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Thread: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

  1. #1421
    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Well, I have oodles of time, so that costs me nothing. I have plenty of energy, again costs me nothing. My money is limited, yet somehow even when I leave some outside for people to find, I always have enough left over. So AGAIN, that costs me nothing. And effort, yup have plenty of that too.

    If YOU see your time, energy, money and efforts as a sacrifice that you may or may not want to make to help others, that's on you. MY time, energy, money and efforts are cheerfully given. ALWAYS.


    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    blue - I do not know which planet you live on, but doing anything costs time, energy, money,
    effort.

    I have helped clean up a garden for an elderly member of the church.
    It took two of us a whole afternoon, and we had a good conversation,
    enjoyed the sunshine, used quite a lot of effort.

    So it cost me all those things, which I freely gave not expecting anything
    in return. And the reason it is precious is because it does cost, but out
    of love we give.

    So this was a sacrifice of time, effort and love. I think you have a limited
    view of sacrifices.

    And now shall mine head be lifted up above mine enemies round about me: therefore will I offer in his tabernacle sacrifices of joy; I will sing, yea, I will sing praises unto the Lord.
    Psalm 27:6

    By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name.
    Heb 13:15

    I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
    Rom 12:1

    But even if I am being poured out like a drink offering on the sacrifice and service coming from your faith, I am glad and rejoice with all of you.
    Phil 2:17

    I have received full payment and have more than enough. I am amply supplied, now that I have received from Epaphroditus the gifts you sent. They are a fragrant offering, an acceptable sacrifice, pleasing to God.
    Phil 4:18
    dcontroversal and Billyd like this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



  2. #1422
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    what does that mean Magenta?

    We are corruptible in the context of being mortal and subject to disease and death.

    We are also corruptible in the sense that temptation still exists.

    Yet none of that has anything to do with what I am talking about.

    My point relates to character, to the condition of the heart.

    Genuine children of God are inwardly pure for they have put off the old man and have put on the new via the washing of regeneration. We thus now presently abide in union with Jesus Christ, the Spirit of His life, Christ in us the hope of glory.

  3. #1423
    Senior Member Grace777x70's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    Grace Guy,

    You are just dancing again and repeating your circular talking points.

    The elephant is obvious. You deny manifest heart purity in the genuine believer.

    You'll refer to this or that but the one thing you will NEVER do is advocate that a genuine child God has a truly pure heart having been truly cleansed in redemption.

    You'll dance around that point because you uphold a positional salvation in which a defiled heart remains, which is why people like you can never advocate that all the sins of the flesh must stop.

    You uphold a sinning religion with Jesus being a cloak for iniquity.
    Just a bunch of religious garbage and complete slander. For a "sinless perfectionists in the flesh" guy - in your religion you will end up in hell by your behavior. Thank God for the grace of God in the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ.

    I maintain that the heart of the believer has been cleansed and I have written about this over 50x times at least. So, to keep your malice and slander down to a minimum - I will repeat what the scriptures say about the heart of the believer in Christ. Hopefully it'll help others out to rely on Christ for their life and living and not their own D.I.Y. self-righteousness/holiness.

    You do realize that malice and slandering people are just as much sins of the flesh as living the homosexual lifestyle?

    All born-again Christians are pure in heart. It's the same reason why all water is wet. It's the very nature of it.

    Thank God that the gospel of the grace of Christ has given us believers a new heart which is pure because it is in Christ!

    I believe that scripture teaches that we have new hearts now in Christ as a new creation in Him.

    In the Old Testament David cried out prophetically - looking into this New Covenant and sais - "Create in me a clean heart O God". Jesus Himself says to "clean up the inside of the cup and the vessel will be clean".

    We don't need to search our hearts for wrong things - we need to have our minds renewed to the truth of Christ living in us now.

    It's the flesh that "speaks" to us as all the "works" in Gal 5 are from the flesh. We are not "in the flesh" as Paul says in Romans 8:9 - but we are "in the Spirit" - our inner man in Christ.

    We need as Christians to learn to live from this new heart that was "created" in us because of Christ's finished work for us.

    I firmly believe we are confusing the "desires of the flesh which still has the law of sin in it" ( Romans 7:23 ) and wrongly calling it our heart.

