Staying Saved (1Peter 4:18)

Grace777x70 · Apr 8, 2017

I heard a guy say one time that the Lord told him that He was sending him out as a missionary. He asked "Where Lord?"

The Lord said "Right here where you are living now. You are to be a missionary to the unbelieving Christians to turn their hearts and to open their eyes to see so that they would believe in what I have done in My work on the cross and resurrection."

Sully · Apr 8, 2017

Grace777x70 said:

I heard a guy say one time that the Lord told him that He was sending him out as a missionary. He asked "Where Lord?"

The Lord said "Right here where you are living now. You are to be a missionary to the unbelieving Christians to turn their hearts and to open their eyes to see so that they would believe in what I have done in My work on the cross and resurrection."

Post perfection g777.

Blain · Apr 8, 2017

Spokenpassage said:

No the reason i called out to him was because I was alone in life no cared about me and i honestly had no reason to even be alive it wasn't because i heard the gospel or anything I just longed to be cared about and to have a reason to live. I don't know the exact reasons for the others i have known but that was mine.

And I am not talking about a feeling either I am talking about an actual connection with God and the love and fire he poured into me was and is not a feeling either it was his spirit and his entire being the very core of who he is. the thing is i had wanted to be saved for a long time but i never could make that connection with him, until that fateful day when I was at my lowest.

Spokenpassage · Apr 8, 2017

Blain said:

See, you did not desire to be saved by what God calls salvation disclosed in the gospel, you wanted to fill a void that countless people desire too. So, should we really say then that you wanted to be saved when you didn't even know what you should be saved from and saved by?

Johnny_B · Apr 8, 2017

It all hangs on justification instead of OSAS, it should be OJAJ. Once God makes us righteous, we can say as David did in Psalms 32:1-2, which Paul quotes when explaining justification. Romans 4:5-8 Romans 4:5-8 “But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works: 7 “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, and whose sins are covered; 8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin.”

Once you've been found not guilty for a grime you can not be charged with it again, that's why once we're justified by God through our faith, we can never be charged for it again. If we were that would be double jeopardy which human courts don't even do, with God being an infinitely more of a righteous judge than any earthly human judge, we can say with David that we are blessed because the Lord does not input our sins to us.

Here's the problem, if someone says a prayer people say they got saved, but are they, we can only know when they begin to life their life, are there fruits of repentance in their lives? If there's not, the likelihood of them being saved are thin. John tells us how we'll know who's saved. I John 1:8-10, 3:9, 4:7, 5:1, 5:4, 5:10, 5:18 “If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us……No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God…..Beloved, let us love one another, for love is of God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God…..Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him……For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith……Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son…..We know that everyone who has been born of God does not keep on sinning, but he who was born of God protects him, and the evil one does not touch him.”

A saved person, doesn't deceive himself, admits they have sin, they confesses their sin, does not make God a liar, His word is in them, does not practice sinning, they love the saints, they believe Jesus is the Christ, they love Him and the Father, they overcome the world because of their faith, they believe what the Father has said about the Son and God protects them or preserves them and the devil can't touch them. If those signs are not seen in a person they are not born-again or of God. They might not stop sinning the day after but they will stop their practice of sin. With I John 1:8-10 always in mind.

Spokenpassage · Apr 8, 2017

Sully said:

Was that Christ honoring to say?

Blain · Apr 8, 2017

Spokenpassage said:

True I did not ask to be saved because of hell or because of my sins perhaps I didn't call out to him for the most noble of reasons but even so he welcomed me into his loving arms without hesitation.

Sully · Apr 8, 2017

Spokenpassage said:

In a word yes

valiant · Apr 8, 2017

OneFaith said:

This is a totally inappropriate heading. The verse follows 'for the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God, and if it begins with us, where shall the ungodly and sinner appear.'

This demonstrates that verse18 is comparing saved people with sinners. On the one hand those made righteous in Christ, on the other the impious and sinner. The righteous are 'scarcely saved' because they depend totally on the sacrifice of another. The impious and sinner are left wallowing in their own sin

if we do not forgive we will not be forgiven. This is in the family. It is written on behalf of a Father to His children. It is not a saving matter, but one of relationships day by day. An unforgiving spirit hinders my relationship with God and with my brother. If it were more none of us would be saved. Forgiveness for all the past wrong done to us would be impossible. We just do not remember it all.

.

Thank God He does not save like that. He 'saves to the uttermost', and He saved before time began. This suggestion would mean we spent large parts of each month unsaved. But when God saves He saves entirely.

You cannot lose what God by His grace (unmerited favour) has given.

Yes, praise God,

Scripture proof please. Once in Christ, in Christ for ever,

We do not have a license to sin (Paul was accused of that too (Rom 6.1). But if your salvation is dependent on your activity then it is you who are saving yourself which suggests a very light view of sin. you do not know what it meant to be 'dead in sin' (Eph 2.1-3) needing to be made alive in Christ.

