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Thread: 1 peter 1:19

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Magenta View Post
    Jesus said ours was a better covenant. I would hate to have lived thousands of years ago, or even hundreds, under the law, such that it was. We are not under the law, for it has been nailed to the cross of Christ, who fulfilled all the requirements of the law, lived a blameless life, and gave Himself willingly as a payment for sin under the requirements of the law.

    We have made so much progress and gained much freedom and yet there remains the struggle for ultimate control and power, mostly through governments, which are meant to serve as well as lead, yet they are prey to many forces that seem to have questionable motives, some simply pecuniary. Yet no matter how much progress we make, much is always lacking, and I see this so much clearer in today's polarized political climate. It is interesting to realize the climate has always been polarized. It never used to interest me much before, but world conditions from a Christian perspective especially, have really made me sit up and take notice.
    Humanity, at least in what we know as the western world, seems to have reached an impasse, and nothing short of Christ's return will suffice, for man is deeply flawed in his fallen state.
    And yet, we are under the law of the Spirit in us. And I break that law of the Spirit in me if I murder you in my heart. And I exacerbate the breaking of it by lying and saying I wasn't angry when all can see by my arrogant, officious speech in which I call you ignorant, a wolf in sheep's clothing, a false teacher, etc., that I was clearly angry and wanted to hurt and cut you with my words. And even if I didn't in fact get angry, the arrogance and lack of humility alone is a breaking of the law of this Spirit in me.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    What purpose would there be in Jesus going to talk with the spirits of the disobedient who are now in prison? Any thoughts?

    Also, why is the word "now" in italic print in my bible? What is the reason for the italics? Is it because they aren't certain the word should be there or because...there's no real english word to convey the greek word...? I've always wondered but never asked.
    This blog explains why...

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by OneFaith View Post
    I think you mean 1 Peter 3:19. See back in the days of Noah, when they were saved by the ark, they"re salvation was not complete- just postponed. Only one thing saves from sin- and that is Christ's blood, but He hadn't died yet. Christ died once for all people- whether they were in the past, present, or future. To those who obeyed God in their lifetime, according to the covenant that they personally lived under, the blood of Christ was applied.

    So we were once imprisoned, like those in slavery in Egypt. But just as they were saved through water (parting the sea), or like how they were saved through water in Noah's ark, we are saved spiritually through water (not by water) when we are baptized into Christ (Romans 6:3). Because Christ shed His life-saving blood in His death- and we come in contact with it when we are baptized into His death.
    I really enjoyed your observation, Sister OneFaith. I did not really see that salvation through water was just a physical salvation, that is, just a mere separation from the world.
    "Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." (Hosea 6.3).

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    What purpose would there be in Jesus going to talk with the spirits of the disobedient who are now in prison? Any thoughts?

    Also, why is the word "now" in italic print in my bible? What is the reason for the italics? Is it because they aren't certain the word should be there or because...there's no real english word to convey the greek word...? I've always wondered but never asked.
    To give them an opportunity to accept the Gospel and be saved from Hell.....

    1 Peter 3:KJV
    18 "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: {19} By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; {20} Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    My fav trans.

    which were formerly disobedient, in the days of Noah, when the long suffering of God commanded an ark to be made, in hope of their repentance; and eight souls only entered into it, and were kept alive in the waters.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Adstar View Post
    To give them an opportunity to accept the Gospel and be saved from Hell.....

    1 Peter 3:KJV
    18 "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: {19} By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; {20} Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."
    Yes, this is what I came to in looking into it yesterday. We have had the gospel freely preached to us so it would seem unfair for them to not have that same opportunity because the gospel was hidden in the OT. It seemed sometimes to me that by some of our doctrines or explanations, they just got the raw deal and we got the better one. So now I think they maybe did get that same opportunity and 1 Peter seems to say so.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    Yes, this is what I came to in looking into it yesterday. We have had the gospel freely preached to us so it would seem unfair for them to not have that same opportunity because the gospel was hidden in the OT. It seemed sometimes to me that by some of our doctrines or explanations, they just got the raw deal and we got the better one. So now I think they maybe did get that same opportunity and 1 Peter seems to say so.
    Though they did get a opportunity for many years Noah was building the Ark, though they shewed him and laughed at him.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    Yes, this is what I came to in looking into it yesterday. We have had the gospel freely preached to us so it would seem unfair for them to not have that same opportunity because the gospel was hidden in the OT. It seemed sometimes to me that by some of our doctrines or explanations, they just got the raw deal and we got the better one. So now I think they maybe did get that same opportunity and 1 Peter seems to say so.
    Well they where guilty of their sins against God.. So i do not believe it can be called a raw deal..

