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Thread: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

  1. #1021


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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Why do you assume that Paul's baptism here is water? Does water baptism wash away sin? If water can wash away sin why did Jesus shed His blood on the cross of Calvary?

    Why call on the name of the Lord in water baptism?

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    Why do you assume that Paul's baptism here is water?
    I assume it to be water the same as you would assume that to bathe or shower means with water.

    Does water baptism wash away sin?
    In a figurative matter, yes. It certainly seems to be the point or moment of the washing away of sins.

    If water can wash away sin why did Jesus shed His blood on the cross of Calvary?
    Look up the meaning of figurative.

    Why call on the name of the Lord in water baptism?
    Don't know why Ananias said this but what is your point?
    Last edited by DJ2; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:57 PM.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Q: 1). Why do you assume that Paul's baptism here is water? Q: 2). Does water baptism wash away sin? Q: 3). If water can wash away sin why did Jesus shed His blood on the cross of Calvary?

    Q: 4). Why call on the name of the Lord in water baptism?

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    [Please pardon my insertion of numbers before the questions in the quote. It makes it easier to be clear in response.]

    A: 1). Because Jesus' commission to his disciples regarding baptism was that of water baptism, not the Holy Ghost. Jesus commanded his disciples (the men he sent) to baptize people with water...He (Jesus) alone does the baptism with the Holy Ghost...even though it sometimes happens at the time of laying on of hands.

    A: 2). Remission (washing away) of sins is the purpose of baptism. That is repeated several times throughout the bible, including the re-quote from Paul. Baptism is how we partake in the likeness of Jesus' death. Just as Jesus needed to submit to death by the cross, we need to submit to the likeness of his death in baptism. Just as Jesus went down into death with sins on him, and came up without those sins... that's what baptism does for us...we go down into baptism with sins, and come up without them.

    Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
    Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

    Have you ever considered what happens if a person is NOT planted together in the likeness of his death?

    A: 3). It's not the water that does the work, it's the submission to the righteous that Jesus laid out for us.

    1Pe_3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

    What Jesus did through the cross activated baptism...I don't really understand how, but I also don't understand how bones form in a chicken's egg.

    At the end of each of the four gospels you can find both necessary elements of salvation in what Jesus says (1. Removal of sins, and 2. Receiving the Holy Ghost)...but the wording regarding water baptism varies... Matthew and Mark use the word "baptizing" or "he that is baptised" where Luke and John use the words "remission of sins" and Joh 20:23 "Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained." In other words, whomever you baptize, their sins will be gone, but whomever you don't baptize, their sins will remain. Remission of sins is the power given them. Baptism is the tool by which it is applied.

    A: 4). Because that's who's name we get baptized in, and who it is that does the work. And, as repentance (turning from old ways) and baptism go hand in hand, we want to actually ask God for the strength to continue in the new life we are coming to embrace as we let him cleanse us from the old.

    Love in Jesus,
    Kelby
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Roger

    Come on Roger, water baptism in the name of Christ in Acts 22: 16 is not an assumption, it is a truth.
    (1) No one is commanded, as Paul was, to be baptized in the Holy Spirit; that is a promise. (Acts 2: 38)
    (2) We are cleansed by water, as instructed in the word. (Eph. 5: 26)
    (3) Acts 22: 16 says - be baptized, and wash away your sins. Please, admit what it says, at least.
    (4) 1 Peter 1:1,2- those who obey our Lord (repentance and baptism) are sprinkled clean with His blood.
    (5) Heb. 10: 22- our hearts are sprinkled clean ( with Christ's blood -Heb 9: 14) as our bodies are washed with pure water.
    (6) Water baptism is apparently God's signal to pour out the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2: 38, 39)
    (7) Baptism is an appeal to God, to give us a good conscience. (1 Peter 3: 21) NASB
    (8) When we are baptized in the name of Christ, we are baptized into his death. Those that die with Christ are freed from sin. (Rom 6: 3- 8)
    (9) Those that obey the form of teaching--death, burial and resurrection -- in baptism are freed from sin. (Rom. 6: 17. 18)

    The first requirement in coming after Jesus is to deny self. (Matt 16: 24)
    God bless.

