My work.

[Grace777x70]

I wanted to give people some history on my type of work so that things can be clear because of some very obvious malicious and untrue things that was said in another thread. I have worked as a pharmaceutical drug rep since 1980 until I retired 2 years ago.

When I speak of pharmacy or pharmaceuticals I am speaking from my life's work and I do not speak against people taking drugs when they need them.

If we give our opinion on things in a post that is not directed at anyone and people "identity" with that truth being said. - that is between them and their Lord.

I encourage all of us to rely on the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ to us all. Be blessed.

 

[stonesoffire]

That's interesting grace...I've always wondered about this definition in the greek. Could this have come about because no one can really say why drugs work, but can say how.??? If this is so...I can see why medicines would be looked at as witchcraft.

 

[Grace777x70]

That's interesting grace...I've always wondered about this definition in the greek. Could this have come about because no one can really say why drugs work, but can say how.??? If this is so...I can see why medicines would be looked at as witchcraft.

It is the "mixing of things together to get a desired result" from which we get the word for pharmacy and pharmaceuticals.

Sometimes the Greek word is translated as "sorcery" as in Galatians 5:20 as a work of the flesh. It is in the same lists as "outbursts of anger", immoral sexual living, malice...etc.

Galatians 5:20 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions,

The family of words from which we get our English word pharmacy is derived from the Greek word pharmakeuō which means “to mix potions or poison.”

The term also refers to the practice of magic. Thus pharmakeia refers to the practice of the arts associated with magic, which in the time of the New Testament involved the use of potions or drugs. In Galatians 5:20 this practice is identified as a work of the flesh.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

Witchcraft has 2 aspects to it:

1) drugs taken to "make magic" to deceive people and change their perception of things.

2) is the spiritual manipulation of things - ( the mixing part of the pharmaceuticals - as these compounds are made by adding this molecule to another one which produces a "desired effect" in the body )

The very same way that spiritual manipulators and those that try to "lord it over your faith" will use different things like belittling people, insulting them in order to get their "desired effect".

This is the "mixing part" to get a "desired effect" as in the mixing of different molecules produce different drugs of the spiritual manipulation aspect of it is a work of the flesh just like the commonly "practice of sorcery" tries to do.

Basically it is a form of manipulation which can use drugs as a means to do this or it can use spiritual manipulation as well.

There was a thread on spiritual abuse being done by some in the body of Christ which was excellent. I believe it was one of Ariel's threads. It was a good one that talks about this type of behavior that can occur amongst us.

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/147300-stop-beating-kids-spiritual-abuse-christians.html

 

[blue_ladybug]

I take drugs twice a day..and I hate it.. LOL

 

[Grace777x70]

I take drugs twice a day..and I hate it.. LOL

They can have some bizarre side effects - such as actually cause many of the works of the flesh to manifest in us too - like "outbursts of anger" - which is a common side effect of drugs.

I can tell you of a very strange one. I was visiting a hospital pharmacists one day and he showed me an experimental drug that they were doing a trial on. It had a strange side effect in which when the patient yawned - they had an orgasm.

At the time I thought - Wow...combine that with a sleeping pill and we would make billions...lol

 

[followjesus]

I wanted to give people some history on my type of work so that things can be clear because of some very obvious malicious and untrue things that was said in another thread. I have worked as a pharmaceutical drug rep since 1980 until I retired 2 years ago.

When I speak of pharmacy or pharmaceuticals I am speaking from my life's work and I do not speak against people taking drugs when they need them.

If we give our opinion on things in a post that is not directed at anyone and people "identity" with that truth being said. - that is between them and their Lord.

I encourage all of us to rely on the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ to us all. Be blessed.

if people are saying malicious things about you Bruce, you should report the posts. we often disagree about doctrine and even Get Heated sometimes, but its not right at all for anyone to begin delving into someone elses personal Life of wich they have no Knowledge based on a discussion in a place like this.

I hope you get that squared away and that whoever did that stops immediately.

 

[Angela53510]

It is the "mixing of things together to get a desired result" from which we get the word for pharmacy and pharmaceuticals.

Sometimes the Greek word is translated as "sorcery" as in Galatians 5:20 as a work of the flesh. It is in the same lists as "outbursts of anger", immoral sexual living, malice...etc.

Galatians 5:20 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions,

The family of words from which we get our English word pharmacy is derived from the Greek word pharmakeuō which means “to mix potions or poison.”

