Is Hell the Fifth Horseman of the Apocalypse?

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Nov 1, 2016
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#1
Revelation 6:8
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth"


So how did Hell follow?

A) Hell was on another horse following the other four
B) Hell sat on the same horse as Death
C) Hell wasn't on a horse
D) Other?

This is something I've always wondered about.

What are your thoughts?

:confused:
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#2
Hell was in the buggy - that what he's called the buggy man...:p

 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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#3
Revelation 6:8
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth"


So how did Hell follow?

A) Hell was on another horse following the other four
B) Hell sat on the same horse as Death
C) Hell wasn't on a horse
D) Other?

This is something I've always wondered about.

What are your thoughts?

:confused:
Its a bad translation.

It should be translated like " his name that sat on him was Death, and underworld (the realm of the dead) followed him"
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#4
it also states that

a. HELL moves to meet thee at thy coming...........O.T.
b. Stirs up all the chief one's of the earth.......O.T.
c. Raised up all the Kings of the Earth...O.T

In my mind it is the result of death....most on the planet are lost (broad wide way) and anytime death en masse happens...most pour into hell......just my rambling thoughts
 

Yahshua

Senior Member
Sep 22, 2013
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#5
Its a bad translation.

It should be translated like " his name that sat on him was Death, and underworld (the realm of the dead) followed him"
Agreed. Bad translation.

Better still, it would be best to understand the word as "the grave".

"He that sat on him was Death, and The Grave followed him" (which would naturally follow death as a consequence).

The Greek word used was "hades" from greco-roman (pagan) influence because Hebrews didn't believe in an "abode where the dead lived as spirits". When someone was dead they were dead: their body returns to the earth and their breath of life returns to God.

But using the word "Hades" (plucked straight from Greek mythology) gave rise to the early church's understanding of "hell: the realm where all the dead reside as spirits".

Then later this concept was further confused with "The Lake of Fire" to become "Burning Hell: the place of torment prepared for satan and all evildoers".


But the basic concept should be understood as "The Grave: the place (or state) every mortal reaches when they die".
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#6
I guess we can all agree that Hell (or Hades as trofimus and Yahshua suggest) is mobile.

Hell is not just 'under the Earth' as most assume, but has the ability to travel about.
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#7
This verse seems to suggest that there are FIVE horses...

Zechariah 6:2
In the first chariot were red horses
and in the second chariot black horses
And in the third chariot white horses
and in the fourth chariot grisled
and bay horses

Is there a clue here?

It's almost as if Hades/Hell is not a rider of a horse, but the horse itself.

Either Grisled or Bay.

It even appears as if the Bay horses take a different path, even though they are from the same chariot...

Zechariah 6:7
"And the bay went forth, and sought to go that they might walk to and fro through the earth: and he said, Get you hence, walk to and fro through the earth. So they walked to and fro through the earth"


I'm not sure what to make of all this yet.

:confused:
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,162
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#8
Agreed. Bad translation.

Better still, it would be best to understand the word as "the grave".

"He that sat on him was Death, and The Grave followed him" (which would naturally follow death as a consequence).

The Greek word used was "hades" from greco-roman (pagan) influence because Hebrews didn't believe in an "abode where the dead lived as spirits". When someone was dead they were dead: their body returns to the earth and their breath of life returns to God.

But using the word "Hades" (plucked straight from Greek mythology) gave rise to the early church's understanding of "hell: the realm where all the dead reside as spirits".

Then later this concept was further confused with "The Lake of Fire" to become "Burning Hell: the place of torment prepared for satan and all evildoers".


But the basic concept should be understood as "The Grave: the place (or state) every mortal reaches when they die".
Yeah, tell that to the rich man of Lazarus fame. Both Lazarus and the rich man died and while their bodies were decaying upon the earth, they found themselves (their spirits) in Sheol/Hades. Lazarus was in a place of paradise and the rich man in a place of torment directly across from where Abraham and Lazarus were.

Everyone who dies without Christ goes into Hades, which is the place of the unrighteous, departed spirits. It is an actual place and not just referring to the Grave. In fact neither Sheol nor Hades should ever be interpreted as grave.

At the end of the thousand year reign of Christ, after Satan's and his angels have been thrown into the lake of fire, those who are in Hades will be resurrected and will stand before God at the great white throne and be judged:

"The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done.

Jesus said "I will build my church and the gates of Hades shall not overcome it." Do you actually think that Jesus was talking about the grave?