  4. #1024
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by KelbyofGod View Post
    [Please pardon my insertion of numbers before the questions in the quote. It makes it easier to be clear in response.]

    A: 1). Because Jesus' commission to his disciples regarding baptism was that of water baptism, not the Holy Ghost. Jesus commanded his disciples (the men he sent) to baptize people with water...He (Jesus) alone does the baptism with the Holy Ghost...even though it sometimes happens at the time of laying on of hands.

    A: 2). Remission (washing away) of sins is the purpose of baptism. That is repeated several times throughout the bible, including the re-quote from Paul. Baptism is how we partake in the likeness of Jesus' death. Just as Jesus needed to submit to death by the cross, we need to submit to the likeness of his death in baptism. Just as Jesus went down into death with sins on him, and came up without those sins... that's what baptism does for us...we go down into baptism with sins, and come up without them.

    Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
    Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

    Have you ever considered what happens if a person is NOT planted together in the likeness of his death?

    A: 3). It's not the water that does the work, it's the submission to the righteous that Jesus laid out for us.

    1Pe_3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

    What Jesus did through the cross activated baptism...I don't really understand how, but I also don't understand how bones form in a chicken's egg.

    At the end of each of the four gospels you can find both necessary elements of salvation in what Jesus says (1. Removal of sins, and 2. Receiving the Holy Ghost)...but the wording regarding water baptism varies... Matthew and Mark use the word "baptizing" or "he that is baptised" where Luke and John use the words "remission of sins" and Joh 20:23 "Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained." In other words, whomever you baptize, their sins will be gone, but whomever you don't baptize, their sins will remain. Remission of sins is the power given them. Baptism is the tool by which it is applied.

    A: 4). Because that's who's name we get baptized in, and who it is that does the work. And, as repentance (turning from old ways) and baptism go hand in hand, we want to actually ask God for the strength to continue in the new life we are coming to embrace as we let him cleanse us from the old.

    Love in Jesus,
    Kelby
    LOL Activated baptism.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    The bible is a mirror not a magnifying glass
    use it to examine yourself not others.

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    Senior Member notuptome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by plaintalk View Post
    Roger

    Come on Roger, water baptism in the name of Christ in Acts 22: 16 is not an assumption, it is a truth.
    (1) No one is commanded, as Paul was, to be baptized in the Holy Spirit; that is a promise. (Acts 2: 38)
    (2) We are cleansed by water, as instructed in the word. (Eph. 5: 26)
    (3) Acts 22: 16 says - be baptized, and wash away your sins. Please, admit what it says, at least.
    (4) 1 Peter 1:1,2- those who obey our Lord (repentance and baptism) are sprinkled clean with His blood.
    (5) Heb. 10: 22- our hearts are sprinkled clean ( with Christ's blood -Heb 9: 14) as our bodies are washed with pure water.
    (6) Water baptism is apparently God's signal to pour out the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2: 38, 39)
    (7) Baptism is an appeal to God, to give us a good conscience. (1 Peter 3: 21) NASB
    (8) When we are baptized in the name of Christ, we are baptized into his death. Those that die with Christ are freed from sin. (Rom 6: 3- 8)
    (9) Those that obey the form of teaching--death, burial and resurrection -- in baptism are freed from sin. (Rom. 6: 17. 18)

    The first requirement in coming after Jesus is to deny self. (Matt 16: 24)
    God bless.
    Water can only wash the outside never clean the real problem in the heart of man.

    Jesus said the same of the Pharisees. Mat 23:24-28.

    You err when you make water baptism to cleanse sin. Blood atonement and Holy Spirit cleansing the baptism of fire.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
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    The bible is a mirror not a magnifying glass
    use it to examine yourself not others.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    just DO what Jesus and John did, and you will find real PEACE!!!
    Nehemiah6 and preston39 like this.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    If a person will see the distinction in the ministry of John the Baptist, Jesus, the 12 Apostles, the Apostle Paul, and stop comingling the instruction, we might come to a better understanding of baptism(s). We can agree there is more than one type. Even see that water baptisms were performed differently, according to the instruction of the gospel call for that ministry currently at work.