The term also refers to the practice of magic. Thus pharmakeia refers to the practice of the arts associated with magic, which in the time of the New Testament involved the use of potions or drugs. In Galatians 5:20 this practice is identified as a work of the flesh.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

Witchcraft has 2 aspects to it:

1) drugs taken to "make magic" to deceive people and change their perception of things.

2) is the spiritual manipulation of things - ( the mixing part of the pharmaceuticals - as these compounds are made by adding this molecule to another one which produces a "desired effect" in the body )

The very same way that spiritual manipulators and those that try to "lord it over your faith" will use different things like belittling people, insulting them in order to get their "desired effect".

This is the "mixing part" to get a "desired effect" as in the mixing of different molecules produce different drugs of the spiritual manipulation aspect of it is a work of the flesh just like the commonly "practice of sorcery" tries to do.

Basically it is a form of manipulation which can use drugs as a means to do this or it can use spiritual manipulation as well.

There was a thread on spiritual abuse being done by some in the body of Christ which was excellent. I believe it was one of Ariel's threads. It was a good one that talks about this type of behavior that can occur amongst us.

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/147300-stop-beating-kids-spiritual-abuse-christians.html

So, once again addressing these myths I see about Gal. 5:20 and the word "witchcraft" being the word φαρμακεία or pharmakia. In fact, this is the truth! This word appears twice in the Bible (also in Rev. 18:23) and means sorcery, magic, or witchcraft in some translations.

The part that is wrong, is this is NOT the word for medicine in the Greek! There are actually a few words 5 words listed in Bauer (BDAG) which have similar roots. These words are not used extensively in the Bible, more they are used in Classical Greek and early Christian literature, including Philo, and Homer, and even in the Septuagint.

So the words are as follows;

Pharmakeia - ψαρμακεία ἡ This is the word in Gal. 5:20 and it is translated magic, sorcery or witchcraft. It is a feminine noun. As usual the thing being done is in the feminine text

Pharmakeus - φαρμακεύς ὁ This is the person - the maker of options, the magician

Pharmakeuo - φαρμακεύω This is the related verb - I make potions, I practice magic

Pharmakon - φάρμακον τό This is the word which refers to medicines. It actually has 3 definitions.

1. a harmful drug, poison. It can also refer to the "imagery" of a poison, such as a "poisoned heart" Not used in the Bible
2. A drug used as a controlling medium, magic potion, charm, Rev. 9:21 "Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts."

3. a healing remedy, medicine, remedy, drug. Used in various Classical Greek texts, and early Christian literature, not in the Bible. This is the one that is the foundation of Greek medicine and these traditions are handed down, although the middle ages, like some people today, revived the notion of ALL medicines being witchcraft, with the result that women healers were frequently branded as witches engaging in magic. But, it does NOT mean witchcraft!

There are many drugs we use today that came from the herbs that God provided for us. I can think of Foxglove, from which digitalis, a heart medicine comes from, and willow bark, which was boiled down as an analgesic which we call "aspirin," today. Not really an evil poison or magic!!

pharmakos - φαρμακος ὁ The person who:
1. one skilled in arcane uses of herbs or drugs.
2. one who does extraordinary things though occult means, socerere, magician.

If anyone thinks I am splitting hairs, I am not! These words are different, even with the same root words. Pharmakon, is the word for medicine, not pharmakeia. That is a word for magic.

I hate to keep harping on this, but this is the result of having no real training in Greek. Although, anyone who just learned the Alphabet could get a copy of Bauer, even on-line and see that words can have very different meanings, and even the same word in Greek, can have very different meanings. You don't need to go to seminary and I know of several people in this forum who are studying Greek on their own, and doing a very good job. But not this folk Greek, based on myths and lies!

Sorry to burst your bubble, Grace777. But I do get tired of people setting themselves up as experts in Greek, based on something they read on the internet, that is false.

Medicine does NOT equal witchcraft. Anyone who has to take medicines need to know that. And your career aside, and I am sure you have some hairy tales to tell about medicine or pharmaceuticals, to suggest that medicine is witchcraft is truly folk theology, and has no place in any intelligent discussion of the Bible in the BDF.

