the law of moses......and the Gospel of Gods Kingdom

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Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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#81
oh man

just SO revealing of the heart of the matter here

Jesus said 10Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”11“No one, sir,” she said.“Then neither do I condemn you,”Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.”


if forgiveness does not aid your sin problem, then you are condemned

Jesus saying he did not condemn her is the same as forgiveness

stop ADDING to what Jesus said
Don't let us argue but 'straighten out the 'kinks in our understanding !
I will agree that 'forgivness 'aids our sin-problem giving us time to learn, but do you think it will 'cure it ? The human heart is desparately wicked looking for any 'loophole to have it's own way and 'resting in grace/forgiveness makes a very comfortable bed people don't want to 'get off from.
We are to 'sin NO MORE...not just have it 'forgiven !
Shall we continue in sin that 'grace may abound ? God forbid ! receiving continuous grace/forgiveness is not the answer - receiving Christ's Spirit is - for it will 'empower us to 'stop sinning....and the Holy Spirit is given to those who OBEY Acts 5v32,...not out of fear but LOVE !
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#82
amen when we follow a doctrine, it should never omit what the Lord said, "reverent fear" is different than " God dont crush me fear:) more like " wait till your father gets home, kind of fear when were 5 :)
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
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#83
The Laws of Moses. actually, Moses authored no laws whatsoever. These laws were written down by him.

The laws regarding Sacrifice for sin Fulfilled in Jesus Christ. Any other sacrifice for propitiation of our sin would be blasphemy, unacceptable.

The laws regarding the priesthood: fulfilled by Jesus Christ in making us all priests to the Most High God with Jesus Christ as the One and Only High Priest.

The Laws regarding the Temple; fulfilled in Jesus Christ, the Head and the Corner Stone with us as the living stones of the Temple. Together, we are the Temple with the Holy Spirit residing in all.

Laws regarding clean and unclean foods.; fulfilled by the teachin gof Jesus christ and His disciples.

Laws regarding gpunishment for infringing any of the laws (sin): fulfilled by Jesus christ having been accepted by the individual as propitiation for sin. The guilt of our transgressions is not held against us for the sake of the Blood of the Lamb of God. This is no excuse to sin intentio9nally.

Law regarding punishment; are covered by mercy, as our Lord teaches in His sermon saying no more eye for aneye rather turn the other cheek.
Any
laws condering morality and good conduct in general is and always will be in force until Jesus christ returns. Otherwise how could there still remain the capaability to sin if there is no law broken?

Jesus teaches the hypocrites that they did notot apply the most important points of the law, faith, merc y and justice. If we apply these pints, and above all, look to the
Example that is Jesus, we will understand oll of the laws of Mose naturally, according to the new nature we have received of the Holy Spirit. After all, the law has been inscribed in our inward parts, upon our hearts.

Anyhone having a problem with the above is sstill under the law, for they believe the law is still as it was before the teaching of Jesus christ, and this is a real pity.

God bless all who are truly in Jesus Christ, and all who will be, amen.
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#84
Luke 16:16 " The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it."

"Otherwise how could there still remain the capaability to sin if there is no law broken?"

the gospel

james 4:17 "
Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

the Law

leviticus 5:17 "
"If anyone sins and does what is forbidden in any of the LORD's commands, even though they do not know it, they are guilty and will be held responsible."

kjv "And if a soul sin, and commit any of these things which are forbidden to be done by the commandments of the LORD; though he wist it not, yet is he guilty, and shall bear his iniquity."


sin is no longer universal as in the book of the mosaic Law, it is personal based on the knowledge of the sinner, based on our own conscience, no longer defined by the book of the Law. we learn from the book of the Law, but it has no power anylonger it was nailed to the cross, and the words of Jesus Christ took its place.