    We have been circumcised with the circumcision of the heart - called the circumcision of Christ and the body of flesh. Col 2:11. This is also called "being sealed by the Holy Spirit" Eph 1:13

    The Holy Spirit "cut away" ( as in physical circumcision ) the body of the flesh from the inner man who is in Christ - the new creation - created in righteousness and holiness. Eph 4:23

    Here are the reasons why I believe we Christians have a new heart now in Christ and not a corrupted heart. We need to learn how to live from this new heart which is where Christ is in us as one spirit by the Holy Spirit.

    The believers new heart in Christ is created in righteousness and holiness: First it was prophesied in the Old Testament.

    Ezekiel 36:26 (NASB)
    26 "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone ( old man ) from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. ( new man in Christ )


    Romans 2:29 (NASB)
    29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.

    By grace we have been given a new heart that is obedient.

    Romans 6:17 (NASB)
    17 But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you
    became obedient from the heartto that form of teaching to which you were committed,

    God cleaned house and moved in. God will not dwell in unrighteousness. God through the Holy Spirit is in our inner man now.

    Ephesians 3:16-17 (NASB)
    16 that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power
    through His Spirit in the inner man,

    17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

    God sealed us and gave us the Holy Spirit in our new hearts.

    2 Corinthians 1:22 (NASB)
    22 who also sealed us and gave us
    t he Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

    We have the Spirit of God's Son in our hearts now.

    Galatians 4:6 (NASB)
    6 Because you are sons, God has sent forth
    the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"

    God has cleansed our hearts by faith.


    Acts 15:8-9 (NASB)
    8 "And God,
    who knows the heart, testified to them giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He also did to us;

    9 and He made no distinction between us and them,
    cleansing their hearts by faith.

    We love from our hearts now as it is pure.


    1 Timothy 1:5 (NASB)
    5 But the goal of our instruction i
    s love from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.

    2 Timothy 2:22 (NASB)
    22 Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace,
    with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. (this is a believer in Christ..hang around them )

    1 Peter 3:4 (NASB)
    4 but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God.

    There are more but this should work to show that the believer has a new heart in Christ.

    We still have the flesh to deal with in our bodies and we are admonished to not to yield to that...but all that is a different subject.
    Last edited by Grace777x70; March 20th, 2017 at 02:37 PM.
    dcontroversal likes this.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  4. #1424
    Senior Member Magenta's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    what does that mean Magenta?

    We are corruptible in the context of being mortal and subject to disease and death.

    We are also corruptible in the sense that temptation still exists.

    Yet none of that has anything to do with what I am talking about.

    My point relates to character, to the condition of the heart.

    Genuine children of God are inwardly pure for they have put off the old man and have put on the new via the washing of regeneration. We thus now presently abide in union with Jesus Christ, the Spirit of His life, Christ in us the hope of glory.
    I do understand that you are talking about the condition of the heart. Corruptibility is separated from mortality in that verse, even if ascribed similar meanings; the reason for death is sin, and we all die the first death, for all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you say you are without sin, you deceive yourself, and the Truth is not in you. Jesus is our intercessor in the here and now because we are being accused constantly by Satan before God. If we were 100% blameless 100% of the time, Satan would have no ammunition. Everything that does not come from faith is sin.
    dcontroversal likes this.


    Embrace the Grace and Rejoice in His Everlasting Mercy and Love

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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Grace Guy,

    You're a Gnostic religionist.


    That last post of yours is obviously advocating duelist dogma. No wonder you can advocate manifest filthiness of conduct at tge same time as a positional purity.

    That is the sin cloak you believe in that I was alluding to earlier.

    The elephant remains. You simply cannot advocate a manifest heart purity that by necessity manifests righteous conduct.

    You bring up the "flesh" and some notion of some "sin indwelling" as if sin is some kind of substance. That is Gnosticism 101.

    The Bible teaches that faith works by love and that love works no ill. Yet you have the ongoing working of ill and blame it on the flesh.

    Your religion has zero power. There is no redemption in it.

    Genuine faith overcomes the world.

    1Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

    Genuine faith overcomes the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh, and the pride of life.

    1Jn 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

    The elephant in the room is that you cannot advocate a real manifest actual victory in Christ, only an imaginary positional abstract one.
    Stunnedbygrace likes this.

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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    Grace Guy,

    You're a Gnostic religionist.


    That last post of yours is obviously advocating duelist dogma. No wonder you can advocate manifest filthiness of conduct at tge same time as a positional purity.

    That is the sin cloak you believe in that I was alluding to earlier.

