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Thread: Suicide instant hell?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Blain's Avatar
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    Default Suicide instant hell?

    So I have confused about suicide. Now I was told that if you commit suicide you instantly go to hell which i know is a Catholic doctrine but I also have talked with many Christians who believe the same. Now according to a lot of Catholics if you even try to kill yourself your only destination is hell, and my friend when I asked her about suicide and hell she said yes if you kill yourself you go to hell because you cannot ask for forgiveness when your dead( she believes if you don't repent for every sin you make you can lose your salvation) But even though i wanted to explain to her that isn't how grace works i couldn't because sadly she cannot be talked to like that she gets very emotional and frustrated and has a heart problem.

    Here is the thing though, I have never found in scripture that suicide is instant condemnation. I do wonder how things would have turned out for me when i tried to kill myself, i was just saved but things at my house were so deeply depressing and I was so alone that I couldn't deal with it anymore and even though I was afraid I would go to hell in my tears I begged for God to forgive me and attempted ti kill myself of course luckily I failed.

    But many people commit suicide because of deep pain and sadness loneliness and heart ache, if one was saved but killed themselves because of the heaviness of all this would god since he knows more than anyone how deeply pain and sadness can cut you have mercy on them or would he send them to fires?
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    Senior Member pottersclay's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Blain, some would say hell, some say grace, I think bro that is a subject left to God.

    To much of a grey area to give a scriptural definite.
    By the way how is steph and her dad doing?
    Blain and Willie-T like this.

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    Senior Member BenFTW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    There are two problems in your post I'd like to address. Two concepts that cannot be factual or rather, true when confronted with the reality of Christ's atonement. First, and foremost, the idea that God decides to have mercy on someone, outside of Christ, so that they may be saved. This idea is an attempt to pretend that God in His sound mercy and judgement decides, "You know what? It was understandable given the situation so I'll save them." What does God's word say? None come to the Father except by whom? Jesus Christ.

    The Gospel is plain, it is simple. Jesus is the savior. God doesn't save men outside of Christ, He saves them through faith. He doesn't save people at His whim, or in His present mercy (as if one day He is like "nope", but on another day He is like "sure.") He doesn't look at the alcoholic and say, "You know what? He had a rough childhood and now he is drinking away his sorrows. I'll excuse it." No, He looks at the sinner and says, "I love you. See what my Son has done on your behalf? I am yours and you are mine, if you believe in My Son who died on the cross for your sins and was raised on the third day for your justification you shall be saved." There is no whim or mercy that God extends in the realm of salvation outside of Christ.

    As for suicide leading to Hell, here is a simple proposition. Is suicide a sin? If your answer is yes, then I ask you, did Christ's sacrifice pay for all sin? Did Jesus not pay for the sins of the world? Did Christ not shed His blood for the remission of sin (all of it)? So then what sin of this world can condemn a believer in Jesus Christ who has made our sins of scarlet as white as snow? If suicide leads believers to Hell, did Christ really pay the penalty for all sin?
    tourist and AllenW like this.

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    Senior Member G00WZ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    1 Corinthians 6:19-20 says that we were bought for a price, that our bodies are the temples of the Holy Spirit and we are not our own.. and in 1 Corinthians 3:17 it says "If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy that person; for God's temple is sacred, and you together are that temple."
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    Senior Member BillG's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blain View Post
    So I have confused about suicide. Now I was told that if you commit suicide you instantly go to hell which i know is a Catholic doctrine but I also have talked with many Christians who believe the same. Now according to a lot of Catholics if you even try to kill yourself your only destination is hell, and my friend when I asked her about suicide and hell she said yes if you kill yourself you go to hell because you cannot ask for forgiveness when your dead( she believes if you don't repent for every sin you make you can lose your salvation) But even though i wanted to explain to her that isn't how grace works i couldn't because sadly she cannot be talked to like that she gets very emotional and frustrated and has a heart problem.

    Here is the thing though, I have never found in scripture that suicide is instant condemnation. I do wonder how things would have turned out for me when i tried to kill myself, i was just saved but things at my house were so deeply depressing and I was so alone that I couldn't deal with it anymore and even though I was afraid I would go to hell in my tears I begged for God to forgive me and attempted ti kill myself of course luckily I failed.