israel defiled the covenant, broke it and God passed judgement according to the witness against them ( the book of the mosaic Law) and the song of moses, Just as He said He would do to moses before His death

deuteronomy 31:16-22 "The LORD said to Moses, “You are about to rest with your fathers,x and these people will soon commit adultery with the foreign gods of the land they are entering. They will ABANDON MEz AND BREAK THE COVENANT I have made with them. My anger will burn against them on that day;

I WILL ABANDON THEM and hide My face from them so that they will become easy prey. Many troubles and afflictions will come to them. On that day they will say, ‘Haven’t these troubles come to us because our God is no longer with us? ’ 18I will certainly hide My face on that day because of all the evil they have done by turning to other gods. 19Therefore write down THIS SONG (song of moses) for yourselves and teach it to the Israelites; have them recite it,af so that this song may be a witness for Me AGAINST the Israelites. 20When I bring them into the land I swore to give their fathers, a land flowing with milk and honey, they will eat their fill and prosper.They will turn to other gods and worship them, despising Me and BREAKING MY COVENANT

And when many troubles and afflictions come to them, this song will testify AGAINST THEM, becauseal their descendants will not have forgotten it. For I know what they are prone to do,even before I bring them into the land I swore to give them.” 22So Moses wrote down this song on that day and taught it to the Israelites."


and the book of the mosaic Law

And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished, 25That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying, 26Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee."


if you then study the prophets you see this unfold as God said it would, then He begins saying through the prophets

isaiah 42:9 "Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them."

and we get all the prophecy of Jesus to come with the Words of eternal Life. if a person simply follows Jesus and His words, the Law doesnt aplly as authority, its great for learning of what Jesus brought, but has no value in salvation any longer. it was only ever to teach us the need for Jesus


 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#85
Don't let us argue but 'straighten out the 'kinks in our understanding !
I will agree that 'forgivness 'aids our sin-problem giving us time to learn, but do you think it will 'cure it ? The human heart is desparately wicked looking for any 'loophole to have it's own way and 'resting in grace/forgiveness makes a very comfortable bed people don't want to 'get off from.
We are to 'sin NO MORE...not just have it 'forgiven !
Shall we continue in sin that 'grace may abound ? God forbid ! receiving continuous grace/forgiveness is not the answer - receiving Christ's Spirit is - for it will 'empower us to 'stop sinning....and the Holy Spirit is given to those who OBEY Acts 5v32,...not out of fear but LOVE !

forgiveness does not AID in our problem with sin

forgiveness because of the grace of God RESTORES us to fellowship with Him through His Son

the Bible says the heart is desperately wicked BUT it does not say it is looking for loopholes. this is the problem here. you ADD to what is said

this is the constant objection to grace offered by those who want grace PLUS a little something they did themself

you CANNOT do anything to gain salvation so why would you think that being a good boy or girl (according to our righteousness which is as a filthy rag to God and you know what He really means by filthy rag or look it up if you don't) will make you more forgiveable?

do you continue in sin? is YOUR understanding telling you not to do that?

well HALLELUJAH bro! mine too

we rest in Jesus. that seems to be a concept too good to be true so therefore some reject it

I KNOW I cannot make it without Him, so I REST in HIM, which means I TRUST in HIS COMPLETED work on MY behalf to finish the job

you know?

as in "He who has begun a good work in you will complete it"

who began the good work? GOD! by His Spirit, through the shed blood of Jesus

read Galatians. it is a more appropriate discussion for the Christian's standing then the commandments

no, I don't expect you to accept or agree because you need to be secure in what you already believe

I'm about read for a shakeup myself cause I need to grow in Christ at this time.

God is GOOD! ALL the time!
 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#86
amen when we follow a doctrine, it should never omit what the Lord said, "reverent fear" is different than " God dont crush me fear:) more like " wait till your father gets home, kind of fear when were 5 :)

the Bible says to follow Christ

not doctrines

Jesus is the LIVING word

we understand the doctrines of the Bible BUT the DOCTRINE of the whole of it, is SALVATION and there is no name under heaven by which we might be saved but the name above ALL names. JESUS CHRIST THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD

and it's OK to call Him Messiah
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#88
the Bible says to follow Christ

not doctrines

Jesus is the LIVING word

who said

john 17:16-17 "Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. 17If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself."

matthew 7:24-27 "Therefore whosoever heareth THESE SAYINGS OF MINE, and DOETH THEM, I will liken him unto a WISE man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26And every one that heareth THESE SAYINGS OF MINE , and DOETH THEM NOT, shall be likened unto a FOOLISH man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was THE FALL of it."

