some things from paul that many omit

[eternally-gratefull]

Those fire and brimstone sermons are meant to keep you safe, not turn you against Gods commandments. Those are for you, Like you would tell your kid " stay out of the busy road" or " dont play with matches it has the potential to kill you" some people Hear " If you do this i will destroy you" But its actually " if you do this, you will die"

No they were not for me. I did not need to hear them. I am already saved, as was (I assume) My whole church, since we had not had visitors in along time..

I needed to know how to live my christian life, To Grow, to be discipled. How to serve others, How to stop focusing on self, how to love God,

Not told how to stay out of hell. I already knew that.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

it is ancient, goes all the way back to Cain. and his self righteousness..

How is it that God told Cain he could rule over that man of sin rising up in his members, and you say we cant? Did God judge Cain too harshly? Solomon said that mans WHOLE PURPOSE IN LIFE is to obey God and keep his commandments all else is vanity. You say we cant do that? And if someone does they are self-righteous. Why? Was Daniel or Hannah self righteous too?

Cain used self righteousness to try to appease God, God rejected his self righteous works. And only accepted Abel's blood sacrifice. Cain killed abel for it.

The same attitude caused the jews to kill christ.

the same attitude caused the romans to kill Gods people for centuries in the name of the "church"

Yes. Cain have done all those things, all he had to do was repent.. Sadly, I believe history shows that never happened. Very few self righteous people repent.. they have to much anger when God tells them all their good deeds will amount to NOTHING as far as payment for their debt they owe God.. which can only come through blood sacrifice.

Sadly, the modern day cains are still killing the modern day abels..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

my

where do you go to church?

I have never heard that from any pastor I know!

he sounds orthodox.. or catholic.

 

[preacher4truth]

titus 1:16 "They PROFESS that they know God; but IN WORKS THEY DENY HIM, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every GOOD WORK REPROBATE."


Titus 2:11-14 "For the GRACE OF GOD that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, TEACHING US that, DENYING UNGODLINESS and WORLDLY LUSTS, we should live SOBERLY, RIGHTEOUSLY, and GODLY, IN THIS PRESENT WORLD; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; WHO GAVE HIMSELF FOR US, THAT HE MIGHT REDEEM US FROM ALL INIQUITY, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of GOOD WORKS."


Titus 3:8 "This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou AFFIRM CONSTANTLY, that THEY WICH HAVE BELIEVED IN GOD MIGHT BE CAREFUL TO MANTAIN GOOD WORKS. These things are good and profitable unto men."


a consistant part of pauls ministry that many people deny, or insist " thats not really what hes saying" Pauls ministry wasnt different in principles such as repentance of sin , what paul often refers to as " Works of the flesh" and we Know He is talking about sinful actions and attitudes because of scripture in His letters like this


Galatians 5:19-21 "Now THE WORKS OF THE FLESH ARE MANIFEST, which are THESE; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. "




This really is not even debatable if a person accepts the scripture, certainly this is not all of pauls doctrine, but makes very clear things many deny. that those who continue on in sinful lives, doing these types of things, will not inherit the Kingdom of God, and when paul is saying " works of the flesh" He is absolutely talking about our conduct.




romans 16 :25-26 "Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the SCRIPTURES OF THE PROPHETS, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, MADE KNOWN TO ALL NATIONS FOR THE OBEDIENCE OF FAITH"


The reason The gospel was given to all nations, is to bring them into obedience, not to exclude believers from Obedience and accountability. That idea is not from God. What we do, matters greatly In Christ.

The passages are descriptive passages, not prescriptive. In other words they describe what the truly converted life will look like, thus are not 'what you have to do to get to heaven'.

Also, these passages do not draw up the entire picture of the truly converted, as if the life were lived in total perfection without sin. The life will be absent 'setting up shop to sin', to 'do business' ('prasso') as to live in sin.

 

[PeterJens]

Interesting observation

Are any of Gods heros not righteous people?

 

[willybob]

Cain used self righteousness to try to appease God, God rejected his self righteous works. And only accepted Abel's blood sacrifice. Cain killed abel for it.