    But many people commit suicide because of deep pain and sadness loneliness and heart ache, if one was saved but killed themselves because of the heaviness of all this would god since he knows more than anyone how deeply pain and sadness can cut you have mercy on them or would he send them to fires?
    Nope it's not instant hell. Those who committ suicide have mental health issues. Genuine believers who have mental issues are living their hell on earth.

    Ive been their, driving down the motorway and thinking, yank the wheel sharply then it's over.

    I even got to stage of asking God to kill me so I knew where I was going, whilst praying at the same time "I know you will take care of my family" So I still had faith in God to provide for my family even if I didn't get it for myself.

    Suicide as some call it is a sin and if you commit that sin then you are in hell.

    What about the person who is speeding on a motorway (a genuine believer) who gets distracted and causes a crash that kills someone? Heaven or hell.

    What about someone who is telling a lie at the exact time when Jesus calls time?

    Are both saved? To me they are.

    With regards to the suicide yes they are.
    Lord

    Help me to be the person my dog thinks I am.

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    Senior Member Miri's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    The way I see it, if you damage your body, i.e. break a leg, would you
    go to hell because you damaged you leg playing football. Or would you
    go to hell because your body became sick and you died of cancer.
    Or what about if an alcoholic died of liver damage of a smoker died of
    lung damage,

    Now - would you go to hell because of a sick mind, mental illness, depression,
    hormonal problem, chemical imbalance - what ever the cause was - if in
    that state of sickness, a person took their life. Do you think they would
    go to hell.

    Sick bodies lead to death and unfortunately sick minds can lead to death.
    My personal opinion is if a born again Christian became mentally ill in some
    way leading to suicide they would not go to hell.

    People who commit suicide are not in a right and fit state of mind.
    Katy-follower, Blain and tourist like this.
    He is God and
    we are not.

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    Senior Member PrynceNY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Only God can make that call. Only he knows every situation. Cant really make a broad statement either way. However he does want us to endure and overcome the challenges of life.
    Grandpa, Miri, Blain and 2 others like this.
    Romans 10:13 - For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
    Acts 3:19 - Repent therefore and turn to God, so that your sins may be blotted out, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord.
    Ephesians 6:11 - Put on the whole armor of God, so that you can stand firm against the schemes of the devil.

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    Senior Member preacher4truth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Salvation in Christ is eternal, unmerited, and never rescinded.

    Unfortunately I've known Christians who have committed suicide. One was the son of a fellow Bible College student who hanged himself after years of depression. His father and mother are missionaries. Very fine people.

    Another was also a Bible student who shot himself. He was very depressed and his entire family were treated very poorly by professing believers at a church where he had gone to do ministry. He was lied to, mistreated, not cared for financially as promised, and came back to this are distraught and took his life.
    People are offended that God is God.

    Oh, my brethren! bold-hearted men are always called mean-spirited by cowards. - Charles Spurgeon

    I threw out the writings of Moses because he killed that Egyptian guy.

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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    The soul that is sinning—it itself will die.” (Ezekiel 18:4) the real hope for dead souls (people) is to live again through “a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.” (Acts 24:15) Individuals stressed and depressed beyond their ability to reason or cope are to pitied not condemned!!
    Miri likes this.

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    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    I think God knows the hearts of those who try, or succeed in, committing suicide and will judge them according to their heartset at that moment..





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



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    Senior Member BenFTW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miri View Post
    The way I see it, if you damage your body, i.e. break a leg, would you
    go to hell because you damaged you leg playing football. Or would you
    go to hell because your body became sick and you died of cancer.
    Or what about if an alcoholic died of liver damage of a smoker died of
    lung damage,

    Now - would you go to hell because of a sick mind, mental illness, depression,
    hormonal problem, chemical imbalance - what ever the cause was - if in
    that state of sickness, a person took their life. Do you think they would
    go to hell.

    Sick bodies lead to death and unfortunately sick minds can lead to death.
    My personal opinion is if a born again Christian became mentally ill in some
    way leading to suicide they would not go to hell.

    People who commit suicide are not in a right and fit state of mind.
    I don't think it even has anything to do with the right state of mind. We cannot make special case scenarios that exempt people from faith in Christ. It is almost a form of universalism, that attempts to save people outside of faith in the Lord. There are no caveats, it is Christ, and Him alone. Did they believe in Jesus? Christ and Him crucified? Then their faith has made them well, in that case, reconciliation to God.

