Millstones

[Mooky]

Hi all,

I have been searching through commentaries for a good explanation of Mark 9:42 ""If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them if a large millstone were hung around their neck and they were thrown into the sea."

Does anyone have any good insights or explanations regarding this verse?Feel free to use your favourite commentary if necessary.

 

[ForthAngel]

Here is a parallel that might help understanding it more:

Matthew 18
Who Is the Greatest?
18 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?” 2 And calling to him a child, he put him in the midst of them 3 and said, “Truly, I say to you, unless you turn and become like children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

5 “Whoever receives one such child in my name receives me, 6 but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.

Seems to be speaking of believers using a child as an example.

 

[dcontroversal]

Obviously a millstone would take you straight to the bottom and drown you...the context is clear...a person would be better off drowning in the bottom of the sea with a millstone around their neck than offend or cause to stumble one of God's children...the consequences would be far worse than drowning at the bottom of the sea.....

 

[Mooky]

So from that section of scripture ...can we deduce that if a person sins against a believer or causes the believer to stumble they are are better off being drowned with a millstone around their neck? That's what I have gotten so far from the commentaries I have read.What about if a believer causes another believer to stumble?

 

[dcontroversal]

So from that section of scripture ...can we deduce that if a person sins against a believer or causes the believer to stumble they are are better off being drowned with a millstone around their neck? That's what I have gotten so far from the commentaries I have read.What about if a believer causes another believer to stumble?

God chastens every SON/Daughter whom he receives.....he deals with us as children.......

 

[GracethroughfaithinChrist]

Hi all,

I have been searching through commentaries for a good explanation of Mark 9:42 ""If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them if a large millstone were hung around their neck and they were thrown into the sea."

Does anyone have any good insights or explanations regarding this verse?Feel free to use your favourite commentary if necessary.

The most severe form of punishment.

"Drowning with a heavy weight around the neck was a Syrian, Greek, and Roman punishment"
pg.1413 (5)

 

[Mooky]

We are called to pray for our enemies.What if we pray for this person?Will God intervene and save them?

 

[Mooky]

I ask because there are some people I don't care to see in heaven ...but the alternative for them is unthinkable.

 

[Galatea]

I think there can be many interpretations. There is a part of chapter of Matthew 18 is generally called "the child text". I believe it is not only spiritually hurting children, but also physically hurting them.

Matthew 18:7-10 "Woe unto the world because of offenses! For it must needs be that offenses come; but woe unto that man by who the offence cometh! Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in Heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in Heaven."

This is my own interpretation and could be entirely wrong. I think it is literal, and Jesus is literally talking about children- because He says except ye become as one of these little ones. I think He is warning people against physically or sexually abusing children. Every time a child is physically or sexually abused, it hurts the child's belief in God. Sometimes, they can get past it, but sometimes they can't. I think when Jesus is telling people it is better to cut their hands, feet, or eyes out- He is saying it is better to cut off your hand than to hurt a child. But, I may be wrong. My interpretation is that it is a text against child abuse. Child abuse, to me, is the most hideous sin in the entire world. So I find it hard to believe that Jesus would never address it on Earth.

These are just my private thoughts, I might be completely off base. It could be my own desire to have Jesus speak a warning against child abuse.

 

[Mooky]

Thank you, Galatea.I have heard its both literal children and believers.Thank you for sharing your thoughts.I appreciate it.

 

[Galatea]

Thank you, Galatea.I have heard its both literal children and believers.Thank you for sharing your thoughts.I appreciate it.

You're welcome. I have no idea if my interpretation is correct. I know I could be completely wrong. It might mean multiple things, though.

 

[Issachar92]

Obviously a millstone would take you straight to the bottom and drown you...the context is clear...a person would be better off drowning in the bottom of the sea with a millstone around their neck than offend or cause to stumble one of God's children...the consequences would be far worse than drowning at the bottom of the sea.....

Nothing to add, this is precisely what it means!

 

[ForthAngel]

I ask because there are some people I don't care to see in heaven ...but the alternative for them is unthinkable.

