Hey Evangelical/Pentacostal/Charismatic types...

[JaumeJ]

Faith is the anwer to all questions, that and waiting on the Lord.

Iknow when I lost the vision in one eye, and almost lost it in the other, my response to God was to thank Him. I ovvered Him the good eye, should it have been His will. The sight failed rapidly in that good eye, and I thank ed Him Now both times when I thanked Him I confessed I would really love to keep my vision, but I prayed His will be don.

There was a miracle with the vision returning to my better eye, and since I have beeen steadily losing it, 30 years -.

I know come the Kingdom all will be well. So with my advancing years I only see what are viewed as health setbacks as stepping stones to the Kingdom

I have recently had a few more stepping stones added to my way, praise God.

As for the truly menatlly incapacitaed, babies or children.......God is Love, thsi should answer all questions. I had an aunt who had the advancement of afive year old. She was always a blessing to me, and I saw great love in her, and felt it had to be God with her. She was incredible.

Do not doubt our Only Hope in any manner. Tese kinds of questions usually arise with unbelievers.

Have faith always. God is always good, amen. Oh, when I was younger I did experience healings of burns and other injuries, but I was younger and our Dad had things for a young person to do.

God is good all of the tiem. The greatest evidence of this is His Only Begotten Son, amen.

Why doesn't God heal amputees or severely vegetabled people (like quadriplegic people who can't speak) through prayer when mountains are supposed to be moved through prayer? Why are modern, documented miracles just cases where the odds were severely stacked against a possibility, but the outcome was still medically and scientifically explainable. For example, John Doe having cancer with a 40% chance of survival and surviving. Could have been God...but it could have been his 40% chance of survival.

This is a question that was just thrown at me recently and idk how to deal with it. Please help haha.

 

[Stephen63]

Jesus is perfect theology:

Another stated phrase that could mean anything.

There is not one time - NOT one time where some one who came to Jesus for healing - that was not healed. He healed all that came to Him. There are many scriptures that attest to this fact.

There were times that Jesus went independently to some such as the Pool of Bethseda. But all that came to Him - He healed.

No where do we find anywhere in Jesus' life where do we see any of these things being said by Jesus to anyone that came to Him for healing;

Mark 5
​

30Immediately Jesus, perceiving in Himself that the power proceeding from Him had gone forth, turned around in the crowd and said, “Who touched My garments?” 31And His disciples said to Him, “You see the crowd pressing in on You, and You say, ‘Who touched Me?’” 32And He looked around to see the woman who had done this. 33But the woman fearing and trembling, aware of what had happened to her, came and fell down before Him and told Him the whole truth. 34And He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace and be healed of your affliction.”

Those that pressed in on Jesus didn't get healed that day. No one but the woman.

 

[Depleted]

Willie- nobody "added" anything

I agree, but only because your name isn't "Nobody."

You did say, "We are seeing healing and restoration where there is faith and obedience" though.

 

[Depleted]

If it's the same one...he leaped over the pews to get to him..

Florida has had some awesome experiences.

Then more than one. Because the guy who had the heart attack was driving to work, felt crappy, so drove to the hospital instead, and collapsed (dead, although they did try to revive him) in the lobby of the hospital. No pews involved. lol

 

[sevenseas]

There was once a 17-year-old Christian who was swimming with her friends. She dove into the water, and floated up a quadriplegic. She still is. Her name is Joni Tada.

She asked the obvious question, (Why me, God?") and she and her friend Steve spent six months studying scripture to learn that answer.

Two decades later, I became disabled. And 2-3 years after that, my husband became disabled. Strangely, it wasn't me becoming disabled that I got tripped up on with "Why me, God?" It was hubby becoming disabled, too. At my darkest hour, Joni's book came into my life.

Here is the book they wrote that answers why God doesn't heal all.
When God Weeps Book | Joni and Friends | Joni and Friends

when I read that book, years ago, it was pretty hard to accept

it was more than that for Joni

her entire story is beyond what we as mere mortals could possibly think up or plan

I can only conclude in God's 'bigger' plan. I would be happy to do without some of the things I have experienced and quite honestly, at times I don't even want to hear the whys

eternity is a long time though

 

[Depleted]

Your point is valid. If the miraculous is happening today how can it be hidden. The answer is obvious, it cannot. We live in a time and place that makes excuses for not having tangible proof of the miraculous absurd. Can God bring the miraculous to this world, of course. He has done it in the past and will do it again. It is the false "movements of the Spirit" that are defended by Christians that is appalling. To all Christians, beware of throwing your hat in the ring of false teachers your support will be judged.