    No one can place a sin above Christ's sacrifice unless they wish to supersede His finished work. No sin outweighs His death, He paid its penalty. To suggest that a sin sends a believer (genuine) to Hell is to reject the Gospel of Jesus Christ. His grace is sufficient.

    Another thing. Not only is the person robbing those in this life, but they are robbing themselves in the next. How? What rewards would they have stored up in Heaven having shortened their life? Such a person, one considering suicide, should be heavenly minded and reminded that their actions now have eternal consequences to the quality of life then. They need to informed that they have a purpose and God will lead them. That He can set them free from that which burdens them and His offers them life.

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    Senior Member Blain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blain, some would say hell, some say grace, I think bro that is a subject left to God.

    To much of a grey area to give a scriptural definite.
    By the way how is steph and her dad doing?
    They are hanging in there dealing with stomach cancer is never easy but as a family I think they are growing closer from it
    Miri, PennEd, blue_ladybug and 4 others like this.
    My life's testimony seems to have helped many people so I am going to put it here http://christianchat.com/testimonies...-new-post.html

    When the hearts of God and a child of his make that special intimate connection a wondrous power is born and a flame ignites that can never be put out

    Jesus knew more than anyone of us-Love hurts

    A fired up Christian shouldn't be that big a deal. Our love should be an overpowering burning desire to serve and be in His presence

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    Senior Member Blain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by BenFTW View Post
    There are two problems in your post I'd like to address. Two concepts that cannot be factual or rather, true when confronted with the reality of Christ's atonement. First, and foremost, the idea that God decides to have mercy on someone, outside of Christ, so that they may be saved. This idea is an attempt to pretend that God in His sound mercy and judgement decides, "You know what? It was understandable given the situation so I'll save them." What does God's word say? None come to the Father except by whom? Jesus Christ.

    The Gospel is plain, it is simple. Jesus is the savior. God doesn't save men outside of Christ, He saves them through faith. He doesn't save people at His whim, or in His present mercy (as if one day He is like "nope", but on another day He is like "sure.") He doesn't look at the alcoholic and say, "You know what? He had a rough childhood and now he is drinking away his sorrows. I'll excuse it." No, He looks at the sinner and says, "I love you. See what my Son has done on your behalf? I am yours and you are mine, if you believe in My Son who died on the cross for your sins and was raised on the third day for your justification you shall be saved." There is no whim or mercy that God extends in the realm of salvation outside of Christ.

    As for suicide leading to Hell, here is a simple proposition. Is suicide a sin? If your answer is yes, then I ask you, did Christ's sacrifice pay for all sin? Did Jesus not pay for the sins of the world? Did Christ not shed His blood for the remission of sin (all of it)? So then what sin of this world can condemn a believer in Jesus Christ who has made our sins of scarlet as white as snow? If suicide leads believers to Hell, did Christ really pay the penalty for all sin?
    I was speaking of people who are saved that commit suicide I should have clarified that
    My life's testimony seems to have helped many people so I am going to put it here http://christianchat.com/testimonies...-new-post.html

    When the hearts of God and a child of his make that special intimate connection a wondrous power is born and a flame ignites that can never be put out

    Jesus knew more than anyone of us-Love hurts

    A fired up Christian shouldn't be that big a deal. Our love should be an overpowering burning desire to serve and be in His presence

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    Senior Member BillG's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by BenFTW View Post
    I don't think it even has anything to do with the right state of mind. We cannot make special case scenarios that exempt people from faith in Christ. It is almost a form of universalism, that attempts to save people outside of faith in the Lord. There are no caveats, it is Christ, and Him alone. Did they believe in Jesus? Christ and Him crucified? Then their faith has made them well, in that case, reconciliation to God.

    No one can place a sin above Christ's sacrifice unless they wish to supersede His finished work. No sin outweighs His death, He paid its penalty. To suggest that a sin sends a believer (genuine) to Hell is to reject the Gospel of Jesus Christ. His grace is sufficient.

    Another thing. Not only is the person robbing those in this life, but they are robbing themselves in the next. How? What rewards would they have stored up in Heaven having shortened their life? Such a person, one considering suicide, should be heavenly minded and reminded that their actions now have eternal consequences to the quality of life then. They need to informed that they have a purpose and God will lead them. That He can set them free from that which burdens them and His offers them life.
    So to you is the suicide in heaven or hell? The suicide who has placed their faith in Jesus but for some reason can't overcome.
    Lord

    Help me to be the person my dog thinks I am.