 

[Grace777x70]

So, once again addressing these myths I see about Gal. 5:20 and the word "witchcraft" being the word φαρμακεία or pharmakia. In fact, this is the truth! This word appears twice in the Bible (also in Rev. 18:23) and means sorcery, magic, or witchcraft in some translations.

The part that is wrong, is this is NOT the word for medicine in the Greek! There are actually a few words 5 words listed in Bauer (BDAG) which have similar roots. These words are not used extensively in the Bible, more they are used in Classical Greek and early Christian literature, including Philo, and Homer, and even in the Septuagint.

So the words are as follows;

Pharmakeia - ψαρμακεία ἡ This is the word in Gal. 5:20 and it is translated magic, sorcery or witchcraft. It is a feminine noun. As usual the thing being done is in the feminine text

Pharmakeus - φαρμακεύς ὁ This is the person - the maker of options, the magician

Pharmakeuo - φαρμακεύω This is the related verb - I make potions, I practice magic

Pharmakon - φάρμακον τό This is the word which refers to medicines. It actually has 3 definitions.

1. a harmful drug, poison. It can also refer to the "imagery" of a poison, such as a "poisoned heart" Not used in the Bible
2. A drug used as a controlling medium, magic potion, charm, Rev. 9:21 "Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts."

3. a healing remedy, medicine, remedy, drug. Used in various Classical Greek texts, and early Christian literature, not in the Bible. This is the one that is the foundation of Greek medicine and these traditions are handed down, although the middle ages, like some people today, revived the notion of ALL medicines being witchcraft, with the result that women healers were frequently branded as witches engaging in magic. But, it does NOT mean witchcraft!

There are many drugs we use today that came from the herbs that God provided for us. I can think of Foxglove, from which digitalis, a heart medicine comes from, and willow bark, which was boiled down as an analgesic which we call "aspirin," today. Not really an evil poison or magic!!

pharmakos - φαρμακος ὁ The person who:
1. one skilled in arcane uses of herbs or drugs.
2. one who does extraordinary things though occult means, socerere, magician.

If anyone thinks I am splitting hairs, I am not! These words are different, even with the same root words. Pharmakon, is the word for medicine, not pharmakeia. That is a word for magic.

I hate to keep harping on this, but this is the result of having no real training in Greek. Although, anyone who just learned the Alphabet could get a copy of Bauer, even on-line and see that words can have very different meanings, and even the same word in Greek, can have very different meanings. You don't need to go to seminary and I know of several people in this forum who are studying Greek on their own, and doing a very good job. But not this folk Greek, based on myths and lies!

Sorry to burst your bubble, Grace777. But I do get tired of people setting themselves up as experts in Greek, based on something they read on the internet, that is false.

Medicine does NOT equal witchcraft. Anyone who has to take medicines need to know that. And your career aside, and I am sure you have some hairy tales to tell about medicine or pharmaceuticals, to suggest that medicine is witchcraft is truly folk theology, and has no place in any intelligent discussion of the Bible in the BDF.

You are free to have your own opinion....

I never said that taking medicines was witchcraft. My goodness....I said that the "mixing of things together to get a desired result" is called witchcraft and it is this word that we get pharmaceuticals and pharmacy from because originally the word meant to make potions.

It's the "mixing together of things" of which the so-called magic potions was used in NT times for example.

I got my information from this source below which is not on the internet but is a part of my software package that has many other Greek resources in it as well

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.


Witchcraft ( which is the mixing of things together to get a "desired result" as in the making of drugs ) IMO is also the spiritual manipulation of those that try to control others in the body of Christ by belittling them and insulting them as I said in my post #3

Have a great rest of the night! Bless you and be well...

 

[Grace777x70]

if people are saying malicious things about you Bruce, you should report the posts. we often disagree about doctrine and even Get Heated sometimes, but its not right at all for anyone to begin delving into someone elses personal Life of wich they have no Knowledge based on a discussion in a place like this.

I hope you get that squared away and that whoever did that stops immediately.

I reported it. Thanks for your post. I appreciate it.

 

[followjesus]

I reported it. Thanks for your post. I appreciate it.

right is right, God bless

 

[Grace777x70]

right is right, God bless

Unfortunately I was accused of saying that people that take medicines are into witchcraft which is obviously false. And was accused that I said that people with an education are following witchcraft. Just more nonsense.


Here is my post to RickyZ


Extreme heretics are rampant in cc..