The same attitude caused the jews to kill christ.

the same attitude caused the romans to kill Gods people for centuries in the name of the "church"

Yes. Cain have done all those things, all he had to do was repent.. Sadly, I believe history shows that never happened. Very few self righteous people repent.. they have to much anger when God tells them all their good deeds will amount to NOTHING as far as payment for their debt they owe God.. which can only come through blood sacrifice.

Sadly, the modern day cains are still killing the modern day abels..

Cain had the ABILITY to do what was right saith the Lord...But he chose to do what he deemed to be right to serve the lusts and desires of the flesh (self-righteousness and justifying disobedience, thus his heart became a dry cistern) however, Able did what was righteous from heart purity and love for God "ie" as scripture says Able's "WORKS were righteous", and this made his brother envious and jealous...same thing I see today in the church of wheat and tares, they get very envious of a righteous person, and seek to bring them down to their level of sin like Cain did...Men call those unrighteous what God calls righteous (logizmie).Logicaly reasoned by the mind of God (logos) to be DOING that which is right.....Do you think Zacharias and Elisabeth were righteous keeping all the commandments of God? or do you call that which is said to be righteous by God unrighteous out of envy in an attempt to bring them down to your level?

 

[PeterJens]

Self righteous - Cains - killing modern day Ables.

Now Jesus died because He threatened the rich, powerful, unloving, hard hearted religious
authorities with revolution. And it was a real threat, because they only existed if the temple
sacrifice continued and the temple was significant. This had very little to do with being
self righteous and a lot more about basic authority and power.

Wealth and affluence is killing the church by taking away relationships and dependency and
replacing it with covetousness and greed. There are very few self-righteous, but the lawless
hate admitting sin is real and you have to feel guilty about it.

There are a few of the older generation who hold to a form of morality, but this is shrinking, and
the lawless without boundaries are going everywhere. Limits and boudaries have collapsed so far
people find it hard to describe what honesty and integrity actually is, even here on cc.

Being upset with someone is more important than finding the truth and letting God define where
we stand. This is so far from the gospel and reality, but then so much conformity has been blamed
for the type of society we grew up in, yet today, people are less aware of who or what they belong
to, or which principles they follow.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Cain had the ABILITY to do what was right saith the Lord...But he chose to do what he deemed to be right to serve the lusts and desires of the flesh (self-righteousness and justifying disobedience, thus his heart became a dry cistern) however, Able did what was righteous from heart purity and love for God "ie" as scripture says Able's "WORKS were righteous", and this made his brother envious and jealous...same thing I see today in the church of wheat and tares, they get very envious of a righteous person, and seek to bring them down to their level of sin like Cain did...Men call those unrighteous what God calls righteous (logizmie).Logicaly reasoned by the mind of God (logos) to be DOING that which is right.....Do you think Zacharias and Elisabeth were righteous keeping all the commandments of God? or do you call that which is said to be righteous by God unrighteous out of envy in an attempt to bring them down to your level?

there are non righteous no not one.

Cain did not have the ability, because he did not have faith, No one can do the works of God unless and until they have faiht in God.

Abel trusted God, and because of it he was saved, and had the works to prove it.. Cain rejected Gods truth, and tried to replace it with his own truth.

That is religion and human good. which God rejects

 

[PeterJens]

there are non righteous no not one.

Cain did not have the ability, because he did not have faith, No one can do the works of God unless and until they have faiht in God.

Abel trusted God, and because of it he was saved, and had the works to prove it.. Cain rejected Gods truth, and tried to replace it with his own truth.

That is religion and human good. which God rejects

It is very true none live their lives without sin.
But we grow up to have the opportunity of communion with God and forgiveness.
In this state of adulthood and communion with God, where any of Gods heroes not righteous?

I get the feeling some hate the designation of righteous because in their mind they judge as
hypocrites.