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Adstar View Post
    Well they where guilty of their sins against God.. So i do not believe it can be called a raw deal..
    And we are guilty of our sins against God too, but have the good luck of hearing the gospel, having our sins forgiven and receiving the Holy Spirit. They are held to their sins without the benefit of the good news so they got the raw deal. So 1 peter says (in my opinion) that He went and proclaimed it to those from the ancient world who were in prison. This seems wonderfully fair to me and it resolves my problems with some doctrine that seems to me to connote that they are going to hell for not obeying the law, even though no one can keep it, and we are going to heaven because we were born at a better time in which we heard the good news that saves us from our sin. I mean...it's how my mind thinks about it - that it was not fair, that the deck was stacked against them. So 1 peter deals with it.

    Some doctrine just seems a little off to me. Or maybe it isn't really doctrine but just what I've heard men say in trying to resolve it. It doesn't quite sit right.
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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    The Law did not apply here, because there was no Law as of yet. The flood was before Abram or Abraham, who hundreds of years before Moses and the Law. So what is the Scripture saying in context.

    1 Peter 3:18-20 "For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison, who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water."

    Christ was made alive "by the Spirit" He was raised by the Holy Spirit, "by whom also" so by the Spirit, Christ preached to these spirit that are in prison, notice Peter uses the word "in", if these spirits had been preached a salvation message and excepted it Peter should be using the word "were", so when does the Spirit preach to these judged spirits? If He did in the three days while He was died, it would be giving them a second chance, so it couldn't be at that time. We have to add what Abraham said about the place of torment, it's a fixed place no one can leave it. Luke 16:25-26 "But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that you in your lifetime received your good things, and Lazarus in like manner bad things; but now he is comforted here, and you are in anguish. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, in order that those who would pass from here to you may not be able, and none may cross from there to us." There would be no purpose for Christ through the Spirit to preach to those imprisoned spirits, because they couldn't leave if they excepted the message.One last thought, why, would the Lord preach to these spirits and not to all the spirits that had been disobedient before Christ's time here on earth.

    It would seem that Christ preached to these spirit in the time of Noah, while Noah was building the ark, because "Divine long-suffering"
    was waiting for them to repent while the ark was being built.

    2 Peter 2:5 seem to help interpret the context of those verses. "
    and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bring in the flood on the world of the ungodly;" The context of this verse is judgement. Then if you look back at Genesis 6:3 it speaks of the Holy Spirit striving with man. "And the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years." The Darby translation says "plead" the NIV "contend", so it seem as though the Spirit of God was dealing with these wicked people (spirits), by Noah's preaching righteousness to them through the Spirit that raised Christ from the died.
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    Exclamation Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by OneFaith View Post
    Jesus said "How can a man rob a strong man's house, unless he first ties up the strong man?" What Jesus meant is Satan is a strong man, and like Robin Hood, Jesus must first bind his power before he can rob us back from him. We are no longer satan's prisoners, death no longer has dominion over us. Because...
    Please allow me a remark, sister OneFaith: the brave represents every person who has no intimacy with Christ. The bravest one is Ha-Satan, who tries to chase our lives.
    "Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." (Hosea 6.3).

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    And we are guilty of our sins against God too, but have the good luck of hearing the gospel, having our sins forgiven and receiving the Holy Spirit. They are held to their sins without the benefit of the good news so they got the raw deal. So 1 peter says (in my opinion) that He went and proclaimed it to those from the ancient world who were in prison. This seems wonderfully fair to me and it resolves my problems with some doctrine that seems to me to connote that they are going to hell for not obeying the law, even though no one can keep it, and we are going to heaven because we were born at a better time in which we heard the good news that saves us from our sin. I mean...it's how my mind thinks about it - that it was not fair, that the deck was stacked against them. So 1 peter deals with it.

