Sabbath

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prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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1 Corinthians 16:2 (HCSB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] On the first day of the week, each of you is to set something aside and save
in keeping with how he prospers, so that no collections will need to be made when I come.
What Was This COLLECTION on first day?

We come now to the eighth and last place where the term
“first day of the week” occurs in the Bible.

8) 1 Corinthians 16:2: “Upon the first day of the week let every one of you
lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him.…”

Often we see this text printed on the little offering envelopes in the pews of popular
churches, and we have been told that this text sets the first day of the week as the time
for taking up the church collection for the carrying on of God’s work, paying the minister, etc.

Let us begin with the first verse and really catch the true intended meaning of this verse.

“Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia,
even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store,
as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.”

This speaks of a collection—but for whom—for what? Note it! Not for the preacher
—not for evangelism—but “the collection for the saints.” The poor saints at Jerusalem
were suffering from drought and famine. They needed, not money, but food.

Notice Paul had given similar instruction to other churches.
Now observe his instruction to the Romans:

“But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints. For it hath pleased them
of Macedonia and Achaia [where the Corinthian church was located] to make a certain
contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.

When therefore I have performed this, and have sealed to them this fruit,
I will come by you into Spain” (Romans 15:25-28).

Ah! Did you catch it? It was not money, but fruit that was being sealed for shipment to
the poor saints at Jerusalem! (The Greek word can also refer to grain, wine, and other
produce which can be stored a long time without spoiling.)

Now turn back to 1?Corinthians 16. Paul is speaking concerning a collection for the saints.
Upon the first day of the week each one of them is instructed to do what? Look at it!
Does it say drop a coin in the collection plate at a church service? Not at all!

It says, “[L]et every one of you lay by him in STORE.” Note it! Lay by! Store up!
Store up by himself—at home! Not lay by at the church house—lay by him—at home.

Now why? “[T]hat there be no gatherings when I come.” Men gather fruit out of the orchard
—they gather vegetables out of the ground, to be stored up. But putting coins in a collection
plate at church, or handing in your tithe envelope could not be called a gathering,
but an offering or collection.

Notice further: “And when I come, whomsoever ye shall approve by your letters,
them will I send to bring your liberality unto Jerusalem. And if it be meet that I go also,
they [more than one] shall go with me” (verses 3-4).

Apparently it was going to require several men to carry this collection, gathered and
stored up, to Jerusalem. If it were tithe or offering for the minister or the spread of
the gospel, Paul could have carried the money alone.


the church has made unknow amounts of money because of this verse.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
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Jesus Christ on the cross completed any and all laws for priests and for sacrifices. Faith, mercy and justice in Jesus Christ have completed the rest..

This, if you have any understanding at all, does not change the laws on doing what is right in the sight of God, which would include keeping in mind our Day of rest as given as a gift has always been the Seventh Day, and it always will be until the six days of this age are completed and our Seventh eternal comes.

God, Who gave this gift to allwho will receive it, has not changed the order of creation and His will. Praise God, and, Obey him, amen.


The annual sabbaths were not part of the law of Moses, but were observed before
the ritualistic ordinances contained in the law of Moses were given.

the feast of Unleavened Bread, as well as the Passover,
was ordained and established forever, prior to the Old Covenant.

—before one word of the ceremonial law of Moses had been given or written
before God even proposed the Old Covenant! What the law of Moses or the
Old Covenant did not bring or institute, they cannot take away!

-
“Seven days thou shalt eat unleavened bread, and in the seventh day shall be
a feast to the [Eternal memorial)—“And it shall be for a sign”—that is, having
also a future meaning—“unto thee upon thine hand, and for a memorial between
thine eyes”—having to do with both works and will—why?—

“that the Lord’s law may be in thy mouth …. Thou shalt therefore keep this ordinance ”

-
21Thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel; Put your burnt offerings unto your sacrifices,
and eat flesh. For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought
them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:

But this thing commanded I them, saying, Obey my voice, and I will be your God, and ye shall be
my people: and walk ye in all the ways that I have commanded you, that it may be well unto you.

Howbeit I sent unto you all my servants the prophets, rising early and sending them,
saying, Oh, do not this abominable thing that I hate.

For I earnestly protested unto your fathers in the day that I brought them up out of the land
of Egypt, even unto this day, rising early and protesting, saying, Obey my voice.

Notice especially, that originally there were no sacrifices— no meat and drink ordinances
held on these days. See Jeremiah 7:22-23. These days were not instituted for the purpose
of the sacrifices as some have wrongly supposed.

