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Thread: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

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    Senior Member preacher4truth's Avatar
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    Default Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Or are the things taking place in this video with Bill Johnson, Todd Bentley and others of their ilk "of God?"

    ForthAngel and SovereignGrace like this.
    People are offended that God is God.

    Oh, my brethren! bold-hearted men are always called mean-spirited by cowards. - Charles Spurgeon

    I threw out the writings of Moses because he killed that Egyptian guy.

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    The famous scripture that is used from those who believe we lose salvation is 1 Tim. 4:1 - but let's look and see what it is really saying "in context".

    They usually love to just quote the part about seducing spirits and doctrines of devils ( which they usually apply to something they don't believe in but some one else might ).

    Let's see what Paul was actually saying "departing from the faith actually is".

    1 Timothy 4:1-5 (NASB)
    1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away ( apostesontai - this is the word - apostasy ) from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,

    2 by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron,

    3 men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth.

    4 For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with gratitude;

    5 for it is sanctified by means of the word of God and prayer.

    What is going to cause this "falling away" ( apostasy )...people who forbid others to marry...and not to eat certain foods...why is this departing from the faith?...it's in verse 3, 4 and 5.

    verse 3 = which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth. It's in knowing who you are in Christ - who is the truth and the faith....this not marrying and not eating certain foods to keep yourself "separated" from others is a form of self-effort and reliance on a D.I.Y. self-righteousness/holiness mindset.

    This is "departing from the faith - apostasy"....... people creating their own righteousness/holiness through their works of the flesh by self-effort when we are to believe on Christ's work on the cross and resurrection for all things.

    It has the "appearance " of good but it denies the power to effect real change ...which is Christ in us and His life.

    .. man-made religion denying the finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ.


    So we see that the word "apostasy" is not what some try to make it into. The seducing spirits and doctrines of devils is clearly defined by Paul.

    There are many warnings in scripture about living your own ways and thoughts contrary to God such as depending on the flesh for life instead of walking by the spirit and they should be heeded if you want His life to be manifested in us.

    Let's build believers up in Christ and feed them the proper nutrients of proclaiming the love and grace of our Lord for them and these will give them the proper foundation in Christ and then the warnings will be applied in context of Christ's finished work on the cross and not on a works-based, fear-based belief system which only nullifies the very grace of God needed for us to live in this earth.
    BenFTW, mailmandan and joaniemarie like this.

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    Senior Member Marano's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    It seems a lot that goes on in the charismatic movement as seen in the video is not biblical, therefore I cannot agree with them.

    I'm pentecostal myself so I believe in manifestation of the holy spirit in various forms, but they always bring repentance and a sense of humility before a holy God, not what seems to go on on the video.

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Here is a short video showing Bill Johnson talking about trusting God. You judge for yourself about the spirit behind this man.



    Here are some of his quotes:

    1. “Jesus was the desire of the nations. His body – us – should be the desire of the nations because He’s irresistible.”

    2. “In the Old Testament, anything unclean has power over what is clean. A leper yelling ‘Unclean!’ doesn’t reveal God’s heart but the severity of sin. In the New Testament it’s the other way around. A believing spouse sanctifies the entire house, mercy triumphs over judgment, and loves covers a multitude of sins.”

    3. “Jesus released peace to the storm. How do we know He had peace? He was sleeping. You have authority over any storm you can sleep in.”

    4. “Automatically thinking ‘everything that happens is God’s will’ is a lazy way to live. We live in a war. Jesus wasn’t fighting the Father’s will when He raised the dead.”

    5. “If God didn’t cause Katrina, who did? My response is, ‘Well, who did He leave in charge? To whom did He give all authority?’ I refuse to blame God. How many life-threatening storms did Jesus bless? I will not stand as an accuser before God holding up the sins of a city against them. I want no likeness to the accuser of the brethren.”

    6. “I am often asked, ‘Where is that in the Bible?’ Psalm 115. ‘God does what He pleases.’ The Bible reveals His nature but does not contain Him or set boundaries for Him.”

    7. “It’s a great time to be alive. It’s probably a great time to be dead too – I don’t know.”

    8. “Don’t be impressed by darkness. Jesus didn’t do the opposite of whatever the devil did. He did what He saw the Father doing… The moment I have a lesser sense of Him and a greater sense of the problem, I will live in reaction to the problem.”

    9. “You cannot hold God hostage (to your questions). He doesn’t owe you an answer. If you want the peace that passes understanding, you’re going to have to give up your right to understanding. It’s called trust.”

    10. “Learn to value the Spirit in every believer. Children don’t get a junior Holy Ghost.”

    11. “The church is often known for what we hate. We hate you. Come to Jesus. You can be like us. It’s ridiculous.”

    12. “We have witches comes to our meetings. It’s quite entertaining. Everybody’s welcome. Not everybody gets to preach.”

