The Rapture

Endoscopy · May 15, 2018

I'm trying to help you brother. I'm not ignoring your scripture. I already addressed your point. Now please respond to my question. Here's the passage again in full context from Mat 23 (KJV). Please see the parts I underlined and please answer this question. I will make it a multiple choice question so that you can respond easier.

Q) In the below passage from Mat 23, which generation is Jesus talking about?

a. His generation (i.e. the one alive when He was on earth)
b. A generation between His and ours
c. Our generation, in the 21st century
d. A generation future to us, as in 22nd century to end of the planet earth

Mat 23:

[SUP]33 [/SUP]Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
[SUP]34 [/SUP]Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
[SUP]35 [/SUP]That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
[SUP]36 [/SUP]Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
[SUP]37 [/SUP]O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
[SUP]38 [/SUP]Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
[SUP]39 [/SUP]For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

Verse 33 is at that point in time but the following is the future. It talks about who will be sent.

Endoscopy · May 15, 2018

preston39 said:

The problem is he holds to the non Biblical fulll pretorist view where everything is accomplished in the spirit world. That means he can say whatever he wants and say it happened in the spirit world. The problem is many prophecies absolutely are not in the spirit world because they identify physical happenings and visually seeing Jesus return. He ignores this saying that it already happened in the spirit world. Hardly any Christians hold to the full pretorist view because of different prophecies going to be in the physical world.

abcdef · May 15, 2018

preston39 said:

Brother p39,

Rev 20:11, shows that this heaven (the material universe) and earth (planet earth) fly away from the face of Jesus on His glory throne.

The last scene on planet earth Rev 20:9, is showing the #2 resurrection and the fire from heaven.

The end of this material world is shown in several places,

Gen 8:22 "While the earth remains".

2 Pet 3:12-13 the elements melt. Air, water, and earth are all consumed by the fire.

Heb 12:27 Our entire universe is moving and shaking right now, deteriorating, coming to an end.

----

Get ready to leave this universe and planet behind. Because that is what Rev 20:11 is showing.

After all die, the last judgment is shown. This will be for everybody, Christian or not. Every deed, every word, every thought and motive of the heart will be judged. Each one of us will take his turn before the throne. Our souls laid bear before Jesus, there will be no flesh to hide behind then. And Jesus will have as long as He wants to take, because there will be no universe to tell how much time has passed.

Some think that this will happen quickly. But I believe that it will take billions of years, as the Judgment proceeds we look around and the universe is flying away from the throne. All the stars fading away in the distance, never to be seen again. Now there is only the spiritual place where Jesus is.

His beauty, cannot be described in the terms of men. It's like once you have seen Him, you'll never want to look away. Jesus is eternally fascinating, eternally amazing, the purest of love that men in the flesh cannot gaze on and live.

Free your mind from the paramiters of this material world. Get ready, because it's almost here.

tanakh · May 15, 2018

Ahwatukee said:

Tanakh,

I am not going to respond to all of the errors in your post, but I going to show you one glaring error:

You are correct in that, I do not believe that Israel is Babylon the Great. First of all, the woman of Rev.12 is positively identified in scripture as the nation Israel. And that because the woman is said to be clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars. These symbols are the same ones used in Joseph's dream in Genesis 37:9-10. According to Rev.12, The woman flees out into the desert to a place where is she (Israel) is cared for from the middle of the seven years to the end until Christ comes.

In addition, we have Mystery, Babylon the Great, destroyed by the beast and the ten kings sometime during the last 3 1/2 years , so much so that scripture says that no one will ever be able to inhabit that city again. (Rev.18:21-24). That said, Jerusalem/Israel cannot be Babylon the Great, because scripture statues the following:

" When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—and to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God’s people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them."