These holy days are memorials, and twice plainly called such. Where do we find such
plain language calling the Sabbath a memorial or sunday (See also Leviticus 23:24.)





Romans 12:1 (KJV)

I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies
a livingsacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

Romans 2:29 (KJV)

But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart,
in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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Acts 20:7 (NASB)
7 On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread,
Paul began talking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight.
.

What “Break Bread” Means

Acts 20- This text does not say, as many claim today, that the disciples always
held communion now sunday every first day of the week? Not at all what it says !

In the first place, it says nothing about anything being done every first day of the week.
It relates the events of this one particular first day of the week, only.

It is not speaking of any customs, but of the events occurring as Paul and his companions
concluded their seven-day visit in passing by this town.

Jesus had introduced the “Lord’s Supper” as part of the Passover, at the beginning of
the annual “days of unleavened bread.” No longer need they kill lambs or eat the roasted
body of Passover lambs, after Christ, our Passover, had been once slain for us.

The Passover was ordained forever (Exodus 12:24).

At His last Passover supper, Jesus substituted the wine as the emblem of His blood,
instead of the blood of the slain lamb. He substituted the unleavened bread for
the roast body of the lamb as the symbol of His body, broken for us.

The disciples continued to observe the Passover annually, now in the form of
“the Lord’s Supper” using only the bread and wine, as a memorial (1Corinthians 11:24)
of Christ’s death (1Corinthians 11:26), showing His death till He comes again.

They continued to observe the Days of Unleavened Bread (Acts 20:6).

This year they had observed the Days of Unleavened Bread and the “Communion” service
at Philippi, after which they came to Troas in five days, where they remained seven days.

After the Sabbath day had ended, [at sunset], “upon the first day of the week…
the disciples came together to break bread.”

Paul was going to walk a long ways across the point in the morning to catch up,
some of his companions allready set sail around the point by sea, a work day.
he was going to be gone for awhile, hence last minute instructions before leaving.

People have assumed this expression to mean the taking of “Communion.”
But notice! Paul preached, and continued preaching until midnight.

They had no opportunity to stop and “break bread” until then. When Paul “therefore
was come up again”—after restoring the one who had fallen down from the third balcony
“and had broken bread, and eaten” Acts 20:11

Note it! “roken bread, and eaten.” This breaking bread was not Communion
—it was simply eating a meal. This expression was commonly used of old to designate
a meal. It still is used in that sense in parts of even the United States.

Notice Luke 22:16, where Jesus was introducing the Lord’s Supper, taking it with His disciples.
He said, “I will not any more eat thereof, until it be fulfilled in the kingdom of God.”

Yet, the day after His resurrection, after walking with the two disciples to Emmaus,
“..as he sat at meat with them, he took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them”
(Luke 24:30). Here Jesus “brake bread,” but it was not the Lord’s Supper,
which He said He would not take again. It was a meal—“he sat at meat.”

Notice Acts 2:46. The disciples, “continuing daily with one accord in the temple,
and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness?.…”
Here again, “breaking bread” means eating a meal. Not on the first day of the week, but daily.

Again, when Paul was shipwrecked on the voyage to Rome, the sailors had been fasting out
of fright. But “Paul besought them all to take meat, saying, This day is the fourteenth day
that ye have tarried and continued fasting, having taken nothing.

Wherefore I pray you to take some meat: for this is for your health?.… And when he had
thus spoken, he took bread, and gave thanks to God in presence of them all: and when he
had broken it, he began to eat” (Acts 27:33-35).

Here Paul broke bread to give to unconverted sailors who were hungry.

The truth is, nowhere in the Bible is the expression “breaking of bread,” or “to break bread,”
used to signify observance of “the Lord’s Supper.” In all these texts it means, simply,
eating a meal.So, when we read in Acts 20:7, 11, “the disciples came together to break bread,”

and how Paul had “broken bread, and eaten,” we know by Scripture interpretation
it referred only to eating food as a meal, not to a Communion service.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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there is 8 places in the new testement that have (first day of the week?

lets see if God changed the day in any of them verses.
the first day of the week in verses
Mt 28:1 ,Mr 16:2,Mr 16:9,Lu 24:1

none of the verses above changes the 7th day to 1st day,
is not a day of worship, the first day people saw Jesus.
this was a normal work day for people

Joh 20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was (yet dark),
unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

John tells use that while it was (still dark), Mary found the tomb empty.
this was not a sunrise service at all, he was allready gone from there.


