent makes rich. He who gathers in summer is a wise son; He who sleeps in harvest is a son who causes shame. Blessings are on the head of the righteous, But violence covers the mouth of the wicked.
PROVERBS 11:25 The generous soul will be made rich, And he who waters will also be watered himself.
PROVERBS 13:4,11-13 he soul of a lazy man desires, and has nothing;But the soul of the diligent shall be made rich. Wealth gained by dishonesty will be diminished,But he who gathers by labor will increase. Hope deferred makes the heart sick, But when the desire comes, it is a tree of life. He who despises the word will be destroyed, But he who fears the commandment will be rewarded.
ISAIAH 58:10-11 If you extend your soul to the hungry And satisfy the afflicted soul, Then your light shall dawn in the darkness, And your darkness shall be as the noonday. The LORD will guide you continually, And satisfy your soul in drought, And strengthen your bones; You shall be like a watered garden, And like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail.
Malachi 3:10-12 "Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, That there may be food in My house, And try Me now in this," Says the LORD of hosts, "If I will not open for you the windows of heaven And pour out for you such blessing That there will not be room enough to receive it. "And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, So that he will not destroy the fruit of your ground, Nor shall the vine fail to bear fruit for you in the field,"Says the LORD of hosts. And all nations will call you blessed For you will be a delightful land,"Says the LORD of hosts.
JEREMIAH 29:11 For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope.
JEREMIAH 17:7-8 "Blessed is the man who trusts in the LORD, And whose hope is the LORD. For he shall be like a tree planted by the waters, Which spreads out its roots by the river, And will not fear when heat comes; But its leaf will be green, And will not be anxious in the year of drought, Nor will cease from yielding fruit."
JOSHUA 1:7-8 Only be strong and very courageous, that you may observe to do according to all the law which Moses My servant commanded you; do not turn from it to the right hand or to the left, that you may prosper wherever you go. This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate in it day and night, that you may observe to do according to all that is written in it. For then you will make your way prosperous, and then you will have good success.
DEUTERONOMY 28:1-2 “Now it shall come to pass, if you diligently obey the voice of the LORD your God, to observe carefully all His commandments which I command you today, that the LORD your God will set you high above all nations of the earth. And all these blessings shall come upon you and overtake you, because you obey the voice of the LORD your God.
DEUTERONOMY 30:19-20 "I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; that you may love the LORD your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days; and that you may dwell in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them."
DEUTERONOMY 6:1-3 "Now this is the commandment, and these are the statutes and judgments which the LORD your God has commanded to teach you, that you may observe them in the land which you are crossing over to possess, that you may fear the LORD your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, you and your son and your grandson, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged. 3 Therefore hear, O Israel, and be careful to observe it, that it may be well with you, and that you may multiply greatly as the LORD God of your fathers has promised you a land flowing with milk and honey."
GALATIANS 6:6-10 Let him who is taught the word share in all good things with him who teaches. Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. And let us not grow weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart. Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all, especially to those who are of the household of faith.
LEVITICUS 26:3-5 "If you walk in My statutes and keep My commandments, and perform them, then I will give you rain in its season, the land shall yield its produce, and the trees of the field shall yield their fruit. Your threshing shall last till the time of vintage, and the vintage shall last till the time of sowing; you shall eat your bread to the full, and dwell in your land safely.
LEVITICUS 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD’s. It is holy to the LORD.
2 CHRONICLES 26:5 He sought God in the days of Zechariah, who had understanding in the visions of God; and as long as he sought the LORD, God made him prosper.
2 CHRONICLES 31:21 And in every work that he began in the service of the house of God, in the law and in the commandment, to seek his God, he did it with all his heart. So he prospered.
PROVERBS19:17 He who has pity on the poor lends to the LORD, And He will pay back what he has given.
PROVERBS 28:13,25 He who covers his sins will not prosper, But whoever confesses and forsakes them will have mercy. He who is of a proud heart stirs up strife, But he who trusts in the LORD will be prospered.
2 CORINTHIANS 9:6-7 But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.
DEUTERONOMY 28:3-14 "Blessed shall you be in the city, and blessed shall you be in the country. "Blessed shall be the fruit of your body, the produce of your ground and the increase of your herds, the increase of your cattle and the offspring of your flocks. "Blessed shall be your basket and your kneading bowl. "Blessed shall you be when you come in, and blessed shall you be when you go out. "The LORD will cause your enemies who rise against you to be defeated before your face; they shall come out against you one way and flee before you seven ways. "The LORD will command the blessing on you in your storehouses and in all to which you set your hand, and He will bless you in the land which the LORD your God is giving you. "The LORD will establish you as a holy people to Himself, just as He has sworn to you, if you keep the commandments of the LORD your God and walk in His ways. Then all peoples of the earth shall see that you are called by the name of the LORD, and they shall be afraid of you. 11 And the LORD will grant you plenty of goods, in the fruit of your body, in the increase of your livestock, and in the produce of your ground, in the land of which the LORD swore to your fathers to give you. The LORD will open to you His good treasure, the heavens, to give the rain to your land in its season, and to bless all the work of your hand. You shall lend to many nations, but you shall not borrow. And the LORD will make you the head and not the tail; you shall be above only, and not be beneath, if you heed the commandments of the LORD your God, which I command you today, and are careful to observe them. So you shall not turn aside from any of the words which I command you this day, to the right or the left, to go after other gods to serve them.
DEUTERONOMY 8:17-18 then you say in your heart,"My power and the might of my hand have gained me this wealth." "And you shall remember the LORD your God, for it is He who gives you power to get wealth that He may establish His covenant which He swore to your fathers, as it is this day.
DEUTERONOMY 11:13-15 "And it shall be that if you earnestly obey My commandments which I command you today, to love the LORD your God and serve Him with all your heart and with all your soul, then I will give you the rain for your land in its season, the early rain and the latter rain, that you may gather in your grain, your new wine, and your oil. And I will send grass in your fields for your livestock, that you may eat and be filled."
Proverbs 10:22 The blessing of the Lord brings wealth, and he adds no trouble to it.
Proverbs 10:24 What the righteous desire will be granted.