That was spoken to Jews contemplating whether to become Christian. The old sacrifices would no longer cleanse,

But the Jews had never been saved, that was what they were contemplating.

But that is a non-Christian. However the seatbelt is Christ, not baptism,. Baptism does not save except as it reveals one who is trusting in the cross and resurrection.,

are you really comparing Christ Jesus our Lord with a car driven by a fallible human?

But for the Christian Christ is driving, therefore he has no fear.

If Christ has saved me once and for all in the eternal plan of God, I can rest confident in His power. Noting can prevent Him doing His saving work.

Thank God my Shepherd does that and He promises me that I 'will never never perish' (John 10.28).

You will fall short of God's best, but it will not affect God's saving of you once you are truly His.

I take God at His word. How about that?

And so we will, whatever it means. But Christ made a general comment. It is for us to interpret it.

That what YOU say, Thank God the Bible does not say that. If you have to keep all the 'conditional statements in the NT' you will never be sure you are saved. 'The blood of Jesus Christ God's Son cleanses from ALL sin',

Actually it is 'work out', 'energise out', but how are we to do it? The next verse tells us, because GOD is at work in you to will and do of His good pleasure'. You missed that bit. We 'work out' what God has 'worked in'. It is a fruit of salvation, not it cause,

They do not respond to the call. They are non-Christians.

If the righteous scarcely be saved means that their salvation in wrought by Another. See the previous verse. Your translation is just PLAIN WRONG.

I prefer Paul in Romans 3.21-5.21where Christ's righteousness IS enough

take that strictly and we are all lost.

OneFaith · Apr 8, 2017

Sully said:

Christ Himself was ridiculed by those who thought they knew the correct way. I am just the messenger. I'm interested in what excuse an unforgiver will have when asked why they didn't believe the scripture delivered to them "If you do not forgive you will not be forgiven."

Why else would God say that to Christians if it didn't matter? Each one will have to answer that for themselves. My answer will be "I forgive all, please be true to Your Word and forgive me." I would dare not say "There are those whom I refuse to forgive, but I want You to forgive me completely, despite what Your scripture said."

Sully · Apr 8, 2017

OneFaith said:

Christ Himself was ridiculed by those who thought they knew the correct way. I am just the messenger. I'm interested in what excuse an unforgiver will have when asked why they didn't believe the scripture delivered to them "If you do not forgive you will not be forgiven."

Why else would God say that to Christians if it didn't matter? Each one will have to answer that for themselves. My answer will be "I forgive all, please be true to Your Word and forgive me." I would dare not say "There are those whom I refuse to forgive, but I want You to forgive me completely, despite what Your scripture said."

It's not the word I disagree with, it's the burdens and yoke you'd like to place on the only work that matters.

PennEd · Apr 8, 2017

I have heard varying versions of "you can't lose your salvation, but you can give it away" or "the Lord won't take away your salvation, but a person can decide to reject it himself".

This makes no sense.

Look at it like this: I GIVE you a bottle of wine. You open it. You drink it. All. You get the intoxicating effects of the wine. I CERTAINLY can't take that wine back. You ingested it. You got the effect of ingesting it. YOU can't give either the wine, OR the effect of drinking the wine back. You may vomit from it, but that isn't gonna change that you are intoxicated.

So the Lord gives us the faith to believe the Gospel. You hear it. You believe it. You are sealed with the Holy Spirit, and have the effects of Him. He won't take back the faith He gave you. And you can't change the effect of being filled by Him. You can't give Him away. You may not ALWAYS live by the effects of the Spirit, but He will never leave you nor forsake you because He cannot dent Himself.

So this idea of giving away what you have already ingested or been filled with is just wrong thinking. Praise Jesus for His faithfulness!!!

Blain · Apr 8, 2017

PennEd said:

I can understand where you are coming from but salvation is not like ingesting wine it's a gift and when you are given a gift you can choose to keep or toss it in the trash or simply say to the person i don't it you can have it back and since father is a loving father and does not force his gift on us he reluctantly takes it back hoping we will once day accept his gift.

The thing is the enemy is always attacking our hearts and will try to steal what was given any way he can he can use all kinds of methods to make us give it away. We are after all in a spiritual war

Grace777x70 · Apr 8, 2017

PennEd said:

I agree....in order for those to say that we can choose to give up our salvation then they would have to say at any time throughout eternity any believer that is in Christ can and will at some point by "an act of their will" leave Christ. That means that the apostle Paul and every other believer is at jeopardy to lose salvation.

What a way to think about what the Lord ahs done for us. This mindset has no idea about the "why" of the gospel in the first place nor knows the Lord's work on the cross and resurrection and that we too are included in His death and resurrection.

