The Law of Moses Has Not Been Abolished

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Apr 23, 2017
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#1
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#2
Romans 7:16
"If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good"
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#3
The condemnation of the law has been nailed to the cross for all who believe and the law is for the lawless.....NEXT!
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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#4
We are free from the law of sin and death. If you are not under grace
you are under the law and will be judged by the law and found wanting.

A new command I give you: Love one another.
As I have loved you, so you must love one another.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#5
Of course it has, it was nigh unto passing away when Hebrews was written:

Heb 8:13 (NASB) When He said, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. But whatever is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to disappear.

Heb 8:13 (KJV) In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
 
Jan 7, 2017
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#6
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
We are not under Old Test. Moral Law, Civil Law or Ceremonial Law, I will leave it at that for now.
 

NotmebutHim

Senior Member
May 17, 2015
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#7
Jesus' statements about the Mosaic Law not passing away were recorded in Matthew's Gospel. We all know that but the reason I bring it up is because we have to consider who Jesus' audience was and to whom Matthew wrote his Gospel. It was written to and for the Jews. Christ was driving the point home that He was not going to destroy the Law. That's the covenant that the Jews were under at that time. He knew full well that there would be some who would see Him as trying to nullify the law of Moses. And later on, in Matthew 23, He starts by telling His disciples and the rest of the crowd that the scribes & Pharisees. sit in Moses' seat, and that the people should observe and do what they are told to observe and do. This was just before Jesus pronounced woes on the scribes & Pharisees.

I can't recall if it was Jesus or one of the Apostles who said that the law is good if one uses it wisely. I can't recall the exact wording on that.

$0.02
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#8
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
Joh 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
Joh 13:35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Mat 22:36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

In the Old Testament God gave them the spiritual laws,love God,and love people,moral laws,which is the ten commandments that always abide,and moral laws,but they could not have the Spirit,so they could not live up to the spiritual laws perfectly,so God had them do physical ordinances to keep them right with Him,that they were able to keep,and also God blessed with things of the physical world,and it was alright at that time,material things,abundance of things,and money,and allowed Israel to war against her enemies.

In the New Testament Jesus said a new commandment I give you,that you love one another as I have loved you,for it is a new commandment for the saints can love perfectly by the Spirit,and love works no ill towards their neighbor,therefore love is the fulfilling of the law,and God does not bless with material things,and money,in the New Testament,but only our needs,and tells us to help the needy and poor whenever possible,and does not allow the saints to war,but says all wars come from the lusts of people,and to be harmless as doves,and turn the other cheek.

We only follow love God,and love people,in the New Testament,and on those two laws hang all the law,and prophets,and in the New Testament we can have the Spirit which we can love God,and love people perfectly,and if all the law and prophets hang on those 2 laws,then they must have been fulfilled,for love God,and love people,to take place in perfection.

Jesus took the physical ordinances of Israel out of the way,nailing them to His cross,for they were contrary to us,which means they had no bearing on spiritual salvation,and no profit to people in spiritual salvation whatsoever,so they passed away,for they were temporary,a shadow of things to come,and the body is of Christ by the Spirit,love God,and love people,and the Old Testament physical ordinances,and physical laws,have no place,and have no profit,in the New Testament,but love God,and love people,which we can do perfectly by the Spirit,and since perfectly,all the law and the prophets hang on those 2 commandments,so they must have been fulfilled.

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament law in Himself.It is not saying that the Old Testament physical ordinances,and physical laws,are in effect until heaven and earth pass,for Jesus took away the physical ordinances,and physical laws,but He fulfilled the Old Testament law that is in effect until heaven and earth pass away,which means they are in effect all the way untl the end of the millennial reign of Christ,and then when the saints are in the New Jerusalem,the final destination of the saints,the earth,and heaven,shall pass away,and they shall not be remembered,or come to mind.In the New Jerusalem the saints,and angels,will not remember anything prior to the New Jerusalem,for it is associated with sin and rebellion,and it will be a place where sin has never been,and sin will never be.

Jesus did not come to destroy the law and prophets,but to fulfill them,which He fulfilled the Old Testament law,for He is a sinless man under the Old Testament,for the New did not go in to effect until He shed His blood,the perfect King,the perfect High Priest,the perfect saint,the perfect sacrifice,the perfect lawgiver giving a new commandment in perfect love,and whatever else He had to fulfill,He fulfilled it all.

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Our righteousness has to exceed that of the scribes and Pharisees,or we cannot enter heaven,which Jesus is saying about the laws of love,and moral laws,when He said if we break the least of the commandments,and teach so,we are the least in the kingdom of heaven,for he pointed out we have to be above the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees,talking about the moral laws,not the physical laws.

