Sabbath

[Hizikyah]

Hi Hizikyah,

Do you think we are still to live under the Mosaic law? If yes why, if not why?

I think the Law of YHWH is the narrow path. The pharisee types completely disobeyed it, changed it and hated it, Yahshua taught the true intention of it;

1 Timothy 1:5, “Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned.”

1 Timothy 1:5-7, " But the goal* of the commandment is love from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. For some men, straying from these things, have turned aside to fruitless discussion, wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions."

(goal)is word #G5056 –télos; Greek Dictionary (Lexicon-Concordance) - #5056 telos {tel'-os} from a primary tello (to set out for a definite point or goal)

HELPS Word-studies – 5056 télos (a neuter noun) – properly, consummation (the end-goal, purpose), such as closure with all its results.

I think people that reject it call it of Moses rather than the Law of YHWH because just that, they dont want to follow it. In Moses day the was a Levitical priesthood, now Yahshua is High Priest after the order of the Messenger of Righteousness, and yes we are to obey it, why? This is why;

Exodus 20:6, "But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws."

John/Yahanan 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."

1 Yahanan/John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of YHWH: When we love YHWH by keeping His Laws. For this is the love of YHWH: That we keep His Law, and His Law is not grievous."

Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete

Mat 5:18-19, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh – the smallest of the letters – will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected. Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of YHWH; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of YHWH." 5:20, "“For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall by no means enter into the reign of the heavens.”

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahanan, saw the holy city, YHWH Shammah, coming down from YHWH out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands. And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of YHWH is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and YHWH Himself will be with them, and be their Father.”

John 3:36, “He who believes in the Son possesses everlasting life, but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of Yah remains on him.”

John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

John/Yahanan 5:24, "Most certainly I tell you, he who hears my word, and believes him who sent me, has eternal life, and doesn't come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life."

Mat 7:21-23, "Not everyone who says to Me; Teacher! Teacher! Will enter into the Kingdom of YHWH, but only he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day; Teacher! Teacher! Have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and in Your Name performed many wonderful works? But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity."

“iniquity” is word # G0458 - anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459, Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law, 1a) because ignorant of it, 1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

Mat 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

For how could anyone who is a part of the Covenant ratified in the blood of Yahshua not seek to follow it;

Jeremiah 31:33, "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israyl: After those days, says יהוה: I will put My Law (Torah/Instructions) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people."

Hebrews 10:16, "“This is the covenant that I shall make with them after those days, says יהוה, giving My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I shall write them.”

 

[phil36]

I think the Law of YHWH is the narrow path. The pharisee types completely disobeyed it, changed it and hated it, Yahshua taught the true intention of it;

Yes, Jesus not only taught it )its real intention and purpose), He obeyed it perfectly, He not only obeyed it but died under the curse of the law. As the law is powerless to save anyone. I am not saying, as I have said before, that the law is of no use, the moral law as summed up (love God- and love your neighbour as yourself), is what the renewed heart by the Spirit enables us to actually do.. The Law could never free anyone. The Law also convicts and condemns sinners.

That is why we do not follow the law, for we cannot 'merit' our own righteousness. It is the merit of Christ that makes us 'counted' as right before God. Following the law to try and be righteous is to deny the efficacy of the incarnation, life and death and ascension of Christ.

The Righteous Shall Live by Faith

10 For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.”11 Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.”[a]12 But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.”13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”—14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit[b] through faith.

 

[Hizikyah]

Yes, Jesus not only taught it )its real intention and purpose), He obeyed it perfectly, He not only obeyed it but died under the curse of the law. As the law is powerless to save anyone. I am not saying, as I have said before, that the law is of no use, the moral law as summed up (love God- and love your neighbour as yourself), is what the renewed heart by the Spirit enables us to actually do.. The Law could never free anyone. The Law also convicts and condemns sinners.

That is why we do not follow the law, for we cannot 'merit' our own righteousness. It is the merit of Christ that makes us 'counted' as right before God. Following the law to try and be righteous is to deny the efficacy of the incarnation, life and death and ascension of Christ.

...the moral law as summed up (love God- and love your neighbour as yourself), is what the renewed heart by the Spirit enables us to actually do...

If you know it is love, real love the way He says, why not walk in it? One can not reject it, not follow it and be loving;

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”

That is why we do not follow the law, for we cannot 'merit' our own righteousness.