The scripture above will take place at the end of the thousand years, where Satan is released from the Abyss. Notice that, those that gathers together are said to "surround the camp of the God's people, the city he loves." The city that He loves of course could be none other than Jerusalem, would demonstrate that there will be people inhabiting Jerusalem all the way up to the end the millennial period. But how can that be if Jerusalem/Israel is Babylon the Great which is destroyed during the last 3 1/2 years of the seven period so that no one can inhabit ever again?

So scripture states that Israel is cared for by God during the last 3 1/2 years. And we have Babylon the Great being destroyed so that no one can ever inhabit that city again, which you claim is Jerusalem and its people Israel. Yet as I pointed out, scripture states that the people that Satan gathers at the end of the thousand years will be surround the city that God loves, which can be none other than Jerusalem, which shows that people will be inhabiting Jerusalem even up to the end.

Furthermore, the book of Revelation is the fulfillment of the long prophesied "day of the Lord" when God pours His wrath out upon the entire earth via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, which are world-wide judgments and not just restricted to Israel. Obviously you have not done any studies on the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, else you would not say that much of the book of Revelation is about God's judgment upon apostate Israel. I'll use a couple of examples: At the culmination of the first four seals a fourth of the earth's (not Israel's) population is killed via war, famine, plagues and by the wild beasts of the earth.

At the sounding of the first trumpet a third of the earth and trees are burned up. A third of the earth is much bigger than Israel.

At the sounding of the second trumpet, a third of the creatures in the oceans are killed and a third of the ships over all the earth are destroyed. How can this be restricted to Israel?

At the sounding of the third trumpet, a third of the rivers and fresh water are contaminated, where many people die from drinking it. It says a third of the rivers and springs of water over all the earth, not a third of Israel's rivers and springs of water.

At the sounding of the fifth trumpet, demonic beings resembling locusts will be released from the Abyss and will torment the entire inhabitants of the earth with stings like that of a scorpion. The only group protected are those 144,000 who will have been sealed on their foreheads. So gain, how is this plague restricted to Israel?

At the fourth bowl judgment, the sun is given power to scorch the inhabitants of the earth with intense heat, searing them. The sun affects the entire earth. So how can this plague be only affect Israel?

At the pouring out of the seventh bowl, the greatest earthquake since mankind has been on the earth will take place, causing all of the mountains and islands world-wide, will not be found. Again, how is that only affecting Israel?

You sir, do not know what you are talking about when you say that "much of the book of Revelation is about Gods judgement on apostate Israel," as I just proved to you by listing the scriptures that it involves the entire earth and all of its inhabitants. Regarding Israel, this is what scripture has to say about her salvation:

"As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you. For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all."

Just as the scripture above states, the Gentiles were given over to disobedience so that God could have mercy on us. In the same way, Israel has been given over to disobedience so that they too may receive God's mercy.

God is about ready to initiate that last seven years. But before He picks up where He left off with His people Israel and the pouring out of His wrath upon all the inhabitants of the earth, the Lord is going to appear in the air and gather His church. Anyone who is not prepared that day will close on them like a trap and they will not escape, but will be exposed to all that is going to take place during that time.

Anyone who is any enemy of Israel, are enemies of God.

It would be a waste of time and effort to reply point by point to your posting but I will say the following:

You should have written Anyone who is any enemy of Christ are enemies of God

Why? because Christ himself is the embodiment of the true Israel. Anyone who is in Christ is part of the true Israel.

In Exodus God calls Israel his Son

In Hosea the Prophet quotes Exodus

In Matthew the apostle quotes Hosea

The Bible is written using pictorial language to convey spiritual truth especially in the Prophetic Books. Revelation relies heavily on this.

PlainWord · May 15, 2018

Endoscopy said:

From your answer I can see you really struggle with basic reading comprehension skills. Where does Jesus say He's jumping into the distant future in any of those verses? Everything He said was aimed squarely at them, such as:

Vs 34. I send unto you, prophets...some of them, ye shall kill...ye shall persecute...

Vs 38. Your house is left unto you desolate.

Do you even know what house Jesus was discussing? He wasn't talking about their individual residences, although they were left desolate also. He was speaking of the temple.