Then I received this post below of which I wasn't even talking to this particular one accusing me of some strange stuff. They apparently "identified" with the post and got angry - then oncefallen closed the thread.

Extreme heretics are rampant in cc..

I reported it for sure because it was obviously out of line.

 

[dcontroversal]

Most know your a good guy.....I quit face book because I made a comment about liking "magic beans" (chocolate covered expresso beans) and got accused vehemently of doing and liking drugs....I take Nexium everyday without it I would get cancer.....does that make me a druggie...?

 

[Angela53510]

You are free to have your own opinion....

I never said that taking medicines was witchcraft. My goodness....I said that the "mixing of things together to get a desired result" is called witchcraft and it is this word that we get pharmaceuticals and pharmacy from because originally the word meant to make potions.

It's the "mixing together of things" of which the so-called magic potions was used in NT times for example.

I got my information from this source below which is not on the internet but is a part of my software package that has many other Greek resources in it as well

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.


Witchcraft ( which is the mixing of things together to get a "desired result" as in the making of drugs ) IMO is also the spiritual manipulation of those that try to control others in the body of Christ by belittling them and insulting them as I said in my post #3

Have a great rest of the night! Bless you and be well...

First, I have never heard of that sigma-omega thing you are using. What happened to the rest of the alphabet? Second, it is a "dictionary??" There are concordances and lexicons. Lexicons, which Bauer is, go from Greek to English. Concordances take a specific translation of the Bible and translate the Greek back through the English. Better than nothing, but not the way you are going to learn and use Greek.

You'll have to pardon me. A dictionary is for giving definitions in the same language as the word you are going through. Unless this is trying to be something like an English-French/French-English dictionary. Is that what you are talking about?

I have NOT given you my opinion on anything. Do you you need page numbers and editions for the Bauer I am using? I took the exact definition out of the most scholarly and most used lexicon in Biblical and Early Christian Greek. I did leave out most of the references to Classical Greek and the early Christian literature, it isn't relevant to the discussion.

Opinions are things like "I like chocolate. It is the best food around." "No, I like strawberry, it is awesome." Here is an internet definition. Please feel free to post something different.

o·pin·ion
əˈpinyən/
noun

• a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
  [COLOR=#878787 !important]"I'm writing to voice my opinion on an issue of great importance"[/COLOR]
  [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
  [TD]belief, judgment, thought(s), (way of) thinking, mind, (point of) view, viewpoint, outlook, attitude, stance, position, perspective, persuasion, standpoint; More
  
  [/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]
  
  
  
  
  • the beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing.
    [COLOR=#878787 !important]"the changing climate of opinion"[/COLOR]
    
    
    
  • an estimation of the quality or worth of someone or something.
    [COLOR=#878787 !important]"I had a higher opinion of myself than I deserved"
    
    
    [/COLOR]
    
    
  
  
  
  

So, an opinion, is something NOT NECESSARILY BASED ON FACT OR KNOWLEDGE. (I don't think the 2nd and 3rd defintion are relevant to this discussion.) I did NOT give an opinion, but scholarly FACTS. The problem with you, is that you say something false, and then when someone calls you on it, you claim it is just "my opinion" versus yours. I sure can tell you don't have any training in writing papers and science, to say nothing of literature or language.

So no, Pharmakon is not witchcraft. The definition has nothing to do with mixing substances in Greek, your software dictionary aside. And I have heard this sick argument before, by Word Faith people, that Christians should have nothing to do with medicine, because it is witchcraft, and it makes me angry for people who trust people like you, who bring up fake Greek definitions, and then pretend that all medicine is witchcraft.

Witchcraft ( which is the mixing of things together to get a "desired result" as in the making of drugs ) IMO is also the spiritual manipulation of those that try to control others in the body of Christ by belittling them and insulting them as I said in my post #3

If this final quote from you is not the definition of belittling, I don't know what is! It is saying sick people who need medicines are involved with witchcraft, is truly the reason why you need to be called on all this folk Greek and folk theology.

By the way, my definitions of this topic in post #7 above, are from Bauer, BDAG, 3rd Edition, pages 1049-1050. Sorry I forgot to put that, in that post.

PS. I have no idea why someone thought you was insulting your career. If it wasn't for modern medicine, I would long ago have died as an infant. But, I will say that being a pharmaceutical rep is an good career, it does not mean you read or understand Greek, as I have shown in so many posts!

