Popeless Catholics

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AllenW

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2016
1,450
70
48
#1
I grew up a Roman Catholic.
It was many years later before I ever entered churches other than Baptist.
Besides, the eastern Orthodox, who claim they are catholics, we have what was called mainstream protestants from Europe.
Episcopalians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Presbyterians.
I've been in each of these churches and they seem so much like a Roman Catholic church.
The old churches, the bells, the candles, and other rituals, I wonder, are they still catholics?
Are they simply popeless catholics?
I've heard people say, "no, they've changed".
Have those people ever been in a Roman catholic church to be qualified to say they've changed?
Are they all ecumenical churches?
How does all this play out in the end times?
Who has the answers?
Who are the experts here?
I'd like to know.
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
113
51
#2
I grew up a Roman Catholic.
It was many years later before I ever entered churches other than Baptist.
Besides, the eastern Orthodox, who claim they are catholics, we have what was called mainstream protestants from Europe.
Episcopalians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Presbyterians.
I've been in each of these churches and they seem so much like a Roman Catholic church.
The old churches, the bells, the candles, and other rituals, I wonder, are they still catholics?
Are they simply popeless catholics?
I've heard people say, "no, they've changed".
Have those people ever been in a Roman catholic church to be qualified to say they've changed?
Are they all ecumenical churches?
How does all this play out in the end times?
Who has the answers?
Who are the experts here?
I'd like to know.

Hi Allen,

It should be easy for you to get the information you need. Just a simple quick search on google for each denominations statement of Faith. And since you seem to Know RC theology,, work it and let us know.
 

AllenW

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2016
1,450
70
48
#3
Hi Allen,

It should be easy for you to get the information you need. Just a simple quick search on google for each denominations statement of Faith. And since you seem to Know RC theology,, work it and let us know.
Sure, I could do that and form my own opinions of everything.
But there's nothing like first hand reports.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
16,252
113
69
Tennessee
#4
I was born and raised a Catholic and attending mass for many years. Early on I questioned certain things like the changing of the Sabbath to Sunday, confessing your sins to a priest, the classification of sins as either venial or mortal, Holy Communion, etc.

I no longer attend church in this denomination. I have no problem with the Pope but certainly don't consider him to have any authority on how to live my life.

The only significant change that I see is the attempt by the Catholic church to create unity among the other denominations, particularly Islam and I find that to be very troubling.

My main concern early on was that the Catholic church gives more credence to church doctrine rather than biblical truth.

I'm no expert on this faith. I believe that there are flaws, often serious, in every religious denomination that must be addressed.
 
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
75
0
#5
Hi Allen,

It should be easy for you to get the information you need. Just a simple quick search on google for each denominations statement of Faith. And since you seem to Know RC theology,, work it and let us know.
Hi Phil,
I agree with Allen.
It's very bad to learn about any religion from the internet.

The best way is to ask persons who are in that denomination - the ones who REALLY know what's going on, and let THEM tell you what their believe system, or doctrines are.

I happen to know both Catholic and Protestant doctrine (I'm Protestant) and believe me, there are mistakes made on both sides of the isle.

Popeless Catholics. Interesting.

If any of those denominations are HERE, it would be nice to hear from them.
I could speak for the RCC with no problem.

Let's see where this goes.

As starters:

Do the churches mentioned by the OP believe in person to minister confession?
The RCC does.

What do other churches believe?

Fran
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#6
Sure, I could do that and form my own opinions of everything.
But there's nothing like first hand reports.
Well, somehow you got to this first-hand report that old churches, bells, and candles are traditions like the RCC in churches well...? In churches that I've never known to be big on candles. (Old churches, because people build a church when they want one, and try to keep it around so they don't have to keep building new ones. Kind of expensive. Bells, simply to tell everyone it's time to assemble, from back in the days that clocks were things only rich people bought. Candles? The last church I saw candles in was in the mid 1970's and it made sense since it WAS a Catholic Church and the candles were the same old spend-money-to-pray-for-the-dead thing as it was when I was a kid.) So, we're left to guess where you think denominations are just popeless, while I'm scratching my head, because I know it's very much different than that.

So seriously? I could only spend an hour or two telling you what I know, but given you seem stuck on buildings, bells and candles as proof protestants are the same as Catholics, I'm lost what you want. And, I can think of better ways to spend my time.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#7
Hi Phil,
I agree with Allen.
It's very bad to learn about any religion from the internet.

The best way is to ask persons who are in that denomination - the ones who REALLY know what's going on, and let THEM tell you what their believe system, or doctrines are.

I happen to know both Catholic and Protestant doctrine (I'm Protestant) and believe me, there are mistakes made on both sides of the isle.

Popeless Catholics. Interesting.

If any of those denominations are HERE, it would be nice to hear from them.
I could speak for the RCC with no problem.

Let's see where this goes.

As starters:

Do the churches mentioned by the OP believe in person to minister confession?
The RCC does.

What do other churches believe?