Paul said we do not void out the law through faith,but we establish the law,and said that the law is spiritual,holy,just,and good,so Paul is talking about the laws of love,moral laws,not the physical ordinances,and physical laws,but he points out the spiritual laws,which does include the ten commandments,for they are laws of love towards God and people.

Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament law,paving the way for us to be able to receive the Spirit,and love God,and love people perfectly,and be able to abide by the moral laws of God,and if perfectly,and all the law and prophets hang on those 2 laws,then the Old Testament law and prophets must have been fulfilled.

Which they were fulfilled by Jesus,for they would have to be,for it cannot say we still go by the Old Testament physical ordinancs,and physical laws,for Jesus took them away,and if we only go by love God,and love people,which are the 2 greatest laws,and can do that perfectly by the Spirit,and all the law and prophest hang on those 2 laws,then they must have been fulfilled.

And they were by Jesus.

If we can have the Spirit,and love God,and love people perfectly,we have fulfilled the Old Testament law,and the New Testament law,and we can establish the spiritual laws,like Paul said we have to do,so how much more did Jesus,a sinless man,fulfill the Old Testament law,as well as the New Testament law,when He was on earth,for if we can fulfill the law by the Spirit,of course Jesus fulfilled the law when He was on earth,and was the first person to do so to pave the way for us to have the Spirit,and fulfill the law.

Of course Jesus fulfilled the law when on earth,and He took the physical ordinances,and physical laws,out of the way,so it cannot refer to them.

Then Jesus goes on to say,you have heard that it has been said this according to the Old Testament,and then states a more excellent way about it that transcends the Old Testament,to the New Testament,concerning more love,love that can finally be perfect by the Spirit.

Love is the fulfilling of the law,but could not be done perfectly in the Old,but can be in the New by the Spirit.

Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Mat 5:23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
Mat 5:24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
Mat 5:25 Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Mat 5:26 Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.
Lust
Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
Mat 5:33 Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:
Mat 5:34 But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:
Mat 5:35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.
Mat 5:36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.
Mat 5:37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.
Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.
Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Jesus presented a more excellent way in love in the New Testament,and perfect love that saves our soul,for love is the fulfilling of the law,and follow peace with all people,and holiness,without which no person shall see the Lord.

Jesus fulfilled the law that will abide until the saints are in the New Jerusalem,which they will not remember the earth,or the heaven,that they used to live,and see.
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#9
The Law of Moses is not abolished. Its just not for Christians. Its for people who haven't come to faith in Christ.(Galatians 3:24-26)

For those who have come to faith in Christ it is abolished. We get something better. The Holy Spirit.


Abiding in Christ, by faith, produces the fruit that the Law Commands. That is how Christians do not nullify the law but uphold it. (Romans 10:3-6)
 

Embankment

Senior Member
Feb 28, 2017
693
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#10
The Law of Moses is not abolished. Its just not for Christians. Its for people who haven't come to faith in Christ.(Galatians 3:24-26)

For those who have come to faith in Christ it is abolished. We get something better. The Holy Spirit.


Abiding in Christ, by faith, produces the fruit that the Law Commands. That is how Christians do not nullify the law but uphold it. (Romans 10:3-6)
Technically the law was only for the Jews. Gentiles had no law at all.
 
L

limey410

Guest
#11
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
Of course the covenant still exists, it is an everlasting covenant, you can still choose to live under it if you desire, it will give you lots of flour for your kneading bowl, it will allow you lend and not borrow, your children will not be eaten by wild animals. (That is if you can fully live by ALL of the Law), make sure you set your pets on fire at every festival etc etc.....

Yet no-where in the Law does it state that you will have an everlasting eternal relationship with your God. It can still be used for its intended purpose, which is to drive people to the Grace and Mercy of the living God. (My estimation is if that you are not driven there, then you are just not trying hard enough to live in obedience to the mosaic law)

We now have a better way to live, under the New Covenant, thank God.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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#12
Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin. Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
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#13
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
Seems you omitted a key clause in that text. No doubt this was by design. "For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, until all be fulfilled." Jesus had just said in the previous verse that he came for the expressed purpose of fulfilling the Law and the prophets. "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill it." The Hebrew writer shown in great detail that the old covenant and it law has been taken away and the new covenant has been inaugurated.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#14
2 Co 3:7 (Young's) and if the ministration of the death, in letters, engraved in stones, came in glory, so that the sons of Israel were not able to look stedfastly to the face of Moses, because of the glory of his face -- which was being made useless

2 Co 3:8 how shall the ministration of the Spirit not be more in glory?

Strongs

G2673 katargeo kat-arg-eh'-o

from G2596 and G691;

to be (render) entirely idle (useless), literally or figuratively.