PlainWord · May 15, 2018

Foolish one???? What am I going to with you my dear grasshopper, LOL. You ignore the question had three parts.

And when he is sitting on the mount of the Olives, the disciples came near to him by himself, saying, `Tell us, when shall these be? and what [is] the sign of thy presence, and of the full end of the age?'

1. When will these things be?

What things? They were discussing the temple a few hours earlier. Now they were on the Mount of Olives looking at what? You said you've been to Jerusalem. If you are on the Mount of Olives looking across the Kidron Valley in 30 AD, what would be the most prominent thing visible to you? No other topic was introduced prior to this question. Look back on the day they just had. Read back a few chapters starting in Mat 21. Jesus gave them a lot of information that day and now they wanted to know when all of this was supposed to happen.

Here are the 3 parts to their question.

2. Sign of Your Presence.

It doesn't say coming. The literal translation is Presence. The opposite of presence is absence, not going or leaving. Did the presence of either God or Jesus come to supervise the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD? If you don't think so you do not know your OT.

3. Full end of the age.

My position is the "full end of the age" was the end of Israel as a nation for the foreseeable future. Yours is the end of planet Earth. It matters not what we think, it matters what they thought and how they used words. Look at their contemporary - Josephus. How does he describe what he was seeing as the temple was on fire? GAME - SET - MATCH!!

So Titus retired into the tower of Antonia, and resolved to storm the temple the next day, early in the morning, with his whole army, and to encamp round about the holy house. But as for that house, God had, for certain, long ago doomed it to the fire; and now that fatal day was come, according to the revolution of ages;

Endoscopy · May 15, 2018

PlainWord said:

Try again. Here is his return using AMPC version. The AMPC gives all alternate meanings of original language words.

First the tribulation ends.
Second the sign of the Son of Man appears.
Third Jesus appears in brilliance and splender.
Fourth all of the tribes of earth will mourn etc.
Fifth he sends the angels to gather the people with the rapture.
Oops. All visible events.

Did the tribulation occur?
Did everyone see Jesus return.

Matthew 24 AMPC (Amplified Classic Edition)

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not shed its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and beat their breasts and lament in anguish, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory [in brilliancy and splendor].
31 And He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect (His chosen ones) from the four winds, [even] from one end of the universe to the other.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

Grasshopper,

You keep going back to Mat 24 ignoring Mat 23 which identifies which generation will see all those things." Also, you ignored my other two multiple choice questions but we can get back to those later. Let me try again to help you with Mat 24 because you are still confused.

We can work with the AMPC although I like YLT better.

All correct observations. Just know the "tribes of the Earth" were the Tribes of Israel as I demonstrated before and the great tribulation was the siege of Jerusalem from Mar to Sep, 70 AD as I also showed.

Let's focus on this. There is a key phrase in Mat 24:31 that you don't fully understand. FOUR WINDS. Where are the Elect gathered from? The "four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

See Ezek 37:9. Using your AMPC:

Then said He to me, Prophesy to the breath and spirit, son of man, and say to the breath and spirit, Thus says the Lord God: Come from the four winds, O breath and spirit, and breathe upon these slain that they may live.

See also Zec 6:5:

And the angel answered me, These are the four winds or spirits of the heavens, which go forth from presenting themselves before the Lord of all the earth.

"Wind" in the Hebrew can also mean "spirit" as seen in Zec 6:5. These four winds also come from all directions, north, south, east and west. They represent God's spiritual power from the spiritual realm present in and acting upon things in our physical realm. Another way of describing this is the four winds accomplish a supernatural event. You call it, "the rapture" and by this I assume you mean the forceful taking of the living up into the sky and off to heaven transformed into spiritual beings? This idea is incorrect. Mat 24:31 is actually speaking of the resurrection of the just and the Harpazo.