Fran
You're going to have to get used to it. Churches put up what they believe online.
Here's my denominational beliefs:
http://www.tenth.org/about/our-beliefs
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,417
3,468
113
#8
I grew up a Roman Catholic.
It was many years later before I ever entered churches other than Baptist.
Besides, the eastern Orthodox, who claim they are catholics, we have what was called mainstream protestants from Europe.
Episcopalians, Lutherans, Methodists, and Presbyterians.
I've been in each of these churches and they seem so much like a Roman Catholic church.
The old churches, the bells, the candles, and other rituals, I wonder, are they still catholics?
Are they simply popeless catholics?
I've heard people say, "no, they've changed".
Have those people ever been in a Roman catholic church to be qualified to say they've changed?
Are they all ecumenical churches?
How does all this play out in the end times?
Who has the answers?
Who are the experts here?
I'd like to know.
To me the good thing that came out of the Luthar rebellion against the catholic church was the liberation of the Bible from the clutches of the catholic church.. The Bible became available to the common people and was eventually translated into the native languages of people...

Now just because a group of people rebelled against the catholic church does not therefore mean they came to God all the way.. The liberation of the Bible only provided an opportunity for people to read the Word it did not mean that they would follow the Word or end their resistance to the conviction of the Holy Spirit.. Yes many of these denominations did reject some of the more glaringly obvious abominations of the catholic religion but some of them just became another false religion just different to the catholic religion..

The Way of Salvation is given in His Word and people should read His Word and cling to it because there is safety in the Word of God... They should be prepared to forsake all for His truth..
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,417
3,468
113
#9
To me the good thing that came out of the Luthar rebellion against the catholic church was the liberation of the Bible from the clutches of the catholic church.. The Bible became available to the common people and was eventually translated into the native languages of people...

Now just because a group of people rebelled against the catholic church does not therefore mean they came to God all the way.. The liberation of the Bible only provided an opportunity for people to read the Word it did not mean that they would follow the Word or end their resistance to the conviction of the Holy Spirit.. Yes many of these denominations did reject some of the more glaringly obvious abominations of the catholic religion but some of them just became another false religion just different to the catholic religion..

The Way of Salvation is given in His Word and people should read His Word and cling to it because there is safety in the Word of God... They should be prepared to forsake all for His truth..
Oh and PS:::

Isaiah 24: KJV
16 "¶ From the uttermost part of the earth have we heard songs, even glory to the righteous. But I said, My leanness, my leanness, woe unto me! the treacherous dealers have dealt treacherously; yea, the treacherous dealers have dealt very treacherously. {17} Fear, and the pit, and the snare, are upon thee, O inhabitant of the earth. {18} And it shall come to pass, that he who fleeth from the noise of the fear shall fall into the pit; and he that cometh up out of the midst of the pit shall be taken in the snare: for the windows from on high are open, and the foundations of the earth do shake."
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
113
51
#10
Sure, I could do that and form my own opinions of everything.
But there's nothing like first hand reports.
Hi AllenW,

Sure we all can have subjective opinions based on our experience, that does not mean it is based on any facts. If you want information get the facts. As I say if you want subjective views, then you have already shown that your opinion is not based on fact.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,312
1,039
113
#11
I'm pretty sure the majority of Catholic Doctrine is grossly Unbiblical
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#12
I went to the Missionary Baptist Seminary in the 90's in Little Rock to "make up" for lost time as far as the bible was concerned....this particular seminary did not make preachers per se, but taught us how to study so as to rightly divide the truth. One of the classes we had to take (4 semester hours) was church history.....a non-bias study will reveal the following....

In all honesty the named religions in your post have their roots in Catholicism and when you get down to it....other than maybe Mormons, JW's and a few others ALL named denominations are tied to some group that came before.....

HAVING said that...there are CORE doctrines that identify a TRUE NEW TESTEMENT Church.......woven through all of the so called Christian churches we find a continuance of the Lord's churches<---Identified as such by what they teach about Salvation, Immersion, What a church is etc.........

One thing to keep in mind....the Corinthian church had some 15 errors and yet they were still identified as a Church that was filled with saved, immersed believers....even though some members were committing grievous sins and the church itself was missing the mark on some 15 things......

To answer your question...I would say YES they are!
 
Last edited:
Apr 30, 2016
5,162
75
0
#13
Well, somehow you got to this first-hand report that old churches, bells, and candles are traditions like the RCC in churches well...? In churches that I've never known to be big on candles. (Old churches, because people build a church when they want one, and try to keep it around so they don't have to keep building new ones. Kind of expensive. Bells, simply to tell everyone it's time to assemble, from back in the days that clocks were things only rich people bought. Candles? The last church I saw candles in was in the mid 1970's and it made sense since it WAS a Catholic Church and the candles were the same old spend-money-to-pray-for-the-dead thing as it was when I was a kid.) So, we're left to guess where you think denominations are just popeless, while I'm scratching my head, because I know it's very much different than that.