I created a document on Sheol and Hades, which are the same place and below are the results:

Characteristics of:

· Is down under the earth - Gen.37:35, 42:38, 44:29, 44::31, Num.16:30, 16:33, Deut.32:22, 1 Sam.2:6, 2 kings 2:6, Job 11:7-8, 17:16, Ps.30:3, 86:13, Prov.9:18, 15:24, Isa.5:14, 14:9, 14:11, 14:15, Isa.38:18, Ezk.31:15-17, Ezk.32:21, Ezk.32:27, Mt.11:23, Lk.10:15,

· Has multiple levels - Deut.32:22, Job 11:7-8,

· Referred to as the pit - Job 17:13, Ps.30:3, Prov.1:12, Isa.14:15, Isa.38:18, Ezk.31:15-17

· Has Chambers - Prov.7:27

· Has Gates/Bars - Job 17:16, Isa.38:10, Mt.16:18

· A place of torment in fire – Lk.16:23-24

· Is a literal entity representing the same location – Rev.6:8, 20:14

Sheol (sheh-ole') The underworld (place to which the spirits of people descend at death)
Hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranean retreat), including its accessories and inmates -- grave, hell, pit.

Hades (hah'-dace) The unseen world:
hádēs (from 1 /A "not" and idein/eidō, "see") – properly, the "unseen place," referring to the (invisible) realm in which the unrighteous dead reside, i.e. the present dwelling place of all the departed (deceased); Hades.
 
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Apr 15, 2017
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#9
Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

The wrath of God does not happen until the 7 years is over.The world can still repent of their sins,and be saved,during the first three and one half years,so the wrath of God is not there.The beast has power to rule,and have his way,for the last three and one half years,so the wrath of God is not there.

The wrath of God does not occur until the 7 years is over.

The 5th seal it appears as if the souls under the altar are waiting for the saints that are going through the tribulation to join up with them,and then Jesus shall avenge the saints.

The 6th seal appears as if it is the end of the tribulation period,and all saints are joined up with those in heaven,and now Jesus will avenge the saints,and the wrath of God will be poured upon the world.

Rev 6:7 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Since the fourth seal is death,and hell follows with him,it appears as if this one fourth of the earth that perishes by these things would have to be the wicked,which this could be for a period that went on for some time before the tribulation,although during the first three and one half years,they have trouble,and chaos,which the Bible says when they say Peace and safety,which is when the 7 years will begin,that sudden destruction shall come upon them,as a woman in travail with child,and they shall not escape,so the one fourth perishing of the wicked could happen then,but it also say beasts of the field causes them to perish too,and famine,which would not have anything to do with the sudden destruction that comes upon them,for that is because when they came together as one to try to have peace on earth,there is still rebellion going on among some people that they have to deal with,which in Daniel 11 before the man of sin claims to be God,who works in the world for the first three and one half years,wages war against certain people.

During the first three and one half years is when Islam clashes with the world,but that causes one third of the population to perish,not one fourth,and describes nuclear weapons as to why so many people perish,which the man of sin before he claims to be God,plucks up 3 horns of the 10 horn kingdom up by the roots,which the world is split in to ten sections with a leader in each section,and the man of sin goes against 3 sections,which is concentrated among the Arab countries as they throw nuclear weapons at them,because they rebelled against the world,because of the way the unified religious system operated,and it was nuclear weapons,and the sort,and not killed by the sword,and by death,and by famine,and by beasts of the field.

So I would tend to think that this one fourth is prior to the first three and one half years,or it is during the first three and one half years,and one fourth perishes,along with the one third that perishes because of nuclear weapons.

It could be that the one fourth that perishes is prior to the three and one half years,or might be during the first three and one half years,but I think it is before the three and one half years,and since the one on the horse his name is death,and hell followed him,it would appear as if it is the wicked that perishes.

I believe that the one fourth that perishes could of been going on for quite a while before they say Peace and safety,and the 7 years begins.
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#10
Thanks Ahwatukee.

Your list is exactly what I'm trying to add to...

· Is down under the earth
· Has multiple levels
· Referred to as the pit
· Has Chambers
· Has Gates/Bars
· A place of torment in fire
· Is a literal entity representing the same location


The bullet point I wish to add will look something like...

· Rides a horse that follows Death

or...

· Shares a horse with Death

Or perhaps...

· Is a horse?

Maybe I'm being a little too esoteric, but I see a larger picture in all of this that has to do with the Bottomless Pit and the Womb...

Psalm 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"


These horses seem to have something to do with either Time travel or a Portal of some sort in combination with a type of energy Scientists haven't been able to discover yet.

They call it Quintessence...

"In physics, quintessence is a hypothetical form of dark energy, more precisely a scalar field, postulated as an explanation of the observation of an accelerating rate of expansion of the universe, rather than due to a true cosmological constant"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintessence_%28physics%29
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#11
Revelation 6:8
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth"


So how did Hell follow?

A) Hell was on another horse following the other four
B) Hell sat on the same horse as Death
C) Hell wasn't on a horse
D) Other?

This is something I've always wondered about.

What are your thoughts?

:confused:
I think hell is what out life turns into when we sin. It is one reason why we sooner or later turn from our sin.
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#12
Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
I find it very fascinating that there are 'Souls' under the altar.

Not only that, but they are also 'waiting' for revenge.

What is this place?

They have to wait for their friends to die...

Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
See that?

Where are they resting? Abraham's Bosom? Paradise?

Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.
Note that 'Power' was given.