The rest of Mat 24 and all of Mat 25 are discussing spiritual things. Mat 25, for instance, starts out identifying that the chapter is all about "the Kingdom of Heaven." The rest of Mat 25 discuss the judgment and the criteria Jesus uses to judge the righteous from the wicked. Mat 25 ends with this:

Then they will go away into eternal punishment, but those who are just and upright and in right standing with God into eternal life.

This happened in 70 AD when "the Son of Man came in all His glory and splendor." The dead in Christ arose and went to Heaven while the living in Christ received salvation and immortality to never die spiritually, meaning they never have to endure a period of separation from God which was the case prior to this event. There is no passage where the living are transformed immediately into spiritual beings and whisked off to heaven. This notion is false and an invention of man.

Sorry for the weird font changes as the cut and paste feature of this site is unpredictable.

Endoscopy · May 16, 2018

PlainWord said:

It doesn't matter where Matthew 23 took place or which generation will see it. Matthew 24 starts with Jesus leaving the temple area and pointing back to the temple complex making the prophecy that not one stone will be left on another of the temple complex. Josephus records this eradication happening to the temple complex. In verse 3 he is on the Mount of Olives and his disciples ask him about the end times. The rest is Jesus prophesying about the end times. Verse 15 talks about the abomination of desolation standing in the Holy Place. That requires the third temple to be built. Archaeologists have excavated where the first and second temple stood. It is in the north part of the City of David and not on the temple mount. Historical records, the Bible, and Archaeology prove the temple was just south of the temple mount. This is in the process of having people understand that the wall is part of the Roman fort Antonio. That fort housing 10,000 people including 6,000 soldiers of the 10th legion would take up the entire plateau. Romans would take the high ground for their fort. The temple and Jerusalem was destroyed later. There are rumors that the Jews are preparing to build the third temple. When that occurs the end times start. With the abomination of desolation taking place in the temple.

Go back and reread the eschatologyical writings including the part of them in the Gospels and Epistles. Matthew 24 is part of this.

More information about this.

Second temple location
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rmk6_bIDMM

Second Temple
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Temple

Destruction of the second temple
http://www.aish.com/jl/h/cc/48944036.html?tab=y#

Gman · May 16, 2018

Whatever you believe about these things keep between you and God it is frankly irrelevant what anyone thinks what will be will be.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

Endoscopy said:

Nope, it's one continuous thought. He was speaking specifically to them, telling them what was to happen to them in their day. Nowhere does Christ say, "oh, by the way you vipers, I'm really going to take your wickedness out on a future generation thousands of years later who had nothing to do with your sins and crimes. Man, am I ever going to punish them, but you all get a pass." Sorry, your idea is completely illogical and unscriptural.

Christ has been condemning His generation throughout. What does Christ say about their generation in Mat 12:39?

But He replied to them, An evil and adulterous generation (a generation morally unfaithful to God) seeks and demands a sign; but no sign shall be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.

I suppose you think this was meant for some generation future to us also? Do you not know what the "sign of Jonah" was?? Do you not see the connection to what happened to Jerusalem in 70 AD? Nineveh was given 40 days to repent or they would be overthrown!! Jerusalem was given 40 years, they did not repent, they were overthrown!!

Endoscopy · May 16, 2018

Gman said:

ROFL
You seem unable to understand what a forum is about. It is a a place for people to exchange ideas on all kinds of topics. This forum is about Christian concepts. Eschatology is one of the discussed topics. Since it is written in Daniel and Revelation in symbolic language it is hard to understand. Daniel even states it is closed until the end times. Therefore much debate about it occurs.

If you don't like a topic go to a thread you like.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

They asked about the end of the age, not the end of the planet. How many times do I have to keep showing you what the actual text says?

They asked when "these things" (the destruction of the temple) would be, the sign of His Presence and the completion of the age. They did not ask about some event far off into our future thousands of years late. This basic misunderstanding of yours is causing you to twist and distort like Hilary.