Oh! No! Wait! He just doesn't know what the bible says...Right?
 
Dec 28, 2016
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#39
We all recall the story of the rich young man (also known as the rich young ruler) and how Jesus told him that he could be saved if he sold his possessions and gave to the poor. St Louis de Monfort taught that this was proof one should love poverty. Indeed, many churches have taught this over the centuries. However, they failed to understand that just a few verses after the young man left Jesus's side, the Messiah said that had he given money to the poor, he would have had a 100 fold increase: Matt 19:29; Mark 10:30. That among these increases were "houses and lands" which are materiality. Therefore, there is some truth to prosperity gospel teaching. It is a sign of divine grace. However, it brings an obligation to be generous towards the less fortunate.
Um, Christ wasn't speaking, in context, about receiving things IN THIS WORLD. Context! It is about eternal life and things afterward! No wonder the churches are in such disarray with faulty teachings like the above fallacy. Goodness sake people!
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#40
Love works no ill towards their neighbor,therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Charity is not arrogannt,and not selfish.

God loves people,and the saints should do the same,and should help them out with their needs if possible.

Any person that teaches the prosperity Gospel,withdraw your selves from them,for the love of money is the root of all evil,for it violates the 2 greatest commandments,love God,and love people,for if you love people,you love God,and the love of money neglects the poor and needy,which the love of people is what it is all about.

God only blesses us with our needs,not our wants,for people are more important than our wants,and some people pray amiss to heap it upon their lusts.

Some people like the ways of the world,the lusts of it,money,material things,worldly entertainment,and do not want to let it go,but they also like the eternal life that God is giving to those who believe.