Joh 20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week,
when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews,
came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.


the doors locked, assembled fear of there lives,was not a day of rest, it was a work day.
nothing here in verse changes the sabbath day, or is not a religious meeting.


Why did Jesus not even tell the Apostles about sunday
John sees the lords day in a future vision, no day of week even mentioned.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
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How then are you Obedient to this verse?


Hebrews 10:24-25 (HCSB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP]And let us be concerned about one another in order to promote love and good works,
[SUP]25 [/SUP]not staying away from our ⌊worship⌋ meetings, as some habitually do, but encouraging each other, and all the more as you see the day drawing near.
Gathering together is 'for like-minded people' not with all and sundry who choose to go. In any case, we are all gathered together here on forum and you can see the friction this causes - sad .
We need to consider this conundrum in more detail if we ever want to come to agreement. We need to see the difference between Instruction and Worship, since they are not the same.
Instruction comes 'from GOD on the sabbath day' - Worship comes 'from man on sunday'....fine, nothing wrong with that....but forsaking the sabbath in favour of one sunday event is bound to cause confusion and disagreement...and PEOPLE have started/caused this problem - not God !!!
If we obeyed God and Jesus we His people would not fight among ourselves.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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It is not a sin to worship God [any day] of the week.
But we are also told to not follow ancient Israels example.


What God has commanded was to remember the Sabbath day ,
and not work for money on this day He made for man.
This is absolutely true - but the world today is geared in such a way of disobedience that it is impossible for some people not to have to work on the sabbath, unless it is to do 'good works. Since we are in this present evil world Gal 1v4, people have no mind/intention to change their ways hence the coming cleansing and destruction by fire.
I believe there is a scripture telling us the fire is already kindled...but there is yet time to pull some out of it, perhaps by an ear (hearing the truth and obeying it).
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
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Would or could mankind change the order of creation?

Likewise, would or could he change the order of what has been, is, and is to come?

Only God is Almight, and only He orders all that is........

Praise God, believe God and worship Him always in Jesus Christ, amen.

Jesus Christ on the cross completed any and all laws for priests and for sacrifices. Faith, mercy and justice in Jesus Christ have completed the rest..

This, if you have any understanding at all, does not change the laws on doing what is right in the sight of God, which would include keeping in mind our Day of rest as given as a gift has always been the Seventh Day, and it always will be until the six days of this age are completed and our Seventh eternal comes.

God, Who gave this gift to allwho will receive it, has not changed the order of creation and His will. Praise God, and, Obey him, amen.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,967
4,585
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What Was This COLLECTION on first day?

We come now to the eighth and last place where the term
“first day of the week” occurs in the Bible.

8) 1 Corinthians 16:2: “Upon the first day of the week let every one of you
lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him.…”

Often we see this text printed on the little offering envelopes in the pews of popular
churches, and we have been told that this text sets the first day of the week as the time
for taking up the church collection for the carrying on of God’s work, paying the minister, etc.

Let us begin with the first verse and really catch the true intended meaning of this verse.

“Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia,
even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store,
as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.”

This speaks of a collection—but for whom—for what? Note it! Not for the preacher
—not for evangelism—but “the collection for the saints.” The poor saints at Jerusalem
were suffering from drought and famine. They needed, not money, but food.

Notice Paul had given similar instruction to other churches.
Now observe his instruction to the Romans:

“But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints. For it hath pleased them
of Macedonia and Achaia [where the Corinthian church was located] to make a certain
contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.

When therefore I have performed this, and have sealed to them this fruit,
I will come by you into Spain” (Romans 15:25-28).

Ah! Did you catch it? It was not money, but fruit that was being sealed for shipment to
the poor saints at Jerusalem! (The Greek word can also refer to grain, wine, and other
produce which can be stored a long time without spoiling.)

Now turn back to 1?Corinthians 16. Paul is speaking concerning a collection for the saints.
Upon the first day of the week each one of them is instructed to do what? Look at it!
Does it say drop a coin in the collection plate at a church service? Not at all!

It says, “[L]et every one of you lay by him in STORE.” Note it! Lay by! Store up!
Store up by himself—at home! Not lay by at the church house—lay by him—at home.

Now why? “[T]hat there be no gatherings when I come.” Men gather fruit out of the orchard
—they gather vegetables out of the ground, to be stored up. But putting coins in a collection
plate at church, or handing in your tithe envelope could not be called a gathering,
but an offering or collection.

Notice further: “And when I come, whomsoever ye shall approve by your letters,
them will I send to bring your liberality unto Jerusalem. And if it be meet that I go also,
they [more than one] shall go with me” (verses 3-4).