    The elephant remains. You simply cannot advocate a manifest heart purity that by necessity manifests righteous conduct.

    You bring up the "flesh" and some notion of some "sin indwelling" as if sin is some kind of substance. That is Gnosticism 101.

    The Bible teaches that faith works by love and that love works no ill. Yet you have the ongoing working of ill and blame it on the flesh.

    Your religion has zero power. There is no redemption in it.

    Genuine faith overcomes the world.

    1Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

    Genuine faith overcomes the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh, and the pride of life.

    1Jn 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

    The elephant in the room is that you cannot advocate a real manifest actual victory in Christ, only an imaginary positional abstract one.
    Show us your power. Manifest your equality with God.
    dcontroversal likes this.

  7. #1427
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Magenta View Post
    I do understand that you are talking about the condition of the heart. Corruptibility is separated from mortality in that verse, even if ascribed similar meanings; the reason for death is sin, and we all die the first death, for all sin and fall short of the glory of God. If you say you are without sin, you deceive yourself, and the Truth is not in you. Jesus is our intercessor in the here and now because we are being accused constantly by Satan before God. If we were 100% blameless 100% of the time, Satan would have no ammunition. Everything that does not come from faith is sin.
    You are just like Grace Guy. Someone who upholds the same dead religion which denies any real victory in Christ.

    You even pull 1Joh 1:8 as if John was arguing in favour of ongoing wickedness in a believer. How foolish! That is an utter denial of redemption and the power of God.

    The issue is the heart and God is in the business of purifyng hearts. Faith purifies the heart and our souls are purified through obedience to the truth. Anyone who truly yields themsleves wholeheartedly to the grace of God is quickened or made alive by that grace. The Gospel is power, real power. By defending ongoing filthiness in salvation you deny that power of the Gospel, instead advocating a mere cloak for vice.

    Again the elephant remains, a denial of genuine manifest heart purity.

  8. #1428
    Senior Member Grace777x70's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    Grace Guy,

    You're a Gnostic religionist.


    That last post of yours is obviously advocating duelist dogma. No wonder you can advocate manifest filthiness of conduct at tge same time as a positional purity.

    That is the sin cloak you believe in that I was alluding to earlier.

    The elephant remains. You simply cannot advocate a manifest heart purity that by necessity manifests righteous conduct.

    You bring up the "flesh" and some notion of some "sin indwelling" as if sin is some kind of substance. That is Gnosticism 101.

    The Bible teaches that faith works by love and that love works no ill. Yet you have the ongoing working of ill and blame it on the flesh.

    Your religion has zero power. There is no redemption in it.

    Genuine faith overcomes the world.

    1Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

    Genuine faith overcomes the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh, and the pride of life.

    1Jn 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

    The elephant in the room is that you cannot advocate a real manifest actual victory in Christ, only an imaginary positional abstract one.
    More nonsense. My goodness your slander is going to send you to hell according to your religion.

    I advocate that it's only by relying on the grace of Christ that we can truly live godly lives in Christ. I have written over 100x times that as we have received Christ ( which is by grace through faith ) - so we walk in Him. Col.2:6

    The fact is - there is sin in our flesh just like Paul said there was in Romans 7:17-22. Not understanding this is a stumbling block to the "sinless perfection in the flesh" believers. They do not know the difference between "sin" the noun and "sinning" the verb that Paul is talking about in Romans chapters 6-7.

    I said this a few times before and I will say it again - the natural mind of man cannot see the realities of the new creation in Christ. It will constantly be trying to refute the new inner man created in righteousness and holiness and it will be complete foolishness to it and "appear" to be gnostic. This is where they come up with having to "maintain" their salvation for going to be with the Lord for eternity.

    One of the reasons gnostics were birthed is because of the truth the apostles were talking about in the new birth in Christ - the new man circumcised with the hand of God in separating the flesh from the inner man in Christ...aka the circumcision of Christ. The natural mind of man took over and created their own "reality" - apart from Christ.

    This isn't even remotely close to true believers in Christ. Everything to do with the new creation is because we are "in Christ". Paul talked about the true believer being in Christ in some form 140X times in his letters.
    dcontroversal likes this.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  9. #1429
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    This is real...

    Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

    Jesus gave Himself for us that He might redeem us from ALL iniquity and purify unto Hinself a peculiar people. These redeemed and purified people would be zealous of righteousness.