 

[Hizikyah]

Genesis 4:1-7, ESV
"1 Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, saying, “I have gotten a man with the help of the LORD.
2, "And again, she bore his brother Abel. Now Abel was a keeper of sheep, and Cain a worker of the ground.
3, "In the course of time Cain brought to the LORD an offering of the fruit of the ground,
4, "and Abel also brought of the firstborn of his flock and of their fat portions. And the LORD had regard for Abel and his offering,
5, "but for Cain and his offering he had no regard. So Cain was very angry, and his face fell.
6, "The LORD said to Cain, “Why are you angry, and why has your face fallen?
7, "If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you must rule over it.”




Genesis 4 WEB
“1, The man knew Eve his wife. She conceived, and gave birth to Cain, and said, “I have gotten a man with Yahweh’s help.
2, "Again she gave birth, to Cain’s brother Abel. Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
3, "As time passed, it happened that Cain brought an offering to Yahweh from the fruit of the ground.
4, "Abel also brought some of the firstborn of his flock and of its fat. Yahweh respected Abel and his offering,
5, "but he didn’t respect Cain and his offering. Cain was very angry, and the expression on his face fell.
6, "Yahweh said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why has the expression of your face fallen?
7, "If you do well, will it not be lifted up? If you don’t do well, sin crouches at the door. Its desire is for you, but you are to rule over it.”


“Its desire is for you, but you are to rule over it”

Proverbs 19:2, “It is not good to have zeal without knowledge, nor to be hasty and miss the way.”

 

[willybob]

there are non righteous no not one.

Cain did not have the ability, because he did not have faith, No one can do the works of God unless and until they have faiht in God.

Abel trusted God, and because of it he was saved, and had the works to prove it.. Cain rejected Gods truth, and tried to replace it with his own truth.

That is religion and human good. which God rejects

Do you think I'm so stupid that you can pool 6 words out of context to go against the whole council of God and it will get past me? You didn't even include the first three words of the verse. Shame on you.

You are a foolish, foolish man sir, VERY foolish indeed ..Paul said
“IT IS WRITTEN there is none good”..Do you even have the slightest clue what he was drawing from in the OT..Let me educate you if your foolish heart is not harden to the point of receiving anything from the word. Others can read this whose hearts are open and see the UTTER FOOLISHNESS of the “none good no not one cleche” taken completely out of context and dipped in euphoria to sooth the consciences of carnal Christians.. You say that Able was unrighteous when God said he in fact was righteous…..Are you a liar or is God lying??? You know, Paul blinded Elimas for a season for blocking other new borns from coming to the true gospel..
Romans 3, (there is none good not one)? What is Paul referencing from the OT?

Every single PASSAGE Paul was quoting from in the old testament the wicked were CONTRASTED against the righteous.. I ask you: why by your own words do you always number yourself among the wicked…You sir are like a foolish man drawing to an inside straight when his opponet already has a full house..

Romans 3
1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.
3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?

4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged. 5 But if our unrighteousness (the Jews as a nation, Isaiah 64) commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man) 6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?

7 For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner? 8 And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just. 9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; (the Jewish nation and the Gentile nations, not individuals per say) An example of this is found in Isaiah 64. Whereas the righteous prophet Isaiah was speaking to a wicked and perverse nation, Israel. In that all of her righteousness was as filthy rags fading away in their iniquities).

10 As it is written, (Paul is drawing from the OT) There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

In examining Paul's declarations to the Romans in chapter 3, let's use two OT examples, Joseph and Hanna, and see if their works are being referenced by Paul. Or could it be that Paul is speaking about other kinds of people? Possibly the wicked and not the righteous? Joseph and Hanna are but two of the many righteous men/women in the OT, I contend that Paul is not speaking of the righteous in verses 10-18 in Romans 3. But rather Paul is referencing the wicked in Psalms 14, 53, 5, 140, 10, 36 and Proverbs 1-16, 16-8, and Isaiah 59-7,8

Psalms 14-1, the wicked who say there is no God. Psalms 53-1 the wicked who are corrupt and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good. None of the wicked do good. Not in any of these verses in which Paul quotes from is he referring to the righteous. Like all chapters, and in both of these occasions, the righteous are always separated from the wicked. Would these OT quotes be speaking about the likes of Joseph, or Hanna etc? Absolutely not! These two Psalms are speaking about the fools who believe not God and the wicked that obey not God. If both Psalms are examined carefully we can find the wicked spoken of in contrast to the righteous. So, in drawing from these two Psalms, Paul is most defiantly speaking of the unrighteous, not the righteous. Therefore types like Joseph and Hanna cannot be who Paul is referencing when he says "There is none righteous, no, not one".