    Paul could not say, "For Christ sent me not to baptize", if he was in fact held to a "commission" to include water baptism as part of salvation or part of gospel instruction, so there's that truth... and also Paul completes his statement with, "lest the cross of Christ be made to none effect."

    1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by oldethennew View Post
    just DO what Jesus and John did, and you will find real PEACE!!!
    I prefer to glory in the cross.

    It took me some time to understand my misplaced faith in the doctrine of water baptism I learned through my church.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    you have been miss-lead, sister...

  10. #1030


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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey_Bee View Post
    I prefer to glory in the cross.

    It took me some time to understand my misplaced faith in the doctrine of water baptism I learned through my church.
    Was the blind man's faith misplaced in his efforts to obey by washing in the Pool of Siloam? Was Peter's faith misplaced when he dropped his net at the command of Jesus? Was the faith of the Hebrews misplaced they covered their door posts with blood? Was the faith of those dying of the snake bites misplaced when they went and gazed upon the bronze serpent?

    Would you Honey_Bee tell any of them to just glory in God and ignore the very commands of that God? What you prefer has no standing with God.
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey_Bee View Post
    I prefer to glory in the cross.

    It took me some time to understand my misplaced faith in the doctrine of water baptism I learned through my church.
    H....,

    Unless we follow G-d's commands, including repentance and water baptism according to scriptures, ....... sacrifice on the cross is not available for sin forgiveness.
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    Blessings to you.

    preston39

    "without Christ you are alone......you can't handle it"!

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey_Bee View Post
    If a person will see the distinction in the ministry of John the Baptist, Jesus, the 12 Apostles, the Apostle Paul, and stop comingling the instruction, we might come to a better understanding of baptism(s). We can agree there is more than one type. Even see that water baptisms were performed differently, according to the instruction of the gospel call for that ministry currently at work.


    Paul could not say, "For Christ sent me not to baptize", if he was in fact held to a "commission" to include water baptism as part of salvation or part of gospel instruction, so there's that truth... and also Paul completes his statement with, "lest the cross of Christ be made to none effect."

    1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
    That verse has been taken out of context so many times.... Paul is not saying that he was not supposed to baptize anyone.. he was correcting the believers in Corinth who were arguing over which of them was a "better Christian" because of who baptized them. Paul is telling them "don't be stupid. WHO baptizes you makes no difference.." That's why he said he was glad he didn't baptize any more of them than he did.... so they couldn't have a claim to greatness because of who baptized them.

    He was NOT minimizing the importance of baptism..

    He was saying that ANYONE could baptize them... that was not why he was sent... he was sent to teach the gospel... that was his "assignment".
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    No man is really saved unless he is in his heart obedient to Christ. C.H. Spurgeon

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Assurance

    22 let us draw near with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. (Heb. 10: 22) NASB

    The Lord in His mercy and wisdom has made several promises and statements about our relationship with Him that are not physically perceptible to us as they are spiritual in nature. Because He created us He is well acquainted with the workings of our mind and what we need to have to experience the full assurance of faith in our daily lives so that we might persevere and endure to the end of our walk with Him. To this end he has given baptism in the name of Christ. This baptism touches so many areas of life; it is not some meaningless rite to be diminished and denigrated but according to Ephesians 4: 5 it is one of the seven pillars of the unity of the Spirit. The entire family of God looks to this ordinance for support, meaning and assurance.

    This baptism in no way distracts from one of the key acknowledgements of the Scriptures, “the just shall live by faith” because we find that faith in God is a necessary and essential requirement. (Acts 8: 36-38) Baptism not only demonstrates our faith but it also even more importantly authenticates it. (James 2: 22)

    This element of the one baptism, baptism in water, is so important in so many areas, that the remarks we read by some are almost unbelievable.