    Present purity is the very opposite of ongoing filthiness.
    Stunnedbygrace likes this.

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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace777x70 View Post
    The sky is blue....
    The sun is out, the sky is blue, there's not a cloud to spoil the view.

    Well unless you live over here then it's,

    The sun is not out, the sky is not blue and there are many grey clouds.

    I might come and live where you do as the sky is always blue
    dcontroversal and Grace777x70 like this.
    Lord

    Help me to be the person my dog thinks I am.

  11. #1431
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post


    You bring up the "flesh" and some notion of some "sin indwelling" as if sin is some kind of substance. That is Gnosticism 101.

    .
    This should help you to know the difference between "sin" - the noun used in Romans 6:14 "sin shall not have dominion over you" and "sinning" the verb which is the action of sinning.

    In order to understand Romans 6-7 ( and then finally chapter 8 where the Spirit comes in ) we need to understand the difference between "sin" and "sinning".

    Not knowing this leads to all kinds of doctrines like this "sinless perfection in the flesh" one that some try to promote. This doctrine will upset the faith of the young Christian and really in the end promote turmoil in their minds and ship-wreck their faith.

    This will also create a works-righteousness mindset instead of a faith-righteousness one that is completely fixed on Christ's completed work for the believer.

    We will always have the flesh with us and anyone that says they never are "sinning" have a very low opinion of the holiness of God and are only thinking of the "biggie sins" which they don't do.

    Malice and slander and things like these ( Gal. 5:21 ) are just as destructive as living a homosexual lifestyle.

    There is a difference between sin the noun and sinning the verb. Set free from sin does not mean set free from sinning entirely the rest of one's life. Sin the noun has been guaranteed in the flesh which is why the Holy Spirit circumcised our hearts ( where He lives and is joined as one in the spirit with us) from the body of flesh.

    Romans chapter 6 and 7 uses the noun "sin" 48x times ( which speaks of the law of sin that is in our flesh ) and only once as the verb which is the action of "sinning".

    Here is what Vine's describes this "law of sin" that is in the flesh - acting through the members of our body when we yield to it.

    "a governing principle or power, e.g.,
    Rom. 6:6; "(the body) of sin," here "sin" is spoken of as an organized power, acting through the members of the body, "

    Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old Testament and New Testament Words.



    The set free from sin ( the noun ) is relating to not having to be subject anymore to the flesh because we have been sealed in our spirit in our inner man in Christ. - the new creation in Him.

    The law of sin is in the flesh and will be there until we leave this earth. Romans 7:19-22. which is where we are not "in the flesh" as Paul says in Romans 8:9 : BUT "in the Spirit".

    Colossians 2:11 (NASB)
    11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

    Now we are to walk by the Spirit so that we will not fulfill the flesh to do "its" desires. Romans 6:13

    As our minds get renewed to the truth of Christ and what He has already done for us - the Holy Spirit transforms us and we live a holier life. This is all God's work but we participate in it with Him. ( sometimes this is also called the saving of the soul which the mind is a part of )
    dcontroversal likes this.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  12. #1432
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by BillG View Post
    The sun is out, the sky is blue, there's not a cloud to spoil the view.

    Well unless you live over here then it's,

    The sun is not out, the sky is not blue and there are many grey clouds.

    I might come and live where you do as the sky is always blue
    If you need blue sky then the best bet is where I live in Florida.
    Grace777x70 and BillG like this.
    M & M's melt in your mouth and not in your hands.

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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by BillG View Post
    The sun is out, the sky is blue, there's not a cloud to spoil the view.

    Well unless you live over here then it's,

    The sun is not out, the sky is not blue and there are many grey clouds.

    I might come and live where you do as the sky is always blue

    Lol....I hear ya!

    We say the sky is blue......but others say we are saying it is green.

    Then they proceed to call others names and insult them because of what they make up in their own minds they are saying.

    They are just slandering people. It's funny that some of the very ones that say we are to live pure lives are the ones slandering others and are full of malice and hatred to others in the body of Christ. Go figure...


    That is a tell-tale sign of a religious spirit dominating their minds. They hate the grace of God that is manifested in Christ's work on the cross and resurrection because it dis-qualifies their "work" of righteousness.
    BillG likes this.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  14. #1434
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by tourist View Post
    If you need blue sky then the best bet is where I live in Florida.
    Only been to Florida once and that was for my honeymoon.

