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SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#301
Dec 28, 2016
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#301
kaylagrl said:
No,the elect are already saved. Repent is a demand of sinners.The verse said "I did not come to call the righteous"... If a sinner is unable to respond and utterly depraved how can God demand repentance? I dont get that.
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No, the elect were not bon saved. They were under God's wrath, even as others.[Ephesians 2:3]

We were elected to salvation, but pre-conversion, we were still lost, born lost.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#302
Dec 28, 2016
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#302
kaylagrl said:
Can you get me the verse that says Adam was sinless? Because apparently he didn't know it and was tossed out of the garden on his ear for being exactly the opposite,sinful. Christ was the only sinless person to walk this earth.
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Ecc. 7:29.
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

Senior Member
#303
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
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#303
SovereignGrace said:
No, the elect were not bon saved. They were under God's wrath, even as others.[Ephesians 2:3]

We were elected to salvation, but pre-conversion, we were still lost, born lost.
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Exactly. Now, these are God's ways, and to us they may not make logical sense, but yes, all the elect were under wrath as well as the rest of mankind.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#304
#304
SovereignGrace said:
Ecc. 7:29.
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[FONT=&quot]Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.


Ummm that does not say anything about Adam,nor does it say sinless. David was called a man after Gods own heart and yet he sinned. This does not show Adam as sinless.[/FONT]
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#305
#305
SovereignGrace said:
No, the elect were not bon saved. They were under God's wrath, even as others.[Ephesians 2:3]

We were elected to salvation, but pre-conversion, we were still lost, born lost.
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They were chosen as elect before birth,no? And others for destruction...
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#306
Dec 28, 2016
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#306
kaylagrl said:
Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.


Ummm that does not say anything about Adam,nor does it say sinless. David was called a man after Gods own heart and yet he sinned. This does not show Adam as sinless.
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Adam was made in the image of God. We are the marred image of God, post-fall. Seth was made in Adam's image, the marred image of God.[Genesis 5:3]
 
preacher4truth

preacher4truth

Senior Member
#307
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
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#307
People don't really need more and more answers, they simply need to believe what they've already been shown: Ephesians 2:3, all those to whom Paul had written, that is, the elect, they were taught they too were under God's wrath. This completely destroys hyper-calvinism.

People need to also understand this: election is the milk of the Word, not the meat, there is absolutely no reason to be gagging on it.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#309
#309
SovereignGrace said:
Adam was made in the image of God. We are the marred image of God, post-fall. Seth was made in Adam's image, the marred image of God.[Genesis 5:3]
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We are made in His image,yes, but we are not sinless nor was Adam. Adam was,obviously,capable of sin and he received the punishment for it along with Eve.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#310
Dec 28, 2016
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#310
kaylagrl said:
We are made in His image,yes, but we are not sinless nor was Adam. Adam was,obviously,capable of sin and he received the punishment for it along with Eve.
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Adam was breathed life by God. To say Adam was not sinless pre-fall is heresy.

The wages of sin is death. If Adam was not sinless prior to eating of that tree, then eating of it would have never affected him.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#311
#311
SovereignGrace said:
Actually the biblical stance would be we were elected from BEFORE the creation of the world.[Ephesians 1:4]



They were left in their fallen state, not made for destruction.
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'



Alright,before creation is still before birth,before you landed on earth. Left in a fallen state still means made for destruction.They cannot respond,correct?
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#312
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
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#312
kaylagrl said:
I keep going back to the Scriptures. Now one has yet explained to me how God can command people to repent,believe,come to Him when they cannot. If you are not of the elect you cannot obey,again God stepping on the leash.
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They can. But you know what? They will not. Why? Habit.

"Can an Ethiopian change his skin or a leopard its spots? Neither can you do good who are accustomed to doing evil."
Jer 13:23

Do not make God what He is not. Our own evilness is stepping on our leash.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#313
Dec 28, 2016
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#313
kaylagrl said:
'



Alright,before creation is still before birth,before you landed on earth. Left in a fallen state still means made for destruction.They cannot respond,correct?
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Ppl do respond, but it's no.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#314
#314
SovereignGrace said:
Adam was breathed life by God. To say Adam was not sinless pre-fall is heresy.

The wages of sin is death. If Adam was not sinless prior to eating of that tree, then eating of it would have never affected him.
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If Adam was sinless he wouldn't have eaten of the tree! He couldn't,he was sinless. Are you saying Adam was deified?
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#317
Dec 28, 2016
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#317
kaylagrl said:
If Adam was sinless he wouldn't have eaten of the tree! He couldn't,he was sinless. Are you saying Adam was deified?
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No, Adam was not deified. He was made sinless, but not able to remain sinless.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#318
#318
SovereignGrace said:
No, Adam was not deified. He was made sinless, but not able to remain sinless.
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​Adam was given a choice and he chose sin.The possibility was there to sin and Adam and Eve chose to sin. They were given choice,as we all are. They were not incapable of sinning as Jesus was.
 
SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#319
Dec 28, 2016
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#319
kaylagrl said:
​Adam was given a choice and he chose sin.
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Exactly. If he was sinless before that choice, then God warning him that he'd die the moment he ate of that tree would have been moot.

The possibility was there to sin and Adam and Eve chose to sin.
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They were made incorrupted, but not incorruptible.


They were given choice,as we all are.
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When they sinned, they fell completely. Even their wills. After God came seeking them, they ran and hid. Not so before then.

They were not incapable of sinning as Jesus was.
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Never stated anything to the contrary.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#320
#320
SovereignGrace said:
The gospel, when it is proclaimed, never goes w/o a response. Ppl will say yea or nay. The unregenerate don't want God, they don't go around seeking Him.
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The Holy Spirit is always drawing man to God. And they have the choice to heed the call. The Bible says "seek Him while He may be found" The Bible says to repent and live. That shows we have a choice to listen and to follow.
 
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