Endoscopy · May 16, 2018

PlainWord said:

Nope, it's one continuous thought. He was speaking specifically to them, telling them what was to happen to them in their day. Nowhere does Christ say, "oh, by the way you vipers, I'm really going to take your wickedness out on a future generation thousands of years later who had nothing to do with your sins and crimes. Man, am I ever going to punish them, but you all get a pass." Sorry, your idea is completely illogical and unscriptural.

Christ has been condemning His generation throughout. What does Christ say about their generation in Mat 12:39?

But He replied to them, An evil and adulterous generation (a generation morally unfaithful to God) seeks and demands a sign; but no sign shall be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.

I suppose you think this was meant for some generation future to us also? Do you not know what the "sign of Jonah" was?? Do you not see the connection to what happened to Jerusalem in 70 AD? Nineveh was given 40 days to repent or they would be overthrown!! Jerusalem was given 40 years, they did not repent, they were overthrown!!

It is obvious to the casual observer that you do not want to hear a non full pretorist view. I reject your view. Just leave it at agree to disagree and leave it at that.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

Endoscopy said:

I used to share your view for much of my life but only became a preterist when my eyes were opened about 5 years ago. Holding to your view makes the scripture null and void, it lets the wicked who killed Christ off the hook and provides no rest to the Thessalonians, no blessed hope for Titus etc. Too many holes in your view brother. But, we can leave it at that and rejoice in our salvation as none of this matters in the end.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

preston39 said:

But it is scriptural brother. The "earth" in this context was first century Israel which was totally cleansed and left desolate.

Why do you think they were told to watch, wait and be sober if Christ wasn't to return for thousands of years?

abcdef · May 16, 2018

PlainWord said:

Brother PW,

Another thing that needs to be considered is the parallel passages of Mk 13 and Lk 21. In those passages only 2 questions are asked,

Mk 13:4, #1 When shall these things be and #2 what shall be the sign?

Lk 21:7, #1 When shall these things be and #2 what sign will there be?

Jesus answered those 2 questions completely in those 2 passages.

In these passages, the question does not appear about the end of the "age".

----

It is plainly seen in Lk 21:24 that the people of Jerusalem are killed by the sword. They use guns and bombs in modern times, proving that this is 70 ad history.

We see nothing about the resur/rapt in those to passages. But we do see the presence/coming of Jesus at the dest of Jerusalem in 70 ad.

Now adding the question and parallel passage from Matt 24, it is seen that the Matt passage is also centering on the 70 ad dest.

This shows that the end of the "age" can only mean the end of the "70 ad temple age".

---------

Jesus came at the 70 ad time period dest., but it wasn't a resurrection coming, that has yet to happen.

Every eye will see Him, means that every Israelite will know that Jesus was Messiah and God when Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed, because those things could only have been done by the power of God. Jesus and the prophets had told them, Ezek 5.

--------

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

abcdef said:

99% Agreed!! Glad you are finally seeing the presence of Christ upon the destr of Jer. The only part you are missing is the resurrection of the just. Three times in John 6, Jesus said he would raise them on the last day. He told Martha the same thing in John 11. It was to be the last day of Israel, not the planet. Christ's presence returned to judge the wicked and reward the saints and to usher in the new Messianic Age, which of course we are still in. The resurrection is found in Mat 24:31, the gathering of the Elect from the four winds.

Your point about the Luke and Mark accounts I was actually going to make too, but brother End, is on baby step 1. He cannot handle anything we are telling him yet. The Luke account is perhaps the clearest because he makes clear it is when Jerusalem is surrounded by its enemies that all should flee Judea (not the planet, LOL). He also states that after these things to look up, because their (the saved) redemption draws near.

All of this (EVERY BIT OF IT) was fulfilled in the first century. All one has to do is ask, "What change did the Cross make?" This seems like a simple question and answer, but too many don't consider the practical implications. Since the Fall and before the Cross, the dead went to Hades, the spiritual underworld, separated from God. Because in Adam all men died, but in Christ man could again be made alive. This restoration was a first century event, it isn't anything we need to wait for. We die, we immediately go to heaven. All are appointed to die.