So seriously? I could only spend an hour or two telling you what I know, but given you seem stuck on buildings, bells and candles as proof protestants are the same as Catholics, I'm lost what you want. And, I can think of better ways to spend my time.
Hi depleted,
Not sure. But I think the OP means that the exterior trappings look Catholic, but maybe
They're different in beliefs?

Fran
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
113
51
#14
Hi Phil,
I agree with Allen.
It's very bad to learn about any religion from the internet.

The best way is to ask persons who are in that denomination - the ones who REALLY know what's going on, and let THEM tell you what their believe system, or doctrines are.

I happen to know both Catholic and Protestant doctrine (I'm Protestant) and believe me, there are mistakes made on both sides of the isle.

Popeless Catholics. Interesting.

If any of those denominations are HERE, it would be nice to hear from them.
I could speak for the RCC with no problem.

Let's see where this goes.

As starters:

Do the churches mentioned by the OP believe in person to minister confession?
The RCC does.

What do other churches believe?

Fran

Hi Franc,

I agree there is a great deal of nonsense on the internet regarding religion and faith. I have to disagree with you tenet. In fact there is a great deal of excellent resources for the Christian believer online. If you want to believe what any denomination or Independent church believes, just got to their website and read their statement of belief, you can check it against scripture yourself. Going to the sources will tell you what is the official belief of each denomination.

Since you say you know RC theology, I am sure you have read the articles from the council of Trent, Vatican I and Vatican II? And what protestant theology have you studied? Sources would be good then we could all check for factuality.

Theres nothing wrong with opinions as long as they are based on truth! And yes I would agree not every system of theology is perfect.

I am in one of the denominations above, and I find AllenW's subjective opinion not factual. Just for instance, what do you thing John Knox would say about Allens post? (thats a hint)
 

Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
3,076
59
48
#15
Hi AllenW,

Sure we all can have subjective opinions based on our experience, that does not mean it is based on any facts. If you want information get the facts. As I say if you want subjective views, then you have already shown that your opinion is not based on fact.
phil36...it seems you want the truth. Here it is...Get the book "The Woman Rides the Beast" by David Hunt.


The book itself goes through the history of the Church of Jesus Christ turning into the RCC. It then takes you through the centuries RCC history, backed up by historical writings.

I will tell you this book among others will leave you with the understanding and little doubt that the RCC will be the one world religion the Bible speaks of. Thus it will be the "Whore that Rides the Beast".
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#16
phil36...it seems you want the truth. Here it is...Get the book "The Woman Rides the Beast" by David Hunt.


The book itself goes through the history of the Church of Jesus Christ turning into the RCC. It then takes you through the centuries RCC history, backed up by historical writings.

I will tell you this book among others will leave you with the understanding and little doubt that the RCC will be the one world religion the Bible speaks of. Thus it will be the "Whore that Rides the Beast".
Warning: Phil and I are reformed.

Would you like the early church history?

Here are the books I recommend:
The Early Church Fathers

:)

(Reformed. Tend to be into very long dissertations on everything. lol)
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
113
51
#17
phil36...it seems you want the truth. Here it is...Get the book "The Woman Rides the Beast" by David Hunt.


The book itself goes through the history of the Church of Jesus Christ turning into the RCC. It then takes you through the centuries RCC history, backed up by historical writings.

I will tell you this book among others will leave you with the understanding and little doubt that the RCC will be the one world religion the Bible speaks of. Thus it will be the "Whore that Rides the Beast".
Hi Bladerunner,

I have read what the church of Rome's official teaching is. I went to the source: Council of Trent, Vatican 1; Vatican II. I have also read pre-reformation history.

I have never said that I agree with their theology, if that's what you think!

Dave Hunt Holds the view that Revelation 17 refers to the RC commune, however, many don't.
 

AllenW

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2016
1,450
70
48
#18
Well, somehow you got to this first-hand report that old churches, bells, and candles are traditions like the RCC in churches well...? In churches that I've never known to be big on candles. (Old churches, because people build a church when they want one, and try to keep it around so they don't have to keep building new ones. Kind of expensive. Bells, simply to tell everyone it's time to assemble, from back in the days that clocks were things only rich people bought. Candles? The last church I saw candles in was in the mid 1970's and it made sense since it WAS a Catholic Church and the candles were the same old spend-money-to-pray-for-the-dead thing as it was when I was a kid.) So, we're left to guess where you think denominations are just popeless, while I'm scratching my head, because I know it's very much different than that.

So seriously? I could only spend an hour or two telling you what I know, but given you seem stuck on buildings, bells and candles as proof protestants are the same as Catholics, I'm lost what you want. And, I can think of better ways to spend my time.
And thank you for telling me and others nothing worth hearing.
 

AllenW

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2016
1,450
70
48
#20
Hi AllenW,

Sure we all can have subjective opinions based on our experience, that does not mean it is based on any facts. If you want information get the facts. As I say if you want subjective views, then you have already shown that your opinion is not based on fact.
And what do you propose I do?
Track you down to see if I am first of all talking to a real person.
Can you be serious in anything you say, or do you think you are serious, or is that "subjective" of me to ask?