You're right. If you don't have tangible proof for today too, that's on you. Not God! He's still healing.

 

[Depleted]

This means everybody who is sick, is because of his Lack Oma faith ore hist disobidient. Tell this all the suffering christians, special the poor which have no money to pay for medicine ore doc. That it is their own fault!
This doctrine is a false doctrine. And to all which supporting this few. Your may forgot that all sick people which where healed finaly died because of another deseases, very few maby because of their age.
All healings and miracles had the purpose to reveal God's Power and for His Glory! But not for to build up a desease and sickness free World. This we will have in heaven but not on earth. Of course we can pray for an sick person to be healed. But to get healed is not promissed. As some teaches and wake up false expectations and false hope, which leads finally to misstrust to God and to disapointness.

Okay, so by your standards hubby and I are the poor. We couldn't afford doctors. And yet, hubby has a massive heart attack so bad that as they were wheeling him to get stents put in, he heard someone say, "This one won't make it."

IF we had to pay for all the care received, our co-pay alone would have cost us 10 months of my income just to have teeth removed. (New valve put in, but his teeth were bad, so they feared an abscess would slip off and head straight for his heart.) No idea how much that whole bill was, but the extraction surgery was the easy operation. Stents and a heart valve replaced, before we got there. That's not counting dialysis and treating two deadly infections before getting that valve replaced.

And yet, as I speak, hubby is due to wake up soon, so we can go out grocery shopping today. Will he die? Of course he will, but it is highly unlikely that today is that day.

Nothing false here. God took a man who wasn't even likely to get to the OR, and brought him back to me. Pert-near miraculous to me.

(Oh, and we owe zip on medical bills too. Also miraculous!)

 

[Depleted]

Of course the Lord uses today also healings to bring people into his family. But this is not common.
Today people taught that it is normal that Christians are health(without sickness ore handycap). And if not they are disobidient ore have lack on faith. This doctrine I cant find in the Bible!

That's okay. That church I cannot find either!

 

[Grace777x70]

No one came to Jesus for healing in this verse - it simply states that people were all about Him which within itself is not people asking to be healed and Him refusing.

There is no scripture showing that Jesus ever refused anyone healing - not one.

Mark 5:31 (NASB)
[SUP]31 [/SUP] And His disciples said to Him, "You see the crowd pressing in on You, and You say, 'Who touched Me?'"


4768. [FONT="Galatia Sil" !important]συνθλίβω[/FONT] [FONT="Gentium" !important]sunthlibō[/FONT] verb

To press or throng together, press upon.

It means “to press together, to throng together” as in a massive crowd of people.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

 

[shittim]

Depleted- Yes, it is true , We are seeing healing and restoration where there is faith and obedience"
and it means just that, with nothing read into it, that is what we are seeing. You may not be seeing it where you are and with the people you are with.
I saw on another thread here the comment that "some people are like beagles, they get a whiff of something and off they go on the trail".
Doesn't mean sickness is the result of less faith and obedience, although it might be in some instances.

 

[BeyondET]

No one came to Jesus for healing in this verse - it simply states that people were all about Him which within itself is not people asking to be healed and Him refusing.

There is no scripture showing that Jesus ever refused anyone healing - not one.

Mark 5:31 (NASB)
[SUP]31 [/SUP] And His disciples said to Him, "You see the crowd pressing in on You, and You say, 'Who touched Me?'"


4768. [FONT="Galatia Sil" !important]συνθλίβω[/FONT] [FONT="Gentium" !important]sunthlibō[/FONT] verb

To press or throng together, press upon.

It means “to press together, to throng together” as in a massive crowd of people.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

Indeed not one healing miracle refused, even when the miracles was done by others in His name...


Mark 9
38John said to Him, “Teacher, we saw someone else driving out demons in Your name, and we tried to stop him, because he does not accompany us.”

39But Jesus replied, “Do not stop him. No one who performs a miracle in My name can turn around and speak evil of Me. 40For whoever is not against us is for us. 41Indeed, if anyone gives you even a cup of water because you bear the name of Christ, truly I tell you, he will never lose his reward.

 

[valiant]

Another stated phrase that could mean anything.