It not about meriting our own righteousness, it's about doing the right thing.

Isayah 42:21, "YHWH is well-pleased, for His righteousness' sake, to magnify the Law, and make it honorable."

Mat 5:18-19, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh – the smallest of the letters – will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected. Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of YHWH; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of YHWH."

Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

"iniquity" is: #0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law 1a) because ignorant of it1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

 

[phil36]

If you know it is love, real love the way He says, why not walk in it? One can not reject it, not follow it and be loving;




It not about meriting our own righteousness, it's about doing the right thing.

So doing the right thing as in following the law makes you right (Just). No need for reams of multicoloured text (sore on my eyes lol).

 

[Hizikyah]

If you know it is love, real love the way He says, why not walk in it? One can not reject it, not follow it and be loving;

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”



It not about meriting our own righteousness, it's about doing the right thing.

Isayah 42:21, "YHWH is well-pleased, for His righteousness' sake, to magnify the Law, and make it honorable."

Mat 5:18-19, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh – the smallest of the letters – will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected. Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of YHWH; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of YHWH."

Mattithyah 24:12, "And because iniquity will abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

"iniquity" is: #0458 anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the condition of without law 1a) because ignorant of it1b) because of violating it, 2) contempt and violation of law, iniquity, wickedness

So doing the right thing as in following the law makes you right (Just). No need for reams of multicoloured text (sore on my eyes lol).

I didn't say that.

It not about meriting our own righteousness, it's about doing the right thing.

Here I will give you an example.

To steal something is wrong.

To not steal is right.

 

[phil36]

I didn't say that.



Here I will give you an example.

To steal something is wrong.

To not steal is right.

Thats good, I hope we ll know right from wrong.

However the Question still stands.


What makes you right with God? How are you Just before God? And how?

 

[Hizikyah]

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law.”

Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Psalm 32:8, “Let Me instruct you and teach you in the way you should go; Let Me counsel, My eye be on you.”[/FONT]

James 2:26, "For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so the faith without works is dead also."

Revelation 22:12-15, "And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood."

Hebrews 12:14, “Pursue peace with all, and pursue set-apartness without which no one shall see the Master.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-10, "Do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the reign of Elohim? Do not be deceived. Neither those who whore, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor greedy of gain, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers shall inherit the reign of Yah.”3-

Galatians 5:19-21, "And the works of the flesh are well-known, which are these: adultery, whoring, uncleanness, indecency, idolatry, drug sorcery, hatred, quarrels, jealousies, fits of rage, selfish ambitions, dissensions, factions, envy, murders, drunkenness, wild parties, and the like – of which I forewarn you, even as I also said before, that those who practice such as these shall not inherit the reign of Yah.”

Ephesians 5:3-5, "But whoring and all uncleanness, or greed of gain, let it not even be named among you, as is proper among set-apart ones neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather thanksgiving. For this you know, that no one who whores, nor unclean one, nor one greedy of gain, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the reign of Messiah and YHWH.”

Deuteronomy 32:5, “A twisted and crooked generation has corrupted itself, Their blemish, they are not His children."

Romans 2:15, "Who show the work of the Torah written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing (condemming sin) or even excusing (justifying sin)."

1 Corinthians 6:9-11, “Do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the reign of Yah? Do not be deceived. Neither those who whore, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor greedy of gain, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers shall inherit the reign of YHWH. And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were set apart, but you were declared right in the Name of the Master יהושע and by the Spirit of our Father.”

Mat 7:21-27, "Not everyone who says to Me; Teacher! Teacher! will enter into the Kingdom of YHWH, but only he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day; Teacher! Teacher! Have we not prophesied in Your Name, and cast out demons in Your Name, and in Your Name performed many wonderful works? But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity. Therefore, everyone who hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat against that house; but it did not fall, for it was founded upon the rock. But everyone who hears these sayings of Mine, but does not do them, is like a foolish man who built his house upon the sand; And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat against that house; and it fell, and great was the fall of it."

 

[Hizikyah]

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law.”

Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

a person is justified by faith thus we establish the Law

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”[/FONT]

 

[phil36]

a person is justified by faith thus we establish the Law

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”

Hi Hizikyah,

Thanks for the scripture in your in your first post. However it still has not answered the question. I could copy and paste reams of scripture in this post and it would be meaningless if I did not explain why I was using the scripture and that it actually answered the question. Unfortunately, you haven't provided an answer .

Without context even Mormons would agree with your post (#3487).

You say a 'person is justified by faith thus establish the law'.

Is it faith alone? How does faith make you Just? and how does it establish the Law?

 

[Hizikyah]

a person is justified by faith thus we establish the Law

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”

Hi Hizikyah,

Thanks for the scripture in your in your first post. However it still has not answered the question. I could copy and paste reams of scripture in this post and it would be meaningless if I did not explain why I was using the scripture and that it actually answered the question. Unfortunately, you haven't provided an answer .

Without context even Mormons would agree with your post (#3487).

You say a 'person is justified by faith thus establish the law'.

Is it faith alone? How does faith make you Just? and how does it establish the Law?

My own words were in there;

a person is justified by faith thus we establish the Law

It has to be Yah working in ones heart, thus it is then up to the individual to walk in that path or not. Walking in it would be estblishing it as a foundation of our moral and spiritual values, not walking in it would be iniquity.

 

[loveme1]

I will say again that it is better to not teach against the Sabbath Commandment.. if you believe it is not part of Loving GOD then that is between you and GOD.. but for those that believe that the Messiah taught us to Keep and teach even the least Commandment and believe it is about Loving GOD through Faith in His Son as much as the other 9.. and the base of Love is the 10.... Worry not for we all here have the Faith of Yahshua and are under Grace at liberty to love and obey.

If our error according to many is in Loving GOD how He Himself instructs then GOD is Gracious and Merciful and we will fair well... but I would not want to be the person whom teaches against His Sabbath Commandment.

 

[Hizikyah]

It has to be Yah working in ones heart, thus it is then up to the individual to walk in that path or not. Walking in it would be estblishing it as a foundation of our moral and spiritual values, not walking in it would be iniquity.

Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the commands of Yah and possessing the witness of יהושעMessiah."

Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the commands of יהוה and the belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”

That is why this is the mark of YHWH head/faith and hand/works.

Exodus 13:9, “And it shall be as a *sign to you on your hand and as a reminder between your eyes, that the Torah (Instructions/Law) of יהוה is to be in your mouth, for with a strong hand יהוה has brought you out of Mitsrayim.”

The word *Sign is word #H226 – owth from Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Hebrew Dictionary: meaning mark, token, sign, consent, flag, evidence of consent.

H226 אוֹת 'owth (oth), a signal (literally or figuratively), as a flag, beacon, monument, omen, prodigy, evidence, etc., [probably from H225 (in the sense of appearing)], KJV: mark, miracle, (en-)sign, token.

Paul supports this;

2 Timothy 2:19, “However, the solid foundation of Yah stands firm, having this *seal, יהוה knows those who are His, and let everyone who names the Name of Messiah turn away from unrighteousness.”

The word *sealis word #G4973 – sphragis: a seal, a signet, Original Word: σφραγίς, ῖδος, ἡ, Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine, Transliteration: sphragis, Phonetic Spelling: (sfrag-ece'), Short Definition: a signet-ring, impression of a seal, the proof, Definition: a seal, signet ring, the impression of a seal, that which the seal attests, the proof.

The word “unrighteousness” is word #G93 ἀδικία – adikia, ad-ee-kee'-ah, (legal) injustice (properly the quality, by implication the act); moral wrongfulness (of charter, life or act):—iniquity, unjust, unrighteousness, wrong.

and the adversary has a counter mark;

...Hand and head… the beast has a counter mark: Also in the hand and head

Revelation 14:9-11, And a third messenger followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark upon his forehead or upon his hand, he also shall drink of the wine of the wrath of Yah, which is poured out undiluted into the cup of His wrath. And he shall be tortured with fire and sulfur before the set-apart messengers and before the Lamb. And the smoke of their torture goes up forever and ever. And they have no rest day or night, those worshiping the beast and his image, also if anyone receives the mark of his name.”