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    Senior Member ForthAngel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    The strange fire conference had a nice panel of preachers that show the utter fallacy of the movements pushing this type of behavior. Here is the intro to the conference:

    Look now to our adversaries (I mean the priesthood, at whose beck and pleasure others
    ply their enmity against us), and consider with me for a little by what zeal they are actuated.
    The true religion which is delivered in the Scriptures, and which all ought to hold, they
    readily permit both themselves and others to be ignorant of, to neglect and despise;

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Philippians 1.12-19

    12 Now I want you to know, brethren, that my circumstances have turned out for the greater progress of the gospel, 13 so that my imprisonment in the cause of Christ has become well known throughout the whole praetorian guard and to everyone else, 14 and that most of the brethren, trusting in the Lord because of my imprisonment, have far more courage to speak the word of God without fear. 15 Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will; 16 the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel;17 the former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition rather than from pure motives, thinking to cause me distress in my imprisonment. 18What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice.

    Yes, and I will rejoice, 19 for I know that this will turn out for my deliverance through your prayers and the provision of the Spirit of Jesus Christ, 20 according to my earnest expectation and hope, that I will not be put to shame in anything, but that with all boldness, Christ will even now, as always, be exalted in my body, whether by life or by death.
    Grace777x70 likes this.

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Question: "What is the meaning of the strange fire in Leviticus 10:1?"


    Answer: In order to understand the phrase “strange fire,” we must review the story in Leviticus in which it appears. The first tabernacle had been erected, and Aaron was doing a lot of sacrificing per God’s instructions (Leviticus 8—9). One day, two of Aaron’s sons, Nadab and Abihu, came along and offered incense with “strange fire.” The Hebrew word translated “strange” means “unauthorized, foreign, or profane.” God not only rejected their sacrifice; He found it so offensive that He consumed the two men with fire.


    After Nadab and Abihu were killed, Moses explained to Aaron why God had done such a harsh thing: “This is what the LORD spoke of when he said: ‘Among those who approach me I will show myself holy; in the sight of all the people I will be honored’” (Leviticus 10:3). The exact nature of the profane fire isn’t known, but, since it was the fire that was unauthorized, it could be that Nadab and Abihu were burning the incense with fire of their own making rather than taking fire from the altar, as specified in Leviticus 19:12. Or it could have been that the two men came into the tabernacle drunk and therefore could not remember what was a violation and what was not (Leviticus 10:8–9). Whatever it was the men did to render the offering profane, it was a sign of their disregard for the utter holiness of God and the need to honor and obey Him in solemn and holy fear. Their carelessness and irreverence were their downfall.


    In judging Nadab and Abihu for their strange fire, God was making a point to all the other priests who would serve in His tabernacle—and later, in His temple—and to us, as well. Since this was the first time sacrifices were being offered on the altar and Israel was getting to know the living God better, when Aaron’s sons were disobedient and profane, God displayed His displeasure in no uncertain terms. God was not going to allow the disobedience of Aaron’s sons to set a precedent for future disregard of His Law. A similar story occurs in Acts 5:1–11, during the time of the early church. A husband and wife lie to Peter about some land given to the church, and they are judged with physical death because of their lie. As Peter puts it, “You have not lied just to human beings but to God” (Acts 5:4).


    God knows our hearts. He knows what we truly believe and our attitude toward Him. We cannot offer to Him proud “sacrifices” that are unworthy of Him. He seeks those who come to Him in humility, ready to sacrifice their pride and lay before Him humble and contrite hearts grieving for sin (Psalm 51:17). Certainly, there is grace and forgiveness and plenty of “second chances” for those who belong to Him. But God wants us to know that He is serious when it comes to His honor and glory. If there is willful disobedience in the life of a believer, then God disciplines us out of His great love for us (Hebrews 12:7–11). If such disobedience continues, God will take harsher measures until we understand how we are disappointing Him. If we continue in our disobedience even after that, then God has every right to remove us from this earth (see 1 Corinthians 11:29–30).

    https://www.gotquestions.org/strange-fire.html
    Look now to our adversaries (I mean the priesthood, at whose beck and pleasure others
    ply their enmity against us), and consider with me for a little by what zeal they are actuated.
    The true religion which is delivered in the Scriptures, and which all ought to hold, they
    readily permit both themselves and others to be ignorant of, to neglect and despise;

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    Senior Member SovereignGrace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by preacher4truth View Post
    Or are the things taking place in this video with Bill Johnson, Todd Bentley and others of their ilk "of God?"

    There's a 'spirit' in that vid, that's for sure.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    Senior Member SovereignGrace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace777x70 View Post
    Here is a short video showing Bill Johnson talking about trusting God. You judge for yourself about the spirit behind this man.



    Here are some of his quotes:

    1. “Jesus was the desire of the nations. His body – us – should be the desire of the nations because He’s irresistible.”

    2. “In the Old Testament, anything unclean has power over what is clean. A leper yelling ‘Unclean!’ doesn’t reveal God’s heart but the severity of sin. In the New Testament it’s the other way around. A believing spouse sanctifies the entire house, mercy triumphs over judgment, and loves covers a multitude of sins.”

    3. “Jesus released peace to the storm. How do we know He had peace? He was sleeping. You have authority over any storm you can sleep in.”