Romans 3- 12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. 13 Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips:

Psalm 53-3, 5-9, 140-3 in NONE of the quotes by Paul is David speaking of the righteous. But rather the wicked, when they are conceived of Satan, that go astray, venturing out from his influential womb (Mystery Babylon, his church), doing his bidding and speaking his lies, (when he speaks a lie he speaketh of "his own" John 8-44).Does this sound like Joseph and Hanna? Nay, may God forbid such slanders upon the righteous and worthy! They use this false teaching to promote the Luther/Calvin lie of total depravity. I ask: Can we place Joseph and Hanna in this same category too? No!!!

but two of the many righteous men/women in the OT, I contend that Paul is not speaking of the righteous in verses 10-18 in Romans 3. But rather Paul is referencing the wicked in Psalms 14, 53, 5, 140, 10, 36 and Proverbs 1-16, 16-8, and Isaiah 59-7,8

Psalms 14-1, the wicked who say there is no God. Psalms 53-1 the wicked who are corrupt and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good. None of the wicked do good. Not in any of these verses in which Paul quotes from is he referring to the righteous. Like all chapters, and in both of these occasions, the righteous are always separated from the wicked. Would these OT quotes be speaking about the likes of Joseph, or Hanna etc? Absolutely not! These two Psalms are speaking about the fools who believe not God and the wicked that obey not God. If both Psalms are examined carefully we can find the wicked spoken of in contrast to the righteous. So, in drawing from these two Psalms, Paul is most defiantly speaking of the unrighteous, not the righteous. Therefore types like Joseph and Hanna cannot be who Paul is referencing when he says "There is none righteous, no, not one".
Romans 3- 12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. 13 Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips:

Psalm 53-3, 5-9, 140-3 in NONE of the quotes by Paul is David speaking of the righteous. But rather the wicked, when they are conceived of Satan, that go astray, venturing out from his influential womb (Mystery Babylon, his church), doing his bidding and speaking his lies, (when he speaks a lie he speaketh of "his own" John 8-44).Does this sound like Joseph and Hanna? Nay, may God forbid such slanders upon the righteous and worthy! They use this false teaching to promote the Luther/Calvin lie of total depravity. I ask: Can we place Joseph and Hanna in this same category too? No!!!

14 Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness:


Psalm 10-7 In this chapter it speaks of the wicked in their pride that persecute the righteous with curses of bitterness out of their mouths of which the apostle James warns against in chapter 3. Do we ever find Joseph and Hanna or Job speaking such things? No!

15 Their feet are swift to shed blood: 16 Destruction and misery are in their ways: 17 And the way of peace have they not known:

Here Paul is drawing in generalities from Proverbs 1-16, 16-8, and Isaiah 59-7,8. In all three chapters it is speaking of a heart that devises evil schemes and the wicked deeds that they madly scurry after. Their feet rush into battle. This sounds more like the wicked deeds of King Saul, and not Joseph and Hanna.

18 There is no fear of God before their eyes.

Psalm 36-1 David has a message from God in his heart concerning the sinfulness of the wicked because there is no fear of God before their eyes. Did Joseph and Hanna have the fear of the Lord? Yes!!!


So, in brief, listed here is a concise reference of whom the apostle Paul is speaking about in verses 10-18. Sadly, not only do the Pundits claim that all of mankind is wicked, but they even apply this to those after conversion as well by falsely parroting "if we say we have no continuous sin in us we are liars the truth is not in us". Somehow overlooking such people as Nathaniel, Cornelius, and Lydia in the NT.

 

[followjesus]

No they were not for me. I did not need to hear them. I am already saved, as was (I assume) My whole church, since we had not had visitors in along time..

I needed to know how to live my christian life, To Grow, to be discipled. How to serve others, How to stop focusing on self, how to love God,

Not told how to stay out of hell. I already knew that.

alrighty so i guess Gods warnings just arent for you.