Apparently it was going to require several men to carry this collection, gathered and
stored up, to Jerusalem. If it were tithe or offering for the minister or the spread of
the gospel, Paul could have carried the money alone.


the church has made unknow amounts of money because of this verse.
\



JEWs paid three tithes, AND all of it went to Synagogue, like you pointed out it was a Theocracy.

One tithe supported the Synagogue and Temple.

Another supported the running of the Government.

The third tithe was not actually due until ever third year, however most paid it in regular increments. It supported widows and those who could no longer take care of themselves. It was the equivalent of our Social Security.

THAT MEANS they were paying 23 1/3 percent, PLUS THE OFFERINGS ON TOP OF THAT, FOR MISSION WORK SUCH AS WHEN PAUL WAS COLLECTING FOR THE SAINTS IN JERUSALEM WHO HAD LOST THEIR JOBS BECAUSE IT BECAME KNOWN THAT THEY WERE CHRISTIANS.

Malachi 3:8-9 (NKJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] "Will a man rob God? Yet you have robbed Me! But you say, 'In what way have we robbed You?' In tithes and offerings.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] You are cursed with a curse, For you have robbed Me, Even this whole nation.


MANY in the CHURCH GAVE even more than they could afford to GIVE. THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT you missed.


2 Corinthians 8:1-15 (NCV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] And now, brothers and sisters, we want you to know about the grace God gave the churches in Macedonia.
[SUP]2 [/SUP] They have been tested by great troubles, and they are very poor. But they gave much because of their great joy.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] I can tell you that they gave as much as they were able and even more than they could afford. No one told them to do it.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But they begged and pleaded with us to let them share in this service for God’s people.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] And they gave in a way we did not expect: They first gave themselves to the Lord and to us. This is what God wants.
[SUP]6 [/SUP] So we asked Titus to help you finish this special work of grace since he is the one who started it.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] You are rich in everything—in faith, in speaking, in knowledge, in truly wanting to help, and in the love you learned from us. In the same way, be strong also in the grace of giving.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I am not commanding you to give. But I want to see if your love is true by comparing you with others that really want to help.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] You know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ. You know that Christ was rich, but for you he became poor so that by his becoming poor you might become rich.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] This is what I think you should do: Last year you were the first to want to give, and you were the first who gave.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] So now finish the work you started. Then your “doing“ will be equal to your “wanting to do.“ Give from what you have.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] If you want to give, your gift will be accepted. It will be judged by what you have, not by what you do not have.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] We do not want you to have troubles while other people are at ease, but we want everything to be equal.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] At this time you have plenty. What you have can help others who are in need. Then later, when they have plenty, they can help you when you are in need, and all will be equal.
[SUP]15 [/SUP] As it is written in the Scriptures, “The person who gathered more did not have too much, nor did the person who gathered less have too little.“
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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Is it a sin to worship on Sunday? Here we poor Christians are deceived to believe that when two or more of us are gathered together in His name, there Christ will be with us also? My goodness, I hope you inform Jesus of His mistake! Otherwise we might all keep worshiping, adoring, and loving Him every day of the week and go to hell for it.
No Magenta, no problem with worshipping God any time anywhere but most christians do it at the expense of forsaking the sabbath when God commands to assemble for instruction before Him. There is no such command for sunday and should therefore not replace the sabbath 7th day....is what we glean from scripture. Let's not argue but discuss !
God does not deny anyone the time they want to praise and worship Him but He also expects them to turn up for His lessons when He gives them ...can you agree with that ?
 
Dec 19, 2009
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How then are you Obedient to this verse?


Hebrews 10:24-25 (HCSB)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] And let us be concerned about one another in order to promote love and good works,
[SUP]25 [/SUP] not staying away from our ⌊worship⌋ meetings, as some habitually do, but encouraging each other, and all the more as you see the day drawing near.
I go to church regularly.
 
J

june123

Guest
Thank you "Jesuslives",

I watched a discussion on "should one keep the sabbath" today between two very learned men, I liked what the one on the side of keeping the 4th commandment ended his discussion with, he said " If I am wrong I have nothing to worry about, but if you are wrong you have to answer to God."

I guess at the end of times we all have to answer to our God.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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Thank you "Jesuslives",

I watched a discussion on "should one keep the sabbath" today between two very learned men, I liked what the one on the side of keeping the 4th commandment ended his discussion with, he said " If I am wrong I have nothing to worry about, but if you are wrong you have to answer to God."