They say "Hold out until you die and then you are saved for sure." I have news for us...death is not our savior. Christ is our Savior and it is all based on what He has done - not what we do.

The process for salvation as in being joined as one for eternity with the Lord is simple.

1) we hear the message of Christ - the gospel of our salvation in Him

2) we believe the message from our hearts

3) we were sealed with the Holy Spirit ( Jesus said in John 14:16 that the Holy Spirit will be with us and in us forever - now was Jesus lying or is he like a "bait and switch" car salesman that has "fine print" which He doesn't talk about )

Ephesians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, = 1) the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, = 2) you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, = 3)

you were sealed = aorist indicative tense / passive voice = a one time event in the past.

Passive voice = the sealing was not done by us but by an outside force - the Holy Spirit Himself.

dcontroversal · Apr 8, 2017

Spokenpassage said:

Numerous biblical, godly men of the bible used sarcasm at one time or another to make a point.......just saying....

Spokenpassage · Apr 8, 2017

dcontroversal said:

True, however, if we see a believer struggling with accepting something that should comfort and encourage them, I cannot in good conscience joke about putting them in another forum and spend time together in misery. That hurts, and I was probably not the one told it.

Sully · Apr 8, 2017

Spokenpassage said:

I'd rather avoid sweet sounding sayings that take me away from the perfection of truth.

Spokenpassage · Apr 8, 2017

Sully said:

There is a time for everything...

Roughsoul1991 · Apr 8, 2017

Blain said:

Very true we are at war in the mind every day and this war only becomes evident once we believe. The teachings of calvinism has perverted the doctrine of grace basically making it belief and nothing else saves. Basically, the new law of love is not important, just belief. The teachings are only guidelines but not commands. They love to use the teachings of Paul and filter all of the Bible through Paul instead of all scriptures as one.

Jude 1:4 warns of this kind of teaching in its severity. They are inherently denying the true grace by believing that how they live after believing has no impact on eternal security because God is all controlling and even though when they sin it doesn't matter because they are already saved. Calvinism turns grace into a puppet theology, easy believism, or hyper-grace. Calvinist believe once we are saved we become puppets and are coasted through life to eternal heaven. No perseverance, no remain, no abide, no run the race, no win the crown, no take up your cross, no walk, no be led, no listen, no become victorious.

Basically, anything that sounds remotely like we have a part in the relationship with God they will cry out legalist because as they say nothing is of our free will in this life and God chooses who he wants to save or not. Every time someone in real life turns away from the faith they will say, well I guess he wasn't truly saved believing he must have been false from the beginning. Not actually taking into consideration maybe it was no one took the time to disciple him and help his faith grow strong so one day he may not be choked out by the weeds and corrupted by the devil ( Parable of the Sower).

Someone said sin no longer matters and if we do deliberately sin all it does is it hurt us physically but not spiritually. This is so misguided as Pauls says in

[h=1]1 Corinthians 10:5-12New International Version (NIV)[/h][FONT=&quot]5 Nevertheless, God was not pleased with most of them; their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]6 Now these things occurred as examples to keep us from setting our hearts on evil things as they did. 7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: “The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in revelry.”[a] 8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did—and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died.9 We should not test Christ,[b] as some of them did—and were killed by snakes. 10 And do not grumble, as some of them did—and were killed by the destroying angel.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]11 These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the culmination of the ages has come.12 So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don’t fall!

[/FONT]
[h=1]Hebrews 3:18-19New International Version (NIV)[/h][FONT=&quot]18 And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.

[/FONT]
[h=1]Revelation 2:4-7New International Version (NIV)[/h][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]4 Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. 5 Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. 6 But you have this in your favor: You hate the practices of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]7 Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who is victorious, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.

[/FONT]
[h=1]Revelation 3:4-6New International Version (NIV)[/h][FONT=&quot]4 Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes.They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy. 5 The one who is victorious will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out the name of that person from the book of life, but will acknowledge that name before my Father and his angels. 6 Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Yet our blessed Lord does not leave this sinful people without some encouragement. He makes honourable mention of the faithful remnant in Sardis, he makes a gracious promise to them. He that overcometh shall be clothed in white raiment; the purity of grace shall be rewarded with the perfect purity of glory. Christ has his book of life, a register of all who shall inherit eternal life; the book of remembrance of all who live to God, and keep up the life and power of godliness in evil times. Christ will bring forward this book of life, and show the names of the faithful, before God, and all the angels, at the great day.

Jude 1[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] 4 For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about[b] long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]5 Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord[c]at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

[/FONT]

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Roughsoul1991 · Apr 8, 2017

Sully said:

In a word no.

Act like children and no one will take you seriously. The only one I come into contact with who is respectful and says what he has to say without all the childishness is Grace777x70.

Out of respect, I read his post because he shows respect. Many of yall's post I ignore. So good luck trying to get your voice heard when you use the same tactics as the American politicians use.

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