So they cling to that interpretation of the Bible,where they can enjoy the things of the world,and the flesh,but still be right with God,and cannot fall.

There is an interpretation of the Bible for everyone,for the pagan,for the occultist,for the prejudice,for the arrogant,for the Buddhist,Hinduist,Muslim,and many other people that want to hear the Bible according to what they believe,and desire,that is not part of the Bible,so they interpret accordingly.

So there will be a belief that caters to the flesh,and worldliness,and they cannot fall,for sin does not affect their relationship with God.

There are millions of people that believe the prosperity Gospel,but it neglects the poor and needy,and you hear them bragging of their money,and material things,and taking cruises,and vacations,and enjoying things of the world,that neglects the poor and needy,and then say,it is of God when He loves people.

If they do not want to help the poor and needy then John says,the love of God does not dwell in them,James said,their faith is dead,and Paul said,they erred from the faith.

The Bible says that those who name the name of Christ has to depart from iniquity,and awake to righteousness,and sin not,but not all have the knowledge of God,which Paul speaks that to their shame,and a person has departed from God,by the deceitfulness of sin,and those who do not do righteousness is not of God.

And if they do not help the poor and needy the love of God does not dwell in them.

If they love the world,or the things in the world,they are not of the Father.

And love is the fulfilling of the law,but love does not think an evil thought,and does not rejoice in iniquity,but in the truth.

Casting down all imaginations,and bringing every thought to the obedience of Christ.

But some people act as if they are suggestions,and if they violate them it does not apply to them,and even violate the helping the poor out by saying God blesses them with money,and material things.

These people are bold in what they say,and believe.

God wants all people to be saved,and they say not so,which is saying God's kingdom is not love,and He is evil for condemning people that have no input in their salvation,and God said all people have sinned,and come short of the glory of God,so He is not going to be giving any certain people favor,especially when He is no repecter of persons,there is no difference between the Jew and Greek,and said,what makes you differ from another person.

God said withdraw from the people that preach the prosperity Gospel,and they say,God blesses with money,and material things,for personal use.

God said if they do not help the poor and needy,the love of God does not dwell in them,and they say,it is not true,for God blesses us with those things.

The Bible says the Lord knows them who are His,having this SEAL,this is the seal that seals the deal,that they depart from iniquity,and awake to righteousness,and sin not,but not all have the knowledge of God,and do not depart from the living God,by the deceitfulness of sin,but they say sin does not affect their relationship with God.

They say faith alone,but that is only when they confess Christ,and when they receive the Spirit then the responsibility falls on them,for work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,and if you do not continue in the goodness of God,you will be cut off,but they say,we shall never fall,and when they receive the Spirit then if they do not do the works of the Spirit their faith is dead,for a person is justified by works in that circumstance,and not faith alone.

The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,but was a future event.

The prophets blood slain from the foundation of the world,but it was a future event.

God had the plan to give mankind salvation from the foundation of the world,so it is the same as of the saints have salvation in the beginning,but it is a future event to all those who accept,for the Spirit and bride,say Come,and anybody that wants that salvation can have it.

But they want to believe God chose them in the beginning,and they can never fall,and faith alone,and works does not keep them right with God,and sin does not affect their relationship with God,and the prosperity Gospel,that way they can live the worldly lifestyle,and if they do not care about the poor and needy,it does not affect them,and if they hold unto sin,they are unscathed,and if they say,I do not feel like laboring for the kingdom of God today,they are alright,that way they got more time for themselves to do what they want to do,and to enjoy the things of the world,but still be right with God.

And the ones that do have a care for people still want all the bases covered,for it is nice to believe we can never fall,but we cannot lie to ourselves.

They will quote that nobody can pluck the saints out of the Father's hands,but that is if they are led of the Spirit acting Christlike,for they ignore the conditions that go along with faith,and love,and confessing Christ.