This notion that a future generation will get to skip death and go straight to heaven by the 10s of millions is absolute lunacy. What would make that generation so special compared to all the generations of believers who went before them?

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

Another thing that screams of first century fulfillment is this big clue Jesus gave:

[SUP]21 [/SUP]

For then there will be great tribulation (affliction, distress, and oppression) such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now—no, and never will be [again].

We have an independent collaboration of this from Joe as he describes the conditions inside of Jerusalem during its great tribulation. Give this a read Brother A-F. BTW, this ties to the 3rd seal. Horrible conditions:

3. Now of those that perished by famine in the city, the number was prodigious, and the miseries they underwent were unspeakable; for if so much as the shadow of any kind of food did any where appear, a war was commenced presently, and the dearest friends fell a fighting one with another about it, snatching from each other the most miserable supports of life. Nor would men believe that those who were dying had no food, but the robbers would search them when they were expiring, lest any one should have concealed food in their bosoms, and counterfeited dying; nay, these robbers gaped for want, and ran about stumbling and staggering along like mad dogs, and reeling against the doors of the houses like drunken men; they would also, in the great distress they were in, rush into the very same houses two or three times in one and the same day. Moreover, their hunger was so intolerable, that it obliged them to chew every thing, while they gathered such things as the most sordid animals would not touch, and endured to eat them; nor did they at length abstain from girdles and shoes; and the very leather which belonged to their shields they pulled off and gnawed: the very wisps of old hay became food to some; and some gathered up fibres, and sold a very small weight of them for four Attic [drachmae]. But why do I describe the shameless impudence that the famine brought on men in their eating inanimate things, while I am going to relate a matter of fact, the like to which no history relates, either among the Greeks or Barbarians? It is horrible to speak of it, and incredible when heard. I had indeed willingly omitted this calamity of ours, that I might not seem to deliver what is so portentous to posterity, but that I have innumerable witnesses to it in my own age; and besides, my country would have had little reason to thank me for suppressing the miseries that she underwent at this time.

PlainWord · May 16, 2018

A-F,

Christ spent considerable time warning the wicked religious leaders of His day about what was to come to them if they did not repent and change their ways. Of course the first warning comes from John the Baptist in Mt 3:

Mt 3:

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? [SUP]8 [/SUP]Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance

.

Jesus uses the same words to describe these wicked men here and tells them exactly what was to come of them:

Mt 23:

Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? [SUP]34 [/SUP]Therefore, indeed, I send you prophets, wise men, and scribes: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to city,

[SUP]35 [/SUP]that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. [SUP]36 [/SUP]Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

We don't have to wonder who these prophets were that Jesus was going to send out, because indeed they were sent out into every town in Israel. They were told at this time to stay in Israel:

Mat 10:
These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. [SUP]6 [/SUP]But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

“Now whatever city or town you enter, inquire who in it is worthy, and stay there till you go out. [SUP]12 [/SUP]And when you go into a household, greet it. [SUP]13 [/SUP]If the household is worthy, let your peace come upon it. But if it is not worthy, let your peace return to you. [SUP]14 [/SUP]And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet. [SUP]15 [/SUP]Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!

Every wicked city that did not receive them was destroyed in the war with Rome.

Looking closely again above at the passage from Mat 23, let's turn to Rev 18. The judgment has come to Jerusalem (Babylon) and we see identical language used.

Rev 18:

For your merchants were the great men of the earth, for by your sorcery all the nations were deceived. [SUP]24 [/SUP]And in her was found the blood of prophets and saints, and of all who were slain on the earth.”

Do you now see that it was Jerusalem, not the RCC, that was the Harlot and she was slain in 70 AD? She was responsible for the blood of the prophets just as Jesus declared in Mat 23.

The Rapture

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Junior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member