I think this lesson taught by Jesus addresses how you feel:

Matthew 5
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47 And if you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? 48 You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

And this from Romans 12:

Marks of the True Christian
9 Let love be genuine. Abhor what is evil; hold fast to what is good. 10 Love one another with brotherly affection. Outdo one another in showing honor. 11 Do not be slothful in zeal, be fervent in spirit, serve the Lord. 12 Rejoice in hope, be patient in tribulation, be constant in prayer. 13 Contribute to the needs of the saints and seek to show hospitality.

14 Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse them. 15 Rejoice with those who rejoice, weep with those who weep. 16 Live in harmony with one another. Do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly. Never be wise in your own sight. 17 Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all. 18 If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. 19 Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.” 20 To the contrary, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals on his head.” 21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

I think once someone understands their own depravity and what God saved them from, it is easier for them as they mature in faith to understand the sins of their enemies. This understanding makes it easier for them to show mercy when mercy is needed. I have a ton of enemies that I can be harsh with, especially when it comes to other professing Christians who deny fundamentals of Christian doctrine or pervert them. I don't like these people, at all. However, were any of them hungry, or needed a place to stay, or needed some money, if I was in a position to help, I would not turn them down. I don't think we have to like someone in order to love them and show them mercy by having compassion on them in their time of need, regardless of how we feel about them otherwise.

As for Christians causing Christians to sin, I dunno. Jesus goes on in Matthew 18 to speak on forgiveness and how to approach a brother or sister who is offending.

 

[Meggido]

I think there can be many interpretations. There is a part of chapter of Matthew 18 is generally called "the child text". I believe it is not only spiritually hurting children, but also physically hurting them.

Matthew 18:7-10 "Woe unto the world because of offenses! For it must needs be that offenses come; but woe unto that man by who the offence cometh! Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in Heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in Heaven."

This is my own interpretation and could be entirely wrong. I think it is literal, and Jesus is literally talking about children- because He says except ye become as one of these little ones. I think He is warning people against physically or sexually abusing children. Every time a child is physically or sexually abused, it hurts the child's belief in God. Sometimes, they can get past it, but sometimes they can't. I think when Jesus is telling people it is better to cut their hands, feet, or eyes out- He is saying it is better to cut off your hand than to hurt a child. But, I may be wrong. My interpretation is that it is a text against child abuse. Child abuse, to me, is the most hideous sin in the entire world. So I find it hard to believe that Jesus would never address it on Earth.

These are just my private thoughts, I might be completely off base. It could be my own desire to have Jesus speak a warning against child abuse.

Yes Jesus was taking about literal children here and warning people not to give their kids up to the fire of Molech and other Canaanite gods, that required children to be given in human sacrifice.

The warning for today is simple: STOP ABORTING CHILDREN

The fact he used a Roman method of death to illustrate this point probably means there were gentile or Romans around when he was making it, therefore he made it clear this was not a Jewish sin, it was a universal sin.

Great Job!

 

[resurrection33]

Hi all,

I have been searching through commentaries for a good explanation of Mark 9:42 ""If anyone causes one of these little ones--those who believe in me--to stumble, it would be better for them if a large millstone were hung around their neck and they were thrown into the sea."

Does anyone have any good insights or explanations regarding this verse?Feel free to use your favourite commentary if necessary.

I think what the Lord is saying is that you will feel miserable, and there will be no escape, like the man or woman convicted of sexually molesting a child.

 

[MattforJesus]

I think there can be many interpretations. There is a part of chapter of Matthew 18 is generally called "the child text". I believe it is not only spiritually hurting children, but also physically hurting them.

Mat 18:7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!
Mat 18:8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.
Mat 18:9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.
Mat 18:10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

I believe it is offenses in the spiritual,and physical,and that it is offenses in general,with sin we do,the sin we do to hurt others spiritually,and physically.

The angels always behold the face of the Father for the little ones,which angels are only sent to those who shall receive salvation,and children at a certain age are protected spiritually by angels,for the son of man came to save that which was lost.

Do not offend in general,and it is even a greater sin to deceive children spiritually,because they might not have a chance to see the truth,and do not harm them physically,like stealing is wrong,but stealing a car would be considered worse than stealing a piece of bubblegum,so offending people spiritually,or physically is wrong,but to offend a child spiritually,or physically,is a greater sin.