Power is the Bay Horse in the NIV...

Zechariah 6:7 (NIV)
"When the powerful horses went out, they were straining to go throughout the earth. And he said, "Go throughout the earth!" So they went throughout the earth"


What is this Power?

Dark Energy?

Nukes?
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#13
I think hell is what out life turns into when we sin. It is one reason why we sooner or later turn from our sin.
Excellent.

I too believe that Hell can also be all around us and within us.

In fact, I believe there are Three Hells that are counterfeit to the Three Heavens.
 

Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
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#14
Revelation 6:8
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth"


So how did Hell follow?

A) Hell was on another horse following the other four
B) Hell sat on the same horse as Death
C) Hell wasn't on a horse
D) Other?

This is something I've always wondered about.

What are your thoughts?

:confused:
To answer your question,,, The fifth Horseman is Death and Hell. Look how it is written... "Followed with HIM".
 
Apr 23, 2017
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#15
Revelation 6:8
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth"


So how did Hell follow?

A) Hell was on another horse following the other four
B) Hell sat on the same horse as Death
C) Hell wasn't on a horse
D) Other?

This is something I've always wondered about.

What are your thoughts?

:confused:
The four horsemen are evil spirits that are sent to the earth for the different purposes symbolized in each seal. Those seals in Revelation correspond to this passage,


Then I looked up again and saw four chariots coming from between two bronze mountains. The first chariot was pulled by red horses, the second by black horses, the third by white horses, and the fourth by powerful dappled-gray horses. "And what are these, my lord?" I asked the angel who was talking with me. The angel replied, "These are the four spirits of heaven who stand before the Lord of all the earth. They are going out to do his work. The chariot with black horses is going north, the chariot with white horses is going west, and the chariot with dappled-gray horses is going south." The powerful horses were eager to set out to patrol the earth. And the LORD said, "Go and patrol the earth!" So they left at once on their patrol. (Zechariah 6:1-7 [NLT])
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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#16
It's all hypothetical really, the book of revelation is primarily about the judgment of the whore aka 1st century apostate Israel that was guilty of killing the prophets which long ago came to pass.

Luk 13:34 'Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that is killing the prophets, and stoning those sent unto her, how often did I will to gather together thy children, as a hen her brood under the wings, and ye did not will.


John tells us the things he was shown must soon come to pass:

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John.

The sooner you take his statements to heart the better you'll understand da book...
 
Nov 1, 2016
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#17
The powerful horses were eager to set out to patrol the earth. And the LORD said, "Go and patrol the earth!" So they left at once on their patrol
See, this is why I can't stand the newer translations.

Your translation says something completely different than the KJV...

Zechariah 6:7
"And the bay went forth, and sought to go that they might walk to and fro through the earth: and he said, Get you hence, walk to and fro through the earth. So they walked to and fro through the earth"


The KJV is saying that not only were there five different horses, but that one of the five (the Bay horse) wanted to separate and go a different path.

We have Four Chariots, yes... however... we have Five Horses.

The Red horses aren't mentioned
The Black horses go North
The White go after them
The Grissled go South
The Bay walked "to and Fro"

You know, it's sad...

This is why there is so much debate and confusion anymore.

The Translators have messed with the text so much, we can't even have a normal conversation without running into one lie after another.

What a drag.

:mad:
 
Apr 23, 2017
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#18
See, this is why I can't stand the newer translations.

Your translation says something completely different than the KJV...

Zechariah 6:7
"And the bay went forth, and sought to go that they might walk to and fro through the earth: and he said, Get you hence, walk to and fro through the earth. So they walked to and fro through the earth"


The KJV is saying that not only were there five different horses, but that one of the five (the Bay horse) wanted to separate and go a different path.

We have Four Chariots, yes... however... we have Five Horses.

The Red horses aren't mentioned
The Black horses go North
The White go after them
The Grissled go South
The Bay walked "to and Fro"

You know, it's sad...

This is why there is so much debate and confusion anymore.

The Translators have messed with the text so much, we can't even have a normal conversation without running into one lie after another.

What a drag.

:mad:
You're confusing your own self, the text clearly states that there are four chariots, even in the KJV,

And I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came four chariots out from between two mountains; and the mountains were mountains of brass. In the first chariot were red horses; and in the second chariot black horses; And in the third chariot white horses; and in the fourth chariot grisled and bay horses. (Zechariah 6:1)

Which represent four spirits,

And the angel answered and said unto me, These are the four spirits of the heavens, which go forth from standing before the Lord of all the earth. (Zechariah 6:5 [KJV])

And these four spirits correspond to the first four seals of Revelation. These passages relate to each other and it is not a coincidence that they fit the descriptions of each other.

 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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#19
Rev 6:8 I looked, and there was a pale green horse! Its rider's name was Death, and Hades followed him. They were given authority over one-fourth of the earth to kill people using wars, famines, plagues, and the wild animals of the earth.

This is the ISV.

KJV

Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Both say there is a rider on the horse.