For we can see the end time anti-Messiah will be "the Lawless one"
2 Thessalonians 2:6-12, "For the mystery of iniquity (secret initiation of lawlessness*) is already working, but the One restraining him will continue to restrain him, until he is made to appear in the midst. And then that lawless one will be revealed, whom Yahshua will remove with the breath of His mouth, and make powerless with the appearance of His coming-- Whose coming is according to the energy of Satan, who works with all power, and signs, and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of sin in those who are perishing, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason, YHWH will send them strong delusion, that they would believe the deception, In order that all those may be judged as not having believed the truth, but as having delighted in sin."

the dragon was enraged

Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the commands of Yah and possessing the witness of יהושעMessiah."

the dragon was enraged with who? Those who have faith in Messiha and guard Yah's Laws? or those who do not guard Yah's Laws?

and no im not holier than thou and im not perfect.

 

[phil36]

My own words were in there;



It has to be Yah working in ones heart, thus it is then up to the individual to walk in that path or not. Walking in it would be estblishing it as a foundation of our moral and spiritual values, not walking in it would be iniquity.

Yeah, I'm not seeing how you are actually answering the question.

So are you saying that the 'merit' of righteousness is Christs, which God 'counts' to us (by faith alone). Therefore since the righteousness is Christs and not our own we cannot merit it ourselves. No work of the law will merit any sort of righteousness?

Basically do you agree that we are saved by grace alone through faith alone? and good works '(works of the law) do not merit salvation. and that since the 'merit' is not our own nor has it been earned by us but Christ, that following the law will us gain us any sort of righteousness as Christ obeyed the demands of the curse under the law?

Its really an easy question to answer. And so far from from reading your posts I find it's just legalism. Which as with anyone under the law is under a curse (Pauls words not mine cf. Galatians).

another good scripture for us all to remember: Our righteousness is Christs, not our own.

3 [FONT=&quot]For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. Rom 10:3[/FONT]

 

[phil36]

I will say again that it is better to not teach against the Sabbath Commandment.. if you believe it is not part of Loving GOD then that is between you and GOD.. but for those that believe that the Messiah taught us to Keep and teach even the least Commandment and believe it is about Loving GOD through Faith in His Son as much as the other 9.. and the base of Love is the 10.... Worry not for we all here have the Faith of Yahshua and are under Grace at liberty to love and obey.

If our error according to many is in Loving GOD how He Himself instructs then GOD is Gracious and Merciful and we will fair well... but I would not want to be the person whom teaches against His Sabbath Commandment.

Hi loveme1,

Your post is a good reminder for us to come back to the topic. Sabbath!

My Question here is not aimed at you but to anyone really, Where before or after the Mosaic law is the Sabbath observance required? Remembering that the Mosaic law is now obsolete (Heb 8:13).

 

[Hizikyah]

Yeah, I'm not seeing how you are actually answering the question.

So are you saying that the 'merit' of righteousness is Christs, which God 'counts' to us (by faith alone). Therefore since the righteousness is Christs and not our own we cannot merit it ourselves. No work of the law will merit any sort of righteousness?

Basically do you agree that we are saved by grace alone through faith alone? and good works '(works of the law) do not merit salvation. and that since the 'merit' is not our own nor has it been earned by us but Christ, that following the law will us gain us any sort of righteousness as Christ obeyed the demands of the curse under the law?

Its really an easy question to answer. And so far from from reading your posts I find it's just legalism. Which as with anyone under the law is under a curse (Pauls words not mine cf. Galatians).

another good scripture for us all to remember: Our righteousness is Christs, not our own.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. Rom 10:3

Yeah so the way I see it you are pretty much ignoreing what I am saying and painting any obedience as self justification. We are grantedsalvation by His unmerited mercy, you may call it grace,, I call it unmerited mercy, mercy I don't deserve and did noting to earn. Yet we are told by every writer of Scripture to follow His Law/Commands/Instructions/Torah...

You misuse Romans 10:3

another good scripture for us all to remember: Our righteousness is Christs, not our own.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. Rom 10:3

Mattithyah 15:2-3, "Why do Your disciples transgress the traditions of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat. But He answered, and said to them: And why do you transgress the Laws of Yahweh by your traditions?"

​

They made their own law they would not submit to Yah by His Commands or His Messiah.

and while we are in Romans 10, is Christ the end of the Law? or is that is terrible translation?

Romans 10:4, "For Christ is the end (telos) of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

Romans 10:4, "For Yahshua is the ultimate result (telos) of the Law unto righteousness for everyone who believes."