John 8:31-32 "Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If YE CONTINUE IN MY WORD, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32And ye shall KNOW THE TRUTH, and the truth shall make you FREE."

paul and all the apostles

1 timothy 6:3-5 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the WORDS OF our Lord Jesus Christ, and to THE DOCTRINE which is according to godliness; 4He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, 5Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself."

I guess the latest support now for the gog is its not about what the Bible actually says its about the living word ? its easy to throw cool phrases out, but to be honest with you, its 100 percent about the doctrine of the One who suffered and died for us, and if people are hearing words that dont line up with what He said and was written its not the spirit of God teaching them. the reason the word is written down is so people Know for themselves what is true, and dont need to grab the latest best seller explaining the real truth that parts from the Bibles doctrine, which is the Gospel of His Only Son. who said before and after He died and was raised that its about what He taught the disciples in the 4 gospels....

its as if some see Gods written word as just paper and ink, not realizing that Gods word is what He said. let there be light...and light was <<< we could not know that without the Bible. Jesus dying on the cross, we wouldnt Know that if it wasnt for accepting what is written in the Bible. Jesus raised from the dead, we would have no knowledge of that, without what is written down by those who saw it. and yeah..we would have no idead if the words of Jesus werent written down, what the will of God is.

anything teaching principles not in line with the gospel, is what causes false doctrines, false doctrines are destructive, right doctrines are life its all about doctrine. its why the bible makes so plain the importance of right doctrine, and warns so sternly against false doctrine. its life and death. and I am thankful God purposed it to be written, so we Know where to Learn the truth. that being said

I hope you have found some better way than what Jesus Christ taught, ill stick with the written Word, believe it and let it reshape my mind and Heart to bring me in Line with Gods Word. its already changed my life so much, im Lost to Jesus and His Words cant be convinced otherwise ill stick with the Knowledge made plain in the word of God which is living in me
 
May 18, 2017
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#89
[Jehovah's False Witness 2 Pe 2:1, Eph 5:11] its not for you to judge someones inclusion in Gods Kingdom friend.
"We have no right to pronounce a sentence of eternal doom against anyone (John 5:22). But by the same token, we have no business receiving just anyone into the communion and fellowship of the church. We should no more forge spiritual bonds with people whose religion is fundamentally in error than we would seek fellowship with those guilty of heinous sin. To do so is tantamount to the arrogance shown by the Corinthians, who refused to dismiss from their fellowship a man living in the grossest kind of sin (1 Corinthians 5:1-3).


We must also remember that serious error can be extremely subtle. False teachers don't wear a sign proclaiming who they are. They disguise themselves as apostles of Christ (2 Corinthians 11:13). "And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness" (vv. 14-15)..." Full text: How can we determine what doctrines are essential and what are they? Questions: Psalm 19:7; Hebrews 11:6; John 5:23; 2 Timothy 3
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#90

"We have no right to pronounce a sentence of eternal doom against anyone (John 5:22). But by the same token, we have no business receiving just anyone into the communion and fellowship of the church. We should no more forge spiritual bonds with people whose religion is fundamentally in error than we would seek fellowship with those guilty of heinous sin. To do so is tantamount to the arrogance shown by the Corinthians, who refused to dismiss from their fellowship a man living in the grossest kind of sin (1 Corinthians 5:1-3).