Mark 5
​

30Immediately Jesus, perceiving in Himself that the power proceeding from Him had gone forth, turned around in the crowd and said, “Who touched My garments?” 31And His disciples said to Him, “You see the crowd pressing in on You, and You say, ‘Who touched Me?’” 32And He looked around to see the woman who had done this. 33But the woman fearing and trembling, aware of what had happened to her, came and fell down before Him and told Him the whole truth. 34And He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace and be healed of your affliction.”

Those that pressed in on Jesus didn't get healed that day. No one but the woman.

but they had not come for healing!!!

 

[Depleted]

Wow really? There were a lot of great replies in this thread, but there were an equal amount (if not more) awful comments in this thread. Did this last election just completely ruin the internet to the point that you can't even safely bring a question (a great question at that) to a CHRISTIAN forum without everyone's cognitive dissonance and hurt feelings going through the roof? Yeah, a vegetabled person. I said it. No regrets. I'm not talking about quadriplegics being vegetabled. I'm talking about worse case scenarios where people are quadriplegics AND vegetabled. People who are severely burned from head-to-toe who can barely function from day to day. Whatever. In other words, people who REALLY have it bad (and there are a lot of those people in existence). Get a grip, people.

That being said. I wanted to reply to every awesome post but there were just too many, as well as people who didn't understand the whole "real miracles and not things that could have gone either way" point. Not saying those people are ignorant, it's an easy point to miss.

In other words, my question was why don't supernatural miracles happen? Why aren't limbs miraculously restored? Why don't severe burns miraculously heal? There has been documented cases of people's hearts beating so slow that they are pronounced dead and finally wake up in a morgue or funeral home, even buried. There are cases where people's cancer goes away with no treatment (can actually be scientifically explained). These aren't necessarily miracles. They could just be nature doing some rare/freak stuff, or they could really be God working a miracle.

I guess the question boils down to...why does God only seem to only intervene in circumstances where it COULD be Him, but it could also NOT be Him.

Right now the best answers I have seen are Willie's and everyone's answers like his.

The whole "you gotta have faith for miracles to work" doesn't really seem to apply here, as there are just too many of these severely disabled, disfigured, pain-drenched people for someone to honestly say that none of them have had as much faith as a Pentecostal preacher on a Sunday morning, or that their families who pray for them don't.

Without a doubt, entire CHURCHES could pray for these people, and no miracles will happen...but we can all pray for a church member with cancer and at least expect a 50/50 chance. 50% they don't make it, and 50% God works a miracle.

Again, I'm not meaning for any of this to sound offensive, idk why it would as I am a Christian who has believed in miracles my whole life. I'm just being real about an issue that people seem to go crazy over. It's a question that has me wondering why. If it didn't, I wouldn't bring it up.

In no particular order:
1. Check out the flags of the posters on here, since you seem to think this is all about Trump being elected. This is an international site, so, really? It's not so myopic as American politics.

2. There are no vegetable people. Honest. None. By very nature, humans fit into the animal kingdom, and vegetables fit into the plant kingdom. It's kind of insulting to be called a vegetable. The word is "vegetative."

3. Really? Brought back to life after a heart attack kills a person isn't good enough for you because of the possibility of slow heartbeat? I guess even the heart monitor can't see that one, huh? I've seen it. The first thing doctors do with a possible heart attack is put the person on a monitor. It can record any beat, whether very fast (I saw 181 beats per minute, but I'm pretty sure baby hearts work faster than that), or very slow. And cancer isn't bad enough for you? Mom's cancer was so bad, I saw it all over her. It started in her neck. By the time she died, it was so bad it was all over her skin too. Looked like 1,000 freckles per sq. inch. But that's not bad enough?

Okay, hubby laid hands on the patient in the bed next to his (long story before it got that far), and prayed because the guy had gout so bad he was groaning so loud, no one could sleep. And God honored that prayer, (actually God forced that prayer. lol) The man fell asleep in peace right after that. It was 2 AM already. Poor hubby. Still couldn't get much sleep, because he was awakened at 6 AM by someone shouting in the hallway that God healed his pain. Same guy. The gout was still there. The pain was gone. That guy was released from the hospital that day.

So, this is all about you wanting just the right sign? Yeah. That was already answered, too, although not by me until now.

Very few had any problems with your original question. Now that I see it's all about what you want to see, and it's a very specific kind of pain for a person, as if the seeing makes the pain fine, I now have a problem with the question. It's very self centered.