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    Senior Member BenFTW's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blain View Post
    I was speaking of people who are saved that commit suicide I should have clarified that
    That is who I am speaking of, too. I know I made the example of the alcoholic but are there not Christians who still have this struggle? Are battling such demons? You see, my point is that Christ paid for all our sins. He paid the penalty. So for one to say a specific sin leads one to Hell is to lift a sin higher than God, to make void Christ's sacrifice and annul it.

    The debate is addressed head on with Christ's sacrifice and its purpose. If suicide is a sin, and Christ paid the penalty for all sin, what left is there to discuss? His grace is sufficient, His blood sufficient for the remission of sin.

    Just being straightforward!

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    Senior Member Blain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Everyone who posted in this thread gave very insightful responses. i especially liked how the point was made about Christ dying for all sins, like if a believer killed themselves from not being able to deal with the deep pain and sadness it's a very good point did Jesus really die for all sins or was his sacrifice limited ty Ben. Also i think blue explain it perfectly As i always it begins and ends with out hearts. Miri and everyone else who posted also deserve applause as their posts were also well informed and insightful.

    To be honest I found it very difficult to accept the whole kill yourself and you go to hell thing it just seemed out of character of god( speaking of those already in Christ of course) But i never accept or reject something without seeking the truth of the matter first and everyone has indeed helped me to find that truth
    Grandpa, Miri, RickyZ and 2 others like this.
    My life's testimony seems to have helped many people so I am going to put it here http://christianchat.com/testimonies...-new-post.html

    When the hearts of God and a child of his make that special intimate connection a wondrous power is born and a flame ignites that can never be put out

    Jesus knew more than anyone of us-Love hurts

    A fired up Christian shouldn't be that big a deal. Our love should be an overpowering burning desire to serve and be in His presence

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    Senior Member PrynceNY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    In addition, Job lost practically everything and continued to rely on God and didn't resort to suicide. That's the type of faith he want us to have. Not for temporary bad situations to make us make drastic decisions.
    Grandpa, Miri and Chris1975 like this.
    Romans 10:13 - For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
    Acts 3:19 - Repent therefore and turn to God, so that your sins may be blotted out, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord.
    Ephesians 6:11 - Put on the whole armor of God, so that you can stand firm against the schemes of the devil.

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    Senior Member blue_ladybug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    What if the person has absolutely no other choice? I think God would understand why they did what they did.
    seed_time_harvest likes this.





    Quote Originally Posted by pottersclay View Post
    Blue_ladybug is innocent, as we know in scripture " all people who like orange tabbies are innocent."
    Quote Originally Posted by blue_ladybug View Post
    LOL.. I'll use that defense the next time I get accused of something.. lol


    To read my cancer, depression, physical pain & suicide testimonies, go to the Blog tab in my profile.



  19. #19
    Senior Member Blain's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by BenFTW View Post
    That is who I am speaking of, too. I know I made the example of the alcoholic but are there not Christians who still have this struggle? Are battling such demons? You see, my point is that Christ paid for all our sins. He paid the penalty. So for one to say a specific sin leads one to Hell is to lift a sin higher than God, to make void Christ's sacrifice and annul it.

    The debate is addressed head on with Christ's sacrifice and its purpose. If suicide is a sin, and Christ paid the penalty for all sin, what left is there to discuss? His grace is sufficient, His blood sufficient for the remission of sin.

    Just being straightforward!
    Ben as always you show such amazing insight into the the real of god I am thankful you frequent this forum
    Grandpa, BenFTW and blue_ladybug like this.
    My life's testimony seems to have helped many people so I am going to put it here http://christianchat.com/testimonies...-new-post.html

    When the hearts of God and a child of his make that special intimate connection a wondrous power is born and a flame ignites that can never be put out

    Jesus knew more than anyone of us-Love hurts

    A fired up Christian shouldn't be that big a deal. Our love should be an overpowering burning desire to serve and be in His presence

  20. #20
    Senior Member BillG's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suicide instant hell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blain View Post
    Ben as always you show such amazing insight into the the real of god I am thankful you frequent this forum
    With you on that one
    Lord

    Help me to be the person my dog thinks I am.

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