Greek Dictionary (Lexicon-Concordance) - #G5056 telos {tel'-os} from a primary tello (to set out for a definite point or goal)

HELPS Word-studies – 5056 télos (a neuter noun) – properly, consummation (the end-goal, purpose), such as closure with all its results.

I know I get attacked for this, but remeber this is NT writing;

1 John 3:7, "Little children, let no man deceive you; he who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous."

Romans 8:1, "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

1 John/Yahanan 2:6, "He who says he abides in Him, is himself also obligated to walk as He walked."

Is the Law written in your heart?

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”

If not;

Romans 8:5-8, "For those who live according to the flesh, set their minds on the things of the flesh; but those who live according to the Spirit, set their minds on the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against; (bitterly opposed to), YHWH; for it his not subject to the Law of YHWH, nor indeed can be. So then, those who are of the flesh cannot please YHWH."

Isayah 24:5-6, "The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants of it, because they have transgressed the Laws, changed the ordinance, and broken the everlasting covenant. Because of this, the curse has devoured the earth, and they who dwell therein are desolate; therefore, the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left."

The Messiah backs this up:

Mat 24:12, "And because iniquity abound, the love of the many will grow cold."

Mat 7:23, "But then I will declare to them; I never knew you. Get away from Me, you who practice iniquity."

iniquity is:#0458 ἀνομία anomia {an-om-ee'-ah} from G0459Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) 1) the condition of without law

Honestly it seems to me you keep asking the same question in different ways after I have answered that you my find fault....

Scripture my friend, Scripture....

 

[phil36]

Yeah so the way I see it you are pretty much ignoreing what I am saying and painting any obedience as self justification. We are grantedsalvation by His unmerited mercy, you may call it grace,, I call it unmerited mercy, mercy I don't deserve and did noting to earn. Yet we are told by every writer of Scripture to follow His Law/Commands/Instructions/Torah...

Hi Hizikyah,

I am not ignoring what you are saying, Im finding it very to understand what you are actually saying. No mention of Christs obedience on your behalf, the cross his rising etc. Just its unmerited mercy..and we are told to follow the law. (unmerited mercy on what basis)

Anyhow we are away of topic, My fault most likely. We can continue on the not by works thread. probably best.


But back to topic, the Sabbath, can you show me where we are commanded to observe the Sabbath before the Mosaic law or after, since the Mosaic law is now obsolete (according to Hebrews 8:13)

 

[Hizikyah]

Hi Hizikyah,

I am not ignoring what you are saying, Im finding it very to understand what you are actually saying. No mention of Christs obedience on your behalf, the cross his rising etc. Just its unmerited mercy..and we are told to follow the law. (unmerited mercy on what basis)

Anyhow we are away of topic, My fault most likely. We can continue on the not by works thread. probably best.


But back to topic, the Sabbath, can you show me where we are commanded to observe the Sabbath before the Mosaic law or after, since the Mosaic law is now obsolete (according to Hebrews 8:13)

Hebrews 8:13, "By saying, ‘renewed,’ He has made the first old. Now what becomes old and growing aged is near disappearing."

So that means the Sabbath is gone? How? really? Seems something in there my text does not say..., I see why you don't get what Im saying, predisposition.

Exodus 20:8-11, "“Remember the Sabbath day, to set it apart. Six days you labour, and shall do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of יהוה your Elohim. You do not do any work – you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates."For in six days יהוה made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore יהוה blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart."

​

Matthew 5:17-18, “Do not think that I came to destroy the Torah or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to complete. For truly, I say to you, till the heaven and the earth pass away, one yod or one tittle shall by no means pass from the Torah till all be done.”

Revelation 21:1-2, “And I saw a renewed heaven and a renewed earth, for the former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea is no more. And I, Yoḥanan, saw the set-apart city, renewed Yerushalayim, coming down out of the heaven from Yah, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”

I quote gfor Yahshua " till the heaven and the earth pass away, one yod or one tittle shall by no means pass from the Torah"

Did heaven and earth pass? IF not then it is still valid.

​

Accepting Yahshua's Sacrifice is not the end but the beginning of the journey, it means the game just started, not that it's over;

Matthew 10:22, “And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.”