I guess at the end of times we all have to answer to our God.
Galatians 3:10 [FONT=&quot]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

[/FONT]
I would say he should be worried about being under a curse. But most "law keepers" don't really read Galatians.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
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Tennessee
Thank you beta, "Agree with you ! but this topic will cause fierce disagreement and rejection....always has done and will do until Christ comes and restores peace among the true believers, anyone else will not be around Rev 19."

How silly of me, I thought that all Christian's would follow the word of God, We are all born in sin and must spend our lives trying to get to know God and doing all we can to follow his laws, I have broken his laws many times and I
regret this so much, I want to live in Jesus to atone for my sins, To do this I must follow his laws, all his commandments.

On the day of judgement I want God's blessing.
Don't let anyone discourage you from doing your best to observe the Sabbath. This is the only commandment that cautions you to "Remember the Sabbath. Of course, there are some Christians that say that the 10 commandments are obsolete. Without these commandments there can be no sin. Maybe that's a good thing. No.
 

Embankment

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2017
693
190
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Don't let anyone discourage you from doing your best to observe the Sabbath. This is the only commandment that cautions you to "Remember the Sabbath. Of course, there are some Christians that say that the 10 commandments are obsolete. Without these commandments there can be no sin. Maybe that's a good thing. No.
I don't know how else to read the Bible without it saying the 10 commandments are obsolete.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
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Most I know reckon that the Sabbath was a prefigure of Christ, and the rest we find in Him, no longer working for salvation, but having saving faith in the work of Christ upon the cross out of His great love for us, where He proclaimed, "It is done." His perfect life fulfilled the law; His death paid the price for sin, and life ever after is found only through faith in Him and His work. The Sabbath is nowhere mentioned as a requirement in the New Testament. In fact, Jesus consistently criticized the Sabbath rules of the Pharisees, and treated it as a ritual law.

What kind of example did Jesus set on the Sabbath? The Bible never says that he rested—we are told only of his activity. He never commands anyone to keep the Sabbath, nor praises anyone for it. Rather, he constantly criticized people who had rules about what could or could not be done on the Sabbath. He always taught more freedom, never any restrictions. Although he told people to be very strict about some laws (Matt. 5:21, 28, etc.), he was always liberal about the Sabbath.

Jesus always compared the Sabbath to ceremonial laws, not to moral laws. When his disciples were picking grain, he used the example of the showbread, and the work of the priests in the temple (Matt. 12:3-6). Those rituals were just as important as the Sabbath. He said that circumcision could be done on the Sabbath (John 7:22), which indicates that circumcision is a more important law than the Sabbath. The Sabbath is a ritual law—it says that behavior that is perfectly good one day, is forbidden on another, simply because the earth has rotated. But true morality does not change from one day of the week to another. When ritual laws became obsolete when Jesus died, it should be no surprise that the ritual of the Sabbath also became obsolete.

Jesus said that daily chores could be done on the Sabbath (Luke 13:15). Even hard labor could be done in an emergency (Luke 14:5). He told a healed man to carry his sleeping mat, even though there was no hurry (John 5:8). He even used the word "work" to describe his activity (v. 17). Many Christians follow this example. https://www.gci.org/law/sabbath
 
J

june123

Guest
I don't know how else to read the Bible without it saying the 10 commandments are obsolete.
I guess if the 4th commandment is obsolete the the other 9 must be as well, but if that were so we wouldn't have any thing to be forgiven for, There would be no judgement day because we would all be sinless.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
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I guess if the 4th commandment is obsolete the the other 9 must be as well, but if that were so we wouldn't have any thing to be forgiven for, There would be no judgement day because we would all be sinless.
Love fulfills all the law and prophets. Jesus said so! :)
 

Embankment

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2017
693
190
43
I guess if the 4th commandment is obsolete the the other 9 must be as well, but if that were so we wouldn't have any thing to be forgiven for, There would be no judgement day because we would all be sinless.
The original sin started with Adam. The 10 commandments are just subsets of the original.
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
5,034
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Bless you, I will keep praying for an answer from God.
June I will pray for you to receive that answer from God. My answer came many years ago, and it has served me well. God created the Sabbath for man as a day of rest. He provided the first day as a day for me to celebrate the life that I have through His son. Jesus fulfilled all the Levitical Law requirements for the Sabbath. He left the day as a day of rest for my family, my employees, and anyone visiting me on that day. He also told me, through his word, not to Judge others for how He has lead them to observe the Sabbath.

Again, I will pray for God to answer your question.