 

[Depleted]

Please give the scripture where our heavenly father gave us the promisse that we as his children never will be sick! I cant find it except when we are in heaven.
Be glad that he healed you! But dont judge others!

Please stop feeding the troll. (And I am very particular that the word "troll" fits the person. He is just a troll getting his jollies by inflaming every thread he starts or enters.)

 

[Stephen63]

No one came to Jesus for healing in this verse - it simply states that people were all about Him which within itself is not people asking to be healed and Him refusing.

There is no scripture showing that Jesus ever refused anyone healing - not one.

Mark 5:31 (NASB)
[SUP]31 [/SUP] And His disciples said to Him, "You see the crowd pressing in on You, and You say, 'Who touched Me?'"


4768. [FONT=&quot]συνθλίβω[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]sunthlibō[/FONT] verb

To press or throng together, press upon.

It means “to press together, to throng together” as in a massive crowd of people.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Sigma-Omega.

The Greek does mean thronging, but doesn't say why.

Why else? Everywhere Jesus went the sick cried out to Him. someone in that crowd wanted it..... the odds are astronomically high that they did.

 

[Stephen63]

but they had not come for healing!!!

That's your statement, it's left up to you to prove it.

 

[Rockrz]

it is the result of believing whole heartedly in that doctrine

Not, it was a result of not knowing how to receive what God has promised and a result of not taking care of his body which is common sense stuff.

The other verses are out of context

No, that's satan's false narrative to get you to ignore God's promises so they do not apply to you.

As long as you are in agreement with satan and discount God's promises... they do not apply to you!

Mark 4:24,25
And he said unto them, Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given.
For he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath.

What you are promoting is not based on the scripture and you bring believers in a false hope with promises which God never gave.

God did actually pay for His people to be healed... but if you reject His promises, it's no problem for me at all.

What you do or don't do is between you and God... and you shall reap what you sow (Gal 6:7,8)

Those that pressed in on Jesus didn't get healed that day. No one but the woman.

Did you not notice why???

Jesus told the woman "Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace and be healed of your affliction"

Jesus said her faith made her well... it was God's power... but she had to have had faith to believe it was God's will to heal her and that if she touched His garment she WOULD be healed.

Scoffers don't get healed...

Please stop feeding the troll. (And I am very particular that the word "troll" fits the person. He is just a troll getting his jollies by inflaming every thread he starts or enters.)

Yeah, satan frequently calls people "trolls" in response to posting God's promises that they reject.

Carnal, religious minded people are always scoffing and rejecting that which the Lord has promised in His Word... always making excuses and speaking of those they know or heard of that supposedly believed in healing and died anyway.

Scoffers don't get healed... neither do those that are not students of God's Word diggin in deep so their life is built upon the firm foundation of the sayings of Jesus (Matthew 7:24, Luke 6:47)

 

[Willie-T]

I've seen all sorts of healings. And I've heard just as many reasons why what I thought I saw never happened.

But, one that happened about three years ago is difficult to deny. Mainly because it happened to a three year-old little girl. The daughter of one of my best friends. Her thumb was cut off when her sister slammed a door on it.

The doctors at All Children's Hospital sewed it back on. I examined it closely about a month later, and there were no scars, at all! And she has full use of it, and complete sensation.

Yes, I've also heard many excuses why this "was just a natural recovery that occurs with children." But sometimes I just have to say to negative doubters, "You're full of it." This is one of those times.

 

[Rockrz]

The doctors at All Children's Hospital sewed it back on

I'd be more impressed when back in the old days there were either no doctors around or no knowledge of mankind knowing how to handle this and... folks had to trust in the Lord alone.

Many Christians go to the doc and die anyway... glad to hear this girl came out OK, but I've seen those that trusted in medical science and things went very badly for them and they STILL had to pay the bill, or their family did after they croaked...

There is also a way of believing God for His protection ahead of time for divine protection... we won't get in to that since so many scoffers here would lose their mind and start slobbering on themselves.

Hebrews 1:14
Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

 

[stonesoffire]

Then more than one. Because the guy who had the heart attack was driving to work, felt crappy, so drove to the hospital instead, and collapsed (dead, although they did try to revive him) in the lobby of the hospital. No pews involved. lol

I think you are talking about the cardiologist who was working on him...and he was pronounced dead...the Lord sent him back in and he prayed for him.. the guy came back.