Matt 24:12-13, “And because of the increase in lawlessness, the love of many shall become cold. But he who shall have endured to the end shall be saved.”

Hebrews 10:36, “For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of Yah you may receive what is promised.”

Hebrews 3:14, “For we have become partakers of Messiah if we hold fast the beginning of our trust firm to the end.”

I didn't metion His Sacrifce outrightbecause it's not the thread topic and you are asking me about the Law, justification, imputed righteousness..

But it was in some of the verses; possessing the witness of יהושעMessiah

Revelation 12:17, “And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to fight with the remnant of her seed, those guarding the commands of Yah and possessing the witness of יהושעMessiah."

Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the commands of יהוה and the belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”

 

[Dan_473]

The whole quote is this from Mathew.

Matthew 22:36-40 New International Version (NIV)

[FONT=&]36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”[/FONT]
[FONT=&]37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”[/FONT]

I'm not following you about "The whole quote is this from Mathew." The quote I posted was from Galatians.

 

[Dan_473]

Exodus 20:6, "But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws."


John/Yahanan 14:15, "If you love Me, keep My commandments."


1 Yahanan/John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of YHWH: When we love YHWH by keeping His Laws. For this is the love of YHWH: That we keep His Law, and His Law is not grievous."

Mat 7:12, "So then, whatever you desire that others would do to and for you, even so do also to and for them, for this is (the intent/sums up) the Law and the Prophets."


Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."


“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete


Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) all, whole, completely


Romans 13:9-10, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and (#G2087 ) any othercommandments are summed up ( #G346 ) in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."


“any”is word #G2087 - heteros
Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) the other, another, other, 1 to number,1a1) to number as opposed to some former person or thing,1a2) the other of two,1b) to quality,1b1) another: i.e. one not of the same nature, form, class, kind, different


“summed up” is word #G346 – anakephalaioó: to sum up, gather up, Original Word: ἀνακεφαλαιόω, Part of Speech: Verb, Transliteration: anakephalaioó, Phonetic Spelling: (an-ak-ef-al-ah'-ee-om-ahee), Short Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one, Definition: I sum up, summarize, recapitulate, gather up in one

"On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

"and (#G2087 ) any other commandments are summed up ( #G346 ) in these Laws"

Yahshua and Paul did not say these abolish or overwrite the rest, but rather the rest are contained in these, me\aning if he rest are broken, these are broken...

say, Hizikyah,
did you want to talk about things from Strong's and Thayer's? My impression from our discussion about 'theos' was that you didn't have a lot of regard for those resources. Did I misunderstand?

 

[loveme1]

Hi loveme1,

Your post is a good reminder for us to come back to the topic. Sabbath!

My Question here is not aimed at you but to anyone really, Where before or after the Mosaic law is the Sabbath observance required? Remembering that the Mosaic law is now obsolete (Heb 8:13).

Hi Phil, By your thinking.. then The other 9 would be obsolete... and yet the 10 Become the base of the Royal Law.. given by the King.. The First is to Love GOD and the second to Love our neighbour... which is even our enemies under the Royal Law.

Under the Royal Law we learn that Sabbath was made for man, not man made for Sabbath.. and that it is lawful to do good.. all taught by the Lord of Sabbath... as so much is instructed of us.. there is no doubt that if Love is not reason then the delight would be a burden. So if I said Phil you have to keep Sabbath.. your intent would not be Faith that work by Love.. if a person is Keeping Sabbath because Moses said to.. then they have not Faith in the Messiah.. who is GOD's Son instructing us to Keep and teach even the least Commandment.. and to Love GOD and each other with all our being.. to believe is to have Faith that worketh by love and most certainly it is because GOD loved us First as shown through His New Covenant with us.. if this pierces not the heart to Repent and believe what will?

Many folks accept Jesus to save themselves from hell.. many want prosperity... but is it not the purpose of a Child to Love their Heavenly Father and set their heart to do what pleases Him? Is not the Messiah the Good Shepherd leading His flock on the path of Righteousness all by the power of GOD? I believe so.

To be set apart is to walk as Christ walked.. to Love and obey Him.. and if we believe then the power of GOD keeps us...

Many will say are you perfect.. you can't keep the Law.. you are trying to earn salvation...

i say ... It is not for but because my Lord saved me that I walk and live by Faith.. and I know there is no boast but to boast and praise GOD.