 

[Hizikyah]

Hebrews 10:36, “For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.”



James 1:12, “Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.”

 

[followjesus]

It is very true none live their lives without sin.
But we grow up to have the opportunity of communion with God and forgiveness.
In this state of adulthood and communion with God, where any of Gods heroes not righteous?

I get the feeling some hate the designation of righteous because in their mind they judge as
hypocrites.

sin is not universal as it was in the Law it is based on ones own understanding of what is right according to the truth of Jesus.

james 4;17 "Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

the law proclaims universally whther you know or not what is sin. the new covenant is based on the holy spirit in us. as the laws are written on out hearts, we become obligated through our knowledge of right and wrong through Christ.

its like if you have 2 5 year olds, one of them you explain Here is your box of markers, BUT do not use them to write on the wall" this child when yu leave the room, writes all over the wall, He is guilty based on the fact that you explained that He was to not write on the wall.

the other child you give a box of markers and leave the room without explaining to Him the rule about writing on the wall, if He does it, he is innocent because He didnt Know its kind of on you for not explaining to him.

what is sin to me, may not be to you, therefore we can indeed walk free of sin by living up to what we have attained. the more Knowledge we have the higher the bar.

Luke 12:47-48 "And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more."


its the reason i cant judge someone else and they cant Judge me, because the judge is within us personally to walk in righteousness is to follow the conscience accoprding to the Knowledge of Christ within me.

Hebrews 4:12-13"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do."

to hear Jesus and deny His word is condemnation, to hear just a little of His word and obey it is righteousness. to grow is to increase Knowledge and apply it to life.

 

[willybob]

God told Cain he could do it, those that argue in favour of sin say you can't....They can study day and night and get the highest achievement degrees, the athletes practice 15 hours a day to finish the first and the best, etc. etc..Some of them gain the highest achievements in the military:::but when it come to obeying God and overcoming sin they somehow cant achieve a mark higher than a foot stool? How did Job do it and they cant...God said Job was righteous and they say none can be righteous....Making ones own version of what it right apart from the word are the ones that are self-righteous...They take the plain righteousness of God's word and turn it into a lie, that's self-righteousness, no?...Ill touch further on this concept shortly..

 

[willybob]

The next out of context stronghold their gonna throw my way is "all our works is filthy rags"... go ahead I'm waiting

I know all their strongholds>>> If we say we have no sin we are liars and the truth is not in us, their is no good no not one, all is filthy rags, the flesh wareth against the Spirit, and Paul the chief of sinners mantra....They pull all this stuff out of context, but the truth is; once it is weighed in the balance of the full weight of scripture their little cliches' are found wanting....

Their whole bible of half verses and half truths amounts to about 3 pages, and like Calvin and Luther they leave out the other 1500 pages...

 

[followjesus]

God told Cain he could do it, those that argue in favour of sin say you can't....They can study day and night and get the highest achievement degrees, the athletes practice 15 hours a day to finish the first and the best, etc. etc..Some of them gain the highest achievements in the military:::but when it come to obeying God and overcoming sin they somehow cant achieve a mark higher than a foot stool? How did Job do it and they cant...God said Job was righteous and they say none can be righteous....Making ones own version of what it right apart from the word are the ones that are self-righteous...They take the plain righteousness of God's word and turn it into a lie, that's self-righteousness, no?...Ill touch further on this concept shortly..

To me, believing that we are already perfect and without sin, or that God no longer requires anything of us because Jesus died, is backwards, a false doctrine. I look at it as Because God sacrificed Jesus His only begotten Son for our Lives, is all the reason we need to repent of the sin that put Him on the cross. it is the reason to give our whole lives all our strength effort ,Heart, our time and our wealth and whatever else we posess to the One who died in our place and promises eternal Life for those who believe Him and therefore hear and obey His Word. the book of Hebrews uses a really great analogy, it likens Jesus gospel to a will and testament.

when a person makes a will, they write out all thier wishes and divide the inheritance among those they choose, often the testator will write conditions in the will for instance if a man has a son who is addicted to drugs, he may place the condition that His son must be " clean" for a year before inheriting the fortune, because the testator has watched his son waste everything of his own on drugs and wild living. The condition isnt just random or making the son jump through Hoops, it is motivated by the testators Love, He is motivating the son to get off drugs and doesnt want to give a fortune to a drug addict because oit will destroy the addict to have an unlimited supply of heroin, or cocaine or whatever.