    • Discipleship- this is one of the ways we know we are following Him. (Matt. 28: 19)
    • Salvation- Mark 16: 15, 16; 1 Peter 3: 21)
    • Forgiveness of sin. (Acts 2: 38; 22: 16)
    • Calling on the name of the Lord for a good conscience. (Acts 2: 21; 22: 16)
    • Entering into Christ. (Rom. 6: 3; Gal. 3: 26, 27)
    • Baptized into His death. (Rom. 6: 3)
    • Obeying the gospel- death, burial and resurrection. (2 Thess. 1: 8)
    • Children of God. (Gal. 3: 26, 27)
    • Receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2: 38, 39; 5: 32)
    • Clothed with Christ. (Gal 3: 26, 27)
    • Dying with Christ. (Rom. 6: 6)
    • Freed from sin. (Rom 6: 7)

    God bless.
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by hornetguy View Post
    That verse has been taken out of context so many times.... Paul is not saying that he was not supposed to baptize anyone.. he was correcting the believers in Corinth who were arguing over which of them was a "better Christian" because of who baptized them. Paul is telling them "don't be stupid. WHO baptizes you makes no difference.." That's why he said he was glad he didn't baptize any more of them than he did.... so they couldn't have a claim to greatness because of who baptized them.

    He was NOT minimizing the importance of baptism..

    He was saying that ANYONE could baptize them... that was not why he was sent... he was sent to teach the gospel... that was his "assignment".
    LOL Hey pot the kettle is black.

    The baptism that saves is not water. Only Holy Spirit baptism which is administered by Christ saves a man. Water baptism is and only can be symbolic. We are not symbolically saved but genuinely saved through Christ by grace.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Water baptism is and only can be symbolic.
    And hornetguy has not said anything different. What he has rightly pointed out is that simply because Paul said that his primary mandate was to preach the Gospel and not to baptize does not nullify the importance of water baptism (as some people wrongly think).

    Holy Spirit baptism comes first, but in Scripture it is IMMEDIATELY followed by water baptism as per the Lord's command. Today we have many people claiming that water baptism is irrelevant for Christians, and that is heresy.
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    LOL .... Only Holy Spirit baptism which is administered by Christ saves a man. ...
    n...,

    Please explain what this means, how it works and how it is applied?
    DJ2 likes this.
    Blessings to you.

    preston39

    "without Christ you are alone......you can't handle it"!

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    When you find peace and comfort in water baptism, there is a problem, and it is usually a "another" gospel issue.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Preston39

    "Unless we follow G-d's commands, including repentance and water baptism according to scriptures, ....... sacrifice on the cross is not available for sin forgiveness. "

    +++


    I am sorry you believe this.

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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by hornetguy View Post
    That verse has been taken out of context so many times.... Paul is not saying that he was not supposed to baptize anyone.. he was correcting the believers in Corinth who were arguing over which of them was a "better Christian" because of who baptized them. Paul is telling them "don't be stupid. WHO baptizes you makes no difference.." That's why he said he was glad he didn't baptize any more of them than he did.... so they couldn't have a claim to greatness because of who baptized them.

    He was NOT minimizing the importance of baptism..

    He was saying that ANYONE could baptize them... that was not why he was sent... he was sent to teach the gospel... that was his "assignment".

    For Christ sent me not to baptize, pretty clear Paul's ministry was not part of a water baptism commission, main point I was sharing. Instructions change down through the NT ministries, that's also the point.

  20. #1040


    DJ2
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    Default Re: Baptism: is it required to be baptized in water?

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey_Bee View Post
    Preston39

    "Unless we follow G-d's commands, including repentance and water baptism according to scriptures, ....... sacrifice on the cross is not available for sin forgiveness. "

    +++


    I am sorry you believe this.
    Paul could not say, "For Christ sent me not to baptize", if he was in fact held to a "commission" to include water baptism as part of salvation or part of gospel instruction, so there's that truth... and also Paul completes his statement with, "lest the cross of Christ be made to none effect."
    Are you not the person who wrote the above? Your misplaced understanding of 1st Cor. 1:17 should concern you more than feeling sorry for Preston39.

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