    Some doctrine just seems a little off to me. Or maybe it isn't really doctrine but just what I've heard men say in trying to resolve it. It doesn't quite sit right.
    You are probably right.

    We will find out for sure one day.

    Even at the GWT Judgment,the sinners are tried. That implies,to me,some squeak through....maybe?

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by BeyondET View Post
    Though they did get a opportunity for many years Noah was building the Ark, though they shewed him and laughed at him.
    But it wasn't the same opportunity of hearing the gospel we have heard, that He died to give us back to God, sins washed by the blood and done with. And the receiving of the Holy Spirit because of this, without which no one can be obedient from the heart and thereby actually have a clean conscience by walking in that Spirit.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by popeye View Post
    You are probably right.

    We will find out for sure one day.

    Even at the GWT Judgment,the sinners are tried. That implies,to me,some squeak through....maybe?
    I've wondered about this, because of the vss that say things like, it will be worse for them on that day than the people of Sodom. My first thought was...hell is hell. How is one person better off than another in hell...?

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    I've wondered about this, because of the vss that say things like, it will be worse for them on that day than the people of Sodom. My first thought was...hell is hell. How is one person better off than another in hell...?
    Well maybe Jesus went down to Hell and preached to the spirits and many of the people who where destroyed in Sodom believed Jesus and where saved....... The ones that are in a worse condition then Sodom are those that reject the gospel truth of Jesus in this life time and remain in that rejection till the day they die... Certainly their ending in the eternal lake of fire will be much worse then the people of Sodom who spent some time in Hell...

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Dcontroversal made a good point that he called the key .(#9)

    My two cents. I would offer the reference in 1 Peter 3, is in respect to receiving the end of our faith that alone comes from hearing God. As it reads earlier in 1 Peter 1, the redemption of our souls.

    It is part of the context of 1 Peter 3 having to do with prisoners who were released as the promised glory that followed ...it is finished . The graves of those prisoners were opened and many old testament saints who had the Spirit of Christ in them were awaiting the results of the trial of Christ .

    Those (old testament saints) reflected the glory spoken of were moved to their abode in the new heavenly Jerusalem , the first resurrection. Many angel witnessed that event of their new spirits and soul entering that Holy City now that Christ had finished the work nothing could hold them .

    Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the "sufferings of Christ", and the glory that should follow.1 Peter 1:9-11

    We simply look back to that manner of time and the glory that followed when those saints were released from what the scriptures call prison a sort of holding pen needed until the veil was rent .
    The glory that did follow as it reads...

    Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. Mat 27:50

    For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; 1Pe 3:18

    It would seem to be saying he had preached the gospel to those born again spirits also who were in prison, just as us today who do not experience that temporal delay. Today for a believer to be absent of the body is to be present with those old testament saints, fast asleep waiting for the second resurrection on the last day judgment day for those who believe not.(no faith)

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    The place where Jesus went after His death on the cross was a different place then hades, He went to a "holding place". Just my opinion here, but I believe that some of the people before the flood were trying to follow God but did not attain to the righteousness necessary in order to be saved from the flood, but could be saved by hearing the gospel. They had been in prison for around two thousand years so I bet they were very eager to accept Jesus as Savior.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    Quote Originally Posted by Stunnedbygrace View Post
    I've wondered about this, because of the vss that say things like, it will be worse for them on that day than the people of Sodom. My first thought was...hell is hell. How is one person better off than another in hell...?
    Are there different degrees of punishment in hell? Matthew 23:14 - Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you devour widows’ houses, even while for a pretense you make long prayers; therefore you shall receive greater condemnation.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    For the idea that the angels are the sons of God of Genesis 6, angels can't have sex. Matthew 22:29-30 "Jesus answered and said to them, “You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God. For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven."

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    Default Re: 1 peter 1:19

    This is one of those places in the bible that seems to be a stalemate because you have scripture on both sides of the issue. Jesus clearly said that those who would get a new body would not marry or be given in marriage and would be equal to the angels. This has led to the assumption that angels of all ages and all types could never have sex, which of course contradicts the story in Genesis and Jude and Peter, where angels had sex with human women and were also punished by God for doing so. The story about SOME angels having had sex with women is so clear that I cannot in good conscience pretend that it does not say that. My opinion, in the past SOME angels were capable of having sex and did so with women even having children.

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