    4. “Automatically thinking ‘everything that happens is God’s will’ is a lazy way to live. We live in a war. Jesus wasn’t fighting the Father’s will when He raised the dead.”

    5. “If God didn’t cause Katrina, who did? My response is, ‘Well, who did He leave in charge? To whom did He give all authority?’ I refuse to blame God. How many life-threatening storms did Jesus bless? I will not stand as an accuser before God holding up the sins of a city against them. I want no likeness to the accuser of the brethren.”

    6. “I am often asked, ‘Where is that in the Bible?’ Psalm 115. ‘God does what He pleases.’ The Bible reveals His nature but does not contain Him or set boundaries for Him.”

    7. “It’s a great time to be alive. It’s probably a great time to be dead too – I don’t know.”

    8. “Don’t be impressed by darkness. Jesus didn’t do the opposite of whatever the devil did. He did what He saw the Father doing… The moment I have a lesser sense of Him and a greater sense of the problem, I will live in reaction to the problem.”

    9. “You cannot hold God hostage (to your questions). He doesn’t owe you an answer. If you want the peace that passes understanding, you’re going to have to give up your right to understanding. It’s called trust.”

    10. “Learn to value the Spirit in every believer. Children don’t get a junior Holy Ghost.”

    11. “The church is often known for what we hate. We hate you. Come to Jesus. You can be like us. It’s ridiculous.”

    12. “We have witches comes to our meetings. It’s quite entertaining. Everybody’s welcome. Not everybody gets to preach.”
    I couldn't give two shakes what he said in the above. To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    Senior Member ForthAngel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignGrace View Post
    I couldn't give two shakes what he said in the above. To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy.
    Not just simple blasphemy, this stuff blasphemes the Holy Spirit. It's blasphemy of the highest order.
    Look now to our adversaries (I mean the priesthood, at whose beck and pleasure others
    ply their enmity against us), and consider with me for a little by what zeal they are actuated.
    The true religion which is delivered in the Scriptures, and which all ought to hold, they
    readily permit both themselves and others to be ignorant of, to neglect and despise;

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Here is the same brother speaking about sexual sin in the church.


    stonesoffire likes this.

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    Senior Member SovereignGrace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForthAngel View Post
    Not just simple blasphemy, this stuff blasphemes the Holy Spirit. It's blasphemy of the highest order.
    Jesus said you can speak evil of Him and it would be forgiven them. But if you speak evil of the Spirit, there's no forgiveness in this world or the one to come.

    I think this movement could damn many souls.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    CS1
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignGrace View Post
    I couldn't give two shakes what he said in the above. To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy.
    hey Soverigngrace

    could you please provide me the proof of your statement please " To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy."
    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignGrace View Post
    Jesus said you can speak evil of Him and it would be forgiven them. But if you speak evil of the Spirit, there's no forgiveness in this world or the one to come.

    I think this movement could damn many souls.
    It fits well with the fulfillment of 2 Thes. 2.
    Look now to our adversaries (I mean the priesthood, at whose beck and pleasure others
    ply their enmity against us), and consider with me for a little by what zeal they are actuated.
    The true religion which is delivered in the Scriptures, and which all ought to hold, they
    readily permit both themselves and others to be ignorant of, to neglect and despise;

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    Senior Member SovereignGrace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grace777x70 View Post
    Here is the same brother speaking about sexual sin in the church.


    Brother, words mean squat if one's all over the place in one's theology. He's endorsing a blasphemous movement.
    preacher4truth likes this.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by CS1 View Post
    hey Soverigngrace

    could you please provide me the proof of your statement please " To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy."
    In the OP's video, one guy was 'in the spirit' and acting like he was smoking a joint. He was equating spiritual euphoria with smoking a joint.
    Angela53510 likes this.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    CS1
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignGrace View Post
    In the OP's video, one guy was 'in the spirit' and acting like he was smoking a joint. He was equating spiritual euphoria with smoking a joint.
    ok thank you
    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    CS1, about 2-3 minutes into that vid you can see the weed smoking mockery.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by CS1 View Post
    hey Soverigngrace

    could you please provide me the proof of your statement please " To endorse this movement is horrible. Smoking weed in the Spirit? Blasphemy."
    At 1:00 minute watch and catch your jaw.
    preacher4truth likes this.
    "What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies."

    William Cranmer

    "For we love not God first, to compel Him to love again; but He loved us first, and gave His Son for us, that we might see love and love again."

    William Tyndale

    “Providence is wiser than you, and you may be confident it has suited all things better to your eternal good than you could do had you been left to your own option.” John Flavel

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    CS1
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    Default Re: Seducing spirits and doctrines of demons?

    Quote Originally Posted by SovereignGrace View Post
    CS1, about 2-3 minutes into that vid you can see the weed smoking mockery.

    yes I did see that very sad and wrong and I would as a spirit-filled tongue Speaking Christian this is not biblical nor does it bring glory to God . This is what the holy Spirit through Paul was trying to deal with in 1 cor 12,13,14 chapters.
    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

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