    I am actually a director for a tour operator that sells bespoke holidays to the USA
    tourist likes this.
    Lord

    Help me to be the person my dog thinks I am.

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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    The understanding of the circumcision of Christ where the new creation in Christ is "cut away" from the flesh is a life changing revelation of the wonderful awesome work that our Lord did when we died with Him on the cross and rose again to being a new creation - joined as one spirit with Him for eternity - sealed by the Holy Spirit who raised Jesus from the dead.

    The truth is that Jesus has already saved us from our sins. If we don't know that - then a lot of the good news of what Jesus did will be a blurr to us.

    We will end up searching for sin in our lives constantly and I have news for all of us. There will be sin in our flesh until we get rid of theses bodies.

    We will be constantly trying to clean up the flesh but the only way to not fulfill the lusts of the flesh is by the Spirit in us.

    That is why the circumcision of Christ is imperative to understand in order to grow up in Christ.

    Abraham's circumcision was a shadow of being circumcised in Christ now from our flesh. We are cut away from the flesh and our inner man of the new creation - our new spirit created in righteousness and holiness in Christ.

    What do we do with the old flesh that is cut away? We throw it out and you can not have it put back on as it is dead. The same goes for our spiritual circumcision in which our flesh is cut away from our inner man - the spirit where Christ dwells.

    We are completely sealed by the Holy Spirit within our spirit in our circumcision in Christ.

    Understanding spiritual circumcision is important to get a revelation of the new creation in Christ now and to the understanding that our new hearts are pure now because our heart and Christ are one spirit - created in righteousness and holiness - by the incorruptible seed of God which abides forever.

    When scriptures talk about the circumcision ( cutting away from) of the heart and of the flesh - it is 2 sides of the same coin.

    Romans 2:29 (NASB)
    29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.


    Colossians 2:11 (NASB)
    11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands,in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

    One day we will have this corruptible body put on immortality with a new body free from sin and death.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  16. #1436
    Senior Member Magenta's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    You are just like Grace Guy. Someone who upholds the same dead religion which denies any real victory in Christ.

    You even pull 1Joh 1:8 as if John was arguing in favour of ongoing wickedness in a believer. How foolish! That is an utter denial of redemption and the power of God.

    The issue is the heart and God is in the business of purifyng hearts. Faith purifies the heart and our souls are purified through obedience to the truth. Anyone who truly yields themsleves wholeheartedly to the grace of God is quickened or made alive by that grace. The Gospel is power, real power. By defending ongoing filthiness in salvation you deny that power of the Gospel, instead advocating a mere cloak for vice.

    Again the elephant remains, a denial of genuine manifest heart purity.
    As if John was arguing in favor of ongoing sin? How foolish and deceitful you are! Children of Satan are liars like you. Jesus said so. Thanks for showing us the disgusting filthiness of your heart


    Embrace the Grace and Rejoice in His Everlasting Mercy and Love

  17. #1437
    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Go to the Family forum and read the plethora of porn, adultery, and divorce threads. Then come back here and tell us how Christians don't sin anymore, after being saved..



    Quote Originally Posted by Skinski7 View Post
    You are just like Grace Guy. Someone who upholds the same dead religion which denies any real victory in Christ.

    You even pull 1Joh 1:8 as if John was arguing in favour of ongoing wickedness in a believer. How foolish! That is an utter denial of redemption and the power of God.

    The issue is the heart and God is in the business of purifyng hearts. Faith purifies the heart and our souls are purified through obedience to the truth. Anyone who truly yields themsleves wholeheartedly to the grace of God is quickened or made alive by that grace. The Gospel is power, real power. By defending ongoing filthiness in salvation you deny that power of the Gospel, instead advocating a mere cloak for vice.

    Again the elephant remains, a denial of genuine manifest heart purity.
    Billyd and Sirk like this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



  18. #1438
    Senior Member Grace777x70's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Romans 7 shows the two conflicts that are going on in a believer. One is not real them ( not their true nature ). The flesh even though it stems from the corrupted Adamic influence in the world is now not the real us.

    When we die and go to be with the Lord - the flesh is not coming with us!...selah

    The flesh and the law of sin in our body - it wages war against the real us in Christ. Romans 7:14-22

    The flesh is ways to think and act that "were" the manner of living we had when we were in Adam but now are left over the old man died on the cross with Christ. ( Eph 4:22 - in reference to your former manner of living )

    Romans 7:17-18 (NASB)
    17 So now, no longer am I ( the new man ) the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me (in my body which has the flesh with the power of sin in it ).