Sorry, I thought I had you on ignore.

 

[followjesus]

Unfortunately I was accused of saying that people that take medicines are into witchcraft which is obviously false. And was accused that I said that people with an education are following witchcraft. Just more nonsense.


Here is my post to RickyZ


Extreme heretics are rampant in cc..

Then I received this post below of which I wasn't even talking to this particular one accusing me of some strange stuff. They apparently "identified" with the post and got angry - then oncefallen closed the thread.

Extreme heretics are rampant in cc..

I reported it for sure because it was obviously out of line.

weve had ALOT of debates lol....and i agree with dc, im convinced your a good guy. I hope you understand you and i debate alot regarding doctrine, that set aside i have respect for you as a man, and truly perceive a decent heart in you, always have since we met over a year ago. do your best to let it roll off, accusations dont make the man, Jesus Does. take care buddy, I Hope the fishing is fruitful down there.

lol now i have to get on with the usual haha jk man jk..... the greatest power a christian Has in them, is to forgive another when they dont deserve it << my unwarranted opinion !

 

[followjesus]

Most know your a good guy.....I quit face book because I made a comment about liking "magic beans" (chocolate covered expresso beans) and got accused vehemently of doing and liking drugs....I take Nexium everyday without it I would get cancer.....does that make me a druggie...?

i once had rocks thrown at me for carrying a bible in a muslim community lol does that make me a "lump head"?

 

[followjesus]

I take drugs twice a day..and I hate it.. LOL

the truth is that some people need medications. My mom has multiple schlurosis has for 20 years and takes several different medications, yet.......im not lookin at Her as a witch or a bad person or accusing Her. She is one of the Most dedicated and wonderful women of God i have ever Known. Have personally seen her do so many things for others, though she cant walk, she hasnt had a bad day in 15 years and praises God every day in thanks for all He Gives Her.

 

[Grace777x70]

How in the world you get that I am saying that sick people taking medicine are into witchcraft is way beyond me. It is complete nonsense..but hey...you are entitled to your opinion.

What you have said what I was saying is completely false and it is something that you made up in your own mind for some reason which may explain your anger.


Here is what the Greek source is if you are interested. It is on my Wordsearch 10 software that I use for studying.

Complete Biblical Library - 39 Vol. Bundle for WORDsearch Bible Software


Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

These are the resource tools that it sourced it's discussion about Witchcraft.

I get the Greek info from this source which includes all these in it.

Resource Tools: Strong <G5331>
Bauer 854
Moulton-Milligan 664
Liddell-Scott 1917
Colin Brown 2:552,558

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

 

[Grace777x70]

Most know your a good guy.....I quit face book because I made a comment about liking "magic beans" (chocolate covered expresso beans) and got accused vehemently of doing and liking drugs....I take Nexium everyday without it I would get cancer.....does that make me a druggie...?

Nexium would stop the acid from forming in your belly. Coffee is really a drug but so is sugar ( but not pizza...I love pizza...lol )

I don't know where someone would ever read that I said that people that take medicines are following witchcraft. The craziness of that just boggles my mind. Where in the world do they come up with this weird thinking?

Oh well..we can't do anything about the way people think so it's best to just ignore them and carry on and leave them in the hands of the Lord. He will be faithful to all of us! He is mighty to save.

 

[Grace777x70]

Angela.....thank you for this encouraging comment below.

"I sure can tell you don't have any training in writing papers and science, to say nothing of literature or language."

This is why many people have spoken out about your behavior and attitude towards others. It is condescending and belittling and I suppose my recourse is to from here on out just ignore this type of foul behavior and just post what I believe and leave it in the hands of the Lord.

I bless you and wish you well...

 

[dcontroversal]

Nexium would stop the acid from forming in your belly. Coffee is really a drug but so is sugar ( but not pizza...I love pizza...lol )

I don't know where someone would ever read that I said that people that take medicines are following witchcraft. The craziness of that just boggles my mind. Where in the world do they come up with this weird thinking?

Oh well..we can't do anything about the way people think so it's best to just ignore them and carry on and leave them in the hands of the Lord. He will be faithful to all of us! He is mighty to save.

Amen.....and I agree....the question about Nexium and me being a druggie was facetious....haha this is the age of drugs for sure....and without them my son would have long passed...I just think the price is a bit high hahahha no pun on the use of HIGH HAHAHAHA