KJV: abolish, cease, cumber, deliver, destroy, do away, become (make) of no (none, without) effect, fail, loose, bring (come) to nought, put away (down), vanish away, make void.
 

Tommy379

Notorious Member
Jan 12, 2016
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#15
In my estimation, Jesus gave us commands that are way more harder to uphold, than the laws Moses brought.
 
S

Spokenpassage

Guest
#16
I am sure that Hebrews said that the first covenant is passed away.

Let's be clear, no one was ever saved by merit of obeying the first covenant. The Law of Moses, as a covenant, were stipulations to Israel of meriting blessings or curses, whether in the land of Canaan, or as a nation itself. It foreshadowed the New Covenant, plus, it was incorporated as the New Covenant's stipulations to Christ (not to us) to merited the eternal blessings of heaven. To us the New Covenant's blessings are freely given, but to Christ those blessings had to be earned by virtue of his righteous life under the law and atoning death at the cross. Since Christ has fulfilled the Law of Moses, typologically (or typically) and obediently, those stipulations have found their end. Circumscion is of no value, simply because, well, it's purpose of pointing foward has finally met its end.

If you believe that believers, sharing in the blessings of Christ in the New Covenant, are bound to regulations that regard to earthly worship and civil duties of the nation of Israelites, then you may be attempting to overthrow the arrival of the New Covenant.

Now, the moral code of the Law of Moses is not abolished, let's be clear on that. How? The Decologue in transcendent to covenants, it was added to the Old Covenant for blessings, but it did not begin in the Old Covenant. God made use of the Decalogue for Israel, more than just pointing out sin and the need for the Christ.
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#17
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.
We will always want to obey the Lord's commandments. Why would we want to start murdering people, or bearing false witness, or committing adultery, or stealing?
 

Desertsrose

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2016
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#18
The Law of Moses has not been abolished, because heaven and earth has not yet passed away, hence "unit heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle will pass away from the Law..." and "whoever sets aside the least of the commands, will be called least...". Even Paul says, "we do not nullify the Law by this faith, but we uphold the Law". Let's start a discussion on these matters.

Hi Chris,

Why the Law then? It was added because of transgressions, having been ordained through angels by the agency of a mediator, until the seed would come to whom the promise had been made. Now a mediator is not for one party only; whereas God is only one. Is the Law then contrary to the promises of God?

May it never be! For if a law had been given which was able to impart life, then righteousness would indeed have been based on law. But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed.

Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. Galatians 3:19-26
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
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#19
Revelation 14:3
And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song except the 144,000 who had been redeemed from the earth.


Revelation 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.


Revelation 15:3
and sang the song of God's servant Moses and of the Lamb: "Great and marvelous are your deeds, Lord God Almighty. Just and true are your ways, King of the nations.
 
Apr 23, 2017
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#20
Seems you omitted a key clause in that text. No doubt this was by design. "For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, until all be fulfilled." Jesus had just said in the previous verse that he came for the expressed purpose of fulfilling the Law and the prophets. "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill it." The Hebrew writer shown in great detail that the old covenant and it law has been taken away and the new covenant has been inaugurated.
The Law is not yet fulfilled, for the autumn festivals (Festival of Trumpets, Day of Atonement, Festival of Booths), which are all related to the second coming of Jesus Christ, have not yet been fulfilled, but the Law did indeed begin to be fulfilled at the first coming of Jesus Christ, for the spring festivals correspond to his first coming (Passover, First Fruits, Pentecost, Feast of Unleavened Bread). Even the Sabbath, which foreshadows the last thousand years of this heaven and earth (6000 years + 1000 years of rest for the entire earth), has also not been fulfilled. This is why, UNTIL heaven and earth pass away, the Law will not pass away. As such, the Law is quite still in full force today. You guys don't like the Law, so you find reasonings to try the ignore it, when it is in fact this very Law that reveals everything that is sin. If you think the Law is abolished, then you cannot possibly live a life that is obedient to God, nor could you possibly actually even fully repent for that matter, for the Law reveals the righteous requirements of God. I have two studies on this The Law of Moses Has Not Been Abolished | Wisdom of God and Why the Law Is Not Abolished, Yet Circumcision, Festivals, Sacrifices, Sabbaths, Foods Are No Longer Observed | Wisdom of God .