    18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me (my body which has the flesh in it ), that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me ( in my new man ), but the doing of the good is not.

    Romans 7:20-23 (NASB)
    20 But if I am doing the very thing I ( new man) do not want, I ( new man ) am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me ( the law of sin in the flesh).

    21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me (new man ), the one who wants to do good.

    22 For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man, ( new man in Christ),

    23 but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.

    italics = my words

    Then Romans chapter 8 comes in and shows us how to walk according to the Spirit and not the flesh to put to death the deeds of the body ( flesh in the body ). Rom 8:13

    We are not fighting a civil war within ourselves ( the flesh and the law of sin do not belong to our new nature which in Christ. ). Jesus said " A house divided will not stand."

    We do not have "2 selves" we have the true self in Christ and we still have the flesh. Even though the flesh manifests "itself" with "its" lusts through our bodies - it is not the real us in Christ.

    We are still responsible for the deeds done in the body as they will affect our life here on this earth and we are to yield our members to the righteousness that is in us in Christ.

    Sin is destructive and will destroy us and those around us if we don't walk by the Spirit - our true selves in Christ because Christ is joined to our spirit and His life will bear fruit on us the branches. The Holy Spirit transforms us as we behold the glory of the Lord as in a mirror.

    Sin is deceitful and distorts our view of our loving Father, ourselves and others.

    We have such a great salvation in our Lord Jesus Christ! Let's keep our eyes on the Lord and not the circumstances of life. Peter walking on the water is a perfect picture of the true Christian life.
    Last edited by Grace777x70; March 20th, 2017 at 03:39 PM.
    The new man in Christ - the new creation that is created in righteousness and

    holiness hears the heart voice of the Spirit and not an old head noise of the letter

    of the word. The Pharisees knew "bible knowledge" but they did not

    know God's heart and so they erred in really understanding what the

    scriptures were saying.


    The Lord wants us to look through His eyes and to live from His heart towards

    people, towards Him and towards ourselves as well.

  19. #1439
    Senior Member JIMBO43's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterJens View Post
    Here is the problem. God declares people righteous on two issues.
    The first is knowing Him, and the second is walking in His ways.

    Sin is defined through the law, though in truth it is always an approximation.
    Obedience is also about the heart and actually loving people.

    Now your version of faith is we can never walk in obedience to God, so we
    trust in Christ alone. It continues in failure and sin, without resolution, except
    getting an imputed clearance.

    Our version is Christ changes our hearts so we can walk pleasingly in the Lord,
    a life worthy of Christ.

    If you cannot get to the walk of Christ, ever, then ofcourse failure is irrelevant,
    because one failure is as big as total failure on every level. It is the legalists
    nighmare, no commitment as to why the law is there or what love and righteousness
    actually are, it is just we are in defeat, and we realise this more day after day.

    But most of what Paul is writing about is about the walk, the path, walking in
    the Spirit without condemnation, because ones walk is pleasing to God.

    It struck me how in our language we can say through the cross we gain the
    righteousness of Christ. This can mean imputed righteousness, ie we are still
    failed sinners, but counted righteous, or we actually are empowered to literally
    walk righteously. Paul implies exactly that, we are empowered to walk righteously
    as unto the Spirit.

    So whatever mark you want to put up, God is saying His people can reach it.

    I have received full payment and have more than enough. I am amply supplied, now that I have received from Epaphroditus the gifts you sent. They are a fragrant offering, an acceptable sacrifice, pleasing to God.
    Phil 4:18

    Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship.
    Rom 12:1

    Therefore, since we have these promises, dear friends, let us purify ourselves from everything that contaminates body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God.
    2 Cor 7:1

    But whoever looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues in it—not forgetting what they have heard, but doing it—they will be blessed in what they do.
    James 1:25

    The truth is you see what you look for is scripture.
    If you want to ignore perfection, holiness, being acceptable, you can easily do this.
    But not reading scripture and just have faith in your head is another sure way to
    go astray.
    AMEN BRO

  20. #1440
    Senior Member JIMBO43's Avatar
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    Default Re: Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer

    YA NEED TO TURN YA VOLUME RIGHT UP AND PRAY FOR THE MORMONS THIS IS A GOOD WORK AND IF YOU DENY THIS YOU ARE AN UNBELIEVER

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