We must also remember that serious error can be extremely subtle. False teachers don't wear a sign proclaiming who they are. They disguise themselves as apostles of Christ (2 Corinthians 11:13). "And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness" (vv. 14-15)..." Full text: How can we determine what doctrines are essential and what are they? Questions: Psalm 19:7; Hebrews 11:6; John 5:23; 2 Timothy 3
"We have no right to pronounce a sentence of eternal doom against anyone (John 5:22). But by the same token, we have no business receiving just anyone into the communion and fellowship of the church. We should no more forge spiritual bonds with people whose religion is fundamentally in error than we would seek fellowship with those guilty of heinous sin. "


its a good thing Jesus didnt teahc such things or every sinner would be pre excluded from entering into the company of righteousness. its not our place to exclude anyone, were to accept the sinners and lead them to the word of God, thats where the decision will be made when they meet Gods Word.

sure the church should not teach acceptance of ongoing open sin, should make the fault Known, for the purpose of offering the persons conscience a reason to repent, but there is no place for one believer, deciding another isnt included in Christ, He died for the worst we can do, and taught the things that rebuild us in His image. its between each believer and the Lord as it poertains to thier sin, its impossible for one to judge andother a sinner, because sin is according to what each knows is right they know and God knows the deepest hidden intent and thoiught of the heart,

should false ideas be corrected? yes, but thats not authority to be the keeper of the door, that place is already filled, as is the judge of each man already fulfilled.

james 4:17 "Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, TO HIM it is sin" <<sin is not universal, its a personal thing between the believer and the savior and God almighty.

romans 14:10-13 "But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.11For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.12So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.13Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way. "


people need to realize our only place is to do the things taught by the gospel, and also realize each is at thier own point of groeth in Knowledge of the truth. one may have just believed yesterday, while another has believed 30 years and sought the Lords word, and the knowledge thier in all those years. that one is much more accountable than the newly born believer. its impossible for me, you or any believer to judge anothers inclusion in Christ, He alone holds that authority
 
May 18, 2017
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#91
[2 Pe 2:1] its a good thing Jesus didn't teach such things or every sinner would be pre excluded from entering into the company of righteousness....t's impossible for one to judge another a sinner...[P]eople need to realize our only place is to do the things taught by the gospel.
Eph 5:11

"We give out the word of God. What men do with it is their business." ~ J. Vernon McGee Ac 20:20
...t[']s not our place to exclude anyone...
Mt 18

See:

Judge Rightly Is Not Some Guy's Name by Bob Enyart
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#92
Eph 5:11

"We give out the word of God. What men do with it is their business." ~ J. Vernon McGee Ac 20:20
Mt 18





See:

Judge Rightly Is Not Some Guy's Name by Bob Enyart
matthew 18 doesnt have anything to do with a believer deciding whos in Gods Kingdom :)

Luke 9 : 52-56 "And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him. 53And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem. 54And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? 55But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. 56For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village."

notice this as well regarding "sinners"

matthew 9:10-13 "
And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples. 11And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners? 12But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick. 13But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance."

and again

Luke 7:36-39 "
And one of the Pharisees desired him that he would eat with him. And he went into the Pharisee's house, and sat down to meat. 37And, behold, a woman in the city, which was a sinner, when she knew that Jesus sat at meat in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster box of ointment, 38And stood at his feet behind him weeping, and began to wash his feet with tears, and did wipe them with the hairs of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment.39Now when the Pharisee which had bidden him saw it, he spake within himself, saying, This man, if he were a prophet, would have known who and what manner of woman this is that toucheth him: for she is a sinner."

continue on to see what He said to the pharisee.....The gospel is not about making ourself righteous, and then Jesus will accept us, or anyone else, its about recognizing that all of us need His mercy, and sharing that along with the truth of His word warnings and all. there is simply no place for a believer to keep people aay from the only person who can Heal thier sin and fill them with the truth and righteousness. one sinner is the same as the next, were all lost without His amazing Grace, and the truth of his word that creates a right Heart. embracing the "sinners" is the place of Gods children and leading them to His call to repentance.

God bless and thanks for the conversation.