Jesus spoke His will and testament in the four gospels, and they are absolutely not without condition, it is His testament, therefore whatever conditions He places upon the inheritance is valid and bound by His words. And A testament goes into effect when the person who wrote the will, dies. as long as the testator is alive, His fortune is his and the inheritance is a promise for when he passes away, as soon as He dies, the will is now in force. So to find out about the inheritance Jesus offers of eternal Life, we need to accept His testimony about it.


im not sure im the right guy to say who is self righteous, or who is a sinner thats not my place, all i know is what has changed my own Life from a terribly violent, adulterous , alcoholic, drug addict, (to name a few)person who had little regard for what is right in Gods eyes, to a person who has no violence left, has no lust in my heart , hasnt drank a drop in more than 10 years, or done drugs in more than that...and what is more is those things that once ruled my life, do not even apeal to me anymore ( this is not a boast in anyway) but Just part of my testimony of what Jesus has done for my life through doing what He says to do. thats the only reason i share what i share with people because it is deliverance for the person who will trust His words. He knows because it is His kingdom, it was His Blood that was shed, His suffering on the cross, He is the One God sent to save us, to be the Lord, to speak His words to the world for salvation.

My value is to simply say " Hear Jesus words take them to Heart and apply them to daily Life because that is what He is saying and it works Just Like He says it will. He is the one who gets to decide who is in or out, who is self righteous. I know what a false doctrine is just because i know the gospel of Jesus Christ and He is the truth, nothing true will disagree with the truth.

 

[followjesus]

The next out of context stronghold their gonna throw my way is "all our works is filthy rags"... go ahead I'm waiting

I know all their strongholds>>> If we say we have no sin we are liars and the truth is not in us, their is no good no not one, all is filthy rags, the flesh wareth against the Spirit, and Paul the chief of sinners mantra....They pull all this stuff out of context, but the truth is; once it is weighed in the balance of the full weight of scripture their little cliches' are found wanting....

Their whole bible of half verses and half truths amounts to about 3 pages, and like Calvin and Luther they leave out the other 1500 pages...

If you wish to know why read some joseph prince teachings and you will understand the power of a false doctrine in the mind. But that being said, dont let it bother you when people disagree with the Word, pray that God will open eyes and hearts and speak truth according to the word. we scatter seeds, God makes them Grow, we plant the word and the condition of the soil may not be prepared as of yet. some people are where i was years ago, and where yu were at your worst whatever that may have been. God is patient and you never Know what kind of struggle someone is having, or what God is currently doing in thier lives to prepare thier hearts for planting.

just my own thoughts for you, and i agree with much of what you have said, remember the goal and that Gods word is for salvation

 

[followjesus]

Hebrews 10:36, “For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.”



James 1:12, “Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.”

amen..perseverance, forgetting the behind and striving ahead !! for as the blessing and promise of eternal Life flows , so do the sufferings and rejections of Christ into our Lives.

 

[Magenta]

im not sure im the right guy to say who is self righteous, or who is a sinner thats not my place, all i know is what has changed my own Life from a terribly violent, adulterous , alcoholic, drug addict, (to name a few)person who had little regard for what is right in Gods eyes, to a person who has no violence left, has no lust in my heart , hasnt drank a drop in more than 10 years, or done drugs in more than that...and what is more is those things that once ruled my life, do not even apeal to me anymore ( this is not a boast in anyway) but Just part of my testimony of what Jesus has done for my life through doing what He says to do. thats the only reason i share what i share with people because it is deliverance for the person who will trust His words. He knows because it is His kingdom, it was His Blood that was shed, His suffering on the cross, He is the One God sent to save us, to be the Lord, to speak His words to the world for salvation.

Amen. That is great that you have been delivered from so much by the power of Jesus.